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Old 09-23-2011, 12:14 AM   #1
TWX
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Default Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

I know that some of you will cringe in horror at the URL of the site i'll reference, but bear me out...

There's a design that's been around for a few years now that integrates a sink into the tank lid of the toilet, that when one flushes, the water pressure pushes some water up into the sink spigot then routes it down into the bowl to help with flushing, so the grey water fro washing one's hands will be used to immediately flush the toilet along with the fresh water stored in the tank. This eliminates the problem of storing grey water in a stagnant way where it might get cruddy or leave buildup, but still reduces the water used and provides a sink in a very tiny space.

I'm thinking out the possible layouts for a bathroom for the workshop. The concrete slab is pre-plumbed for both a toilet and a shower. Unfortunately for me, the 100a service for the power for the workshop runs horizontally through this area and makes a 90 degree turn at the corner of the walls right in the corner where the shower would go, and the sewage vent pipe, probably 4 or 5 inches, runs floor to ceiling behind where the toilet should go, sticking out from the wall.

I figure I'll have to fir away from the wall if I actually want to finish it right and install a shower. I may box in the vent pipe so I won't have to fir the whole wall to 4-6", but I could insulate the hell out of that wall instead. I'll have to fir around the the electrical conduit pipe, but I'm thinking that maybe I'd get one of those corner showers and place it against the corner made by the new wall and an old wall, so that the old-old corner where the electrical goes can be left with an access hatch.

I mentioned the toilet with integrated sink mainly because I figure it's a good idea to leave the main utility sink OUT of the bathroom to reduce the likelihood of leaving it full of junk where it's out of sight, out of mind.

I've attached a very, very rough layout of what I have in mind. It's certainly NOT to scale, but I've tried to get some of it close to what's right...
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Old 09-23-2011, 12:24 AM   #2
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

I don't know anyone who has ever used a shower in their shop. It always SEEMS like a good idea, but it just never seems to get used.
One more thing to keep clean... and guys NEVER clean a shower, so they always get disgusting looking.
Toilets also always get disgusting looking.

I figure my stand-up to sit-down toilet usage is about 10:1. Meaning, when I'm working in the shop, sucking down sodas, tea or water, I'll frequently need to step behind the shop for "The pause that refreshes."
If I'm out in the shop and need to take a break to sit down, I'll wash my hands, go into the house, take care of business and then raid the fridge or pantry and make an event out of it.

I'm installing a urinal in my shop.

-Brad
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Old 09-23-2011, 12:33 AM   #3
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

Main reason I'm considering a shower is that Dad keeps a restored Charger in the workshop's third stall in exchange for doing the yardwork at the house, and the yard is about four tenths of an acre. At the moment he makes the drive home (about 30 miles) grungy from the work. I assume he'd like to clean up, but he doesn't want to spend much time in the house for some reason when we're not home. He doesn't mind, however, spending time in the garage. He's 59 and retired now and Mom wants him out of the house, so this arrangement could go on another ten years easy.

I want the commode because my wife and I are going to have kids someday in the not too distant future, and I want somewhere for some peace and quiet, if you know what I mean... Once we have kids I very much doubt that I would be able to budget for the bathroom at all, so I have to do it and to allocate the money for it now while it's not closed off as options go.

It very well could be the last really expensive thing I do to the workshop. Insulating the ceiling and putting up sheetrock won't exactly be cheap, but probably quite a bit cheaper than a bathroom.
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Old 09-23-2011, 12:41 AM   #4
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

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Main reason I'm considering a shower is that Dad keeps a restored Charger in the workshop's third stall in exchange for doing the yardwork at the house, and the yard is about four tenths of an acre. At the moment he makes the drive home (about 30 miles) grungy from the work. I assume he'd like to clean up, but he doesn't want to spend much time in the house for some reason when we're not home. He doesn't mind, however, spending time in the garage. He's 59 and retired now and Mom wants him out of the house, so this arrangement could go on another ten years easy.

I want the commode because my wife and I are going to have kids someday in the not too distant future, and I want somewhere for some peace and quiet, if you know what I mean... Once we have kids I very much doubt that I would be able to budget for the bathroom at all, so I have to do it and to allocate the money for it now while it's not closed off as options go.

It very well could be the last really expensive thing I do to the workshop. Insulating the ceiling and putting up sheetrock won't exactly be cheap, but probably quite a bit cheaper than a bathroom.
Bwahaha! I stand corrected! I have finally met someone who can justify a shower in the shop, AND you make an EXCELLENT case for the commode!

-Brad
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Old 09-23-2011, 01:12 AM   #5
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

Yeah, it'd be more of a gardener's bathroom I guess. Small, but enough to freshen up.

I had somewhat considered even the idea of a stacked laundry set for the work-on-stuff clothes, but I don't think I'm going to bother with that.

The other advantage of having this bathroom is that there are two hot water heaters in the house- one that feeds the three bathrooms and one that feeds the kitchen and workshop. Stupid arrangement if you ask me, but not much I can easily do for the plumbing decisions made in 1979, especially with a partial flat-roof home where getting to the hot water pipes would be difficult. We had a failure on the one for the bathrooms once on Saturday morning for a holiday weekend, and it was good we hadn't rented out the old house yet so we could go over there to bathe as the idiots sent out didn't get it fixed until Wednesday. This bathroom would let us bathe if that unit ever failed again. As much as I'd like to switch one of the existing bathrooms to use the other hot water heater, that'll probably cost as much as putting in the new bathroom, as I can get free help for most of the bathroom installs, while the plumber would probably cost me thousands to run that much copper pipe.
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Old 09-23-2011, 01:28 AM   #6
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

It sounds like you're looking for a prison toilet.
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Old 09-23-2011, 01:43 AM   #7
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

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It sounds like you're looking for a prison toilet.
Not completely. I would rather the experience be more inviting than that. They had prison-style toilets at the Las Vegas Hilton in the bathrooms near the Star Trek Experience before they closed it down, and it really wasn't a pleasant place to take a load off...
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Old 09-23-2011, 02:24 AM   #8
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

I read the manufacturer's site. It indicates the fill valve is routed thru a spout and into a poly sink, which drains into the tank to complete the water circuit. I don't see how the sink can be used without flushing the toilet.

Also, it looks like it would be an enormous pain in the ass if you had to adjust the flush valve chain. I don't know about your toilet, but every one I've ever had, that damn little chain gets tangled up every few months.

On the plus side, it does cost thousands of dollars less than a prison toilet, and you don't have to get arrested or go to some weird Star Trek hotel to use it.
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Old 09-23-2011, 04:55 AM   #9
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

I must get over to America sometime.
Never seen a chain in a cistern before .... ever ...
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Old 09-23-2011, 06:50 AM   #10
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

I have a bathroom in my shop with shower in it. The shower get's used all the time and I would never have another shop without one. Out in the shop to all hours of the night and don't worry about tracking crap all over the house or bothering the wife when I come in. It is nice to come in clean and just slip into the bed and not disturb anybody. Trust me it keeps me on good terms with the wife and that is a good thing.
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Old 09-23-2011, 06:58 AM   #11
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

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I don't know anyone who has ever used a shower in their shop. It always SEEMS like a good idea, but it just never seems to get used.
Well, now you've met TWO. In my situation, I built the badass shower I didn't have room for in the master suite. We use it at least 1-2 times a week. Wash the dogs in it (has a handy bench that makes it MUCH easier), great for cleaning up after yard-work, and/or decontaminating before coming into the house.

Two other added bonuses for the full bath in the shop: If I have workmen on the property for some reason, I can lock the inner door to the shop and give them access to a crapper/water without having them IN the house or IN my shop. Second, I have lots of weekends where buddies are over for some shop-time, if anybody has to take a break, they don't have to tromp through the house or bother the wife to use the bathroom.

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Old 09-23-2011, 08:07 AM   #12
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

Down at floor level I don't have a shower but do upstairs in an apt. But,,, I have 2 laundry sinks plus regular bathroom with stool and laundry. One of the things that make it easy to maintain is this partial across the shop behind a privacy sheet. One of the best and most worthwhile setups I have, keeps the public bathroom so much cleaner.
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Old 09-23-2011, 08:23 AM   #13
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

I didn't use a combined toilet/sink but I put a regular toilet and vanity/sink in the garage bathroom. I went from studded walls and no floor to finished walls, 3/4" OSB floor and usable bathroom for about 400 bucks. It's nothing fancy but does get the job done.

I originally was going to put a shower in but that area has been taken over by an extra fiberglass hood and nitrous bottles, maybe one day.
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Old 09-23-2011, 08:43 AM   #14
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

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Two other added bonuses for the full bath in the shop: If I have workmen on the property for some reason, I can lock the inner door to the shop and give them access to a crapper/water without having them IN the house or IN my shop. Second, I have lots of weekends where buddies are over for some shop-time, if anybody has to take a break, they don't have to tromp through the house or bother the wife to use the bathroom.
That was part of the other thought. Since I've got the best workshop space of any of the average people I know (ie, not rich) I've already had friends over a bit. Granted, one of the house's bathrooms has an exterior door, but it's locked unless we're going through it, so it's not exactly convenient for a guest unless I remember to unlock it before they arrive. It also leads right into the laundry before reaching the bathroom portion, and since certain particular articles of clothing get air-dried above the machines, my wife doesn't like people coming in that way past that.

I probably won't go particularly fancy with the shower, as our master bathroom is very well equipped, but the simple ability to clean up would be nice.
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Old 09-23-2011, 09:23 AM   #15
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

That doesn't appear to have any sort of temperature control. I wouldn't install a sink without hot water and hot water would be a tremendous waste in a toilet flush.
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Old 09-23-2011, 09:32 AM   #16
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

The type of toilet/sink combo you're describing is common place in Asia. Typically used in public restrooms the sink is designed to wash your hands after the deed, then the gray water is captured for the next flush. I don't think it would be useful to use as a wash sink for really dirty hands...
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Old 09-23-2011, 09:34 AM   #17
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

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That doesn't appear to have any sort of temperature control. I wouldn't install a sink without hot water and hot water would be a tremendous waste in a toilet flush.
I live in Phoenix. Even on our coldest night of the year I could probably wash my hands in cold water and still get acceptable results.
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Old 09-23-2011, 11:37 AM   #18
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

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I have a bathroom in my shop with shower in it. The shower get's used all the time and I would never have another shop without one. Out in the shop to all hours of the night and don't worry about tracking crap all over the house or bothering the wife when I come in. It is nice to come in clean and just slip into the bed and not disturb anybody. Trust me it keeps me on good terms with the wife and that is a good thing.
The flowers are a nice touch too.
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Old 09-23-2011, 11:46 AM   #19
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

I have a small room just big enough for the toilet, and a utility sink just outside the toilet room.

No need to have 2 sinks.

Work's good for me, even when I have 20 kids at the house building robots.
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Old 09-23-2011, 01:29 PM   #20
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Default Re: Toilets with a sink in the tank lid and workshop bathroom

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Work's good for me, even when I have 20 kids at the house building robots.
That statement is either really cool as in "ROBOTS!!!" or really creepy, as in "Chinese sweatshop"...

I cannot decide which...
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