150 amp service load center question

mikester · Aug 25, 2012

I have a Square D QO series load center for my service. Its got 30 spaces in it. I already have a few double breakers installed in it. Is there a panel that has more spaces in it for a 150 amp service or do I have to go with a 200 amp service ? Im getting ready to buy a manual transfer switch so while the guys there I'd like to get it all done at once.

p_mori7 · Aug 25, 2012

If you need more circuits, you could supply power to a sub-panel from your existing 150A main panel rather than replacing the main panel itself.

mikester · Aug 25, 2012

I didnt really want to do that because of space. It would be easier to get a bigger panel. I just dont know if they make one with more spaces.

RECox286 · Aug 25, 2012

I would start to search the internet: SquareD.com.

Uncle Bob

Gokart · Aug 25, 2012

Schneider does make a 32 circuit MB load center(QO132M150), but that only give you 2 extra spaces.

I would suggest moving up to a 200amp panel for 42 circuits

mikester · Aug 25, 2012

Stupid question, but can you use a 200 amp panel with a 150 amp service ?

Gokart · Aug 25, 2012

It isn't stupid at all. A 200 amp panel means the bus is rated up to 200 amps. If you are using a main lug main (meaning there is not a main cb) then you are good to go. If you are using a panel with a main breaker , I would suggest only installing a 150 main cb.

'04 Cummins · Aug 25, 2012

mikester said:
Stupid question, but can you use a 200 amp panel with a 150 amp service ?

Negative Batman, not without getting a service upgrade from the poco...

Unless, of course, you added a 150a enclosed circuit breaker prior to your new 200a main panel. But that would require a permit and inspection as well, so kinda pointless...

MrMark · Aug 25, 2012

'04 Cummins said:
Negative Batman, not without getting a service upgrade from the poco...

Unless, of course, you added a 150a enclosed circuit breaker prior to your new 200a main panel. But that would require a permit and inspection as well, so kinda pointless...

Perhaps technically true, not sure . . .

But . . . the poco is not going to pull new wire if direct burial and all the older homes in a lot of areas are 100 amp service or #2 AL for direct burial PoCo feeder. I see everyone using 200 amp panels when the service is changed over.

Is there any problem with this? The poco doesn't have a problem with it, nor do the inspectors since to put in a new service equip you have to have poco disconnect and they won't reconnect without inspection by the local authority.

So what is the deal on this?

Has anyone been in this very situation? Must be very common.

'04 Cummins · Aug 25, 2012

MrMark said:
Perhaps technically true, not sure . . .

But . . . the poco is not going to pull new wire if direct burial and all the older homes in a lot of areas are 100 amp service or #2 AL for direct burial PoCo feeder. I see everyone using 200 amp panels when the service is changed over.

Is there any problem with this? The poco doesn't have a problem with it, nor do the inspectors since to put in a new service equip you have to have poco disconnect and they won't reconnect without inspection by the local authority.

So what is the deal on this?

Has anyone been in this very situation? Must be very common.

Not sure what the protocol is exactly. I can tell you that years ago when my parents had a service upgrade from 100a to 200a, new, larger service cable was pulled from the pole, but that was overhead.

Don't know if the OP has buried cable or overhead, or what size wire in either case.

I know he said he didn't want to, but for sure the easiest and cheapest way for more spaces is a subpanel...

Stuart in MN · Aug 25, 2012

You can use a panelboard rated for 200 amps on a 150 amp service, if you put a 150 amp main breaker in it.

Charles (in GA) · Aug 25, 2012

Its done all the time. If the panel is protected with a 150 amp disconnect outside, install anything you want that is rated at 150 amps or more. If your only disconnect is the main in the panel, you will have to have the POCO remove power anyhow to change out the panel, but buy a 40 or 42 space MAIN LUG panel, then buy a 150 amp main breaker conversion kit for it, or have a 40 or 42 space panel with the 150 amp main installed special ordered for you.

Check with the POCO to determine that actual size of the service wires and meter, it may already be 200 amp capable. Then check the size of the service entrance wire from the meter or the outside disconnect, and see if it is OK for 200 amp. Builder may have just cheaped out and installed the 150 amp panel to save a couple of bucks.

Charles

mikester · Aug 25, 2012

Stuart in MN said:
You can use a panelboard rated for 200 amps on a 150 amp service, if you put a 150 amp main breaker in it.

Thats what I really wanted to know. Im pretty sure if I go up to a 200 amp service I'll need a new meter pan, mast and wire to the pole.
Are the main breakers the same dimensions ? Would they mount in the panel the same way ?

Most of this started with the idea of putting in a hot tub. I didnt have a free slot for the breaker. Then it snowballed. Ive got a sheet of plywood on my basement wall with everything mounted to it. Service, sprinkler controls, alarm, media panel. Next will be the transfer switch.

Stuart in MN · Aug 25, 2012

mikester said:
Thats what I really wanted to know. Im pretty sure if I go up to a 200 amp service I'll need a new meter pan, mast and wire to the pole.

Without seeing them in person it's hard to say, but that may well be the case. It would be worth talking to your local utility; you'd be responsible for a bigger meter pan and mast (if required) but they may be willing to put in the larger overhead service from the pole for no additional charge or at least for a nominal charge. Every utility is different so there's no way to say for sure but a phone call to find out won't hurt.

mikester said:
Are the main breakers the same dimensions ? Would they mount in the panel the same way ?

Are you talking about reusing the 150amp breaker from the existing panelboard in the new panelboard? If the new one is also a Square D QO panel I *think* it will work, but my Square D catalog is at work so I can't say that for sure. If it were me I'd order the new panelboard with new breakers, assuming the existing panelboard is fairly old I wouldn't want to reuse the old ones.

MrMark · Aug 26, 2012

On the undersized feeder issue, when I called inquiring of the poco what about the #2 alum feeders, they couldn't have cared less. They had no problem with putting a 200 amp service on that feeder. The Edison planning guy said it wouldn't be a problem. He made some comment about the transformer being pretty close. I guess if you smoke that underground wire no big deal from their point of view and the odds of that happening are really small given that it is cooled by the dirt.

150 amp service load center question

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