The VISES of Garage Journal

[trijeff]

[... I was going to forget about it, but my wife thought it looked pretty neat and insisted we go and get it.[/QUOTE]

Keeper.

 

[SilverDeck]

Posted this on the 2016 Garage Sale thread but it should be included here as well:

$50 garage sale find from last Friday (6/3/2016). Wilton machinist's vise, model 101028 (4"). Schiller Park era, but keyway on slide does not seem to have any markings at all (even after cleaning and wire brushing). Am guessing a 1960s or 1970s production(?) Original swivel lock downs were replaced at some point with hex nuts. The original dust cap was missing but I've already remedied that with a steel freeze plug from the auto parts store. 2" freeze cap size was a perfect fit after minor sanding of the cap edge. Has a little bit of black rattle can paint on the jaws but it yields to mineral sprits and patience and I'm cleaning the whole thing up as time permits. Just a nice vise with honest wear and nothing broken or welded. Have been looking for one of these for a long time at a price I could afford and this one fit the bill.

Need some help from the Wilton bullet experts out there: How unusual is it that I can't find any markings on the slide of my 101028? I'm guessing it is 1960s or 1970s vintage. Schiller Park markings on the sides. But absolutely no marks (lightly stamped or otherwise on the slide key. I've looked several times after cleaning off the key with mineral spirits.

 

[IHmachinery]

IH: most of the Dawns I've seen and the one I own are the red color I think I see a tad of left on your vice. the members had a lot of information about them 2 or 3 months ago so if you can't find it maybe they will say what posts. or if VA has time I bet his magic search tool can.



nice find.

Mine was definitely blue. Just took it apart and cleaned it. The red you saw on the jaw was just a but of overspray from someone with poor aim being enthusiastic with the rustoleum. But I may paint it red if that was the more standard collar. This will be a user -- probably a gift.


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[IHmachinery]

Mine was definitely blue. Just took it apart and cleaned it. The red you saw on the jaw was just a but of overspray from someone with poor aim being enthusiastic with the rustoleum. But I may paint it red if that was the more standard collar. This will be a user -- probably a gift.


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...bit not but ... color not collar ... Damn touch keyboard ...


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[va.grouseman]

Previously posted by IHmachinery.

I picked this vise up yesterday. It is a "Dawn" 4-1/2" vise, made in Australia. Like vises made here in Canada (when things were actually made here) this looks a lot like an English vise (e.g. Paramo) -- presumably a legacy of our colonial past.

Anyway, I had never heard of this brand before and so thought I'd post a couple pictures. I will clean it up and paint it ...
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IHmachinery, here is a brief history of your Dawn vise/vice.---Their well made vises/vices.

http://www.dawntools.com.au/about_dawn.php

 

[FigureItOut]

I pulled apart this Ridgid today and cleaned a bunch of metal shavings out of the lead screw, lubed and mounted it in it's new temporary home.
It's first job was to help me make a handle for the hold down screw. I didn't feel the need to spend $50 for the correct handle, but I can't decide if I want to take the original out of the other side and make another so they match.

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[exmaxima1]

I pulled apart this Ridgid today and cleaned a bunch of metal shavings out of the lead screw, lubed and mounted it in it's new temporary home.

How did you get the vise apart? Did you just remove the underside screw that adjusts the play in the dynamic jaw?

 

[Watsondog]

One of 3 ...Wilton 600 at my customers shop today...I need one of these big boys.


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[FigureItOut]

How did you get the vise apart? Did you just remove the underside screw that adjusts the play in the dynamic jaw?

Yes. I felt a little resistance as the end of the screw hit the nut, so I checked and it looks like they warped the thread a bit to let you know you're at the end, but it didn't fight me coming out.
I wanted to remove the screw entirely from the dynamic jaw, but I wasn't too confident in getting it back together with the spring and the roll pin and all.

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[IHmachinery]

IH: most of the Dawns I've seen and the one I own are the red color I think I see a tad of left on your vice. the members had a lot of information about them 2 or 3 months ago so if you can't find it maybe they will say what posts. or if VA has time I bet his magic search tool can.



nice find.

Drives: found post #43282 which states that the higher end 'cast steel' Dawn vises were blue, whereas their more common 'cast semi-steel' vises were red. (I have no idea what 'semi-steel is, but that's another topic). The poster indicated that he had seen many red ones, but only a couple blue ones.

So, thanks to the amazing collected wisdom on this site, I know what I have, and why it is blue. So I will try to match the original blue when I repaint it.

Thanks VERY MUCH for pointing me to the previous posts on Dawn vises. Extremely helpful!






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[scooternut]

One of 3 ...Wilton 600 at my customers shop today...I need one of these big boys.


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https://pittsburgh.craigslist.org/tls/5624673937.html

It certainly is not free, but here you go.

 

[IHmachinery]

Previously posted by IHmachinery.



I picked this vise up yesterday. It is a "Dawn" 4-1/2" vise, made in Australia. Like vises made here in Canada (when things were actually made here) this looks a lot like an English vise (e.g. Paramo) -- presumably a legacy of our colonial past.



Anyway, I had never heard of this brand before and so thought I'd post a couple pictures. I will clean it up and paint it ...

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IHmachinery, here is a brief history of your Dawn vise/vice.---Their well made vises/vices.



http://www.dawntools.com.au/about_dawn.php

VA: thanks very much! I really appreciate this


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[drivesitfar]

SD: the older Chicago and Pat. Pend bullets without dates stamped on them probably were made between 1941-1945. since yours is from after they moved to Schiller Park i'd guess it was in a school and had many many many many users and the date stamp just wore off. since the first vises that came out of Schiller Park had a Guar Exp and 5 year advance date on them i'd guess your vise was probably early 60's or maybe late 50's made. make sense?

I've seen several old public school and shop vises like yours without any date stamps on them and not sure how many Bluebolt has recorded on his Excel sheet with over 200 bullets, but I know he has a few.


IH: you're very welcome. when Parker put semi steel on the sides of their vises they actually put bars of steel inside the cast iron dynamic jaws. now since yours is Australian made I don't know if that would be a similar method or if Dawn actually made their vices from steel and not cast. I do know they will stand up to most vices in durability and quality.

 

[va.grouseman]

Originally posted by SilverDeck.

Need some help from the Wilton bullet experts out there: How unusual is it that I can't find any markings on the slide of my 101028? I'm guessing it is 1960s or 1970s vintage. Schiller Park markings on the sides. But absolutely no marks (lightly stamped or otherwise on the slide key. I've looked several times after cleaning off the key with mineral spirits.
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Silver, some of the Wiltons with no date stamp are some of the first made, and some have the date worn of by use



Here's two sites that might pique your interest.



https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...jPnCfZ1YHWZppnqi2FM60/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=0


http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=269079

 

[coljar]

One of 3 ...Wilton 600 at my customers shop today...I need one of these big boys.


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I don't need one, but I want one now, after getting the 400........and I'll have my eye out for a baby bullet, etc. etc.

 

[IHmachinery]

IH[/B]: you're very welcome. when Parker put semi steel on the sides of their vises they actually put bars of steel inside the cast iron dynamic jaws. now since yours is Australian made I don't know if that would be a similar method or if Dawn actually made their vices from steel and not cast. I do know they will stand up to most vices in durability and quality.

When I looked at the web page that VA pointed me to (the current Dawn web page) it appears they still make a distinction between their standard (red) line of vises and their (super duty) line which is made of "spheroidal graphite ductile iron ... Similar to cast steel" and apparently tougher so as to be suited to chipping, hammering, etc. These are now in a kind of blue-green color. As I noted earlier, the older one I have (apparently pre 1972, based on information in other posts) was closer to the blue used by Record.



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[drivesitfar]

Scooter or JKB: did either of you happen to see the Reed 209 or maybe it was a 109 that was for sale for a grand last month in your area? did it sell?

ALL: speaking of big bullets there is an 8 inch one with the bolts coming in from the backside of the jaws for sale in my area for about a grand that i'm debating on. please somebody buy it because i'd rather have a Reed 109 or even a 208 that is mint instead.

 

[Ridjobradi]

Finally have a few days at home and I was able to dig out a few more pieces. This is a little Goodall Pratt vise that I brought overseas several years back, so that I could work on little hobby projects. That is anti seize on the screw and the slides. The salty air here is a major issue.

 

[Ridjobradi]

This "YANKEE" No. 993 vise is from NORTH BROS. MFG. CO., PHILA, PA USA. It came with an early, possibly pre-1900, shaper I bought several years ago. It isn't a typical shaper vise, so it may end up on either the Myers or the Hamilton drill press.

 

[PghJKB]

https://pittsburgh.craigslist.org/tls/5624673937.html

It certainly is not free, but here you go.

Scooter or JKB: did either of you happen to see the Reed 209 or maybe it was a 109 that was for sale for a grand last month in your area? did it sell?

ALL: speaking of big bullets there is an 8 inch one with the bolts coming in from the backside of the jaws for sale in my area for about a grand that i'm debating on. please somebody buy it because i'd rather have a Reed 109 or even a 208 that is mint instead.

Scooter
The Wilton 600 was part of an an ES last Sat. Seller is apparently looking for a quick turnover.

Drives, the Reed 109 is no longer on CL, perhaps it sold. It was there for over two weeks.

There is a collector north east of the Burgh (in the Freeport / Tarentum corridor) that has a bunch of big uns, he may have taken it. I doubt it, the price was, IMHO, delusional.

JKB

 

[CRSINMICH]

IHmachinery: Here's a bit more information on Dawn vises and the definition of semi-steel from Machinerys Handbook. Nice vise.

 

[bagged89s10]

My new work truck finally came in. It had a subpar quality yost vise mounted in the back. It will be getting replaced.

 

[wrenchguy]

Drives, the Reed 109 is no longer on CL, perhaps it sold. It was there for over two weeks.

There is a collector north east of the Burgh (in the Freeport / Tarentum corridor) that has a bunch of big uns, he may have taken it. I doubt it, the price was, IMHO, delusional.

JKB

4 this serious collector price was not delusional, even with cracked slide. i think it went to kansas.

 

[bulletpruf]

My new work truck finally came in. It had a subpar quality yost vise mounted in the back. It will be getting replaced.

Looks like the one that I recently bought from Amazon. Needed something to use until I found something vintage and solid. It was such a POS that I never used it. Gave it away this weekend.

 

[SilverDeck]

Can anyone confirm the thread size/pitch for the screws that hold the jaws on a Wilton bullet 101028 (4" jaws) ? I believe that they are 5/16:18 but just wanted to double check.

Am in the process of slowly get my vise cleaned up. Last night I removed and cleaned the jaw pad on the dynamic jaw (lots of dried grease and crud between the jaw pad and the dynamic jaw. After putting it all back together I noticed a very slight amount of play in the jaw pad when the screws were fully tightened - almost like the screws were slightly too long and were bottoming out in the jaw before fully cinching the jaw pad tight to the dynamic jaw. It is possible that the screws and/or the jaw pad are replacements. I'll do some more checking to make sure the threaded holes are fully cleaned out before taking any drastic action, but I'm wondering if I could shorten the screws by about one thread so that they will tighten up the jaw pad. I've got a tap & die set with a 5/16:18 die that I could use to clean up the threads on the shortened bolt. The amount of play in the jaw pad when the screws are fully tightened is small (maybe 1/32") but is noticeable. Any advice on whether to try shortening the screws just a teeny bit or is it not worth worrying about? Not sure if the static jaw has these same issues, but time will tell. As it sits now there isn't any play in the uncleaned static jaw pad like there is in the newly-cleaned dynamic jaw pad.

 

[Craptain]

My new work truck finally came in. It had a subpar quality yost vise mounted in the back. It will be getting replaced.

I have never previously seen Yost and subpar in the same sentence. They must have gone a long way down from my Yost.

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[G-ManBart]

Can anyone confirm the thread size/pitch for the screws that hold the jaws on a Wilton bullet 101028 (4" jaws) ? I believe that they are 5/16:18 but just wanted to double check.

Am in the process of slowly get my vise cleaned up. Last night I removed and cleaned the jaw pad on the dynamic jaw (lots of dried grease and crud between the jaw pad and the dynamic jaw. After putting it all back together I noticed a very slight amount of play in the jaw pad when the screws were fully tightened - almost like the screws were slightly too long and were bottoming out in the jaw before fully cinching the jaw pad tight to the dynamic jaw. It is possible that the screws and/or the jaw pad are replacements. I'll do some more checking to make sure the threaded holes are fully cleaned out before taking any drastic action, but I'm wondering if I could shorten the screws by about one thread so that they will tighten up the jaw pad. I've got a tap & die set with a 5/16:18 die that I could use to clean up the threads on the shortened bolt. The amount of play in the jaw pad when the screws are fully tightened is small (maybe 1/32") but is noticeable. Any advice on whether to try shortening the screws just a teeny bit or is it not worth worrying about? Not sure if the static jaw has these same issues, but time will tell. As it sits now there isn't any play in the uncleaned static jaw pad like there is in the newly-cleaned dynamic jaw pad.

You can easily shorten the screws....a belt sander works well, but a grinder or even a Dremel will work. No need to use the tap and die set, just round out the end after you shorten them so the thread has a bit of a ramp where it starts and you'll be fine.

 

[va.grouseman]

$1000.00 for a 9'' Reed is not a ridiculous price,---When you factor in the rarity, the size, (Dayids List has it at 283 lbs.), the condition, the collector value, and the fact that a 238 lb. Wilton is going for $2500.00 to $3600.00, depending on where you buy, I'd say it was priced reasonable.---And that Reed is tougher than anything you can buy today.---But all this comes under JMO.

 

[scooternut]

drives I did not see it in person, the 109. Sent them an offer that they must not have liked. Probably should've found my reason to just pay up. At least I still have the 106, which is probably far more useful for my purposes.

 

[G-ManBart]

I have never previously seen Yost and subpar in the same sentence. They must have gone a long way down from my Yost.

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Like all the other American vise companies they only make some of their vises here. I have a US Yost that's great, but work bought some Chinese Yost vises and they're not very impressive at all.

 

[wkndwarrior29]

Now that I finished repainting my Emmert tiger vise I wanted to share some pictures. During the process I was happy to find the original metal in good condition with no repairs. For anyone that wondered, it is a shade over 150lbs with the extra coat of paint. I'm still considering painting the raised lettering.

 

[IHmachinery]

IHmachinery: Here's a bit more information on Dawn vises and the definition of semi-steel from Machinerys Handbook. Nice vise.

Thank you VERY much! This is very helpful!


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[drivesitfar]

WRENCH: was the slide cracked that I couldn't see or was that a weld on the dynamic under the jaws.

ALL: a grand for a 9 inch vise isn't what it's worth especially if it's in great shape. of course how many of us actually have a use for it that a good 6 or 8 inch vise won't do. I don't have a use specifically for it, but I would like to own one.

here's the picture from the ad. sounds like maybe Demo has it coming his direction as we speak? the force for big steel is definitely pulling hard towards him that is for certain. any confirmation that the REED 109 is on it's way to you? DEMO?

 

[va.grouseman]

Thanks for saving a picture of the 109 Drive.---I forgot to, and now all you get is (This post has been deleted).---

 

[CRSINMICH]

Now that I finished repainting my Emmert tiger vise I wanted to share some pictures. During the process I was happy to find the original metal in good condition with no repairs. For anyone that wondered, it is a shade over 150lbs with the extra coat of paint. I'm still considering painting the raised lettering.

wkndwarrior: Those Tigers seem to be rare. There have only been a few posted here and I've only seen one in the wild - the one I bought. It's a number 46 and a stout mofo. You should definitely paint the letters. One member who posted pictures way last summer did a superb job on his. I think his screen name is SteelKilt. Mine is way down the resto list but it is in the works right now. I never thought about putting my Tiger on the hearth. It should hold about 1/2 a face cord.

 

[CRSINMICH]

Thank you VERY much! This is very helpful!

IHmachinery: I missed this page when looking for information on Dawn. It's from 1941. Check out the offset vise - third one down in left column. I think I'd like to find a Dawnette though.

 

[bulletpruf]

Now that I finished repainting my Emmert tiger vise I wanted to share some pictures. During the process I was happy to find the original metal in good condition with no repairs. For anyone that wondered, it is a shade over 150lbs with the extra coat of paint. I'm still considering painting the raised lettering.

Did you paint EVERYTHING? Usually just the main jaw and dynamic jaw (minus the machined portions) are painted and the rest is natural...

 

[joe.striper]

$1000.00 for a 9'' Reed is not a ridiculous price,---When you factor in the rarity, the size, (Dayids List has it at 283 lbs.), the condition, the collector value, and the fact that a 238 lb. Wilton is going for $2500.00 to $3600.00, depending on where you buy, I'd say it was priced reasonable.---And that Reed is tougher than anything you can buy today.---But all this comes under JMO.

I spoke to the buyer this morning, I will allow them the courtesy to reveal themselves. They were thrilled to get it. The seller got a ton of calls. There is a lot of interest in big steel, and yet my 7" Prentiss 23 swivel jaw gets no love on CL at $250.

No issue though as Rev Scott found me some Chicom 8" jaw inserts he's sending me so I can machine the Prentiss' jaws and install them.

Personally i have no idea how one restores something that damned big. Just a major pita in my opinion and Ive only handeld/restored 7" vises!

Oh well, as I like to say, that's why God created, blondes, brunettes and redheads!!

 

[Al Bundy]

Would love some assistance with this. Came from the family farm, I know nothing about vises. All I know is I haven't seen one like it on the portion of this thread that I've managed to read. It would be nice to have something of value as opposed to all the worthless **** I've sorted through.

 

[drivesitfar]

AL: there have been a few Sheldon wood vises posted here in the last few weeks and the guys seem to like them. yours is different than theirs and since it has 2 jaws and looks like a patternmaker's vise I wouldn't say it has NO VALUE. if it's from a relative's farm i'd clean it up and put it to use because of the history and it does look like it might come in handy. maybe somebody else can tell you more. thanks for posting it.

JOE: so the 109 is coming up to VISE HEAVEN REGION in the US and I've got a good idea who might be the new owner. thanks for the heads up. I don't shop for vises on EBAY and maybe that keeps my vise addiction to a level I can sort of maintain. that said unless your Prentiss is broken or maybe the jaws are missing it should sell for that.

I couldn't find it listed and I looked up Viseman and got WISEMAN and I knew that wasn't the right guy.

cheers