Who here won this box for $6k

[scooby074]

I'd like to see the financing and security agreement where the buyer transfers ownership of his box to Matco financial in exhange for the loan as stated by Krusty the Clown. Is this a rent to own contract? If so, as the "owner" of the box according to Krusty, how does Matco financial limit its liability as to acts or occurences surrounding the use and storage of the box?

As the seller, and the item not being paid in full at time of purchase, Matco in this case has the right to take out a chattel mortgage to protect their interest. They may or may not do this, its their choice.

Matco no longer "owns" the item in the truest sense, but the mortgage gives them the right to repossess the item in the case the buyer defaults.

Simple as that.

A common (if slightly different) example
You buy a house (ie mortgage). The bank doesnt own it , but you better believe theyll take it if you dont pay. Same goes for cars etc.

 

[MrMark]

You need to check to see if a UCC financing statement has been filed with the secretary of state. Checking with the tool company is not only a waste of time, it's not the legally correct course of action.

 

[scooby074]

You need to check to see if a UCC financing statement has been filed with the secretary of state. Checking with the tool company is not only a waste of time, it's not the legally correct course of action.

This is correct. The CM will need to be registered with the proper officials in your location.

Bob on the tool truck would not be an accurate source as to liens on the item.

 

[MrMark]

You get a star.

It's not really a chattel mortgage it's a security interest under the State in questions adoption of the UCC. The financing statement is constructive NOTICE to the world that there is a priority lien against the goods in question and that another has priority over YOU. There are defenses and exceptions available to the BFP for value.

As the seller, and the item not being paid in full at time of purchase, Matco in this case has the right to take out a chattel mortgage to protect their interest. They may or may not do this, its their choice.

Matco no longer "owns" the item in the truest sense, but the mortgage gives them the right to repossess the item in the case the buyer defaults.

Simple as that.

A common (if slightly different) example
You buy a house (ie mortgage). The bank doesnt own it , but you better believe theyll take it if you dont pay. Same goes for cars etc.

 

[scooby074]

You get a star.

It's not really a chattel mortgage it's a security interest under the State in questions adoption of the UCC. The financing statement is constructive NOTICE to the world that there is a priority lien against the goods in question and that another has priority over YOU. There are defenses and exceptions available to the BFP for value.

I cant really comment on the UCC accurately, We have a different system here. The lien or chattel mortgage (interchangeable) are filed with the Registry of Deeds. A little different system but the end result is the same> Protecting the interest of the seller.

 

[MrMark]

Yes, checking with the tool company is really not smart. What if they miss something and tell you that they don't see anything in their records? Are you free and clear? Not at all. The court doesn't care about that. What if they say yah, we got a chattel mortgage on that one, and they don't?

What the tool company says doesn't matter one bit under the law. The only thing that matters is whether a prior security interest has been created and perfected under the UCC.

 

[MrMark]

I cant really comment on the UCC accurately, We have a different system here. The lien or chattel mortgage (interchangeable) are filed with the Registry of Deeds. A little different system but the end result is the same> Protecting the interest of the seller.

Yes, sounds like you have a pre-UCC system of chattel mortgages and such.

 

[MrMark]

QUOTE FROM 67:

"You don't own a box that you're financing b/c the finance company has the right to take that box back if the buyer defaults on the payments. That's pretty straightforward, but if you want to defend your buddy's repudiation of this, knock yourself out."


This is flat out wrong. Do you own your own house? I suppose you have a deed of trust (Georgia, right?) rather than a mortgage where you transferred your title to the third party trustee in consideration of the loan. Right?

Even with a deed of trust, the borrower retains equitable title to the property.

Do you think this Matco agreement has a transfer of title to some third party trustee to hold the legal title until the debt is paid like in a deed of trust?

If it does that would be the only reason the seller didn't "OWN" the box (although he would still hold equitable title which is more than enough title to avoid the theft business) it sure isn't because Matco can foreclose on a default to take the box back.

 

[nate379]

Hmm.. One of my friends has a C Man pro box about the size of my Snap On and I like his much better. I went to grab some tools one day and it was night and day difference how better the drawers opened and closed. The one drawer had probably 400lbs of stuff it in too.

.

I have a brand new Montezuma siting on an old Snap on Roller, the difference is night and day. The Snap on is made to open and close a million times a day, no way that Montezuma takes that. Its great for me and I like the box but there's no comparison if you ask me

 

[Flash21]

the way i take it he is saying that as long as the UCC is properly filed the finance company has the right to reposses the box from a third party, so yes i agree. of course it appears he is a lawyer and i might need to hire a lawyer to interpret his interpretation

I'm a little confused why you're asking us? That's been our position all along...that if the secondhand buyer does his due diligence and doesn't find any claim on it, he should be good to go.

'67: I'm asking you guys because I want to be sure I know how to protect myself if / when I buy a used box. I wanted to see if you agreed with HappyShooter's comments around how to do that.


The way I read it, HappyShooter said that if you did the UCC due diligence and could prove a resonalbe price was paid, then you were clean. I'm not sure what happens in the event the secured loan is defaulted on some time after the 2nd owner purchases the box. At the time the 2nd owner purchased, there was no default situation and no UCC records. Some time later, the loan is defaulted.

What happens then? If I read HappyShooter's posts right, if the 2nd owner presents the bill of sale and evidence of UCC research then the judge will likely let the 2nd owner keep the box and tell the finance company to go after the original seller.

 

[MrMark]

THe UCC filing is not a filing of default. It is a filing of a security interest in goods. It should be filed at the time the original loan is made. (at least it should be if the finance company wants to be protected) If you check for the UCC filing at the time of purchase and there is no record you have done all you can do and you will be protected. If something comes up later you were first in time and are protected. On the other hand, if there is a recorded security interest you need to have the seller get it removed by financing company before you buy.

I wouldn't worry about any of this for small stuff. Anything over 1000 that you suspect was purchased on credit it might make sense to do the search depending on your risk tolerance. It all depends on what you are comfortable with. If it's a huge purchase of a 10,000 piece of equip then by all means. The odds of a financing company finding you and going thru the legal expenses of filing a claim and delivery case for anything under 10 grand are just a little more than getting hit by lightning.

Another reason that it isn't a good idea to just call Snap on is that you have no way of knowing who might have financed something. The legal check with the secretary of state is the only act that will let you know whether this item is safe to buy.

You don't need evidence of UCC research to prevail as a BFP for value. You need only show you are a BFP for value and that the financing statement either wasn't filed at all or it wasn't filed at the time you purchased.

The date of financing statement filing is of record at the Secretary of State's office. The "evidence" doesn't hurt to keep though.

 

[MrMark]

What I'm getting at is that there is no requirement that you must actually search the records at the secretary state's office as a prerequisite to being a protected purchaser under the law. You only do it to satisfy yourself that you can safely purchase the item.

 

[Flash21]

BFP stands for ?

Does the UCC file automatically disappear from the system once the secured loan is paid off?

Again, you can't follow this process if you don't have the original owner's name.

I was reading the thread as UCC filing as declaring a security interest and then 'records' in the filing would indicate a loan default situation. I guess I wasn't understanding that correctly.

 

[Flash21]

What I'm getting at is that there is no requirement that you must actually search the records at the secretary state's office as a prerequisite to being a protected purchaser under the law. You only do it to satisfy yourself that you can safely purchase the item.

^ this seems to disagree with HappyShooter's response.

 

[MrMark]

Here's some free advice (not advise) to some who obviously need it:

http://real-estate-law.freeadvice.com/commercial_real_estate/deed_trust.htm


The man who is so completely sure of himself when he is so completely wrong is a fool indeed. Who said that?

 

[MrMark]

^ this seems to disagree with HappyShooter's response.

Where? Can you post it? I'll take a look at Article 9 but I can't recall any requirement of actual search.

BFP is a bona fide purchaser.

 

[MrMark]

BFP stands for ?

Does the UCC file automatically disappear from the system once the secured loan is paid off?

Again, you can't follow this process if you don't have the original owner's name.

I was reading the thread as UCC filing as declaring a security interest and then 'records' in the filing would indicate a loan default situation. I guess I wasn't understanding that correctly.

The UCC file should be removed once the loan is paid off. You may have to make sure that it is removed. I am not familiar with the mechanics of this.

There may be a record of default too. But, there has to be a security interest filed before your purchase for them to take priority over you.

Yeah, unless you have the owner's name you are in trouble.

 

[Flash21]

Yeah, unless you have the owner's name you are in trouble.

I guess you need to demand to see some picture ID to help prevent the seller from giving you a fake name...and then hope the ID isn't fake. AND I guess you need to hope the seller is honest because they could have an 'agent' (friend / family) selling it with a different name that doesn't have any UCC filings. Bottom line...if you aren't 100% certain that you have the name of the original person that took the secured loan you have no idea in the end if it has a lein against it.


Here are HappyShooters comments, inline with my own. After reading your latest reponses and re-reading HappyShooter's I think I might finally understand how the UCC thing works. His info seems to indicate a 3rd party can get title if they show no UCC filings existed at the time of sale and there is paperwork a resonable price was paid...which I think does line up with what you are saying.

Thanks for everyone's time and efforts replying to my questions, you helped my understanding a great deal.

No, not in most American states. We (mostly) use the UCC in our states. The seller (legal term in this instance that means the guy who bought it from snap on and is now selling it to you) is selling to you the buyer.

If you the buyer purchased in good faith the legal question is whether you had notice. Notice is done through the UCC filing system in each state, usually through the secretary of state. In other words, did the creditor (say snap on here) properly file a UCC notice. Since revised article 9 came out about 10 years ago, this also means did they properly comply with the model search logic--which is its own legal/admin question for court.

Anyhow, before you the buyer buy you need to check the UCC system for the seller. If there is a filing, don't buy. If there is a filing, made properly, and you didn't check or you missed it, things start to get bad.

Depending on the state, so this is a general overview, your state may vary, if the creditor had a proper filing and you purchased anyway, you take ownership of the tools/box with the same title the seller had, a voidable title. That means the creditor can send someone to a place of business to try to pick up the goods in a peaceful manner. In some states they can also try to do that from a home--but not as many states.

The creditor, their agent (the repo man), or both are on the hook for illegal activities during the repo, including breach of the peace. In other words, if the snap on guy finds out you purchased a box from his customer and comes to your home and starts kicking the door and yellling the cops are coming to arrest you, video it--you have hit the legal jackpot.

The proper legal step for the creditor is to file--what most states call--a claim and delivery action. For example, snap on finds out you purchased a box from one of their customers, they think they filed the UCC correctly, they sue you with the goal of the suit being a court order against you to turn over the box. During that suit you get to argue something back against the creditor--most of the time in these suits the argument is they didn't file correctly (that model search logic stuff) so 'I wouldn't be able to find your filing with a reasonable search'.

If the creditor 1) screwed up the filing or didn't do one, and 2) you acted in 'good faith' as part of the purchase (a legal concept and term of art just for the uniform commerical code--but at its heart you acted as a reasonable and honest buyer would and you paid a fair value)-- then you as the buyer get better than the seller's voidable title, you get good title even against the creditor.

If you get the good title legally, then the creditor is out of luck as far as your tools go. They are reduced back to suing the seller for the money he owes them.

The lesson here? Check the UCC before you plunk down 6k on a box of tools, keep the results of that check, and get something in writing from the seller showing that you paid some reasonable amount.

Happyshooter - THANK YOU for that explanation on how a buyer can protect him/herself. I think it is the first I've seen that explains how to protect yourself in the event that the company can't tell you if it is paid for over the phone like Matco.

Very informative!

So if I understand correctly:

1) You check the UCC filing system in your state and verify no records for the model number / serial number you are purchasing.

2) You get a signed bill of sale that you bought it in good faith and paid a resonable price.

You should be covered. Correct? I just want to cement my understanding.

Of course, the hassle of the court proceedings, etc, will probably outweigh any 'deal' you are getting on the toolbox anyway...even if you are allowed to keep it in the end so I guess it really is buyer beware.

Close, the UCC search is based on the Seller's names. For example, you are buying from Mike Smith who does business as Smith's Garage per his government D/B/A. You search Mike Smith, Michael Smith, Mickey Smith, Smiths Garage, and Smith's Garage.

If Mike Smith owns Smith's Garage, LLC, then search all the above, without the LLC (model search logic again).

If snap-on filed against Mike, there will be a filing by them that you have to pay to download that will have the description (anything from tool box serial number 99XXXX, to 'all assets'). Note that the filing may not be by snap-on, it could be from his bank, or a leasing company, or anyone really. Download and read all the filings against Mike to be safe. Hint, if there is more than one I would bet money at least one is an all assets filing.

You don't have to do this in most states if you are buying from a reseller or tool company (not a pawnshop). This is because of another part of the UCC that says if you are buying from a company that usually sells goods of that type, you get good title. Pawnshops are usually excluded from that rule so you have to check to be safe. Then, again, snap-on is unlikely to trace the box through a pawnshop.

Can this get pricey? Heck, yes. Back before Delphi went bankrupt, I had to check some filings for a client for a hyper legal point. I spent over $500 just in downloading filings from the UCC system, and several thousand dollars in time reading them all.

In this case, if there is just one filing I, myself, if I was buying, would pay the $5 or $10 to download and read it. More than one? Walk away.

 

[MrMark]

When someone makes wildly inaccurate posts, such as not knowing the first thing about how a loan works, I'm going to call them on it.

He's a big boy, he doesn't need anyone to defend him.

It's tough to walk away isn't it?!

I think Mr. Mark is confusing his *** with a hole in the ground.

Methinks he's a troll as well.

...

You don't own a box that you're financing b/c the finance company has the right to take that box back if the buyer defaults on the payments. That's pretty straightforward, but if you want to defend your buddy's repudiation of this, knock yourself out.

I'm not a lawyer, just someone who knows the difference between right and wrong.

...

This must look pretty funny right about now. I hear if you put a ton of salt and pepper on it, Crow don't taste too bad.*

UH, there's a giant hole over there for you to crawl in.












*In this case, however, some hot Mexican chile peppers and chipotle sauce may be necessary to kill the sting.

 

[Skyline]

@MrMark:

Thank you for all the time you put into posting on this thread. I buy big toolboxes a few times per year, so this is pretty important stuff for me. I'm not sure I agree that checking the S/N with Matco Financial is a waste of time though. While in theory, they could miss an item with a UCC lein still outstanding, if they DO find it, then either way you will know where you stand. And all it takes is one phone call. Also, if the original purchaser was not the seller you are dealing with, you can find this out too. A UCC search would not have found anything. I have talked to these folks at Matco on a couple of box purchases, and they are more than willing to search their records for you.

Also, can you describe in detail how to do a UCC search in your state? Is it online? Is it name only, or can you search for a S/N?

 

[Skyline]

I have another question here aimed at the truck dealers;

If you sell a box on truck credit, do you file a UCC?

 

[krusty the clown]

I have another question here aimed at the truck dealers;

If you sell a box on truck credit, do you file a UCC?

no........see my previous post.

 

[norry]

Do I even dare to ask what is considered a 'reasonable price' for these purposes? I mean, I get that the purpose is to avoid people saying "I sold this KRL to my buddy for $5, now you can't seize it" but considering the deals that don't sell quickly in this economy, I could see someone selling a box (one he can legitimately sell) at a pretty steep discount if he needs some money quickly. I mean, if you're competing with an entire room full of Lista's that take a week or two to sell at $750...

 

[Flash21]

I would nominate this thread for the sticky "Directory of Top Threads: Most popular and Informative" with a heading that matches the majority topic throughout the thread.

 

[Flash21]

Also, can you describe in detail how to do a UCC search in your state? Is it online? Is it name only, or can you search for a S/N?

It was discussed earlier in the thread (I know it is big) that it is name only, you can't search based on item, PN, SN, etc.

I wondered how to do the search too, so I did a Google search with UCC and my state and the first hit was the UCC website for my state.

You click on link for "start search" and select "Search name of a debtor who is an individual "

Then it asks for the first, middle, last names and suffix, if any, of the individual.

I put in some names and in just a couple of seconds, I had a "Certified Search Report". This is the report HappyShooter recommended you keep as evidence you did due diligence to check UCC filings.

Literally took less than 2 minutes to complete.

Thanks again for all of the info, everyone!

 

[krusty the clown]

i talked to my cornwell girl today and she agreed to give me a copy of a contract to scan and post. this way we can actually see the language and stop assuming.

 

[Flash21]

i talked to my cornwell girl today and she agreed to give me a copy of a contract to scan and post. this way we can actually see the language and stop assuming.

Thanks krusty!

 

[Happyshooter]

This is a really hard question. If you buy a $6,000 (used fair market value) box for $5 and there is no UCC filed, the truck guy who decides to sue you will likely have a good claim that you were not a good faith purchaser for value.

If you paid $2,000 and the truck guy is claiming the used FMV is $6k, it really is going to depend on how the judge feels. The idea is that the good faith purchaser for value is a guy who has no notice and thinks he is buying the good title. How much of a discount is too much? I think 2k towards a (maybe) 6k used box may be okay if the buyer and seller barely know each other. If they are best friends in the FOE and drinking buddies, maybe not. It is all a factual call for the judge who gets the case.

Of course, what truck seller is going to pay an attorney $1,000 to chase a $4,000 box?

If I bought a box of tools for $2,000 to outfit my home garage, I would check the UCC, if no filings I would buy.

If the snap on truck man came to my door the next month claiming a secured interest and the box was worth 6k, I would close the door after saying goodbye.

Do I even dare to ask what is considered a 'reasonable price' for these purposes? I mean, I get that the purpose is to avoid people saying "I sold this KRL to my buddy for $5, now you can't seize it" but considering the deals that don't sell quickly in this economy, I could see someone selling a box (one he can legitimately sell) at a pretty steep discount if he needs some money quickly. I mean, if you're competing with an entire room full of Lista's that take a week or two to sell at $750...

 

[MrMark]

Here's some helpful information for those interested. It details a typical commercial transaction and how it works:

http://smallbusiness.att.yahoo.com/...c-58-security_agreements_for_business_loans-i

Here's a typical security agreement:

http://contracts.corporate.findlaw.com/agreements/boots/geneva.security.1998.01.02.html

Note especially the following language:

"2. Grant of Security Interest. To secure all obligations now or
hereafter owing by the Debtor to the holders of the Notes under the Note
Purchase Agreements, the Notes and the other Documents, together with all
amendments, supplements or restatements of any of the foregoing obligations (all
of the foregoing obligations, collectively, the "Obligations"), the Debtor
hereby conveys, grants, transfers and assigns to the Secured Party and grants to the Secured Party a first priority security interest in all of Debtor's right, title and interest in, to and under, the following (but excluding any Excluded
Items as hereinafter defined):"


Note the grant is of a "security interest", not title, like in a deed of trust or a pledge agreement. I imagine the tool financing companies contracts track this one closely.

Why anyone would think that granting someone a security interest in property means you no longer own the property is beyond me. Why anyone thinks a third party purchaser could be arrested for receiving stolen property is likewise beyond me. To receive stolen property requires that the property first be stolen and that you knew or really should have known that. Here, the owner OWNs his property, as surprising as that may be to some. As I have said from the beginning, this is why Texas and probably other states have enacted special criminal statutes that criminalize harming a security interest. There are federal statutes as well for items securing an SBA loan for example.

Unless the Matco agreement contains a transfer clause to transfer title of the property then Matco doesn't own it.

There is an entire course in law school on Secured Transactions Under the UCC. It is a specialty area for some lawyers. I don't know if it is big or small business. My guess is that it is a small firm practice area.

I don't know why anyone is worried about the financing company getting paid vis-a-vis some BFP for value. The UCC protects the finance company on the original sale only if Matco filed all the proper paperwork. The UCC is there to protect the commercial system, which includes buyers as well as sellers, and yes, finance companies.

 

[MrMark]

This is a really hard question. If you buy a $6,000 (used fair market value) box for $5 and there is no UCC filed, the truck guy who decides to sue you will likely have a good claim that you were not a good faith purchaser for value.

If you paid $2,000 and the truck guy is claiming the used FMV is $6k, it really is going to depend on how the judge feels. The idea is that the good faith purchaser for value is a guy who has no notice and thinks he is buying the good title. How much of a discount is too much? I think 2k towards a (maybe) 6k used box may be okay if the buyer and seller barely know each other. If they are best friends in the FOE and drinking buddies, maybe not. It is all a factual call for the judge who gets the case.

Of course, what truck seller is going to pay an attorney $1,000 to chase a $4,000 box?

If I bought a box of tools for $2,000 to outfit my home garage, I would check the UCC, if no filings I would buy.

If the snap on truck man came to my door the next month claiming a secured interest and the box was worth 6k, I would close the door after saying goodbye.

I'd run it through a jury (if it wasn't some piddling small claims thing) and take my chances with the jury in a case of Joe Tool Buyer vs. Matco Corporate Finance. Judge would be too risky. I'd win unless the Judge took it away for no triable issue of fact (wouldn't happen).

 

[Happyshooter]

I'd run it through a jury (if it wasn't some piddling small claims thing) and take my chances with the jury in a case of Joe Tool Buyer vs. Matco Corporate Finance. Judge would be too risky. I'd win unless the Judge took it away for no triable issue of fact (wouldn't happen).

Can you get a jury in a replevin action in Cali?

In most of the midwest you don't.

 

[MrMark]

I'm not 100 percent having never done one, but I don't see why not:

(1) Article I, section 16 of the California Constitution provides, “Trial by jury is an inviolate right and shall be secured to all…. […]. In a civil cause a jury may be waived by the consent of the parties expressed as prescribed by statute.” Cal. Const. Art. I, § 16.

(2) Under existing statutory law in California, a party can waive or forfeit its right to a jury trial in only six ways: (1) by failing to appear at trial, (2) by written consent given after the litigation has begun and then filed with the court, (3) by oral consent given in open court and entered in the court minutes, (4) by failing to timely request a trial by jury as required by the rules governing trials, (5) by failing to timely deposit with the court the advance jury fees, or (6) by failing to deposit with the court any additional jury fees due. See Cal. Code Civ. P. § 631.


http://www.thorpreed.com/html/the_library/library_51.html

I really only do work in the federal system.

 

[krusty the clown]

ok guy's i got my hands on a matco PSA contract today. to save a lot of typing here's the important parts.......

section 5(g) not sell, lease or remove any collateral from buyer's address set forth herin.

section 6 if buyer shall fail to comply with section 5 herof or otherwise fails to preform any of it's obligations under this agreement or under any reciepts, such failure shall constitute a "default" hereunder.


sooo......on a MATCO PSA agreement if a buyer sells a toolbox that has a contract with an outstanding balance it automatically goes into default. the collateral (toolbox) can then be reposessed.

 

[MrMark]

ok guy's i got my hands on a matco PSA contract today. to save a lot of typing here's the important parts.......

section 5(g) not sell, lease or remove any collateral from buyer's address set forth herin.

section 6 if buyer shall fail to comply with section 5 herof or otherwise fails to preform any of it's obligations under this agreement or under any reciepts, such failure shall constitute a "default" hereunder.


sooo......on a MATCO PSA agreement if a buyer sells a toolbox that has a contract with an outstanding balance it automatically goes into default. the collateral (toolbox) can then be reposessed.

Thanks Krusty. That's what I expected. A standard purchase security agreement. The buyer owns the box and gives a security interest. Standard commercial contract.

The "truck credit" that you are familiar with is something weird - a form of rent to own - that allows guys to use tools without actually owning them unless and until they complete their payments. A guy selling tools that he obtained by truck credit could potentially be prosecuted for theft since he would be selling stuff he didn't own. The guy selling a box he hasn't paid off is just breaching his contract.

In states that have enacted criminal statutes against damaging collateral he is also committing a crime.

Yes, the toolbox can be repossessed upon default but the only parties to that contract are the original buyer (seller) and the finance company. The third party buyer is not party to that and repossession as to him would have to go thru a civil action.

 

[Hiball]

Thanks for hashing out this from a legal perspective fellas. Even a dummy can understand this lingo.

 

[MrMark]

Krusty,

I think I know the reason the different credit arrangements are used. This is what I think:

Truck Credit

Dealer does not want to go thru the hassle of filing UCC 1's and going thru the legal system to get back tools sold on a small revolving account basis. The rent to own basis means the title to the goods never transfers to the mechanic. So the tool truck owner can just walk in a get his tools back from a deadbeat without legal impediment. The downside to this system is that the tool truck seller doesn't have security and if the mechanic unloads the tools the tool truck owner is out of luck vis-a-vis the new third party buyer.

PSA

With the standard security agreement like used by the finance companies, they get the protection of the UCC by making a public filling. They are protected against any subsequent buyer so long as they fill out the paperwork and file it correctly. It is more work to go through this but the benefit is greater protection through the legal system for the finance company.

 

[krusty the clown]

from the dealers point of view it's a little different.

most dealers can't afford to put a $8k purchase out on credit.

with comapny finance he gets his money back in the form of a credit on his tool bill within a couple of weeks vs. 3 years (or so). and in most cases it isn't recoursed to the dealer.

 

[MrMark]

from the dealers point of view it's a little different.

most dealers can't afford to put a $8k purchase out on credit.

with comapny finance he gets his money back in the form of a credit on his tool bill within a couple of weeks vs. 3 years (or so). and in most cases it isn't recoursed to the dealer.

Not only that, but it would be stupid for a dealer to float something like that out for three years on an interest free loan. Dealer would lose a lot doing that. Plus, for the dealer to charge interest there would be complications . . .

 

[Hiball]

from the dealers point of view it's a little different.

most dealers can't afford to put a $8k purchase out on credit.

with comapny finance he gets his money back in the form of a credit on his tool bill within a couple of weeks vs. 3 years (or so). and in most cases it isn't recoursed to the dealer.

I bet with the "Rent to Own" truck credit there is alot of credit extended to people who probably couldnt get a Personal loan for tools, You agree Krusty? It would definitely get me to thinking if a guy wanted to finance a $8K toolbox on weekly payments.

 

[krusty the clown]

I bet with the "Rent to Own" truck credit there is alot of credit extended to people who probably couldnt get a Personal loan for tools, You agree Krusty?

you would be amazed.......

It would definitely get me to thinking if a guy wanted to finance a $8K toolbox on weekly payments.

even company finance is a weekly payment.


there are lot's of mechanics with less than stellar credit who make thier payments to the tool man.