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Between 265 & 485 SQ/FT The 12-Gauge Garage

Workspaces sized between 265 and 485 squarefeet.
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Dan in Pasadena

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Feb 18, 2009
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Hi Jack! Very nice piece. I assume you wrote the copy? I think it set the perfect tone, big kudos.

I'd love to see you accomplish your goal of a 1:25 lap. I'm sure you've been asked this before but what about non stock engine modifications? Are they just too pricey for the likely results or is it the possible loss of reliability that concerns you; perhaps some of both? Hard to imagine you couldn't squeeze more than 300Hp out of that 3.6, probably a LOT more but I totally appreciate with a home and two small children it would be way down the priority list. Anyway, congrats and I liked watching the piece. Best, Dan
 

dcmus

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Dec 19, 2011
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Ardmore, Ok
As a musician and a voracious reader I'm in awe. Have been devouring the site and offer my sincere thanks to everyone!
 
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Jack Olsen

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Thanks!

Here's a garage project from last week. My son wanted a shelf to hold his water and book up in his bunk bed. So we did the project together. Today, he did a presentation to his kindergarten class about it. These were the pictures he showed -- along with a little bag of metal shavings, a cut section of steel -- and the bunk bed shelf itself.

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1Garageman

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May 12, 2009
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Columbus, Ohio
I bet that was fun to do with your son. It's great that your son is interested at an early age in getting into these kind of projects.
You both did a great job!
 

ruffryder

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Sep 13, 2012
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How old is your son?

My 3 year old likes to do projects with me too and it is a lot of fun working with him.

Cool story.
 

roadhouse

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Dec 18, 2014
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59
Location
Tulsa, OK
Saw the video of your 911 on another forum today. Very impressive! I love seeing guys track their cars, rather than just looking at them in the garage. Quick times, too!
 

Scott0023

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Apr 11, 2013
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177
Location
Atlanta
When my daughter was in kindergarten she liked to help in the garage. She had seen me weld and had asked about it. So, I decided she needed to see it up close.

We both put on our gloves and helmets and got after it. Her gloves went up so far on her arms they were more like calving gloves than welding gloves. After we had run a few beads on the MIG, mom comes out.

Mom - "What are you doing?"
Me - "Teaching her how to run a good weld bead (duh)"
Mom - "Don't you think she should learn how to tie hers shoes first?"
Me - "No. She will get that soon enough. Someone who can run a good bead can get a good job anytime they need one"

The door closed. On Monday my daughter took her metal work into show and tell.

My daughter is 21 now and is now wanting to come back into the garage after a very long absence and learn some woodworking.

>Scott
 

Dan in Pasadena

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You're a good Dad, Jack. And in my experience that counts infinitely more than the garage, race car, or movie scripts.

Good on you, it'll come back to you a thousand fold over the years. Merry Christmas to you and yours, Dan
 
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Jack Olsen

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Here's a flashback to an earlier part of this thread: my active aero idea that uses motors to switch the rear wing on my race car to a low-drag (and low-downforce) setting for the straight sections of my local track.

I did some more testing, and here's a comparison between two runs on the front straight at WSIR, one (red) with the wing going to low drag on the straight, and one (blue) with the wing remaining in a fixed position. The rear ride height sensor wasn't working, so this shows the front, which drops down when the rear wing is switched to the low drag position (note: the line going higher on the graph means the nose of the car was moving lower to the ground).

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So that would seem to show that leaving the wing in the high-downforce (high drag) position on the straight meant losing ultimate high speed.

But then here's the flipside. This is the same two laps, but looking at the back straight. This time the high drag (and high downforce) speed starts out slower, but then catches up to the low drag run -- which doesn't make any sense, if the low-drag position is lowering a significant amount of drag.

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The difference could be as simple as the prevailing winds during the two (sequential) laps. Or one of many other factors. The back straight data is compromised somewhat by not being entirely straight and also having more abrupt elevation changes, both of which make the ride height data less clear cut than in the previous graphic -- where you can easily see the exact moment where I change the wing's angle.

I did not get enough with/without measurements to see if there is a consistent pattern yet. So this may very well be junk data.

The jury is still out...
 

Outlawmws

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The Badlands
Jack, I'm not sure I'm following you. The red line is using the low drag position. It is almost entirely higher speed throughout. Not a lot, but its a long straight, so that adds up.

Also, you DID break your personal best recently. I'm assuming that was with the low drag position in use?

A tiny bit of speed increase across the entirety of the track (or at least much of it) gets you there.

That part of a second or so off your record translates to how many MPH? You are working with extremely small fractions here.
 
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zkling

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Jan 23, 2007
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Jack, what all data acq do you have on the car? Do you have plots of steering pos, throttle pos and accel to compare as well?
 
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Jack Olsen

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Outlawmws, the first graph made me think I was getting great results. But the second one calls it into question -- in that the low-drag line starts out faster, but then ends up at the same (ultimate) top speed. By the logic of the previous graphic, the red top speed should have ended up higher than the blue in the second graph.

But I think this is such a limited data sample that it's practically useless. I could have had a headwind in one run or a tailwind in another. In order to get a real snapshot of this, I think I'd need to drive out to where I can do straight-line tests in a controlled environment, reversing direction to correct for prevailing wins. To do that, I'll need a free afternoon.

zkling, I have a pretty rudimentary data setup. Aside from GPS-measured speed, the thing's got accelerometers for lateral and longitudinal Gs, and it combines both to draw a picture of my driving path. The only inputs I've added are for front and rear ride height, although I discovered the rear one is disconnected.
 

Outlawmws

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I see what you mean now. But as you mentioned it doesn't take into account head winds, and given that drag is exponential, and you were going in opposite directions...

What is the prevailing wind direction at WS? Whatever that Wind speed was, and given that you were going in opposite directions, I'd expect to see a drop off at the higher wind speed.

Don't forget, whatever the wind speed, the difference in each direction is potentially double, as the tail wind effectively lowers your actual air drag, same as driving into it increases it...

While I agree it's not conclusive, I think it's likely going in the right direction.
 

Outlawmws

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An afterthought.

You might try this as a "test": get up to a reasonably high speed in your low drag position, and the hit the wing to high drag, and see what your accelerometer says... I'll bet you will even feel it in the seat of your pants (or helmet)

Heck, you could try that one on the freeway. (I am again driving a mouse power Samurai, and can tell a huge difference between "drafting " a semi rig, (even as much as 3 seconds behind them) and breaking the wind myself. And this is all at only 60-70 MPH generally... Air drag can things hugely, or in very subtle ways...)
 
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Jack Olsen

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RideHeight1159215051.jpg


Yes. I got two $5 second-hand ride height sensors pulled out of a '95 Lincoln Continental. They're just linear potentiometers -- incoming voltage is reduced based on the position of a sliding rod. I tied them into my front and rear suspension. Calibration just means getting a voltage reading at a standstill, and then looking at voltage with different amounts of weight piled pver the front or rear axle. The data logger in my car can recored and smooth out the incoming voltages so that I can get a simple line to show changes in ride height. I did straight-line high speed testing with them, and was easily able to see the changes from single-step changes in the angle of attack of my wing. It also lets you see the cantilever effect of pushing one end down (with a wing or splitter) and seeing the other end of the car rise up.
 
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