1/2" Impact Comparison: IR VS. Aircat

[TNToy]

Okay. I bought an Aircat Nitro Cat off of eBay for $163 shipped (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180041907901). Disclaimer: I've used it for exactly one day at work. Should my opinion change after a week, month, etc... I'll be sure to chime back in.

The past three months, I've used a 1/2" drive Ingersoll-Rand 2135Ti and a 3/8" IR 2112 exclusively at work. Pulling heads, rotating a jillion sets of tires, front suspension work, brakes, struts... Well, I've got a fairly good idea what the IR Titanium is made of.

The aircat is about a 1/4" taller from the base of the grip to the top of the handle, and the metal motor housing on the front of the gun is about 1/2" longer. They're very close to the same size, but the Ti is smaller.

The Ti is also lighter. Obviously, since the Aircat has a steel (I assume) front housing, it'll weight more than the Ti. It's also a bit nose-heavy, since that's where the weight differnce lies. Hefting the steel-front IR composite gun (the IR 2131) has me believeing the Aircat is a bit lighter than the 2131, but heavier than the 2135.

The IR also has the edge as far as it's track record: I know how long an IR gun will last in everyday service, and that's not the case with the Aircat. However, since Mac Tools is rebadging Nitro Cat guns, I assume that (1)They are going to have to warranty them, and (2)they've tested them extensively and have faith in their durability.

The IR's forward/reverse buttons are also something the Aircat is missing, so it's not a one-handed affair to change directions with the gun like with the Ti. However, I believe that may be a benefit, as I know of more than one Ti owner whose had the housing/button wear against each other enough that they continually fall out - the only cure is a new housing.

Now, sit down, becase I'm about to tell you that those are the only areas where the IR is superior.

The Aircat is MUCH quieter than the already quiet Ti gun, and it has about exactly the same amount of oomph. The standard Aircat uses the same Twin-Hammer mechanism as the Ti, and I believe would behave the same. The Nitro Cat uses a "twin clutch" system that vibrates in your hand about half as much as a Ti does.

Twin Clutch vs. Twin Hammer (http://www.aircat.com/cms/index.php?s=content&p=fact)

I pulled the valvebody out of a 4L60E-equipped Blazer today to repair the TCC: The converter was locking & unlocking continuously on the highway. First time I've used an impact to remove that many fasteners THAT close to my ear without earplugs. Do not get me wrong: The Ti is a great gun that's VERY quiet when compared to pretty much any steel-housing gun with a decent amount of torque. But it can't touch the aircat in this category. That thing is SOOOOO quiet it's rediculous. The tech in the bay across from me actually asked me what I was using, he noticed the LACK of noise. And he's also used to the Ti. The best way I can describe it is that it's about as loud as a Ti gun with the regulator knob on the back set to the lowest setting. It's quiet. :D


Next job was to pull the rusty lugnuts and caliper brackets off of an F-150 in order to turn the rotors. I was worried at this point, because the gun was so quiet and so smooth when tightening something as much as it could, that I thought the gun was pretty weak. My faith was restored when the Ti had to hammer for 5-10 seconds to break that same fastener free. Normally you torque a bolt with a weak impact, and the Ti will run it off without even hammering on it. So I gunned it down with the Ti, and used the Aircat to take it off. Same thing. The guns were about the same strength with this guesstimation: The aircat was a little bit heavier, but much quieter.

Last job of the day (actually not mine, but the previously mentioned tech across from me who runs a Ti) was a Volvo S70 getting regular service. Tire rotation, except some lube monkey ran the lugs down tight with an impact and they were RUSTY. When the first lug took 15 seconds of hammering in the reverse direction, tightening it, and then running it out to remove with a Ti, it looked like a good test for the Aircat. Once again, the two guns proved to be about exactly the same strength. Twice the Aircat removed a lug bolt that the Ti wouldn't, but that was after the Ti was rapping on it for 15 seconds and might have helped. But once again, the Aircat didn't shake the heck out of your wrist like the Ti: Glass smooth when beating on a frozen fastener, and once again it was quiet as anything.

So far, I love this gun. Especially at about half the cost of the 2135Ti. Don't get me wrong: Last week I would have sworn the IR Titanium guns were the best thing since sliced bread. However, this gun may just be better. :D

[TNToy]

Oh, let me add this, too, since I think it sums up my opinion of the Aircat design pretty well:

Last week I was thinking I would eventually need a 3/8" gun for the garage, once I have a compressor up & running, and use a IR 2112 at work. Now, I'm looking at the Aircat 3/8" guns... thinking I can buy that one for work, and keep the Ti gun at home.

Not only are they good, they're so incredibly affordable... at least, compared to the Ti's. :)

[wantedabiggergarage]

Since I have the 2112 and the 2135ti at the shop, I still need one for home. Because I have liked the handiness of the 2112, I am thinking of the Aircat 1350TC. 1/2" anvil in a 3/8" body, although I find different torque listings between the manufacturer and the retailer.
Now, if I can keep it from migrating.....:thumbup:


Thanks for the review, please remember to update down the road!

[TNToy]

Get an Aircat. You won't regret it. I'm just waiting to see if the 3/8" drive nitrocat pops up on eBay any cheaper, before I buy one next week.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230046175943

So far it looks like I can get it for under $140 including shipping. I've used it a bunch more today, and I seriously love this gun. One of the other techs was talking to me toyday while I rotated a set of tires - yeah, he had to raise his voice, but we were having a conversation with the gun in use.

There's no way to avoid hearing damage with a gun like the thunder gun or an IR 231 unless you wear earplugs. With the Titanium guns, they're a LOT quieter than an old-school gun, but I still wore earplugs because they were still fairly loud, and you had to YELL to be heard over it. The Aircat specs say it's about 10 dB quieter than the Ti (86 vs 95), which equates to half the volume. I'd definitely believe it - this thing is super quiet. :)

On the differing specs, are you referring to the 1/2" mini being rated at 700 ft/lb and the 3/8" being rated at 500, even though the only difference is the anvil size? Be warned that they apprently use torque specs to match IR's "Nut Busting Torque" rating of 1,000 ft/lb on the 2135. Expect a gun just as strong as your current 2135 or 2112, and you'll be dead on. They're almost the exact same strength, and I see no reason for the 3/8" version to be any different. ;)

The wierdest thing is that the Aircat is so quiet and doesn't shudder in your hand - so it "feels" REALLY weak compared to the Ti. But the fasteners don't seem to be able to tell the diffence. :thumbup:

[kartracer55]

Nice!. Got you Pm's as well. Well now Im really torn. I kinda want to try out the new SK pro-guns as well. The SK 1/2 goes for about 160, and it say will loosen a nu tightened to 1,000 ft lbs in 4 seconds compared to the ti's 6-7 seconds. 510ft lbs max, 8500 rpm, 4.27lbs. How do those specs compare to the Aircat?

So now im stuck between the Aircat/nitrocat 3/8 and the SK pro gun. The Nitrocat I can get for about 140, 500ftlbs in reverse. The SK Im seeing right here only has like 280 and is a bit more expensive, but its a composite/magnesium housing so it weighs less than 3 lbs.

Hmm... Wheres that aircat made?

Jim

[TNToy]

The SK uses the same twin-hammer setup that the IR uses. My guess is that it's basically a copy of the Ingersoll composite line. That means you'll have a pretty good idea what to expect.

I would guess that IR must have a patent on the forward/reverse buttons - but not on the twin-hammer design, since no one who builds a powerful, plastic gun uses the quick-change buttons... but they all use the same mechanism.

So the aircat will probably be smoother and quieter than the SK, as well. Don't hear me wrong on the weight: The only thing the aircat is heavier than (Titanium IR) is the lightest gun on the market. I never actually noticed the difference when I was using it all day - it wasn't annoying at all... but when you hefted 'em side by side there was a difference...

I do not know where the Aircat is made. Given the lack of a huge "Made in USA" badge on the box, I would guess, not here. The big question is: Do YOU know where the SK is made? Almost every tool company farms out their pneumatic tool manufacturing to someone else - does SK?

[wantedabiggergarage]

The SK uses the same twin-hammer setup that the IR uses. My guess is that it's basically a copy of the Ingersoll composite line. That means you'll have a pretty good idea what to expect.

I would guess that IR must have a patent on the forward/reverse buttons - but not on the twin-hammer design, since no one who builds a powerful, plastic gun uses the quick-change buttons... but they all use the same mechanism.

So the aircat will probably be smoother and quieter than the SK, as well. Don't hear me wrong on the weight: The only thing the aircat is heavier than (Titanium IR) is the lightest gun on the market. I never actually noticed the difference when I was using it all day - it wasn't annoying at all... but when you hefted 'em side by side there was a difference...

I do not know where the Aircat is made. Given the lack of a huge "Made in USA" badge on the box, I would guess, not here. The big question is: Do YOU know where the SK is made? Almost every tool company farms out their pneumatic tool manufacturing to someone else - does SK?

I believe there was a post here about the SK guns. They were listed on Ebay as bing made in the USA, and the poster said when he contacted SK, they said, No they are not.

[chevy302dz]

The AirCat composite impacts are nice:thumbup: , has anyone used any of their other air tools yet (cutoff guns, drills, etc)?

[wantedabiggergarage]

Was given a Mac tools mini catalog last week. Finally got through it this morning, they are rebranding and selling the aircats.
The one I was looking at online $69.99 +shipping, in the Mac catalog $209.

[TNToy]

What aircat is $70? I'm guessing a ratchet or something. It's definitely not an impact...

[wantedabiggergarage]

What aircat is $70? I'm guessing a ratchet or something. It's definitely not an impact...


They have been selling so well, he has up'd them to $75 (buy it now). YES IT'S an IMPACT. The one I was looking at was the old standard (they list it at less specs then Aircat does), but it is 1/2" drive in a 3/8" body.

[TNToy]

Found it. (This one (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/500LBS-MINI-COMPOSITE-AIRCAT-GUN-1-2-AR-IMPACT-WRENCH_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ43988QQihZ015QQi temZ250044912743QQrdZ1))

I'd really love to buy an AirCat to compare my NitroCat to. Since it uses the same mechanism as the IR, I'm betting it'd handle diffferently from the NitroCat's twin-clutch design - more vibration in the handle/wrist because the hammers rotate left/right instead of the clutches which pund front/rear. But I just can't bring myself to look at anything other than the nitrocat lineup - dang. :D

[TNToy]

Okay. I bought an Aircat Nitro Cat off of eBay for $163 shipped (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180041907901). Disclaimer: I've used it for exactly one day at work. Should my opinion change after a week, month, etc... I'll be sure to chime back in.

Well it's been a while now, and it finally happened. I removed something with an IR Titanium that the NitroCat couldn't get off. :(

I was doing an alignment on a car and had to adjust the front camber. This requires loosening the two large bolts at the bottom of the strut that hold it to the knucke, while the tire is still on. You take a deep 21mm, stick a swivel on it, and snake your gun in there from under the car to do it quick and fast.

Well, a swivel and a deep socket on a partially-rounded fastener, through a tiny 1/4" air hose instead of the 3/8" one I usually use? It wasn't an ideal situation for maximum torque. I can FEEL the power loss trying to run my 'Cat through the tiny hoses built into our alignment rack every time I do it - it's very obvious. This was really a worst-case scenario. A wobble joint seriously cuts down on how hard the gun hammers on things.

Anyway... wailed on it with the nitrocat for about 20 seconds reverse, then forward, then back to reverse. Grabbed a Ti from another tech... and the nut sloooowwwwly backed off in about 5 seconds.

So it appears the NitroCat is not quite as powerful as the Titanium. But it's really, really close. I'm still going to be using this gun all the time even though it appears that it doesn't win the uber-torque contest. It's quiet, and I like my hearing. And even if it's down 5, 10, or 50 ft lbs. on the IR it's still realy strong. And more importantly, I can buy a 3/8" and a 1/2" aircat for the price of the 2135Ti.

Hope it helps. Just trying to be as fair as possible. It's possible that the NitroCat just isn't as efficient as the IR - maybe the IR just does better when starved of the nessecary volume to run full-bore. I do know that that nut would have come loose if I hadn't been running the AirCat through a straw, on a swivel joint.

For those of you using a pencil-thin 1/4" hose... stop. Go buy a 3/8" one with 1/4" fittings on the ends. ;)

[eschoendorff]

1/4" air hose? I think all my stuff is 3/8" (the Goodyear hose at Harbor Freight)... in fact, I don't remember ever seeing 1/4" air hose....

[TNToy]

Maybe I have that wrong on the sizing. I'm not sure.

Either way, there's two common sizes of air hose. A thinner one, and a larger diameter one. I pretty much always use the thicker one. The hose on the alimgent rack I was using is that thin, hard coiled plastic stuff. Really restricts your airflow...

[eschoendorff]

Maybe I have that wrong on the sizing. I'm not sure.

Either way, there's two common sizes of air hose. A thinner one, and a larger diameter one. I pretty much always use the thicker one. The hose on the alimgent rack I was using is that thin, hard coiled plastic stuff. Really restricts your airflow...
Oh those hoses.... yeah I know what you mean. And I avoid those pieces of s*** like the plague!

[kartracer55]

There IS a reason they tell you you need a 3/8 hose on the box...








That 1/4 hose really does restric air tools. I cant even run my air ratchet at full power on the 1/4 coil hose for airing up tires, and that doesnt draw much air. Plus the hoses on racks are a joke. They give you a little 1/4inch coupler expecting you to use a 1/4 hose with the thing.

Jim

[TNToy]

Exactly. Now skipping the coiled plastic hoses...

There are still two common sizes of rubber hose. One has a 1/4" inside diameter, and is about half an inch thick. That's the one I was telling you to skip... and I do see a lot of people using them.

The larger hose with a 3/8" inside diameter is around 5/8" or 3/4" thick, and you can definitely tell the difference when you're used to running the gun with this hose all day... and switch to the smaller one. ;)

[lilpeenoiracer]

looks like tooltopia sells these now for ebay price. made me cry since i just got mine at norhtern tools few weeks ago.
http://www.tooltopia.com/index.asp?PageAction=MFGSEARCH&ManfID=264&Page=1

this thing is one of my quietest tools... thinking about selling my ir1200 for the aircats 3/8s air ratchet for the quietness.

[69lkmno]

Yeah, I just got mine yesterday from Ebay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=013&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWN%3AIT&viewitem=&item=230058830807&rd=1,1

[TNToy]

The only problem with ToolTopia is they don't sell the NitroCat in 3/8" drive. And I need to order one.

They have the nitro in 1/2" and 1/2"-in-3/8"-body flavors. But they only sell the twin hammer standard aircat in 3/8" drive. So I've gotta do like LKMNO did and buy one on ebay. I keep putting one bid on 'em and getting out-bid. I refuse to pay more than $130 + $7 to ship... since the auctions come up constantly, I'm not going to bid one up to $150 just to get it right now.

I should have bought all the aircats I wanted on eBay... THEN posted my review of it all over the place. DUH! :(

[Ramblur]

I should have bought all the aircats I wanted on eBay... THEN posted my review of it all over the place. DUH! :(

I got mine.:thumbup: :lol_hitti

[lilpeenoiracer]

im going to wait till tooltopia stocks up on the 3/8s nitrocat ill email them tonight and see what they can do for us.

[kartracer55]

hte 3/8 nitro's are tough to find. Try searching "exhaust technologies" its the official company name. You should find a few links, I know I did

Jim

[TNToy]

Did you end up buying an aircat, Jim? I never did see you say which gun you decided on.

[lilpeenoiracer]

k well tool topia said as of right now they wont be getting the 1355-XL adn they didnt say any thing else.

[SteveU]

I just recieved my 1/2" Nitrocat, this thing is awesome! Noise level is actually lower than my 250 ft lb toolkit impact. Took the cheap gun & hammered a lugnut on for 10 sec then switched to the Nitrocat heard da da da vroom. Next took the nitrocat on the lowest setting & tightened it back on & decided to stop while it was still turning & switched back to the cheap gun, wouldn't touch it. Next test was to hand torque a nut to 150 lbs with a torque wrench then loosen it with the cat, same thing, 2 or 3 impacts then spins off where the cheap gun would hammer on it for a second or so before loosening it. This was running 3/8" hose with type V hvlp fittings on both guns at 90psi. Don't have a good gun to compare it to but it blows away the cheapies.

[TNToy]

UPDATE:

Still satisfied as anything over here. I just bought a 3/8" Nitrocat off of eBay today. Finally. Been hurting for a 3/8" gun for a while...

If you're in the market for a 1/2" drive gun, Tooltopia has the Nitrocat for $134 to your door. I just wish they had a 3/8" ntircat - I would have bought there.
http://www.tooltopia.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=24880

Anyone whose bought an Aircat/Nitrocat recently, post up your review in here, please. :D

[SteveU]

The Nitrocat got a bit of a workout the other day. Buddy brought over his 4wd pickup & used it to loosen the locking hub bolts on the front wheels. Earlier in the day he had tried it at home using a 4' cheater bar & bounced up & down on it with all 200 lbs with no luck. I was in the house watching the kids but he told me that it hammered on the drivers side for 15-20 seconds before spinning it off, the passenger side came off after about 3-5 seconds. Earlier in the day I figured what the heck & got under my 84 dodge ram pickup that has been run thru some of our michigan winters & took out 2 of the bumper mount bolts that go thru the frame just to see if it would do it. Due to rust, it hammered on them all the way off but made steady progress never stalling out. Cleaned them up & put them back figuring that if it took these off shouldn't be anything that I do that it won't either loosen or break off. I'm with TNT, when it's time for a 3/8" gun it will be a nitrocat. Looking thru the specs, the 3/8" nitrocat is stronger than a lot of 1/2" guns & the 1/2" is stronger than several 3/4" guns:thumbup:

[Proeliator]

I got that 1/2 nitrocat for christmas and LOVE it. Strong, quiet, its fantastic. My buddy came over and was using it (he has the ti) and he liked how it felt (doesn't beat on you) and how quiet it was. When I told him the price he got real bitter. :D

[TNToy]

...When I told him the price he got real bitter. :D
Yeah. That's the best part.

If this gun cost MORE than a $300 2135Ti... I don't know if I'd have gone for it. Probably, but I would have thought a lot more about it first.

Fortunately, parting with $300 for an Aircat isn't something I have to justify. :D

[KeukaDan]

what is the difference between the ACA1000-M, ACA1000-TH and the ACA1000-TC? I see that the TH is cheaper and that the M has flames but other than that I haven't seen the spec differences.

[z28toz06]

In your comparison I might have missed it but are you comparing 2 similarly sized guns? Are they both capable of 500 lb feet? Or are you comparing a 450 lb ft aircat to a 1000 lb TI? This sight has good prices on aircats. I have a snapon blue point that I like but if I could sell it I would buy an aircat in a second. Anyone interested in a snapon/bluepoint 1/2" gun? Brand new. Changed a set of coilovers in my sons EVO, that's the only time its been used. 150 plus shipping/
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/NTESearch?storeId=6970&N=0&Ntk=All&Ntt=aircat&Nty=1&D=aircat&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Dx=mode+matchallpartial

[SteveU]

The TH is twin hammer & the TC is twin clutch. The twin clutch doesn't hit as often as the twin hammer but hits harder according to their faq. Most of the traditional impacts like IR use twin hammer, Aircat is the only one I have seen that does the twin clutch. It is real smooth, quiet & powerful, I didn't notice much if any vibration even when taking off rusty bumper mount bolts on an 18 yr old pickup. According to the site the Nitrocat is aircats premium offering, I'm real happy with mine. Far as longevity goes, however many weeks TNT's lasts, mine should last that many years with the amount of use it'll get around here. Right now I should be good to about 2020 :beer:

[TNToy]

what is the difference between the ACA1000-M, ACA1000-TH and the ACA1000-TC? I see that the TH is cheaper and that the M has flames but other than that I haven't seen the spec differences.

TH - Twin hammer gun. This is the mechanism that most everyone else uses. Louder and shakes more, but proven and very durable.

TC - Twin clutch. Unique to the Nitrocat as far as I know. Much smoother operation, and instead of a sound like an incredibly loud 'jingle' or 'rattle' it just ticks like a vehicle with a bad lifter or the exhaust leak from hell. If you look at the exploded diagram posted earlier by me, the primary moving parts (the hammers, or clutches, depending)... a twin hammer has two rotating hammers that spin inside the casing. The clutches move front-rear, and this would explain why the Nitrocat is easier on your wrists.

In your comparison I might have missed it but are you comparing 2 similarly sized guns? Are they both capable of 500 lb feet? Or are you comparing a 450 lb ft aircat to a 1000 lb TI?
The Nitrocat with the twin-clutch mechanism is what I've got. Both Ingersoll-Rand's 2135TI and Aircat's Nitrocat are rated at 600 ft/lb... with a theoretical ability to loosen a fastener torqued to 100 ft/lb if it hammers on it for a while. As is the case with most everyone else, the salesmen like to put the larger number in big, bold letters.

I personally feel that all guns are over-rated. A 250 ft/lb gun that's $28 from Home Depot can't hardly torque a bolt to 100ft/lb to save it's life. There's no way my Nitrocat has struggled with the fasteners it has, which are worst-case vehicle bolts (large suspension-component bolts that haven't been removed in 120,000+ miles) if it can actually bust loose a 600 ft/lb bolt.

But the IR is it's primary competitor, and is over-rated equally with this one. They're both about he same strength. It's just that when I've used a Titanium gun after becoming used to my Nitrocat... it's loud as f*@&-ing hell. And until I used the aircat, that was the quietest gun I'd ever seen.

This sight has good prices on aircats. I have a snapon blue point that I like but if I could sell it I would buy an aircat in a second. Anyone interested in a snapon/bluepoint 1/2" gun? Brand new. Changed a set of coilovers in my sons EVO, that's the only time its been used. 150 plus shipping/
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/NTESearch?storeId=6970&N=0&Ntk=All&Ntt=aircat&Nty=1&D=aircat&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Dx=mode+matchallpartial
It's a Snap-On tool. Trade it in on the Snap-On truck for $$ toward some handtools you badly need. I traded my 3/8" Snap-On gun in, and got myself a 3/8" Nitrocat last week. He'll gladly take a like-new tool back at a loss to you, and turn around and sell it at the next shop down the road for $50 more. ;)

And here's the review right now... :D

[TNToy]

Okay. So I FINALLY managed to weasel a 3/8" Nitrocat out from under yall's noses on eBay. I'll never make the mistake of telling you all to hit eBay for a tool, until I've bought all of MINE first. :p :D

Here's some direct comparison pictures of the 1/2" and 3/8" Nitrocats. Been using the 3/8" gun for 4 or 5 days, and loving it. You have no idea how LIGHT that gun is. It feels about the same weight as my 1/4" air ratchet. My composite IR 1200 3/8" air ratchet weighs than this thing!

I've been using it to remove lugs during services, since it's so light you can fling it around in one hand. The 1/2" Nitro is light and all, but not like this thing. :D

Noise? I thought the 1/2" was quiet, but the 3/8" is amazing. Conversations with it going vrrrrrrrrr in the background aren't at all difficult.

[ImportTuner]

I added the 3/8 Nitrocat to my collection about 3 months ago; fantastic wrench - has almost the power of most 1/2" impacts and is so light and quiet. It's a great complement to my IR 2135TI and IR 2131.
:bounce: :bounce:

[toolfreak]

The 3/8 nitrocat is on the top of my list of air tools to get since I don't care much for my snap on gun. A guy at work is trying to tell me to get the new snap on 3/8 at over $300 and there is no way I will have another snap on impact. I told him about the ir titaniums and the nitrocat but he swears by all snap on 3/8s impacts even though they are almost twice the price.

[ImportTuner]

I also have the Blue Point AT355A 3/8" impact; it does not come near the power of the 3/8" Nitrocat and cost half as much ...
:bounce:

[TNToy]

Oh, you mean this one (http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?search=true&item_ID=75610&PartNo=mg31&group_id=19753&supersede=&store=snapon-store&tool=all). ;)

One of the guys at work was out for 3 months when he cut his hand open with a utility knife. Dude has every snap-on tool made. I had been using a Titanium 3/8" drive IR at the time, and asked him if I could borrow the MG31 to try it out while he was gone. He let me, and I used it for about 5 fasteners - did the swaybar links on the back of an S80 with it, or tried to. Wouldn't zip then down without the tie-rod end spinning. The IR did. The Snappy had nowhere near the power of either my 3/8" IR or the new Nitrocat.

I also used to own the old standy Snap-On 3/8" gun, the IM31 (http://cgi.ebay.com/SNAP-ON-IM31-IMPACT-WRENCH_W0QQitemZ130061697149QQcmdZViewItem). Traded it in and got a Nitrocat.

So I've used all 4 guns you either own, or are looking to own. Trust me, get a Nitrocat. It's the best of the 4. It also has two awesome attributes: Price, and the ability to literally use it all day without damaging your hearing. Most techs my age won't care about that until they're 55 and mostly deaf. But I do.

The primary benefit to Snappy impacts is lifespan. They last at least 5 years if oiled several times a week (I actually do oil my Nitrocats twice a day) and they're always $75 to get rebuilt, no questions, even if 'rebuilt' requires a whole new gun.

The Titanium IRs dont last nearly as long as the metal-cased Snap-Ons, but have more power and weigh less and are quieter. The Aircats do everything IR does even *better* ... but the lifespan is the X factor.

So far my 1/2" is still working like it's brand new, after removing and re-installing about 8,000 lugnuts by my math (8 cars/day over 50 work days since purchased)... and that's not including all the other, much tighter fasteners that got worked on once the tires were off.

[toolfreak]

Yeah I have the im31 and the guy at work just bought the mg31 and is telling me how much power it has. I will have to quit buying other tools and buy a 3/8 nitrocat. I don't think I will ever get the 1/2 since the IR ti's everyone at work has tried usually doesn't last a year before needing a rebuild.

[TNToy]

I'll let you know in a year or two how the IR Ti and the Nitrocat compare. One of the guys at work just bought the re-badged Matco version of the 2135Ti, so we bought ours within weeks of each other.

Whichever one dies first, I'll be sure to post up. I suppose it won't be a straight comparison, though... since mine is oiled twice a day, and I haven't seen him oil his at all yet.

[Deafautotech]

i had bought mac tool aw434 2 year ago for 75 dollars and it work good as i bought it when it did rebuilt and it is really loud as other techs told me to quiet down. then i got snap on IM5100 (50 dollars as snap on guy tried sell it quick so sold me for 50 dollars instead 100 dollars.) i had both and it work me really good but my work get tired of my louder air tools. so i did buy it now IR 2135ti rebuilt by IR service center for 125 dollars in ebay then 7 dollars to shipping. so when i got it and use it in my work. they starting looking at me and what is that air tool that are quieter than my snap on and mac tools impact wrenches. they are happy that i got IR2135ti as very powerful and quieter. but i found out that someone take off muffler on my snap on im5100 before i bought and mac tool aw434 that have no muffler. i dont care how much loud of it made but i need it to work. i am deaf so i only need buy tool to service me good and long time. i still use my snap on im5100 for tires rotation and brakes. i dont need powerful impact to work on simple work that only use for 10 mins.

I always lube oil in my all air tools as i use Lucas air tool lube bottle that sell 5 dollars for one bottle as about 50oz or more. it is really good for my air tools.

[toolfreak]

I have to give the IR TI credit since a guy at work has used his to take off cutting edge bolts on a scraper that were either put on with a 3/4 or 1" impact. I do believe that has alot to do with why they don't last long when working on heavy equipment.

[kartracer55]

The 3/8 nitrocat is, by far, the best 3/8's gun I have ever used. My only complaint is that the trigger is not quite as easy to control as other guns. It is light, powerful, and most of all, quiet. I can run it full speed and it is about the same level as my cordless drill.

Its a bit overkill, I mean a 100$ cp gun will also work for alot of things too. So its not like you absolutly NEED to buy this gun and replace your others, but if your in the market for a gun, I would definetly consider it.

Im also not a big fan of the direction control. I prefer the Ti's push buttons to the twist dial in tha back. I think my favorite is the snap on's, because you can use your thumb and quickly reverse the gun while in use, but again... its not a big deal.


As for the pin clutch design, other companies use it. Kaeser impact wrenches also use this setup. It just isnt very popular, but I have a feeling we will see this style becoming more and more popular thanks to these nitro-cats.

Jim

[wilbilt]

Just curious, unless I missed it earlier in this thread...

What air pressure are you running to compare? I know many tools are rated for 90PSI maximum, yet are routinely operated at 150PSI or more.

I know 175PSI can really wake up a tired CP gun, but for how long?

[SteveU]

175 psi? Wouldn't that be like running nitrous in the family car?

[wilbilt]

175 psi? Wouldn't that be like running nitrous in the family car?

Well, maybe...but I only did it that one time...and nobody saw...


Seriously, I'm curious as to the PSI you guys are running. Owners tend to run their air at whatever the compressor is set to out of the box. It was 175 most places I worked, with no regulators at the drops. If you wanted a lower pressure, you had best supply your own regulator.

The tired Emglo I have at home was set to 175PSI when I got it. I have "detuned" it to 125PSI and run my tools at 90-100PSI, which seems adequate for what I'm doing these days.

[kartracer55]

I run my tools at 95psi at home. Everything at work is at 120-145 or so from two rotary screw compressors, so its pretty much a constant 145.... the nitro cat on 95 still runs circles around snap ons at 140

Jim

[wilbilt]

the nitro cat on 95 still runs circles around snap ons at 140
Jim

Now that's good info...;)

[TNToy]

My comparisons were all done at 90 PSI.

Again, same thing. My off-road toy (a Toyota) has an on-board engine driven air compressor on it. I run it at 150 PSI.

None of my other guns (Titanium excluded) have as much oomph at 150 PSI as the Nitrocat does at 90.

[ImportTuner]

I run all my air tools at 95 PSI ... seems to work fine.
:)

[paulgoh]

I bought the 1/2" Nitrocat after reading the review here but to my utter disappointment, it can't remove my Civic's crankshaft bolt...:(

I ended up linking all of my 1/2" impact extension, 17 mm impact socket, a crankshaft pulley holder, a 1/2" breaker bar and a 4 ft cheater bar to break it loose. I literally have to lean my whole body weight onto the bar and the crankshaft bolt finally broke loose with a loud crack.

I think the Nitrocat is quiet and cool and powerful for all the other fasteners I've encountered on my cars and it is well worth the money. However, I would like to hear your opinions on which impact wrench is good enough for a crankshaft bolt?

[Uncle Buck]

I bought the 1/2" Nitrocat after reading the review here but to my utter disappointment, it can't remove my Civic's crankshaft bolt...:(

I ended up linking all of my 1/2" impact extension, 17 mm impact socket, a crankshaft pulley holder, a 1/2" breaker bar and a 4 ft cheater bar to break it loose. I literally have to lean my whole body weight onto the bar and the crankshaft bolt finally broke loose with a loud crack.

I think the Nitrocat is quiet and cool and powerful for all the other fasteners I've encountered on my cars and it is well worth the money. However, I would like to hear your opinions on which impact wrench is good enough for a crankshaft bolt?

This is just the kind of task that 3/4" set no one ever sees a need to keep was made for, and a prime example of why I keep my set! :beer:

[ImportTuner]

I bought the 1/2" Nitrocat after reading the review here but to my utter disappointment, it can't remove my Civic's crankshaft bolt...:(

I ended up linking all of my 1/2" impact extension, 17 mm impact socket, a crankshaft pulley holder, a 1/2" breaker bar and a 4 ft cheater bar to break it loose. I literally have to lean my whole body weight onto the bar and the crankshaft bolt finally broke loose with a loud crack.

I think the Nitrocat is quiet and cool and powerful for all the other fasteners I've encountered on my cars and it is well worth the money. However, I would like to hear your opinions on which impact wrench is good enough for a crankshaft bolt?

My IR2135 worked great on a 1988 Honda Accord .... 2001 Civic, and 2003 Civic ..

[PoorOwner]

I bought the 1/2" Nitrocat after reading the review here but to my utter disappointment, it can't remove my Civic's crankshaft bolt...:(

I ended up linking all of my 1/2" impact extension, 17 mm impact socket, a crankshaft pulley holder, a 1/2" breaker bar and a 4 ft cheater bar to break it loose. I literally have to lean my whole body weight onto the bar and the crankshaft bolt finally broke loose with a loud crack.

I think the Nitrocat is quiet and cool and powerful for all the other fasteners I've encountered on my cars and it is well worth the money. However, I would like to hear your opinions on which impact wrench is good enough for a crankshaft bolt?

Next time maybe you can see if you can put the breaker bar on the ground and crank the starter, make sure the direction of course.

Not sure why the nitrocat couldn't get it off. Probably loctited from the factory so who knows what loosening torque it required. Sounded like you made about 800 ft lbs

[paulgoh]

My IR2135 worked great on a 1988 Honda Accord .... 2001 Civic, and 2003 Civic ..

Argh!! Initially I wanted an IR 2135QTi...but got the Nitrocat after reading the review...ARGH!!!! Are all of your crankshaft bolts factory fresh or pre-owned? What kinda pressure did you set and how long did it take?

[jimmycrackcorn]

Next time maybe you can see if you can put the breaker bar on the ground and crank the starter, make sure the direction of course.

Not sure why the nitrocat couldn't get it off. Probably loctited from the factory so who knows what loosening torque it required. Sounded like you made about 800 ft lbs

Olympic Prybar throwing......

Could be compressor, how long you let it hit for before you gave up. Alil' air tool oil helps gives it some extra bang, makes the vanes seal better....

[jimmycrackcorn]

Argh!! Initially I wanted an IR 2135QTi...but got the Nitrocat after reading the review...ARGH!!!! Are all of your crankshaft bolts factory fresh or pre-owned? What kinda pressure did you set and how long did it take?

2135qti old news, 2135timax

http://www.pten.com/images/article/1189615762284_totm5.jpg
Impactool packs more torque
Ingersoll Rand Productivity Solutions' 2135TiMAX 1/2" Impactool delivers 780 ft./lbs. of reverse torque and 1,100 ft./lbs. of nut-busting torque. With more than 10 percent added torque than the original model, the new model weighs 3.95 lbs., for a power-to-weight ratio resulting in less operator fatigue. The tool's twin-hammer mechanism allows more power per pound and is less sensitive to air pressure fluctuations. Other features include:
• A variable-speed trigger and patented power regulator with enhanced settings allow better torque in a variety of demanding applications.
• One-handed forward-reverse controls switch between tasks or applications.
• Optimal airflow means better tool efficiency and maximum performance.

[paulgoh]

Olympic Prybar throwing......

Could be compressor, how long you let it hit for before you gave up. Alil' air tool oil helps give it some extra bang, makes the vanes seal better....

I set the compressor to 90 PSI (running PSI, not static PSI, i.e., I run the impact gun while I look at the regulator) and let it hit for about 30 seconds (I have a 25 gallon 2 stage 175 PSI compressor). Then I set it to 120 PSI and let it hit for another 30 seconds. After that, I gave up...:(

[Amarkel]

Any pressure over 90psi will not increase torque according IR, but it will increase tool speed. As for damage, I don't know, I will check with the guys at IR.

Any one using an IR Thunder Gun out there?

[SteveU]

Using high flow fittings also gives about any air tool extra oomph. I have had good luck with Milton type V HVLP fittings but have also read on here about a few guys using 3/8" fittings.

[jimmycrackcorn]

Any one using an IR Thunder Gun out there?

Those things are mean!

Using high flow fittings also gives about any air tool extra oomph. I have had good luck with Milton type V HVLP fittings but have also read on here about a few guys using 3/8" fittings.

I gotta try that

[Lug-Nut]

In response to an earlier post on the new 2135Ti - you can check it out on the website (www.irtools.com/2135timax). It's supposed to have more torque (780 ft-lb) and apparently, there's a quiet version of it.

[kartracer55]

I set the compressor to 90 PSI (running PSI, not static PSI, i.e., I run the impact gun while I look at the regulator) and let it hit for about 30 seconds (I have a 25 gallon 2 stage 175 PSI compressor). Then I set it to 120 PSI and let it hit for another 30 seconds. After that, I gave up...:(

Id say your compressor doesn't put out enough air to run the gun. Its all about the CFM, not just the pressure. My guess is the gun can make full power for a second or two and then the power just drops off. The best gun in the world doesnt mean anything if theres not enough air behind it.

[jwith68]

Well, based on the favorable reviews here and a few other places, I just bought a Nitrocat 1000TC off eBay. Got a smoking good deal on it, like $104.99, shipped! :thumbup:

I think this was one of those instances where a minor listing error kept a lot of people from finding it - it was listed as a "Nitro Cat" instead of a "Nitrocat". Just now won the auction, sure hope it all comes through OK (seller does have a 100% positive rating.) I'll post a review after I get chance to exercise it a bit, but I will only be able to compare it to an early IR 2131 and an el-cheapo.

[nissan_crawler]

Well, based on the favorable reviews here and a few other places, I just bought a Nitrocat 1000TC off eBay. Got a smoking good deal on it, like $104.99, shipped! :thumbup:

I think this was one of those instances where a minor listing error kept a lot of people from finding it - it was listed as a "Nitro Cat" instead of a "Nitrocat". Just now won the auction, sure hope it all comes through OK (seller does have a 100% positive rating.) I'll post a review after I get chance to exercise it a bit, but I will only be able to compare it to an early IR 2131 and an el-cheapo.

Don't worry, I bought the Nitrocat and after using it once, I promptly sold my IR TI. This convinced me to buy a 1/4" Aircat ratchet. It flat out makes my Ir look pathetic, plus the trigger is MUCH better, not too mention the noise. That prompted me to get an aircat die grinder to replace my dying IR. Once again, no comparison.

Aircat has convinced this long time IR fan to slowly replace all IR stock with Aircat.

[krusty the clown]

i bought a nitrocat 2 years ago and was impressed at first however it has been losing power steadily since i have owned it despite oiling on a regular basis. it finally got to the point i bought a ti after using the bosses to remove what my nitrocat wouldn't. the ti is twice the gun. i still use the nitrocat for tire work on the lowest setting it put lugnuts at 70 ftlbs.

btw the honda's engine rotates counterclockwise so using the engines starter will tighten the crankshaftbolt.

[engnerdan]

Any pressure over 90psi will not increase torque according IR, but it will increase tool speed. As for damage, I don't know, I will check with the guys at IR.

Any one using an IR Thunder Gun out there?

I know that info is according to IR, who knows what they have going on inside there gun. I know for a fact that more air pressure (with flow to match) will make more torque nad higher speeds. I have a 1/2 MAC gun and last night it would not budge some flexplate bolts (split a impact socket but would not move them) at 90-100psi. So I cranked the regulator up to max (between 145-175 what ever the tank pressure is) and boom they came off. I know I don't have a flow problem, 80 gallon tank high flow reg, and all high flow fittings, and all 3/8 or better hose.

My Matco/IR 2112 3/8 gun becomes insane at 175 psi, its dangerous to use. At 90psi it is rated like 9,500rpm. It will throw a fastener and socket into orbit if you are not careful.

-Dan

[SteveU]

i bought a nitrocat 2 years ago and was impressed at first however it has been losing power steadily since i have owned it despite oiling on a regular basis. it finally got to the point i bought a ti after using the bosses to remove what my nitrocat wouldn't. the ti is twice the gun. i still use the nitrocat for tire work on the lowest setting it put lugnuts at 70 ftlbs. .

There was a post by TNT about removing the 5mm allen screw ahead of the trigger on the underside of the gun & putting some lube in there, he said it made a difference on his. Search for 'grease those nitrocats' or similar for the thread. This will be the first thing I do if mine starts losing power.

[wrenchr]

I will have to peep these out next week on the Mac truck.

[krusty the clown]

There was a post by TNT about removing the 5mm allen screw ahead of the trigger on the underside of the gun & putting some lube in there, he said it made a difference on his. Search for 'grease those nitrocats' or similar for the thread. This will be the first thing I do if mine starts losing power.

mine calls for oil according to aircats website. it didn't seem to help much.

[jay50]

i bought a nitrocat 2 years ago and was impressed at first however it has been losing power steadily since i have owned it despite oiling on a regular basis. it finally got to the point i bought a ti after using the bosses to remove what my nitrocat wouldn't. the ti is twice the gun. i still use the nitrocat for tire work on the lowest setting it put lugnuts at 70 ftlbs.

btw the honda's engine rotates counterclockwise so using the engines starter will tighten the crankshaftbolt.

Before buying my IR TI MAX recently; I stopped by a garage where I know a couple of the guys who have been wrenching there to see what they were using. They were switching back to IR; the NitroCats were not holding up very well and did not have the power of the IR...:shocking:

[Moose-LandTran]

Any one using an IR Thunder Gun out there?

i really want to get me one of them. we don't get them over here in the UK, so i'd have to get one sent to me. but i think at some time i'll have to get one and give it a try.

[grzmonkey]

SK and Aircat are from Taiwan ... careful on service and parts availability. Don't see many CP fans on this site ... my box is loaded CP 7740 1/2", 7830 3/8" ratchet (only ratchet that will compete agains the SO at 1/2" the price, 734 1/2" impact (for back up).

[Sack]

Any one using an IR Thunder Gun out there?

I've been using one for about 6 years now and love it. It's been up to every task, never failing me. It ain't quiet, ain't light, but takes off any fastener I need it to.

[DavidtheDuke]

btw the honda's engine rotates counterclockwise so using the engines starter will tighten the crankshaftbolt.

I can't wait to try out the MG725 against those damn Honda crank bolts with PSI @ 180

[TNToy]

I have to say that I was very happy with the Nitrocat for approximately one year of shop use. Then I had to borrow a 2135Ti, and a 2135TiMAX, to remove a couple of things the 'Cat wouldn't.

So I bought a TiMAX to use at work, and took the Nitrocat home.

[jay50]

I can't wait to try out the MG725 against those damn Honda crank bolts with PSI @ 180

Thoses factory installed Honda crank bolts are $%#& to remove. Most 1/2 drives will not remove them and even some weaker 3/4 impacts. I believe red loctite is used on the original factory bolts.

I have resorted to removing them by apply heat to the face of the bolt followed by a 4 foot piece of steel pipe slipped over the handle of a 2 foot breaker bar with socket. Helper holds the pulley hold-down tool in place and I apply the force. Man, when that bolt finally lets loose, it sounds like a rifle being shot. Scares the crap out of anyone around...:lol_hitti

[DavidtheDuke]

Scares the crap out of anyone around...:lol_hitti Oh I know, me and dad do it with every bolt. He holds the flywheel and I grab an exhaust pipe and my cheap 1/2 breaker bar :beer:

[PoorOwner]

I bought mostly aircat tools based on TNToy's recommendation from earlier. So it won't hold up to shop use? I wonder what is wearing out and can it be repaired?

I think I might still be OK since I only use it occasionally at home. The aircats are cheaper than IR Ti series so that's another reason for me to choose aircat.

[PoorOwner]

Thoses factory installed Honda crank bolts are $%#& to remove. Most 1/2 drives will not remove them and even some weaker 3/4 impacts. I believe red loctite is used on the original factory bolts.

I have resorted to removing them by apply heat to the face of the bolt followed by a 4 foot piece of steel pipe slipped over the handle of a 2 foot breaker bar with socket. Helper holds the pulley hold-down tool in place and I apply the force. Man, when that bolt finally lets loose, it sounds like a rifle being shot. Scares the crap out of anyone around...:lol_hitti

And what brand of breaker bar are you using for this operation? I think if I try that with my HF bars it will shear at the swivel.

[DavidtheDuke]

And what brand of breaker bar are you using for this operation? I think if I try that with my HF bars it will shear at the swivel.

I have a Goodwrench one, looks like Taiwan or China (doesn't say). I've popped Honda bolts among other things that took a 4+ foot cheater bar. $20 I paid, well spent so far.

[eschoendorff]

And what brand of breaker bar are you using for this operation? I think if I try that with my HF bars it will shear at the swivel.

I have a HF 25" 1/2 breaker bar and an S*K 24" 1/2 breaker bar... the HF model flexes a lot... the S*K, not so much, FWIW....

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y17/eschoendorff/breakerbar2.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y17/eschoendorff/breakerbar1.jpg

[Marlin]

Any pressure over 90psi will not increase torque according IR, but it will increase tool speed. As for damage, I don't know, I will check with the guys at IR.

Any one using an IR Thunder Gun out there?

Did you read this in an IR manual? Actually, the performance will increase as the pressure goes up with the downside being it can affect the tool life. In most cases, however, people are not getting the pressure at the tool that they think they are. The 90 psi rating is actully meant to be measured at the inlet of the tool while the tool is running free speed. A lot of people don't realize the pressure drop that occurrs through the hsoe and quick disconnects.

[jay50]

And what brand of breaker bar are you using for this operation? I think if I try that with my HF bars it will shear at the swivel.


Cman breaker bar; has never let me down on these jobs:bowdown:

[tbgallant]

Anybody else have experiance with the Nitrocat 3/8 or 1/2" in a shop environment. Is it down on power or just not as snappy as a new IR? Giving up 100 ft-lbs for the cost savings seems reasonable.. but I don't want to lose 100 ft-lbs every year?

[c.schulz]

Keep me posted on this


Chris

[Moose-LandTran]

I have a HF 25" 1/2 breaker bar and an S*K 24" 1/2 breaker bar... the HF model flexes a lot... the S*K, not so much, FWIW....

Those HF bars, where the end of the bar is pinched are notoriously weak. So many brands sell those bars, i can't tell you how many i've broken. A while ago, me and some friends were setting up to do a huge teardown/rebuild of a friend Dodge Ram, my friend bought 5 of those bars. we broke them all within the first 4 hours or so. they shear/snap just before the swivel head.

The ones with the fork on the bar are the only ones worth buying, when you can find them. i had a cheap one with the fork on the bar and it took a hell of a lot of abuse. (never broke, sold it to a friend.)

Snap-on bars are the way to go, they're expensive but soooo worth it. i have 3!

[wrenchr]

I would like to try a aircat out one of these days!!

[Backyard Mechanic]

I bought mostly aircat tools based on TNToy's recommendation from earlier. So it won't hold up to shop use? I wonder what is wearing out and can it be repaired?

I think I might still be OK since I only use it occasionally at home. The aircats are cheaper than IR Ti series so that's another reason for me to choose aircat.

You can buy excellent used IR 2135TiMAX's on eBay for around $120- or less with a little effort.

[06wt]

Wel i just finished reading this whole thread, so tntony can we get a update? Do u still have the cats? rebuild? gone?

[Marlin]

Wel i just finished reading this whole thread, so tntony can we get a update? Do u still have the cats? rebuild? gone?

I have to say that I was very happy with the Nitrocat for approximately one year of shop use. Then I had to borrow a 2135Ti, and a 2135TiMAX, to remove a couple of things the 'Cat wouldn't.

So I bought a TiMAX to use at work, and took the Nitrocat home.
From a previous post.

[06wt]

i seen that post but that post was made about a year ago. I was just wondering if he still has them and if they needed rebuilding and how easy was it to get parts if he did rebuild them.

[Marlin]

i seen that post but that post was made about a year ago. I was just wondering if he still has them and if they needed rebuilding and how easy was it to get parts if he did rebuild them.

Which product, the IR or the Aircat?

[06wt]

Which product, the IR or the Aircat?

the aircats, im just want to know how long they last. I already have ir impacts but im looking at getting one of the small body 1/2'' aircats