Welcome to the The Garage Journal Board forums.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

Go Back   The Garage Journal Board > The Garage > Heating and A/C

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 03-05-2013, 11:19 AM   #1
AE2
Member
 
AE2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NW Missouri
Posts: 95
Default Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

The compressor in my A/C heat pump has failed. Serviceman says its locked up. The unit is 9 years old 12 seer and the compressor itself is under warranty. Brand is Rudd or Ruud, (don't remember right now). He has given me prices to repair. Compressor replacement is quoted at 1040.76. His labor is $495, R22 is 472.50, filter/dryer is $48 and freight is $25.

He has also given a price for a new outside unit of $3947.50. That includes an American Standard/Trane 13 seer unit, new evap coil, thermostat, pad and flush the lines.

Replacement compressor has 1yr parts and labor warranty
New unit has 10yr parts and 5yr labor

I'm hoping you guys can give me your opinions so I can make a decision based on more than the cost.
AE2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2013, 11:39 AM   #2
Bruce4310TX
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Forth-Worth, TX
Posts: 339
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

buy it off the internet and replace it yourself and have someone service it.
__________________
Aviation Mechanic Pays less, but the hours/responsibility are a little greater than being a DR....
Bruce4310TX is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 03-05-2013, 11:52 AM   #3
ishiboo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Oshkosh, WI
Posts: 4,271
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce4310TX View Post
buy it off the internet and replace it yourself and have someone service it.
You will likely have no warranty if you go this route.
ishiboo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2013, 05:07 PM   #4
BD1
Senior Member
 
BD1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Illinois
Posts: 2,153
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

How many tons ??
Sounds to me you gotta get more estimates. $472.50 for about 7 or 8 pounds of freon ? WOW ! The name plate at condenser should say the amount of freon in compressor and if you have the manual it should give the amount per line size and footage.

looks like you got $2000.00 to repair. if the reversing valve goes after repair, more big bucks gone. if the evap coil or piping developes a leak, there goes more money.
is the refrigerant piping easily accessible ?? Are there any fittings on it ? I would get a price on replacing the piping too. In my area it is not recommended to reuse piping that was a R 22 system and then go to 410 A. Check what the manufacture says on the new equipment in regards to reusing existing piping.
i would replace. Check with utility company on rebates.
BD1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2013, 05:44 PM   #5
AE2
Member
 
AE2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NW Missouri
Posts: 95
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

I don't know how many tons it is, the data tag isn't the easiest to read. They guys says it takes 13lbs of coolant and that's why its so high. The piping is pretty easy to get to and I don't think there are any fittings in it. He said the piping is fine because he would flush it with something and he has never had any issues afterwards. I'm going to call around. The guy I talked to installed it in 2003 and his name was on the sticker so that's how I found him. He is a one man show and leaves a lot to be desired just get a hold of him and getting him to show up. I checked for rebates this morning online but they expired Feb 28. I'm sure some more will start shortly.
AE2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2013, 06:05 PM   #6
brihvac
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: North Wilmington, Delaware
Posts: 397
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

Quote:
Originally Posted by AE2 View Post
The compressor in my A/C heat pump has failed. Serviceman says its locked up. The unit is 9 years old 12 seer and the compressor itself is under warranty. Brand is Rudd or Ruud, (don't remember right now). He has given me prices to repair. Compressor replacement is quoted at 1040.76. His labor is $495, R22 is 472.50, filter/dryer is $48 and freight is $25.

He has also given a price for a new outside unit of $3947.50. That includes an American Standard/Trane 13 seer unit, new evap coil, thermostat, pad and flush the lines.

Replacement compressor has 1yr parts and labor warranty
New unit has 10yr parts and 5yr labor

I'm hoping you guys can give me your opinions so I can make a decision based on more than the cost.
Labor and shipping seem ok. However, he is charging you $48 for a $15. dryer and he is also charging you for a full 30lb bottle of 22 when he is only gonna need about 5lbs give or take. (13lbs? I doubt it being a 12 seer, even if it was 5 ton with a long line set, thats a lot)I also change the capacitor when I do it. It is an easy job for a professional, but I do not suggest you do it yourself if you dont know what you are doing. Wish you were local, would do it for half. Easy job that will take about an hour or so. Longest part is pulling a vaccum.
He seems to be inflating his repair price to get you to go with a new unit.

Last edited by brihvac; 03-05-2013 at 06:14 PM.
brihvac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2013, 06:22 PM   #7
AE2
Member
 
AE2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NW Missouri
Posts: 95
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

I'm going to get a couple more quotes. The data tag doesn't have anything for a charge so the 13lb is what he said. Model says 360, so I believe that means 3 ton. I won't be doing it myself, I'm handy but not that handy.
Ruud UPMC-036JAZ

Last edited by AE2; 03-05-2013 at 06:44 PM.
AE2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2013, 07:03 PM   #8
philjafo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 244
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

The price he quoted you for the Freon is lower then I would have charged, r22 is becoming obsolete and in the coming years will only get more expensive and eventually unavailable. A new compressor should get you a lot of years of service however that 1 year warranty would only cover the compressor, and there are other parts that can fail. A whole new unit the warranty covers the whole thing, I would also recommend getting the highest efficiency unit you can get too. You pay for the equipment once but you pay for the electricity it uses every month http://www.hvacopcost.com/
philjafo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2013, 06:31 AM   #9
Tim The Tool Man
Senior Member
 
Tim The Tool Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Lehigh Valley, PA
Posts: 1,092
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

Please do yourself a favor and check your warranty. It might be covered if it is only seven years old. Get several more quotes!!!
Tim The Tool Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2013, 10:23 AM   #10
BD1
Senior Member
 
BD1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Illinois
Posts: 2,153
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

''The price he quoted you for the Freon is lower then I would have charged, r22 is becoming obsolete and in the coming years will only get more expensive and eventually unavailable.''

Actually there are replacements out already for R-22. It is completely compatible .No need to buy at outrageous prices. Your location may vary.
http://www2.dupont.com/ISCEON/en_US/...CEON_MO99.html
BD1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2013, 08:46 PM   #11
purevil115
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 107
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

Did he try to put a hard start kit on the compressor. Sometimes you can use these to get by till you can decide if this doesnt work I would prolly replace the whole outside unit. Some people get lucky with new compressors but everything else is 10 years old and after taking it apart sometimes its just a down hill battle. Depends on condition of the outside unit now.
purevil115 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2013, 08:51 PM   #12
AE2
Member
 
AE2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NW Missouri
Posts: 95
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

Someone else asked about a hard start and he didn't do that. I think we are leaning towards a new unit as well. We haven't lived here long but I'm planning on staying a while, so I think that is a better choice.
AE2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2013, 08:59 PM   #13
pop pop
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Virginia
Posts: 2,044
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

You're going to have to make an educated guess on the condition of the housing/coils/fan etc. If after 7 years they are still in good condition, my recommendation would be replace the compressor - as long as he will pull the vacuum to 50 microns or so and hold it for a half hour, longer if it is cold. If you get the 30 minute turn around, he'll leave contaminants in the system that will bit you within the next 24 months. This should cost $1K to $1.3K and last for another 5 -10 years. By then you'll be ready for the newest and greatest new system - total replacement.
pop pop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2013, 09:31 PM   #14
purevil115
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 107
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

Id try the hard start kit before anything Ive used a bunch of them to prolong older units on its last leg. I agree with pop pop though if replaced correct it should be fine but just depends on the unit itself if its worth it. Ive seen super new units in horrid shape cause of wet leaves, dogs peeing and stuff like that. Some old units people would cover with plastic during winter and they would be all rusted out inside and out.
purevil115 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2013, 09:53 PM   #15
Todd.Brock
Senior Member
 
Todd.Brock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 2,135
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

My thread details the specifics, but a 15 SEER (up to) 2.5 ton is 4600 for Trane, 2800 for Carrier, 3000 for Goodman and 2750 ish for York. I am going with the Carrier. Now just deciding on extra insulation for the condenser that would increase cost 150 or so. Good luck.... Estimates take a decent amount of time. I had 4 and could get a feel for the guys pretty early on.
Todd.Brock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2013, 10:33 PM   #16
James-W
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Southeastern Wisconsin
Posts: 1,001
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

It is my understanding that a central air-conditioner and/or a heat pump lifespan is about 13 years if properly maintained, less than that if it isn't properly maintained. The opening poster said the heat pump is 9 years old. This means the unit is roughly two thirds of the way thru its normal lifetime.

So even if you spend the money to get it repaired and it is working just fine again, the number of years it can reasonably be expected to last will be significantly less than what you would expect from a new heat pump.

Therefore, and quite obviously, I don't speak for everyone when I say this, but if it were me I would hesitate spending a lot of money to repair it. Maybe I am a little weird but I would rather take the money I would spend on repairing this heat pump and use it for a down-payment on a new heat pump that is more efficient and will have a decent warranty. By doing this he will save money on energy costs to operate the unit, the new heat pump will most likely be quieter than the old one, and he will have a decent warranty with the new one.
James-W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2013, 10:55 PM   #17
AE2
Member
 
AE2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NW Missouri
Posts: 95
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

Thanks for all the feedback. I am going to try and find a hard start kit tomorrow and give that a work. They look to be $25 and sound like a cheap way to get started.
AE2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2013, 11:44 AM   #18
JimL
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 168
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

Quote:
Originally Posted by BD1 View Post
''The price he quoted you for the Freon is lower then I would have charged, r22 is becoming obsolete and in the coming years will only get more expensive and eventually unavailable.''

Actually there are replacements out already for R-22. It is completely compatible .No need to buy at outrageous prices. Your location may vary.
http://www2.dupont.com/ISCEON/en_US/...CEON_MO99.html
And the replacements are a pain in the ass to use.....
JimL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2013, 12:56 PM   #19
AE2
Member
 
AE2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: NW Missouri
Posts: 95
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

I found a local supply house that carried the hard start kit in stock. $11.83 including tax. Installed very quickly and the compressor started. It ran for quite some time, but the output air never got warm in heat pump mode. Was advised to try in AC mode on a warmer day to see if it would just need some coolant. While testing the unit out, it tripped the breaker for the third time. I ended up going with a service company a friend works for to replace the compressor. They are not local and its still cheaper than the original quote. The major difference is, I trust these guys.
AE2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2013, 02:34 PM   #20
pop pop
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Virginia
Posts: 2,044
Default Re: Replace A/C Heat pump compressor or entire outside unit

The installer has more to do with how long it will last than the equipment. That said, a great mechanic has problems keeping a Yugo on the road.
pop pop is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:52 PM.