Why doesn't Craftsman make more polished wrenches?
- Thread starter bmwpower
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Deafautotech
Well-known member
craftsman sell polished wrench double box set but it have 45 degree but not 5 degree. i used my craftsman professional 45 dgree and it is good for me to work where 5 degree dont fit in.
Deafautotech said:
Yea, that's what I was referring to...the 5 degree set. I have the 45 degree set and I like it, but sometimes you need something straight on or close to it.
Plus, it would be nice it they have a polished set of any of their specialty wrenches, like half moons (I don't think they're polished).
A polished set of their regular length wrenches would be nice too.
Hell, just polish everything and get rid of the raised panel hand cutters.
Deafautotech
Well-known member
i am agree with you! i like plished wrench as easy to handle and easy to clean it. but i hate to damage polish wrench so i rather damage my matte wrenches so i have no problem...
eschoendorff
Well-known member
Polished wrenches = man jewelry. My wife is just now starting to get this idea....
IntrstlarOvrdrve
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I honestly just can't stand a non polished finish at this point. Easier to clean, and feels better on the hand.
eschoendorff
Well-known member
Yeah... really, inexcusable in 2007. Come on... even the Chinese are goin' shiney!wilbilt said:hahaha
I also think the raised-panel box ratcheting Craftsman Gearwrenches are a bit strange. "Retro", maybe?
JohnZ
Well-known member
I bought two sets of the standard-length fully-polished wrenches about eight years ago; they only offered them for a year or so. I wrote their buyer about five years ago trying to get more, and he suggested I contact S-K, who made them for Sears. Craftsman only has them in the "long-pattern" design now, and I don't need "long-pattern" wrenches. 
Don't tell my wife ... I love my polished wrenched ..eschoendorff said:
TNToy
Well-known member
I just like polished wrenches because everything raised-panel is made out of pot metal, and rounds things off or snaps.
Also because you should get a little bling to go along with a $200-300 set of wrenches.
Also because you should get a little bling to go along with a $200-300 set of wrenches.
chad s
Well-known member
I dont know what your definition of pot metal is. The pot metal used on old cars is very soft. A wrench made from pot metal wouldnt last one use. It will also melt with a very low heat source. An O/A torch will melt pot metal, maybe even a propane torch.TNToy said:
That being said, yea, raised pannel wrenches (or ratchets) **** no matter what they are made from.
TNToy
Well-known member
Craftsman.chad s said:
Stirring the pot for the Sears fans...
dink
Well-known member
TNToy said:Craftsman.
Stirring the pot for the Sears fans...
Blasphomy plain blasphomy
HA kidding
chad s
Well-known member
They are steel, just low grade when compared to the good stuff. The primary ingredients in pot metal are zinc, lead, and aluminum, or various/different mixtures of those and other metals.TNToy said:Craftsman.
Stirring the pot for the Sears fans...
A wrench made of true pot metal would not be useable.
You would be very very surprised if you knew the steel source for most all "Made In The USA" wrenches and other hand tools. It is basically the same for all of them.
It isn't the "steel" that accounts for some being softer than others. It's the heat treating process.
KingPerformance
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I still haven't got you figured out bmwpower, all of these lesser quality company's have treated you wrong by giving you poor quality and you are still buying everything but what you know to be good. Honestly, I don't blame you, I have tried just about every company out there and I'm not settled on what I will and won't use. Some call me a tool snob, I just say I don't want to use tools that will eventually cause me to work more or harder.
KingPerformance said:
What is "good", really?
The only one that really "dropped the ball" was SK. Everyone praised them, so I bought some...and then returned them 3x. No corporate response, nothing. Goodbye!
I'm not a pro mechanic my any means, just a car nut/newbie tool collector who has 3 kids to feed, who built a garage and has no money left over for the "best" stuff. So I look around, price things out, add them to a wish list, spend hours looking at them online and move on. Craftsman is just one of those convenient brands that I have looked to when I've been in a bind on the weekend.
KingPerformance
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bmwpower said:
It is VERY hard for me not to buy Craftsman tools any more. It REALLY is. They are for the most part, inexpensive, easy to find, and have an amazing warranty. But after using something better, I just can't. It ***** having to constantly go to sears with a handful of tools, I have done it. Originally I REFUSED to believe in the difference. I do from time to time pick up a tool I know I won’t use often, or something that was made by someone else (craftsman cable hose clamp pliers), a battery charger, etc … I wrote something up for another forum on this, and I'm going to have to post it up on here, showing the differences between a Craftsman and a Snap On 15mm combination wrench. I chose 15mm because it is almost an unused wrench and I wanted to compare apples to apples, not a used beat up spread craftsman to something else. If I showed you pics of my 10mm Craftsman combination you would cringe. For me, I’ll never get rid of my tools, and I have never ever lost a tool, even when I was a wrenching as a tech, so the small jump in price for a quality tool over a lifetime outweighs the headaches the lesser expensive tool will give me over the years. Keep an eye out for used tools if you can’t afford new, don’t impulse buy, and only buy what you know you will need.
I make a thread dedicated to this and post some pics up soon, I have just been too busy to take pics as of late.
malibu101
Well-known member
"I chose 15mm because it is almost an unused wrench and I wanted to compare apples to apples, not a used beat up spread craftsman to something else."
15mm is a very commonly used wrench in my world.
And others I have visited.
Seriously, I always like to see an honest side by side comparison between anything. If you have the time, I'd like to see your opinion on the above matter.
15mm is a very commonly used wrench in my world.
And others I have visited.
Seriously, I always like to see an honest side by side comparison between anything. If you have the time, I'd like to see your opinion on the above matter.
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TNToy
Well-known member
We've learned 4 important things from this thread:
(1) BMWPower isn't actually made of money.
(2) Chad S has no sense of humor when it comes to metallurgy.
(3) KingPerformance doesn't work on european cars.
(4) Malibu and wilbilt, appraently HAVE spent some time wrenching on Germans.
(1) BMWPower isn't actually made of money.
(2) Chad S has no sense of humor when it comes to metallurgy.
(3) KingPerformance doesn't work on european cars.
(4) Malibu and wilbilt, appraently HAVE spent some time wrenching on Germans.
KingPerformance
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TNToy said:We've learned 4 important things from this thread:
(1) BMWPower isn't actually made of money.
(2) Chad S has no sense of humor when it comes to metallurgy.
(3) KingPerformance doesn't work on european cars.
(4) Malibu and wilbilt, appraently HAVE spent some time wrenching on Germans.
Hahahahaha, true that. I prefer a different breed of vehicle. Though I did have a short stint at a VW dealership for 1 year.
Lots of 15mm on VWs, Rabbit, Quantum, etc.
GM, Ford, and Chrysler liked them too. It seems tie rod sleeve nuts on 80s-90s Ford trucks were 15mm, plus a bunch of stuff I forget. Front shock nuts? Maybe.
Lately, it's the wife's Caravan. Plenty there, too, along with 12 and 16mm.
GM, Ford, and Chrysler liked them too. It seems tie rod sleeve nuts on 80s-90s Ford trucks were 15mm, plus a bunch of stuff I forget. Front shock nuts? Maybe.
Lately, it's the wife's Caravan. Plenty there, too, along with 12 and 16mm.
KingPerformance
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wilbilt said:
15mm maybe common on VW's, but I wasn't around for the Rabbit, Quantum, etc... Start thinking 1.8t's, electrical gremlins etc ... I have a special tool for tie rod's. I have been working on Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Subaru, Ford, GM and a few Chrysler products for years, and have never needed a 15mm wrench. Now the 3/8 air ratchet ... 15mm is a maybe. And you take shocks out with a wrench? Man, that would take for ever! TIME IS MONEY!
Deafautotech
Well-known member
i used my 15mm sockets a lot (1/4dr, 3/8dr, and 1/2dr) for chrysler and jeep in dealership. i had all socket on mac tool and snap on as it is very useful to me. as wrench as i used ratcheting not normal wrench as it take long time and not make it on flat rate time......
KingPerformance said:And you take shocks out with a wrench? Man, that would take for ever! TIME IS MONEY!
Yep. Hold the nut with a wrench, and spin the stud.
If the stud rounds, snap it off. TIME IS MONEY.
Of course, I work on computers and network infrastructure these days, so a gentler approach works best...
kythri
Well-known member
wilbilt said:Of course, I work on computers and network infrastructure these days, so a gentler approach works best...
But, sometimes, a computer just needs a good swift smack.
I believe the industry term is "technical tap"...
Are you a systems guy, or a network guy? I've been all over the place. Finished up a tour as a Systems Admin a year or so ago, and closed down the Oregon branch of the corporation I was working for.
Didn't want to move to Albuquerque (great town, just like Oregon too much to leave), so I've been going to school, getting technical certs. Currently in a Cisco class at the moment, augmenting my admittedly inferior router skills with some much needed learning.
kythri said:
I was hired as a workstation tech, but my position has evolved into something quite frightening. I do everything from HW/SW support to pulling cable and systems design. Video security systems, both analog and IP, network copiers, classroom projectors and audio systems, etc. They have recently informed me that I am now also responsible for our Nextel phones and users as well.
Our network administration is technically the responsibility of the County Office of Education, but they don't always respond on a timely basis when things blow up and the users are beating me with large sticks. I am definitely NOT a netadmin, but do dabble in the IOS from time to time...
Charles (in GA)
Well-known member
Cost more money, thats why.
Charles
Charles (in GA)
Well-known member
bmwpower said:
I highly suspect that the higher price would drive off more customers, than the improved "quality" of a polished wrench would gain. The polished tool probably has a lower profit margin than the matte finish one, and the end result would be less total dollars profit.
The Craftsman matte finished "raised panel" wrenches are virtually a trade mark of the tool. I have several sets of different vintage, the oldest is a combination wrench set from WWII that is black phospate finished, chrome was in short supply. My dad bought them new with tool ration coupons since he worked in a job that required them. The set is not complete, the 3/8 is a Plumb, marked "war finish" and the 9/16 box end shattered on me one day, 30 years or so ago, Sears gave me a new one, but they couldn't understand why the one I had didn't have chrome on it. I have two other fractional combination sets of later vintages, and two metric sets, one USA and one is made in Japan, but nearly identical to the US set.
I work as an airline mechanic, I have a tool box rig sorta like the "taco wagon" that was mentioned in a recent thread. Everyone at work has something like it. Two boxes mounted on an angle iron frame and on casters with a tow bar and hitch. I work mostly from a tote tray, and while my primary wrenches are Snap On, I have a couple of sets of the Craftsman ones in the box to use when the tote tray is at the airplane and I'm at my box. I really like Snap On tools, the fit, the finish, the feel, the quality, everything about them, but there is nothing wrong with a standard Craftsman wrench for a home shop. I have three old rollaways at home, one was my Dad's from his house, and the other two were ones I used and used at work till I retired them. They are full of tools, of all brands, but largely Craftsman. They haven't let me down yet, be it a tractor, my car or truck, or my airplane, or my mower.
I hate to say so, and I'm sure I'll get flamed for it, but I detect on this board, alot of vanity and one upsmanship, "I have more wrenches than you" and "mine are Snappys" or "mine are Macs" or "I've got every different type of wrench known to mankind, even if I don't know what all of them are for", and I see alot of bickering and arguing about whether a certain wrench is the right one to have or "should I buy this set because its mirror finished even though it won't make me a better mechanic?"................. Sorry, but I get a real chuckle out of it all. Not comdeming valid questions at all, like how useful is a certain wrench (such as a starter and manifold wrench) or a question as to whether others have broken such and such a wrench repeatedly, is it defective? or the like, but I simply cannot help laughing at some of the "vanity" questions or posts.
Go ahead, crank up the flame throwers, it won't bother me one iota.
Charles
wantedabiggergarage
Member Emeritus
Charles (in GA) said:
You can still buy the black phospate Craftsman's. They are their industrial line and passed a certain point they then are Armstrongs (also Dahaner). Fastenal, is where you get them. I turned wrenchs for a bit, then am down to a part timer (if he is short handed, and I am off, almost family). I have both seen the tool snobery, and been pushed to try to represent it. I agree with you on the vanity issues, but as someone with a lot of wrenchs, I can tell you, the two reasons I have so many (not counting specialty): 1. They are in four different places 2. Having the wrench that makes the job go faster, makes me more money, and I only buy ones when they are a bargin.
I have used and will use a bit, but can say I can do a lot more with my POS (yes not very quality) Pittsburgh set, more then my brother can do with the Snap's he has access to.
eschoendorff
Well-known member
Charles (in GA) said:
Charles.... you make it very difficult to flame you when you make sense.
That being said, The Cman Pro wrenches are advertised as specially heat treated, etc... I gotta remember where I saw this.
TNToy
Well-known member
No kidding.
The thing that bugs me most is the pushing. I prefer Snap-On and Matco over craftsman, and I've made that clear. But almost no one on this forum actually needs it[/b]. Most of these guys are working on a project car at their own pace over a period of months, and craftsman will do the job just fine...
The thing that bugs me most is the pushing. I prefer Snap-On and Matco over craftsman, and I've made that clear. But almost no one on this forum actually needs it[/b]. Most of these guys are working on a project car at their own pace over a period of months, and craftsman will do the job just fine...
To feed back some of the comments with my experience. I do have to agree Craftsman isbe going after a different market than 40 yrs ago. Tools we have from that time have a great feel and were priced vs salaries close to or above what the polished tools are today. Many pros especially in areas that did not have trucks servicing them routinely had Craftsman boxes and tools. They marketed to the professional as with the catalog easier to get, much less cost close in quality. As for the DIY market it was smaller and the snobs in the DIY used Craftsman then, the regular person got by with a cheaper set.
About 30 years ago there started a slow but steady decrease in quality but stability equalling a decrease in price vs rising inflation to the standard Craftsman tools. When there was enough difference to market two lines the pro's showed up. I like the pro's wish they had more, for the truck guys to catch me they have to call first. Otherwise finding me is hard to impossible. So the ability to go to a store is very nice. I was looking for the regular length polished and wished they had it also. The same for smaller angle box ends.
The new raised panel level Craftsman is marketed toward the DIY market as a better choice than the lowest quality elcheapos. They are still great for that a person I know who just asked what to get. He is starting to do some work, it will be once or twice a week. My recommendation for him is this level of Craftsman vs the wonder tools at Big Lots he was looking at.
Working on something daily I move toward the pro or truck tools when they stop by or I find them on Ebay. The right tool for the right person's activities.
Do also agree as with anything we can get snobbish about it. But as people who have knowledge it is we need to at times put behind us what we use to advise others on what is the best for them. I have also stated at time here that I never cared about polish the way I here it described here at times. I care about the feel and work. They do not look like jewels after a couple weeks of use, in fact the industrial or old finishes look less scratched up since that finish hides the dings better. But then if the dings do not hurt feel and work I do not care much about them.
About 30 years ago there started a slow but steady decrease in quality but stability equalling a decrease in price vs rising inflation to the standard Craftsman tools. When there was enough difference to market two lines the pro's showed up. I like the pro's wish they had more, for the truck guys to catch me they have to call first. Otherwise finding me is hard to impossible. So the ability to go to a store is very nice. I was looking for the regular length polished and wished they had it also. The same for smaller angle box ends.
The new raised panel level Craftsman is marketed toward the DIY market as a better choice than the lowest quality elcheapos. They are still great for that a person I know who just asked what to get. He is starting to do some work, it will be once or twice a week. My recommendation for him is this level of Craftsman vs the wonder tools at Big Lots he was looking at.
Working on something daily I move toward the pro or truck tools when they stop by or I find them on Ebay. The right tool for the right person's activities.
Do also agree as with anything we can get snobbish about it. But as people who have knowledge it is we need to at times put behind us what we use to advise others on what is the best for them. I have also stated at time here that I never cared about polish the way I here it described here at times. I care about the feel and work. They do not look like jewels after a couple weeks of use, in fact the industrial or old finishes look less scratched up since that finish hides the dings better. But then if the dings do not hurt feel and work I do not care much about them.
Yup. I can understand the "Pro Wrenches" buying the higher priced stuff. They earn their living with them, I'm the same way with precision measuring tools. I buy nothing but Starrett, Brown & Sharpe, or Mitutyo. Sure, I have a couple sets of the 6" digital calipers from Harbor Freight ... one set is in my handtool's box and the other are here on my desk. I'm not going to use a $100 PLUS set of calipers or mics in the dusy, dirty, greasy area of the workshop.
I look at hand tools kind of like I look at cars. Kia & Hyundai (Harbor Freight, Wal Mart, etc) thru Ford & Chevy (Craftsman, Kobalt, Husky) thru Mercedes, Lexus, & BMW (Snappy, Mac, Matco, Cornwell). All of them will get the job "done" ... some just make the job easier, more pleasant, have better "service" if it breaks, and will last a lot longer than others.
Let's all remember that we're here because we enjoy "wrenching" ... whether it be for a living or for a hobby ... regardless of the wrench used.
I look at hand tools kind of like I look at cars. Kia & Hyundai (Harbor Freight, Wal Mart, etc) thru Ford & Chevy (Craftsman, Kobalt, Husky) thru Mercedes, Lexus, & BMW (Snappy, Mac, Matco, Cornwell). All of them will get the job "done" ... some just make the job easier, more pleasant, have better "service" if it breaks, and will last a lot longer than others.
Let's all remember that we're here because we enjoy "wrenching" ... whether it be for a living or for a hobby ... regardless of the wrench used.
Amen to that ..-lecroix- said:
15mm maybe common on VW's, but I wasn't around for the Rabbit, Quantum, etc... Start thinking 1.8t's, electrical gremlins etc ... I have a special tool for tie rod's. I have been working on Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Subaru, Ford, GM and a few Chrysler products for years, and have never needed a 15mm wrench. Now the 3/8 air ratchet ... 15mm is a maybe. And you take shocks out with a wrench? Man, that would take for ever! TIME IS MONEY!
i worked on gm cars for years and the most used wrench sizes are 18 mm 15mm 13 mm 10mm 3/4 11/16 5/8 9/16 1/2 7/16 and 3/8