Above 1200 Sq/FT The Salvage Garage
- Thread starter Strouty
- Start date
Wokspaces above 1200 squarefeet.
FullRaceMerc
Well-known member
Allenw
Well-known member
I always figure if I don't make some kind of mess I didn't do it right.I hardly made a mess.
I definitely got paint where I didn't want it, but I also didn't want to take the time to mask things. In a perfect scenario, I should have painted the wood before putting it up, but I had help and took advantage of it. Otherwise the pieces would still not be painted and they wouldn't be mounted. I may put another coat on it, just depends on how the day goes.
I have decided how to move forward with the shop upgrade/stockroom installation, I just need to figure out if it is truly feasible. My plan is what I had originally planned years ago, a plan that everyone thought was dumb. I will still have to do things in stages, but I should be able to do it without too much effort, at least once I get things figured out. So I am going to jack up the roof (20' section at a time), pour a concrete vertical wall to set the existing walls back onto (or rebuild the walls using 2x6 lumber). the only real attachment I have to deal with is the electrical and my plan all along was to rework that into surface mount conduit as my inside the wall design *****. I think almost every planned outlet has been blocked or covered by something, at least with surface mount it should be easier to reconfigure. Once all the walls are done, I can replace the roof system with new trusses that will fit my intended usage. I would start on the stockroom end and work out from there as the stockroom setup will be the biggest PITA to move later. By doing it this way I should be able to have the stockroom setup sooner and that is my ultimate goal.
I have decided how to move forward with the shop upgrade/stockroom installation, I just need to figure out if it is truly feasible. My plan is what I had originally planned years ago, a plan that everyone thought was dumb. I will still have to do things in stages, but I should be able to do it without too much effort, at least once I get things figured out. So I am going to jack up the roof (20' section at a time), pour a concrete vertical wall to set the existing walls back onto (or rebuild the walls using 2x6 lumber). the only real attachment I have to deal with is the electrical and my plan all along was to rework that into surface mount conduit as my inside the wall design *****. I think almost every planned outlet has been blocked or covered by something, at least with surface mount it should be easier to reconfigure. Once all the walls are done, I can replace the roof system with new trusses that will fit my intended usage. I would start on the stockroom end and work out from there as the stockroom setup will be the biggest PITA to move later. By doing it this way I should be able to have the stockroom setup sooner and that is my ultimate goal.
Prospecter
Well-known member
Will you need to contend with new building codes?
I am "helpless" today, so I have just been cleaning things up, going to paint another coat on the plywood, that should cover it (pun intended).
Trying to figure out what is going where, finding a lot of my storage drawers have had furry friends in there, so I have some cleaning to do, basically taking twice as long to get anything done. I am going to go back to the Hill this afternoon, I want to bring at least one of the empty Lista cabinets from the conex back into the shop so I can move drawers from some of the storage wall. I need three of the shorter uprights over at the Salvage Garage so I can move things around without making a huge mess, might be too late, but I guess it could be worse. My plan is to remove the pallet racking from the Hill and all the Lista storage wall, I will use the four cabinets for tools and supplies. All the other Lista stuff will come back to the SG, also going to take my big tool box, will leave my yellow cart up there. The two rotobin things are getting moved as well, when I get done the Hill will be fairly bare bones so when I do the final move it won't be a huge issue.
Trying to figure out what is going where, finding a lot of my storage drawers have had furry friends in there, so I have some cleaning to do, basically taking twice as long to get anything done. I am going to go back to the Hill this afternoon, I want to bring at least one of the empty Lista cabinets from the conex back into the shop so I can move drawers from some of the storage wall. I need three of the shorter uprights over at the Salvage Garage so I can move things around without making a huge mess, might be too late, but I guess it could be worse. My plan is to remove the pallet racking from the Hill and all the Lista storage wall, I will use the four cabinets for tools and supplies. All the other Lista stuff will come back to the SG, also going to take my big tool box, will leave my yellow cart up there. The two rotobin things are getting moved as well, when I get done the Hill will be fairly bare bones so when I do the final move it won't be a huge issue.
jollygreengiant
Well-known member
Is there something wrong with the lower walls of your current building, or a reason why you want to lift it and place it on concrete stem walls?
If the goal is to get more ceiling height with minimal cost and time, have you considered just lifting off the roof and adding on to your current walls? I was involved with a project like this once. They called us in first thing in the morning, and we lifted the entire roof off and set it beside the building. After that we left for a while and came back later in the afternoon, and by that point the carpenters had added 4' of height to the current walls. So then we simply lifted the roof back onto the building and the carpenters secured it into place. It was quick, relatively cheap, and did I mention quick? This way all your stuff inside the building is only exposed to the weather for one day; you don't have to worry about keeping the weather out for days/weeks as you jack up one roof section at a time.
Ask has nothing to do with it, those folks can show up without an invitation. Didn't you say your shop is zoned commercial? Around here they would be showing up at the first sign of construction work on a commercial building a slapping a stop work order on it if there wasn't a permit.
I am outside of the viewing area for any officials and the neighbors are on board. The reason I want to add the stem wall and replace my current walls is to gain height, the current walls are a mess, they were 2 x4 and I added an inner 2x4 wall, so there is jumbled mess. When I did that, I wasn't even pretending to be a carpenter, I can plumb a tower, but apparently not a wall. Plus the walls are directly on the slab and the level of the ground (not changeable) is almost even with the slab, so things get wet from time to time, especially with any snow pack. By adding a stem wall I get more height and still use 12' lumber to save some money.
jollygreengiant
Well-known member
Gotcha. That makes more sense now.
It sounds like that's the best way forward for your situation. I just hope that this project doesn't end up like so many and be quite a bit late, that would likely throw a bit of a wrench into your plans.
I have some valving that came from a manufactured housing plant, it was used to control hydraulic cylinders so that you could raise multiple cylinders at one time. My plan is to find four cylinders that will travel the distance I would like to raise the roof so it is done in one shot. I had thought about just using my two big forklifts, but since I am going to change out the walls it messes with the top plate. Plan is to use two I-Beams 20' long to become the new top plate while jacking/lifting. I actually tested this at one point to see how it would work and it seemed decent enough. I figure the 20' section of roof probably weighs around 20k pounds and if I strip the shingles first it would take a significant chunk of that away. The two beams would be connected to the bottom chord of the trusses and then braced to the floor using non penetrating weight, most likely a forklift. I will work through the plan and get more detailed as I find the pitfalls.
Old Man Roger
Well-known member
A little Rube Goldbergish, wouldnt a few basement jacks probably do the job?
Prospecter
Well-known member
I'm thinking like Old Man Roger. Jacks would allow you unobtrusively lift the building, "Fix" the sill, lower the building. then you could "Fix" the walls a section at a time, and put a new roof on.
I need to lift about four feet to add the stem wall and replace the walls. I figure that some hydraulic rams from forklifts might work, but I won't be able to synchronize them if they are all different sizes. Not that big of a deal, but I know right now I have three very nice rams available and I am sure I will be able to find another one. If I could find four that were the same, I would prefer that. Or I guess two similar pairs would also work, have the matching ones on each side. No matter what I can make it work, they just need to be heavy duty enough. The plan would be to build an offset structure inside probably using the rams/I-Beams, that would support things and I could cut off the bottom five or so feet of one wall at a time, pour the stem wall, then move to the next wall. I would just use a tarp while doing construction to keep the weather out. Then once all the stem walls are poured (four that 20' section) I would build some walls on the ground and then get ready to lift and remove the old ones. Technically as soon as I support the roof, I could start removing the inner wall and extra drywall.
I think I just saved myself a huge amount of time and no I am not forgetting about the project, I have the four post mohawk lift, it lifts 25000 pounds and lifts about four feet, also it is already a structure that could be setup inside the shop. I will still need to connect it to the roof structure, but that should be a heck of a lot easier than trying to cobble together things.
I looked at the drawings, it will lift 5' and the lifting portion is 8' wide and 20' long, should be about perfect, will give me plenty of room for wall demo and foundation work, and it has dogs to hold the load without any issues. I am now really glad I bought that!
I looked at the drawings, it will lift 5' and the lifting portion is 8' wide and 20' long, should be about perfect, will give me plenty of room for wall demo and foundation work, and it has dogs to hold the load without any issues. I am now really glad I bought that!
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Old Man Roger
Well-known member
Thats a biggin.
I think my next step is to figure out how much material is actually involved so I can get a weight estimate. I will also need to take into consideration the extra framework that I fab to help hold things together.
Rough overestimate is 10 squares for roof, so 4500 pounds for shingles, 1500 pounds for plywood. 11 trusses at about 150' of 2x6 each would be around 3300 pounds, 1000 pounds for insulation and any underlayment on the roof. That puts just the roof around 10k lbs.
Walls, if I leave everything doubled up would be about 2000 pounds of 2x4s, drywall about 3000 pounds, and plywood behind drywall about 1500. I am figuring another 1000 pounds for insulation, wire, hardware, and the aluminum corrugated siding. There is no external sheathing. That would be about 7500 pounds total. If I do nothing for prep, that puts us at 17,500 pounds leaving 7500 pounds for framework and reinforcements. I am probably quite a bit over as I would rather be higher than under on an estimation. Once I measure things I can get these numbers down to a more realistic figure, but for now it seems totally feasible with the equipment I have.
Rough overestimate is 10 squares for roof, so 4500 pounds for shingles, 1500 pounds for plywood. 11 trusses at about 150' of 2x6 each would be around 3300 pounds, 1000 pounds for insulation and any underlayment on the roof. That puts just the roof around 10k lbs.
Walls, if I leave everything doubled up would be about 2000 pounds of 2x4s, drywall about 3000 pounds, and plywood behind drywall about 1500. I am figuring another 1000 pounds for insulation, wire, hardware, and the aluminum corrugated siding. There is no external sheathing. That would be about 7500 pounds total. If I do nothing for prep, that puts us at 17,500 pounds leaving 7500 pounds for framework and reinforcements. I am probably quite a bit over as I would rather be higher than under on an estimation. Once I measure things I can get these numbers down to a more realistic figure, but for now it seems totally feasible with the equipment I have.
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I started poking around at the Hill, looks like I have enough forms to pour up to 32’ of wall 4’ tall, I will have to put new plywood on them, most are just frames, but these are very rugged forms. I also found some hardware, some cross ties, but not the right length, going to have to buy some anyways. I will have to move all that stuff over to the Salvage Garage and get things together. Looks like I am going to have the I beams and most everything else I am going to need. Next step is to fix the concrete truck…
Tommo3
Well-known member
Wouldn't it make more sense to support upper structure, cut away lower walls a section at a time pour stem wall in sections and then raise the roof?
Whats the end goal? You have a ton of **** for one guy to handle. I don't have nearly the amount of stuff you have and my shop is a pig sty. You spend more than half your time shuffling **** around with no end in sight.
The end goal is to get a man to mars.
Shuffling stuff is always something I do, always has been, probably always will be. In all honesty the project is the shop, always will be. It was no different when I had a utility truck, it was always morphing and I was always able to figure out how to have more stuff with me at all times. That being said, I want to be able to pull any of my trucks or equipment inside the Salvage Garage to work on them, I want to have a nice clean office space and a place to work on clean projects, I want to have ancillary storage that is organized so I can find the things I have, I want to have a separated woodworking space so I don't have sawdust in the main shop. My full dream is to be able to fabricate anything out of anything at anytime. Probably a lofty goal for my space, but I am still going to try.
My help abandoned me again, I just wish I had known sooner, I just got to the Salvage Garage and since it is nice outside, I have more that I could do at the Hill. I am going to stay here for a while, then try and get some stuff done at the Hill later. At least I had a small load of shelving in the truck, so I can at least offload that. Not sure what makes sense, I had planned around two people. 
Old Man Roger
Well-known member
I think most people on this site want all that too, some already have it. I don’t think that’s the problem walrus is alluding to.
I don't think I have an answer. Until I am physically unable, I will probably continue on the path I am on. I am hopeful that organizing things using an actual system is going to make a big dent in my time ****. With the move from the Hill the amount of stuff is going to get worse, but then it will consolidate and start to get more manageable, the transition is going to be an ordeal and I know that. I know that planning things out and implementing them are two totally different animals, I also know that I don't really comprehend that statement.
I guess maybe being at the Salvage Garage is the better choice, found out there is no power at the Hill. I am going to get a bit motivated and unload the shelving, I can prep things outside for the two person parts and I can take some measurements to get more accurate weights for the big lift off.
Old Man Roger
Well-known member
I admire your goal, not your task.lol I think most people just think you store too much stuff, and that is making your task more difficult. Admittedly you have some amazing stuff, but some of us think it’s just too much of it for your own good.
Hopefully, someday, you will either amaze all of us and end up completing your goal fully stocked, or maybe you will thin the heard and complete your goal. Either way, I think most are rooting for you, some, like me, just think you’re your own worse enemy.
I would really hate to see you so buried in cool machinery and stock that you just can’t deal with it all, and honestly, that’s what it looks like to me, but I’m just going on your posts on a website. What do I know?
reader2580
Well-known member
I have a similar problem to Strouty, but just not to the same extent. I keep buying stuff for projects and then never doing the projects. I end up losing tools, or parts for projects, and then end up buying more tools or parts.
I have stuff everywhere in my house and two garages. The only things kept outside are my vehicle and a trailer. Everything else, including a 43 foot converted coach bus, is inside a building. My house is pretty messy, and it would drive a wife or girlfriend insane if I had one. I actually took the day off work for the next two days to clean and organize. I need to get off my computer.
I have stuff everywhere in my house and two garages. The only things kept outside are my vehicle and a trailer. Everything else, including a 43 foot converted coach bus, is inside a building. My house is pretty messy, and it would drive a wife or girlfriend insane if I had one. I actually took the day off work for the next two days to clean and organize. I need to get off my computer.
Old Man Roger
Well-known member
How many years ago was it that you were going to purge? You guys are owned by your stuff, not the other way around.
Old Man Roger
Well-known member
I have a buddy who hoards classic cars, among other awesome toys, the problem is he pays hundreds of thousands of dollars for some of them, then lets them rust in a metal building sitting on and under multiple 4 post lifts. His stuff is cool, but it doesn’t change the fact that he’s a hoarder.
I am a funny guy, I can and will toss things or sell things, but I have a lot of "dreams" and I don't like to crush them. I also don't hoard trash, I just keep the good stuff.
I just talked to the power company, they can still do what they call a disconnect/reconnect without the City being involved, so I can have them show up and remove the line, then they can reinstall it after I am done doing the "repair" work. It may make more sense to go underground and just deal with things once, I am not sure what the City will require for inspections if I was to go that route, seems like it would be a quick external check, but I would rather not have any eyes on things until I am done with the rework.
I just talked to the power company, they can still do what they call a disconnect/reconnect without the City being involved, so I can have them show up and remove the line, then they can reinstall it after I am done doing the "repair" work. It may make more sense to go underground and just deal with things once, I am not sure what the City will require for inspections if I was to go that route, seems like it would be a quick external check, but I would rather not have any eyes on things until I am done with the rework.
Old Man Roger
Well-known member
Ya, no doubt you got some cool stuff, but unless you got a crew like Jay Leno, you might want to down size.lol
Old Man Roger
Well-known member
And you don’t have to give up on dreams, just clear the way for achieving them in an orderly fashion.