View Full Version : PB Swiss... Wow..


MD11
12-01-2009, 11:07 AM
Well, I just wanted to share with members here that are fedup with Made in China and the trend many of our favorite American tool makers are joining, which is to ship more and more production to China. While I still love my Snap on, and for wrenches, sockets and ratchets, they're still #1 in my book... I decided to buy my 1/4" bit set from PB Swiss (they're sold out of their US distributor in Atlanta, Count On Tools, Inc at http://www.pbtools.us/ ) and I can't say well enough about the quality of these bits, or the screw drivers I also ordered. A woman named Donna Shook handles most of the orders there and she's great.. I had to call in twice to get changes to my order and they handled it with a smile (over the phone)..

Everything is 100% Swiss made, and the heft, quality of materials and even color coding is superb, and the quality is above what I expected; even from the Swiss. I sill have my Snap On SDM400A bit set, but my new go to bits are these beauties. I'd post pictures, but my poor camera work won't do them justice, and the website has plenty of close up photos. If you're a tool snob, there are no finer bits IMHO, and their screw drivers are on par, maybe better than the Snap On's which are themselves great. I used to prefer Wiha screw drivers, but I think this will be my new brand.

Wanted to share.. that's all.
:beer:

superautobacs
12-01-2009, 11:21 AM
Feel free to bring up this (http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27365&highlight=PB+Swiss) older thread, and include some pictures in there while you're at it. :)

MD11
12-01-2009, 11:48 AM
I will do just that.... the photo's I'm taking with this camera are not turning out well.. I think it's the lighting but I'll give it a shot.. but thanks for the link.. will at least repeat my points in there.. ;-)

mods, feel free to kill this thread..

american lockpicker
12-01-2009, 11:59 AM
I can't wait to get my first PB tools.

JakeD
12-01-2009, 04:16 PM
My only minor complaint is that the hard handles on my PB Swiss torx drivers smell horrible like rancid baby vomit.

pirana
12-01-2009, 05:26 PM
Their chisels & punches are the cat's ass too!

caper
12-01-2009, 06:10 PM
My only minor complaint is that the hard handles on my PB Swiss torx drivers smell horrible like rancid baby vomit.

I make a concerted effort not to smell my tools.:lol_hitti

superautobacs
12-01-2009, 06:14 PM
I make a concerted effort not to smell my tools.:lol_hitti

I hold my breath whenever I open up the top enclosure of my tool box (contains PB multicraft and classic handles).

Pretty smelly I tell you. :lol:

american lockpicker
12-02-2009, 12:21 AM
I have a set of USA stanley tools that smell terrible.

Chreese
12-02-2009, 04:49 AM
My only minor complaint is that the hard handles on my PB Swiss torx drivers smell horrible like rancid baby vomit.

I know what you mean. Since I ran out of shop-space I store some of my PB stuff in my bed room. It's hard to get used to this smell.

Chreese

Monte
12-02-2009, 05:02 AM
Too much "PAK" inside the handles ?? :)

JakeD
12-02-2009, 08:22 AM
I make a concerted effort not to smell my tools.:lol_hitti

You'd make an even more concerted effort if you sniffed these bad-boys. For this reason, I'd recommend the swiss grips. I have a set of Swiss Grip screwdrivers and they are my favorites.

MD11
12-02-2009, 08:43 AM
Swiss grips are easily the best rubber I've ever felt in my hands.. I wish the entire interior rubber of my car was made of the same stuff!

superautobacs
12-02-2009, 11:45 AM
It probably is PAH, Monte.

Here's an article:Want to know about PAH's? (http://www.bureauveritas.cn/wps/wcm/connect/35d2f4804b5e423c9aa79e93f26b1a3d/Bulletin08B138.pdf?MOD=AJPERES&CACHEID=35d2f4804b5e423c9aa79e93f26b1a3d)

The following materials are examples that could contain PAHs:
> Elastomer (plastic and rubber material)
> Black or dark colored polymer
> Coatings and varnish
> Materials treated with conservation agents (naphthalene) (e.g. leather products, wood, bast and natural bristle)

[EDIT]
From the manufacturer:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.pbswisstools.com/uploads/pics/3014_04.jpg
Classic transparent handles
Cellulose-Aceto-Butyrate is a modified natural material which is produced from wood. PB Swiss Tools Classic and multicraft® handles are made of this material. The transparent plastic unifies in a unique manner the following important characteristics for first-class hand tools: friendly to the skin, slip-proof, extremely resistant to impact, insensitive against tension tears, resistant to oil and fuel.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

I did some searching on Cellulose-Aceto-Butyrate...
pdf file (http://www.rotuba.com/downloads/Rotuba_Cellulose_Acetate_Butyrate_MSDS.pdf)
another one (http://74.125.155.132/search?q=cache:AoSEHzUlzYYJ:ws.eastman.com/ProductCatalogApps/PageControllers/Sustainability_PC.aspx%3Fproduct%3D71001227+Cellul ose-Acetobutyrate+health&cd=18&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca&client=firefox-a)

48548
12-02-2009, 12:17 PM
Where are the pictures of the smell?:monkey_po

:needpics:

superautobacs
12-14-2009, 10:58 AM
I exchanged a couple emails with PB Swiss and I thought I'd add the information here.
Here's the body of the exchanged emails:
---------------------------------------------------------
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 2. Dezember 2009 18:57
An: info@pbswisstools.com

Hello,

I'm a relatively happy PB Swiss tools owner.

I have a question about the smell emitted from the various plastic handled tools that I have, both classic and multicraft handles. I'd really like to know what's contained in the handles that produces this distinct smell from your products.

Sincerely,
Chris

---------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 16:04:00 +0100
From: a.burkhalter@pbswisstools.com
Subject: AW: Kontakt
To: :headscrat@hotmail.com

Dear Mr. :pimpflash



The plastic handles do contain Celluloseacetobutyrat (CAB) which is the material causing the smell (especially if you stock them in a closed area without fresh air, like for example in a drawer or in a tool case). If the smell isn’t bearable anymore, the tool can be changed for free (under guarantee). If you don’t like these plastic handles anymore, there would be an alternative, the handles made by Santoprene.



We hope this information is helpful. If you need more information, please let us know.



Best regards


Andreas Burkhalter

PB Swiss Tools GmbH
P.O. Box 182
CH-3457 Wasen/Bern
www.pbswisstools.com
a.burkhalter@pbswisstools.com
Direct P+ 41 34 437 71 16

F+ 41 34 437 71 90
-----------------------------------------------------

Gesendet: Freitag, 4. Dezember 2009 17:52
An: a.burkhalter@pbswisstools.com
Betreff: RE: AW: Kontakt



Hi Andreas,

Thank you for the reply.

I'd also like to know if these handles contain PAH's (poly aromatic hydrocarbons).

Regards,
Chris
------------------------------------------------------
After 10 days I finally got a reply from them (I'm happy that they did reply...IMO, it goes to show that he/they cares about the customer).

---------------------------------------------------------

Dear Chris


PAH’s are not an ingredient of our raw material we use and is not used as an addition for the production. - Please find enclosed an information sheet.


We hope these informations are helpful. If you need more information, please let us know.


Best regards

Andreas Burkhalter


PB Swiss Tools GmbH
P.O. Box 182
CH-3457 Wasen/Bern
www.pbswisstools.com
a.burkhalter@pbswisstools.com
Direct P+ 41 34 437 71 16

F+ 41 34 437 71 90
------------------------------------------------

The file is a pdf and I've attached it below. What I found interesting is that the content is not theirs; it's outsourced information from a company called Eastman, located in Kingsport, TN. If you recall, one of the external links I provided in my previous post here is also from Eastman.

MD11
12-14-2009, 11:04 AM
Good on you and good on PB Swiss for the totally honest info. 10+ Days later, I'm still waiting to hear from a senior member of the Snap On management team as to whether the internals of the 80 tooth ratchet are US Made or Chinese?

Monte
12-14-2009, 11:18 AM
Thanks for the info Chris !! (superautobacs) :D

It seems that Eastman is the supplier of the raw plastic material to PB. In the newspaper article posted in the other PB thread it was pointed out that the plastic material is from the US.

ps: 24 steps from raw material to top quality PB screwdriver: click (http://mdmetric.com/mfgscwdvr.pdf)

scottmlew
12-14-2009, 11:25 AM
Thanks for posting! And it's great to hear that they'll warranty a tool if you don't like the smell of it!!!

The implication of their email is that the smell gets worse/stronger over time...I would have expected the opposite.

MD11
12-14-2009, 11:34 AM
Again, if the smell of the hard handles isn't tolerable for you and you can tolerate a soft grip (it's not mush), the Swissgrip for me is the finest grip of any screw driver I've seen... including the newer SO.

Monte
12-14-2009, 11:34 AM
Some more info on the Eastman "Tenite" click (http://www.eastman.com/Literature_Center/P/PPC101.pdf)
It seems craftsman hadles are made from the same material like PB handles.... :)

superautobacs
12-14-2009, 11:50 AM
And the Craftsman BBQ tool set, too. :D

Monte
12-14-2009, 12:05 PM
:D
PB screwdrivers with craftsman handles !! ridiculous !!!! :D :D ;)
Time to replace my PB tools with higher quality tools ! :D

speed bump
12-14-2009, 12:34 PM
Some more info on the Eastman "Tenite" click (http://www.eastman.com/Literature_Center/P/PPC101.pdf)
It seems craftsman hadles are made from the same material like PB handles.... :)

Which means you need to keep your PB Swiss tools away from Brake Cleaner.

FoMoCoPower
12-14-2009, 02:55 PM
I buy older Made in USA tools at estate sales/auctions whenever I can. I refuse to buy the China stuff.

MD11
12-14-2009, 03:11 PM
I buy older Made in USA tools at estate sales/auctions whenever I can. I refuse to buy the China stuff.

Good for you.. that's very smart! .. but just to be clear, PB Swiss is not made in China :thumbup:

Monte
12-14-2009, 04:25 PM
Maybe he was thinking about this "swiss" eh "Switz" tool.... :)

http://www.worldimporttools.com/img_tool/switz_tool/switz_1.jpg

Keep
12-14-2009, 09:16 PM
Well your post sold me on these. I just ordered up the 6244 set, a set of picks and rad hose picks (amazon packaged them) I have to have them relayed to me as they will not ship the PB stuff outside the US. So I should have them in a couple weeks.

SpiderGearsMan
12-14-2009, 09:25 PM
pb blaster ?
if this is a paid advertisement ,thanks for the spam ?

Keep
12-14-2009, 09:46 PM
pb blaster ?
if this is a paid advertisement ,thanks for the spam ?

huh? PB Swiss the people that make nice screwdrivers....:headscrat

MD11
12-14-2009, 11:33 PM
very nice vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MQ90teDjg0

Vinko
12-15-2009, 05:24 AM
Again, if the smell of the hard handles isn't tolerable for you and you can tolerate a soft grip (it's not mush), the Swissgrip for me is the finest grip of any screw driver I've seen... including the newer SO.

I like the Swiss grip too. Don't know if I like it any better than a Snappy hard handle of the last generation. Just bought some pics in the new hard handle instinct line and I really like those too. I guess I like it all:)

Kjbakke2
12-15-2009, 05:46 AM
where do you guys get your pb swiss.....i have me a massive jonesing for those tasty white handled anniversary models and another set or two

MD11
12-15-2009, 08:22 AM
where do you guys get your pb swiss.....i have me a massive jonesing for those tasty white handled anniversary models and another set or two

I have been getting mine from here, and the service is great!

http://www.pbtools.us/

Right now, 30% off all inventory is also going on.

american lockpicker
12-15-2009, 08:34 AM
I can see me ordering this next year.

http://pbtoolsus.thomasnet.com/item/bit-drivers-holders-universal-/pb-6461-insider-universal-bit-holder/pn-2666?&forward=1

MD11
12-15-2009, 10:05 AM
pb blaster ?
if this is a paid advertisement ,thanks for the spam ?

..........:wtf:

scottmlew
12-15-2009, 10:47 AM
I have been getting mine from here, and the service is great!

http://www.pbtools.us/

Right now, 30% off all inventory is also going on.

Agreed on service...I'm very happy with them (only 1 order from them, but it was a big one, and I was impressed with how they handled a couple of out of stock items and some substitutions).

Are they still doing 30% off? It was supposed to end in November...it's nice if it's extended, though!

MD11
12-15-2009, 11:02 AM
Agreed on service...I'm very happy with them (only 1 order from them, but it was a big one, and I was impressed with how they handled a couple of out of stock items and some substitutions).

Are they still doing 30% off? It was supposed to end in November...it's nice if it's extended, though!

I think it was Nov/Dec, but I haven't ordered in a couple weeks so I might be wrong..

Also, I got a nice white T-Shirt from them with my last order.. I wonder if that's a free gift after a certain sized order?

superautobacs
12-15-2009, 01:13 PM
I think there's a free gift thrown into any order that's over $100....IIRC.
There's no such perk offered by Small Parts Inc.

scottmlew
12-15-2009, 03:05 PM
I ordered $500 of stuff (and that's AFTER the discount) and got absolutely no freebie! :(

Keep
12-29-2009, 12:28 PM
Woohoo I came home today to a package:

PB 6244c
pb 7674
pb 7680

Thanks for the recommendation. They are exactly what I was looking for, hard handled and comfortable. Its to bad its such a hassle to order them up here!

truckdriver
12-29-2009, 01:40 PM
How does the warranty wook with PB Swiss? Mail it in to distibuter? I really like the powerbits, just wish they had SAE hex. I'm still planning on ordering the Wiha hex bits so I guess it don't matter.

Vinko
12-30-2009, 03:05 AM
How does the warranty wook with PB Swiss? Mail it in to distibuter? I really like the powerbits, just wish they had SAE hex. I'm still planning on ordering the Wiha hex bits so I guess it don't matter.


Not sure how it works, I've got to contact Small Parts, Inc. about that. I have two picks that need to be warrantied. (If they'll do so).

scottmlew
12-30-2009, 11:30 AM
Not sure how it works, I've got to contact Small Parts, Inc. about that. I have two picks that need to be warrantied. (If they'll do so).

What happened to your picks?

ericg
12-30-2009, 03:05 PM
MD11, if you ever hear from senior management at Snap On about the country of origin for the internals for the 80 tooth ratchet, please post. I am sure that a lot of people on the forum are looking for the answer. I called SO customer service and they said that the ratchet internals are made in the US but when I asked for it in writing, the response was that "they could not accomodate my request."

Eric

48548
12-30-2009, 03:25 PM
MD11, if you ever hear from senior management at Snap On about the country of origin for the internals for the 80 tooth ratchet, please post. I am sure that a lot of people on the forum are looking for the answer. I called SO customer service and they said that the ratchet internals are made in the US but when I asked for it in writing, the response was that "they could not accomodate my request."

Eric

It sounds like they are hiding something and or don't want a lawsuit.... Hmmm....

ericg
12-30-2009, 03:40 PM
48548, this issue has been discussed so many times on this forum without a true answer from SO. Merkava_4 has emails from SO attesting to the fact that the Dual 80 ratchets are made in the TN plant, yet the ratchet is not stamped "made in usa." If you take what Merk shared with the forum, it can safely be assumed that the internals are outsourced. I went shopping with the wife today and I could not find one article of clothing made in the USA. I saw made in China, Phillipines, Viet Nam, Honduras, India and at least ten other countries. It is truly sad.

Eric

woody 73
12-30-2009, 04:26 PM
Dont hold me too this, but I think if everything is made in the usa then you can stamp usa on the product in question. If any part does not come from the usa then you can not use the usa stamp mark.

Does the PB Swiss have a nice feel , I am looking for a screwdriver that my sore hands can hold for a long period of time?

CamarosRus
12-30-2009, 06:11 PM
We unload much of that Asian made "stuff", being shipped across the USA to every store you can name, (almost) every brand name you can think of.

Over 1 MILLION containers in 2009!!!!!!!!

Expecting to see Snap-On Tools on consignment records in the future.



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v470/CamarosRus/Misc%20Camaro%20pics/Pier18.jpg

Vinko
12-31-2009, 02:07 AM
Dont hold me too this, but I think if everything is made in the usa then you can stamp usa on the product in question. If any part does not come from the usa then you can not use the usa stamp mark.


It's been a while since I looked through all the gov't regs. And I'm not sure that I fully understood them all when I did read them. There are a lot of caveats and some exceptions or imprecise language. But if you look at the FTC site, you'll see that the putting a "Made in the USA" label is not confined to those things which are 100% US made. Certain states have additional requirements.

I talked to who I thought was a really good attorney in this field and he said that certain instances of labeling appear to be subjective. The FTC doesn't "know," he doesn't "know", and no one seems to "know.


Does the PB Swiss have a nice feel , I am looking for a screwdriver that my sore hands can hold for a long period of time?

I think the Swiss Grip does, but the Instinct grip from SO is growing on me.

Vinko
12-31-2009, 02:16 AM
What happened to your picks?

I started a thread about this previously. More info there if you're curious:)

I was using a few to pull a small bearing out of a wheel. (about 2" wheel used for a utility dolly). They both snapped. My own fault. A larger pick would've done the job, but it was the wrong tool for the job anyway. A case of tool abuse :(:)

It was a bad week. Also snapped two Proto punches on pins.

Evogun
12-31-2009, 03:06 AM
Why, do non of these guys bits have anti-cam features?:headscrat

They look pretty but I still like Wera more.

redsky49
12-31-2009, 09:18 AM
It's been a while since I looked through all the gov't regs. And I'm not sure that I fully understood them all when I did read them. There are a lot of caveats and some exceptions or imprecise language. But if you look at the FTC site, you'll see that the putting a "Made in the USA" label is not confined to those things which are 100% US made. Certain states have additional requirements.


As my wife has informed me, the label "Made in the US" is used for the textile production in the Marianas Islands where Asian temporary workers are exclusively employed. The loopholes in the labeling laws allow US territories to make the "US manufactured" claim, and they take advantage of that provision for competitive reasons.

Whatever happened to the US Ladies Garment Workers Union? I used to see that label on all my shirts. No more though. Are tool manufacturers next?

truckdriver
12-31-2009, 10:44 AM
I could've sworn this was about PB Swiss, not COO for SO tools. Since there are plenty of other threads for that can we get back to PB Swiss?

scottmlew
12-31-2009, 12:50 PM
Does the PB Swiss have a nice feel , I am looking for a screwdriver that my sore hands can hold for a long period of time?

I think the SwissGrips are super comfortable, but if your primary focus is on comfort, I'd check out the Felo Ergonics. They're very soft and conforming, and I know at least one person with arthritis who swears by them as a result.