The VISES of Garage Journal

[1foxracing]

Are there any date codes on top of the stationary jaw?

Cheers

I haven't disassembled them yet to check.
I did read over your thread on the repair/restoration project and your turned out fantastic!
This morning I went on the hunt for the Rustoleum Verde Green in quart cans and found out they only offer it in the spray can version so I ordered a few cans and some primer up.
I'm not going to strip them until I have everything here so I can at least get some primer on them quickly.
Thank you for the info!

 

[Mark in Indiana]

1fox:
Thanks for the compliment.
I traveled 200 miles round trip for each of my FPU vises. How far did you travel for yours?

 

[drivesitfar]

Fox: I agree with Mark that those FPU vices are definitely worth taking a road trip for. i've got a Fowler sticker on one of mine too.

Maico: the vice you posted that you thought looks like a Leinen might be, but i'm guessing it's another brand cause I haven't seen a Leinen with that look or screws holding the slide in place. I'll post it over on the Tools of the Old World and maybe Monte or another member over there recognizes it cause i'm pretty sure it's from that side of the world where it was made.

AKARick: nice work on the vise restoration and it looks a lot like Fretter's burgundy color he used a lot before he started liking naked vices maybe a bit better. just curious what make it is and I can't say i've ever seen a badge on the hub (end of main screw) before so can you tell us what it says on that badge or maybe there are two badges?

 

[Mark in Indiana]

1fox & Drives:

I briefly looked around for a Fowler FPU vise. Although I read mention of them, I couldn't find any more information.
I forgot that Hi-Test was another FPU brand.

I'll dig around some more. Enjoyed the discussion.

 

[maico]

If you strip a vise of old paint how to you stop it rusting without painting ? For example, this Reed owned by a member here shows the metal nicely which a thick coat of paint would cover.

Could burnishing or a clear coat of something be used ?

 

[jpickar]

Picked up a couple today, A Will Burt Versa Vise (Bull nose jaws) and a clamp on "Rail" type hobby/Jewelers vise. Both from the same place I got a bunch of other stuff with these two so I'd call it $20 for both.

Notice the pipe jaws are near pristine on the versa vise, lots of surface rust and it was apparently outside but not in direct rain. I found the pipe jaws on the "tools table" and I'd guess they were taken off when new and never used... The miracle is that I found them at all!

The Versa Vise has 3-1/2" jaws, the clamp-on 1-1/2".

Decent finds, I just wish the Versa Vise had the Parrot jaws...

Well I never cease to learn something new every time I get on GJ. I bought a pair of pipe jaws I saw for a $1 at a sale last fall. I was just getting ready to do something with them. Now I see they go to a versa vise. Guess I will hang onto them and keep looking for a versa vise. I have been wanting one for several years now and haven't come across one yet.
Thanks for the post Outlaw!
John

 

[drivesitfar]

JP: just an FYI. those style of pipe jaws come on other makes of open screw vises so while you have something that you can use it might not fit a VERSA VISE.

Outlaw: looks like the versa vise you found has spent it's entire life outside with very little use and should clean up nicely.

 

[AngryBeaver]

If you strip a vise of old paint how to you stop it rusting without painting ? For example, this vise owned by a member here shows the metal nicely which a thick coat of paint would cover. Is it burnished somehow or a clear coat used ?

Boiled linseed oil. most members here bake them until they quit smoking to harden the oil faster than it would on its own. it would take weeks or months to dry on its own.

I picked up my first and second Wilton ever today. Guy was selling the C2 and told me about the 450 also. Paid 250 for the pair. Not sure if the price was way too high or what. There is no vises around here for sale. The base on the 450 is cracked, I think I found a few on eBay reasonable. The C2 is in good shape besides someone welded a different jaw into the static jaw. Not sure if I can very carefully cut that out and get a new set of jaws or not. What do you guys think?

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very good deal. I bought my C2 for 250 with a missing swivel base. its a damn good user. that and a 200 dollar 450 is all anyone would ever need. the 450 is on my work bench and the C2 is on my welding table. yours will clean up well. take a wire wheel/flap wheel on a grinder to find where the weld is, carefully grind it out and order up some new jaws from Kevin. you might have to retap the holes. Ive noticed a lot of wiltons that have welded on jaws are usually a result from people still using the vise with the screwed on jaws while they were loose and flopping around ripping most, if not all, of the remaining threads out.

 

[kukko]

Saw these at a recent swap meet. Thought the Wilton was a fair price if you really needed it, at $250. The Emmert was $1000!

 

[Outlawmws]

Clear, a lot of guys use BLO, simply coating it with gun-oil, but that can attract a lot of dirt

 

[Fretters]

If you strip a vise of old paint how to you stop it rusting without painting ? For example, this Reed owned by a member here shows the metal nicely which a thick coat of paint would cover.

Could burnishing or a clear coat of something be used ?

Wax, Linseed Oil, shoe polish etc. Pretty much anything which will give you a covering which stays. You could clear coat, but you'd have the problem of it chipping, touching up etc. Easier done for touch-up/refreshing with the former coatings.

 

[Fretters]

Boiled linseed oil. most members here bake them until they quit smoking to harden the oil faster than it would on its own. it would take weeks or months to dry on its own.
.

Doesn't take that long to harden. I use thinned, virgin Linseed Oil, and a few days will see that fine for use. Boiled should take even less time.

 

[va.grouseman]

Kukko, that's a little rich on the Turtleback.---You can find them cheaper than that, but I do concede that the old Turtlebacks fetch a good price.

 

[Outlawmws]

Boiled linseed oil. most members here bake them until they quit smoking to harden the oil faster than it would on its own. it would take weeks or months to dry on its own.

.

Doesn't take that long to harden. I use thinned, virgin Linseed Oil, and a few days will see that fine for use. Boiled should take even less time.

Agreed; if it takes that long you put it on too thick. THIN coats, several if you want build up.

 

[Brorex]

Nice finds! And both are repairable. I think you should try to have the base welded up. I welded up the base on my Desmond Simplex about 10 yrs ago after cutting a groove in it and it has held up wonderfully. And that was before I knew all the rules about welding cast iron. Just a regular ole MIG.

As far as the C2, I'd suggest taking the paint off with a wire wheel so you can see what's going on. Then get a cutting wheel on a grinder and excise that jaw as carefully as you can leaving as much of the original casting as you can. Whatever is left you can shape later as needed.

Good luck and post updates!

*Edit* And ya, you did real good paying $250 for both of those. I've paid more for a single 4 1/2" Wilton bullet...ergh, I'm jeal-happy for you!

Thanks for the comment. I got that jaw out. Here's some pics. Where is the best place to order replacement jaws. I haven't been on here for a while but I know there's a member here that sells them out of Colorado. Thanks in advance. I'd like to get the new jaws and then work on cleaning up all the weld and shaping it the way it needs to be. View attachment 1

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[1foxracing]

1fox:
Thanks for the compliment.
I traveled 200 miles round trip for each of my FPU vises. How far did you travel for yours?

518 miles round trip,took my Civic that got around 40MPG. The guy also had a Hi-Test FPU that he currently doesn't want to part with. He has several other vises for sale on craigslist, Parkers, Wilton's, Reeds, Prentiss and so on, most seemed to have the rear swiveling jaw and he has purchased replacement pins for many of them from Dr, Scott.
His name is David and he lives close to Flint,MI. I did tell him about this forum and e-mailed him a link to this particular thread. I think many here would enjoy seeing his collection.

 

[Mark in Indiana]

1fox:
Well worth the trip! 2 great vises + a road trip = win/win.

 

[bagged89s10]

Doesn't take that long to harden. I use thinned, virgin Linseed Oil, and a few days will see that fine for use. Boiled should take even less time.

I usually put on the BLO thick, wait 10-20 min, then wipe the vise down so all the excess BLO is gone. Then I put in my oven at a low temp like 200F to let it dry. This method also keeps the vise from getting the yellowish tint. I prefer the natural gray metal color.

 

[drivesitfar]

Bagged: just to clarify to others. you are using a $100 smoker that you bought and not your family's oven you cook food in. YES??

ALL: it's best to wipe on BLO when it's warmer say around 70 degrees sort of like spray paint, but it will dry even if it's cold out if you don't put on too heavy.

BLO also works well on wood

 

[Fretters]

I usually put on the BLO thick, wait 10-20 min, then wipe the vise down so all the excess BLO is gone.

Similar. I either wipe on a thin film with a cloth, else brush it on. Depends upon the surface I'm coating. Either way, it gets a wipe down after a while to remove any excess, then left to air dry.

 

[HandsomeDan]

any of you ever do a clear powdercoat?

 

[eddieK]

Rock Island restore -

I have some questions for the experts here -

This is a rock Island 571 It has the Birtman Elect. Co label and replaceable jaws ...It also has a 4 number numeric stamp on the slide

Pics -



picture host

From what I have learned this means the vise was manufactured after 1930 and before 1957...does anyone know what these stamping numbers represent?

 

[eddieK]

If you strip a vise of old paint how to you stop it rusting without painting ? For example, this Reed owned by a member here shows the metal nicely which a thick coat of paint would cover.

Could burnishing or a clear coat of something be used ?

Boiled Linseed Oil - Two days in the sun...


Or - If you don't want to stay married very long about two hours in the oven.

 

[drivesitfar]

Eddie: probably part #'s. is there a date stamp on your Rock Island on the top of the slide just behind the static when the jaws are closed?

ALL: just an FYI. if you bake on BLO i've been told it stinks and not in a good way so never put it in your family's oven and a cheap smoker set outside might be your best option if you don't want it to dry naturally or in the sun.

 

[MayerMR]

Thanks for the comment. I got that jaw out. Here's some pics. Where is the best place to order replacement jaws. I haven't been on here for a while but I know there's a member here that sells them out of Colorado. Thanks in advance. I'd like to get the new jaws and then work on cleaning up all the weld and shaping it the way it needs to be. View attachment 1

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Nice job! And buy the from Kevin at WiltonViseParts.com. They are the nicest dang things you can imagine. I put them on this Wilton 1750 I recently completed and they about make it too nice to use!

 

[454ragtop]

So if anyone ever wondered if a new (1998-current) Wilton 600 screw would work in a pre 1998 600, the answer is technically no.

GJ member 2slow had an extra screw/handle assembly that he provided to me very graciously for just the cost of shipping. There's nothing terribly wrong with mine but I jumped on the opportunity to replace with a brand new part. There is only a slight bend in the new one that I planned on having straightened. Unfortunately the screw is about 1 1/2" longer.

So here is the question of the day. Would you......

1.) revert back to my original plan of cleaning up and polishing the original and then continue the search for someone in need of a new handle for a post 1998 Wilton 600 or....

2.) There is a very good local machine shop that I take wheels to from time to time for work. I was going to ask my friend there to straighten the handle. I could just ask him to cut it down to the correct length as well. I'm really on the fence as it will look very nice with its new handle once I get it finished up and painted plus I liked the idea of having the basically NOS handle and my original one completely polished out.

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Surprised no one else replied, but I'd just shorten the screw, if it's a perfect match other than the length, Doubt it's very hard, probably cut it with a hacksaw, if not, a cutoff wheel would make quick work of it.

 

[chrisnazzy]

Surprised no one else replied, but I'd just shorten the screw, if it's a perfect match other than the length, Doubt it's very hard, probably cut it with a hacksaw, if not, a cutoff wheel would make quick work of it.

Thanks 454. I was certainly looking for a few members to chime in but within only a few minutes Razorhunter posted his holy grail, that pristine Reed 204 1/2 and with how fast this thread moves I think my post just got gobbled up.

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[454ragtop]

Went to a swap meet this weekend, picked up a couple vises. One is a basic Parker 974, nice shape, didn't get any pics of that one.
Other is this small unmarked vise, 2-1/4" jaws, weighs 7lb 6oz. with the mounting parts. Note the Parker type jaws, but retained by screws thru the working face, not the usual pins thru the top. Has a fairly short screw, limits safe opening to about 2", versus the 2-3/4" of slide sticking out of the static with the vise closed. It also doesn't have a collar of any sort, uses a spring inside the slide to open the jaw, but does have a thrust washer between the "meatball" and the dynamic. Anybody recognize it? My first thought was Prentiss, seems they often made unmarked vises, and the "meatball" looks Prentiss'ish. The Parker type jaws throw it off though. It's in real nice shape, appears to have seen little to no use.

 

[454ragtop]

Couple crappy pics of the jaws showing the mounting screws of the mystery mini vise.

 

[KMScott]

I like that vise 454, I could have fun with it. First 2-1/2 vise I have seen with the Parker Union type jaws. Bolting on the face seems odd too. The unclamp under the bench says pretty old. I would not be surprised if Parker tried their hand in this style of vise.

 

[MayerMR]

Thanks 454. I was certainly looking for a few members to chime in but within only a few minutes Razorhunter posted his holy grail, that pristine Reed 204 1/2 and with how fast this thread moves I think my post just got gobbled up.

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I know how you feel, same thing happened to me! Can't blame them though, that Reed was a helluva find.

 

[akasrick]

AKARick: nice work on the vise restoration and it looks a lot like Fretter's burgundy color he used a lot before he started liking naked vices maybe a bit better. just curious what make it is and I can't say i've ever seen a badge on the hub (end of main screw) before so can you tell us what it says on that badge or maybe there are two badges?

Drives, here is an earlier model of what I think that vise is.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=741763&d=1519868430

Later they went to this,
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=756031&d=1523577810

It is pretty much a painting exercise based on that info.

The two badges are cast, not pinned the larger has an "S3'" in raised letters
the smaller has nothing left on it.
It originally came to me with the 3 parts on the left of picture
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=741760&d=1519868430
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=741889&d=1519898523

akasrick

 

[autopts]

Thanks 454. I was certainly looking for a few members to chime in but within only a few minutes Razorhunter posted his holy grail, that pristine Reed 204 1/2 and with how fast this thread moves I think my post just got gobbled up.

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I know the changeover years take the same collar and also matching numbers on the nut assembly. Despite minor changes, Wilton has had that basic design for Decades.
454 That's a wonderful find!!!

 

[exmaxima1]

My first thought was Prentiss, seems they often made unmarked vises, and the "meatball" looks Prentiss'ish. The Parker type jaws throw it off though. It's in real nice shape, appears to have seen little to no use.

Yep, the general shape of the vise and the meatball spindle sort of scream "Prentiss" to me as well.

 

[eddieK]

Eddie: probably part #'s. is there a date stamp on your Rock Island on the top of the slide just behind the static when the jaws are closed?

ALL: just an FYI. if you bake on BLO i've been told it stinks and not in a good way so never put it in your family's oven and a cheap smoker set outside might be your best option if you don't want it to dry naturally or in the sun.

Drives, if something was there, long ago ground away.

 

[eddieK]

Went to a swap meet this weekend, picked up a couple vises. One is a basic Parker 974, nice shape, didn't get any pics of that one.
Other is this small unmarked vise, 2-1/4" jaws, weighs 7lb 6oz. with the mounting parts. Note the Parker type jaws, but retained by screws thru the working face, not the usual pins thru the top. Has a fairly short screw, limits safe opening to about 2", versus the 2-3/4" of slide sticking out of the static with the vise closed. It also doesn't have a collar of any sort, uses a spring inside the slide to open the jaw, but does have a thrust washer between the "meatball" and the dynamic. Anybody recognize it? My first thought was Prentiss, seems they often made unmarked vises, and the "meatball" looks Prentiss'ish. The Parker type jaws throw it off though. It's in real nice shape, appears to have seen little to no use.

Does it look like the screw was modified to a spring set up? Prentiss usually has the POS crown nut. The main body, the screw and meatball, the slide support and in general it looks like a prentiss

 

[twertsy]

Went to a swap meet this weekend, picked up a couple vises. One is a basic Parker 974, nice shape, didn't get any pics of that one.
Other is this small unmarked vise, 2-1/4" jaws, weighs 7lb 6oz. with the mounting parts. Note the Parker type jaws, but retained by screws thru the working face, not the usual pins thru the top. Has a fairly short screw, limits safe opening to about 2", versus the 2-3/4" of slide sticking out of the static with the vise closed. It also doesn't have a collar of any sort, uses a spring inside the slide to open the jaw, but does have a thrust washer between the "meatball" and the dynamic. Anybody recognize it? My first thought was Prentiss, seems they often made unmarked vises, and the "meatball" looks Prentiss'ish. The Parker type jaws throw it off though. It's in real nice shape, appears to have seen little to no use.

The rear "slide guide" looks distinctly Parker around 1900.

 

[akasrick]

Went to a swap meet this weekend, picked up a couple vises. One is a basic Parker 974, nice shape, didn't get any pics of that one.
Other is this small unmarked vise, 2-1/4" jaws, weighs 7lb 6oz. with the mounting parts. Note the Parker type jaws, .... snip

Adv from <s>1920s</s> clearly the file says 1902
Same jaw configuration, 1 & 1/4" wider.

akasrick

 

[bagged89s10]

Bagged: just to clarify to others. you are using a $100 smoker that you bought and not your family's oven you cook food in. YES??



ALL: it's best to wipe on BLO when it's warmer say around 70 degrees sort of like spray paint, but it will dry even if it's cold out if you don't put on too heavy.



BLO also works well on wood

Yes Do NOT use the family’s oven. You don’t want all the toxic chemicals from paint, BLO or whatever else might be on the vise getting embedded into the interior of the oven, and eventually getting passed into cooked food. Go buy yourself an electric smoker like I did or search Craigslist for a used oven. You can probably even use chicken coop or powder coating lamps.

 

[bagged89s10]

Went to a swap meet this weekend, picked up a couple vises. One is a basic Parker 974, nice shape, didn't get any pics of that one.

Other is this small unmarked vise, 2-1/4" jaws, weighs 7lb 6oz. with the mounting parts. Note the Parker type jaws, but retained by screws thru the working face, not the usual pins thru the top. Has a fairly short screw, limits safe opening to about 2", versus the 2-3/4" of slide sticking out of the static with the vise closed. It also doesn't have a collar of any sort, uses a spring inside the slide to open the jaw, but does have a thrust washer between the "meatball" and the dynamic. Anybody recognize it? My first thought was Prentiss, seems they often made unmarked vises, and the "meatball" looks Prentiss'ish. The Parker type jaws throw it off though. It's in real nice shape, appears to have seen little to no use.

Those Parker union style jaws really makes me believe it’s a very old Parker. The only thing is that I’ve never seen a Parker with screw in jaws. I know some of the old farmer vises have cast in jaws, but I haven’t seen the screw in yet. Prentiss was eventually a division of Parker, so I wouldn’t be surprised if there was some type of design collaboration of engineers. Maybe the design just never got approved and that one was a prototype.

Anything that screams prentiss about the nut or the shaft collar.?

https://patents.google.com/patent/US396066A/en?oq=396066