Building tube fenders for a jeep

[bad_idea]

This mornings post is just for Mike.

I read it anyways. What you going to do about it?

 

[LXCam]

I read it anyways. What you going to do about it?

Ya I see how you are Ben, sticking your nose in other folks biz. Boy see if I ever post a private message in a public place again.


So I don't know if the bed liner was a good idea or not. One positive is it certainly hides a ton of sins...which after sanding the primer this morning is a godsend.

But this stuff says to do 2-3 lite coats and this kit (4quarts) is supposed to provide enough coverage for 150sqft. But I've blow thru two bottles already and only have one side done with a very lite 2nd coat. Guess we'll find out later tonight after I can flip this stuff and spray the top. If anyone knows some pro tricks here I'd luv some input. I've sprayed plenty of undercoating before but like math showing my work is a whole nother story.

After sanding the primer and wiping it all down again I taped off all the areas I absolutely do not want any build up. All these areas will get painted after the bedliner is cured.





This is the hidden side and so far where it's flashed off looks just ok. I hope this wasn't a mistake.

 

[bad_idea]

Zero experience. Pretty work is not my strong point. Looks good from here.

 

[LXCam]

Pretty work is not my strong point.

When it comes to paint and body, I'm not either. But I can rock a rattle can finish like nobodies business


It's a damn good thing I finally figured out what I was doing before I mixed the last bottle. I finally got it to lay down a decent even texture. And luckily pulling the tape didn't pull the coating, so that was a major win.

Now for the sad part. Earlier today after I did the bottoms I turned on the heater and closed up the shop and give it a few hours to cure. When I came back in I was floored to still see everything a super shiny black. And immediately wondered wtf I screwed up. Turns out after doing a bunch of digging found out this kit is a gloss black all though it's not advertised as such. I figured it would be a matt finish like every stinking bedliner product I've ever seen. I wanna right now.

I'll have to call the manufacturer on Monday and see what the best method is for toning this down about 10 notches.

 

[zmotorsports]

Everything turned out great Cam. I like the seam sealed edge underneath. I think that will go a long way to prevent intrusion.

Personally, I kinda like the gloss black but it may be a bit much if nothing else on the Jeep is gloss black. Looking forward to seeming everything assembled and installed. That will be one custom Jeep that the owner should be proud to drive.


Sent from my iPhone using Garage Journal

 

[WoodsTruck]

Just add Armor-All to the tires and top. Dust will take care of the rest.

 

[Bears Fan]

The parts came out awesome

 

[LXCam]

Everything turned out great Cam. I like the seam sealed edge underneath. I think that will go a long way to prevent intrusion.

Personally, I kinda like the gloss black but it may be a bit much if nothing else on the Jeep is gloss black. Looking forward to seeming everything assembled and installed. That will be one custom Jeep that the owner should be proud to drive.

Thanks again Mike. I think I already said this between the tears and sobbing last night but maybe if the Jeep's paint looked new it'd be fine. But right now this would be akin to putting a couple polished billet pieces on a rat rod me thinks

The parts came out awesome

Thanks bears fan.

Just add Armor-All to the tires and top. Dust will take care of the rest.

No **** huh.

And speaking of dirt...

Last night an old nightmare popped into the knoggin. I was just getting started setting up my contracting business and a plumbing contractor buddy of mine was getting ready to expand his business. He had a older 3/4 ton utility body that originally was a powder blue. But he bought a brand spanking new ford that was dark blue metalic. He decided he wanted the older truck to match so off to the paint shop it went.

In the middle of paint prison he gets a DUI and when he found out what his commercial insurance was going to cost him dashed those ideas of grandeur. He finally gets the truck back and parks it next to his house. So we're talking one night and he says you're gonna but this truck so off I went to write him a check.

It was parked in an area with no lights and was pretty dirty. And on the way home I swung by a old delapitated self wash place, you know the kind with one 40watt light bulb and grease for concrete and hosed her off.

The next morning was a picture perfect bright blue sunny California day. The wife was the first one up and as she stepped out the front door called for me "hey Jesus!, come errr!!!!" You should have seen this thing. It was the heaviest metal flake low rider/bass boat paint job I'd ever seen.

I talked with several folks about how to dial it down but there was just nothing that could be done short of a new paint job. One buddy suggested I don't wash it and let it sun fade. Over the next couple of years it never got washed and I can't tell you how many hundreds of guys gave me **** over that thing. So finally one day I couldn't take how grundgy it became and washed it. Omg, it still looked like a new ranger boat. Needles to say I finally got her repainted white not long afterwards.



Ok so this morning I reached out to my good buddy who is one of the best coatings guy in the business. Right in the middle of typing this up he called me back with some suggestions. So before this stuff cures anymore then it has I need to run and get some rattle can epoxy paint and try it out on some hidden areas.

Thanks for following along

 

[LXCam]

So I tried all kinds of combinations. Straight satin, satin over flat, high gloss clear over flat, low gloss clear over flat, wiping it down with acetone and flashing it with the torch (which btw that worked great but wasn't consistent on the finish) even a couple other extraordinarily desperate methods I'd never admit too. So I sent over three of the best samples to the owner to choose from.










And what does he pick. The flat as it turned out a nice eegshell finish over the gloss.



I won't be able to get any flat clear until tomorrow which ***** a huge set. But at least my heart isn't pounding outta my chest anymore.

 

[LXCam]

Yesterday after resolving my finish issue finally stood back and took a hard look at the jeep. She's in great shape but you can certainly tell that 20yrs of existence has taken their toll on all the plastic. Fortunately it's all still in good shape, it's not brittle or cracked anywhere. So I've got a question about the plastic and the roof. Is there a product out there that would bring it back to life without a lot of drama? I'm not opposed to painting the small stuff like the bumper side pieces and swaybar cap. But I'm not doing the lid more then a good cleaning.

And speaking of cleaning before I ever started anything I pressure washed the **** out of it. But after stripping her down uncovered even more dirt, mud and caked on grease. So once again she went back outside for another round against the Landa high heat pressure washer. As far as I can tell I got the vast majority of the last of it. Enough that a regular regiment of pressure washing should keep it looking presentable.









And before I start bolting her back together I'm going to rub out and wax as best I can. I had planned on waxing the **** out of the areas that will never get that chance again, at least not without some disassembly. And I don't want to return it not looking her best either with shiny and dull spots.

I also just noticed the tow hitch has a nice tweek in it. You couldn't see it with the bumper in place but I am concerned that straightening it will impact fitment of the bumper since that bracket I made for the hinge side was built in place. I'm going to need to take a hard look at that before I make my final decision.




And last but not least I'm very happy with yesterday's paint results. With the high gloss and how light refracted off it, it looked blotchy. Now it was a nice uniform finish. I do have a couple pieces with areas where you can see my spray lines so those will get sprayed again this afternoon and I'll clear it all tomorrow afternoon. Despite the setback and extra work and not looking forwards to waxing it I'm very happy with the end results.






I was concerned that the bedliner would kill the detail of the sheet metal edge wrap after putting in all that effort. But it's still there albeit significantly more subtle then before. I'll regret not having it powder coated only because of everything I did, it's the one thing I'm the most proud of.

 

[zmotorsports]

Cam, several people from our RV group have used a product from Eastwood called plastic rejuvenator and have been very pleased with the results. Keep in mind that these people full-time so their RV and Jeeps never see a garage and are always outside, usually in the sun as they are fair weather seekers.

Here is a link to what they have been using.
https://www.eastwood.com/ew-plastic...MIzf3vktHt3wIViD9pCh1FFgpzEAAYASAAEgLAs_D_BwE

I have not used it personally but they sure rave about it. I put some 303 Aersospace treatment on mine every couple of months and it brings the color back but I don't know how it would work on severely neglected plastic.

 

[LXCam]

Thanks for the suggestion but I'll have to try that out on another project. I wanted the jeep gone today but now it's looking like Wednesday/Thursday if my luck holds out. I'll give these pieces a thorough cleaning with my tried and trued method of Wesleys white wall cleaner and see how they look. That stuff does a remarkable job of making plastic and rubber look like plastic and rubber again. And if not I've got the good **** here for painting plastic. My only issue is the weather isn't going to cooperate over the next couple of days for that stuff. I might just go will ole reliable plastic dip too.

 

[LXCam]

DOing the last little bit of mechanical work. Needed to replace the C knuckle ball joints. I held off waiting for him to make a decision on gears and or axles.

Well anyhow I don't think the upper bj is supposed to come apart like this



Could be that's why I could get a 1/4" of movement out of it eh?

 

[Bigblue&Goldie]

I bet that drove really nice.....

 

[LXCam]

I bet that drove really nice.....

Like a million pesos

 

[zmotorsports]

Yeah, me thinks something's wrong there bud. I'll bet it was a handful chasing it down the road, or across the road rather.

 

[LXCam]

Yeah, me thinks something's wrong there bud. I'll bet it was a handful chasing it down the road, or across the road rather.

When we picked it up my son drove it 30 miles home with stock size tires. We get home and he says you trying to kill me? I'd heard of the dreaded death wobble with the Jeep's but had never driven one. So before I installed the lift I checked out all the steering but wasn't getting any play

It wasn't until after I installed the lift and these pos rims and tires the owner picked up did I test drive it. I didn't even make it to 40mph before I turned around and drove her right back on the lift. Once again I got nothing until I shoved the prybar up into the C vertically and then I could get the top joint to move on the driverside only. That pic and my post was before I did the passenger side. Welp once I dug in the passenger side came apart like that as well.

I also happened to notice after buttoning her up last night I don't have near as much camber as before. Imagine that?

 

[zmotorsports]

I also happened to notice after buttoning her up last night I don't have near as much camber as before. Imagine that?

What, don't you want to add a few degrees of -camber for handling and cornering? Now you went and took that away.

 

[Bigblue&Goldie]

Are those DOT approved or race tires? The BFG Baja T/A's are probably the worst tire ever made on the asphalt, but tough as nails offroad. Personally, I would never want them on a Jeep due to the compound and super stiff construction. We ran Toyo race tires on my Dad's JK and they were phenomenal, but I've never been able to get my hands on another set.

 

[LXCam]

What, don't you want to add a few degrees of -camber for handling and cornering? Now you went and took that away.

Yezz sir. I took a wet noodle ride that handled like it was on rails



and turned it into a stiff noodle....errr-hum

Are those DOT approved or race tires? The BFG Baja T/A's are probably the worst tire ever made on the asphalt, but tough as nails offroad. Personally, I would never want them on a Jeep due to the compound and super stiff construction. We ran Toyo race tires on my Dad's JK and they were phenomenal, but I've never been able to get my hands on another set.

That they are BnG. And to add the the misery they're old and hard as a rock. When they got dropped off I immediately told him those gotta go. I guess he thought I meant on the ride cause nothing more has been said other then going bigger. I'll give him one pavement drive and I bet he changes his mind right quick.

They have a real intense crown, looks like close to +3/4". I'm not sure if that was intentional or if whom ever the previous owner was ran them with 10lbs of air in them for every occasion. It's crazy how rounded they are, never seen nothing like it on something that sees the street.

 

[LXCam]

Got started on bringing it back to life this afternoon but it sure doesn't look like I got much done. Funny how those stupid details eat up time. But at least the difs are buttoned up and filled and I aligned the front end after creating my own dropped pitman arm out of the stock unit.

Cleaned the dif flanges, chased all the holes and bolts with the thread restorererer. Even hit them all with the wire brush to get the rust gone.







Painted the swaybar bushing caps and greased the bushes.



And this getting old really *****. Tonight in another thread I talked about some bike brackets I built for my hydraulic table and then it hit me. The old trick of restoring plastic with a heat gun. Yesterday I cleaned all the stuff going back on and other then the dirt washing away, it did nothing for the finish and I figured I'd just coat all of it. But after I remembered that trick I pulled out the gun and did one of the bumper pieces. It's not perfect but it sure looks way better. Good enough I'm going to run with it.

 

[bad_idea]

Got any pics of the drop pitman arm?

Please do tell about this heat gun trick.

 

[LXCam]

Got any pics of the drop pitman arm?

Please do tell about this heat gun trick.

All I did on the pitman arm was remove it, stick the big end in the vise, heat the thickest part near the steering box side and tweek it down a bit so the tie rod end was at a happier angle. I didn't intentionally take any pics the stock position but the tie rod was very near its articulation limit. Now it's in a happy place. I had meant to get a new one but forgot too. Figured if this doesn't work I'll run by 4WP n get one. But now I don't see any need too. Being it was cast steel and not iron it was nothing more then get it red hot, tweek and let it naturally cool.

As for the plastic I have no idea why this works but thankfully it does. Take a heat gun set on WOT and just go over the piece like you were spray painting it. It's a fine line between enough heat and not melting the piece but you can see the transformation and back off when you get it too hot. My HG is a 1500 watt unit and I had to stay about an inch off the piece to build enough heat and go about a tenth the speed you would if painting it. It's a slow process but as you can see is very effective. The other thing to pay attention too is to work your line but move away from the area and allow the area to cool off a tad. otherwise the residual heat will start to deform the piece. The second picture shows I did the corner and left the field alone. After doing the edge I then went back into the flat working my way around again like a circle working towards the center. And unlike paint you'll need to go back and hit the blotchy areas where the plastic is a bit thicker. I should add that I've never done such a large area, only small straight creases before. This was a bit of an experiment so I started on the bottom and figured out what technique worked the best

A buddy of mine taught me this decades ago on restoring the fenders on our dirt bikes when one would get creased and turned white. If I had a clue how to post a vid I'd do one up. But I haven't so I can't. Unfortunately I'm no Mike

 

[zmotorsports]

Looks great Cam. I hear ya about the little details eating up so much time, believe me I hear ya.

As for the heat gun trick my son did that on his LJ several years ago and I was amazed at how well it worked, the tricky part was being consistent across the entire fender but it worked and lasted quite well. He just applied some 303 Aerospace to it a few times a year and they still looked good when he sold it last year.

 

[LXCam]

Looks great Cam. I hear ya about the little details eating up so much time, believe me I hear ya.

As for the heat gun trick my son did that on his LJ several years ago and I was amazed at how well it worked, the tricky part was being consistent across the entire fender but it worked and lasted quite well. He just applied some 303 Aerospace to it a few times a year and they still looked good when he sold it last year.

Details, ya I know I was preaching to the choir. Lol

Funny how tricks of the trade has changed thru the years. This was back before the internet so who knows where he learned it. Now it seems all it takes is a 2 second search on YouTube and wala, everyone's a hero. Guess I'll be ordering some of that 303 and giving it a shot too. Once again the internet to the rescue.

 

[zmotorsports]

Details, ya I know I was preaching to the choir. Lol

Funny how tricks of the trade has changed thru the years. This was back before the internet so who knows where he learned it. Now it seems all it takes is a 2 second search on YouTube and wala, everyone's a hero. Guess I'll be ordering some of that 303 and giving it a shot too. Once again the internet to the rescue.

Yes, but the internet can be just as much an enemy as well. When I had my business it was horrible because people saw something on TV or the internet and immediately thought it was easy and anybody could do it. They would either try to beat me up on price, or worse, they attempted it first and realized the wizardry of internet or TV and then brought it to me to fix because they F-ed it up so bad.

But yes Cam, for the most part I agree that the internet is great for quick searches and information.

 

[LXCam]

Yes, but the internet can be just as much an enemy as well. When I had my business it was horrible because people saw something on TV or the internet and immediately thought it was easy and anybody could do it. They would either try to beat me up on price, or worse, they attempted it first and realized the wizardry of internet or TV and then brought it to me to fix because they F-ed it up so bad.

But yes Cam, for the most part I agree that the internet is great for quick searches and information.

Oh boy am I with you there my friend. The reason I went underground with my performance business was the endless hours getting jacked around on the phone only to see a build price get beat by a few hundred bucks and then months later come back in a hot mess and no money left to fix it right. And the endless tire kicker questions, my gawd it was nonstop 7 days a week.




I'm not much for rain but getting off today because of it didn't break my heart. Figured I show the fender installation details. I picked up a roll of 1" wide 3M double sided forever tape and am using it between the fender and the body so the paint doesn't get scratched up and start rusting. Once it's all bolted together I'll kill the sticky with some WD. That should hopefully stop it from collecting a dirt line. If that doesn't work for some reason I'll maybe caulk it. Well see.

Being this tape is prettt darn sticky I made a couple 3/8" studs for where the tubing has nuts welded to the inside. I also punched out all the holes for the machine screws using a center punch and gasket maker. That worked pretty good. The studs allowed me to hang the fender far enough off so I could install a few of the machine screws and when I was confident everything was lined up, drove them home.

Funny after all this effort my only gripe is the fact I stupidly dumped a box of 10-24 nylock nuts in with the 10-32's. What a PITA finding the right ones. Then there's hitting each one with antiseize. Funny how something so minor can get old quick.

 

[Duker]

I see a major issue here... the Jeep is becoming too Pretty to be a desert Jeep! It has all turned out great! [emoji1531]

So how does the guy feel about an engine swap.... I know a guy in Utah....!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[LXCam]

I see a major issue here... the Jeep is becoming too Pretty to be a desert Jeep! It has all turned out great! [emoji1531]

So how does the guy feel about an engine swap.... I know a guy in Utah....!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

So ya think I went too far rubbing out and waxing the paint?

Heck mikes got this down pat, I bet the owner could just hang out for the day and drive it home that night.

And thanks Duke.

 

[WoodsTruck]

Awesome work.

Is the winch wound backwards?

 

[Balor]

Very nice LXCam

rngr1

 

[zmotorsports]

Oh boy am I with you there my friend. The reason I went underground with my performance business was the endless hours getting jacked around on the phone only to see a build price get beat by a few hundred bucks and then months later come back in a hot mess and no money left to fix it right. And the endless tire kicker questions, my gawd it was nonstop 7 days a week.

That is one thing I don't miss about owning my business. Even though it was just a small side business I got many of the same phone calls and tire kickers. I also got a lot (way too much) of the people coming to me after they had someone else screw something up and wanted me to fix it "right". This is after they thought I was too high priced and took it somewhere to get it done cheaper. The comment that I used to get so many times and absolutely drove me up the wall was "I need this fixed really cheap because I already spend all of my funds having the other stuff done." So basically some guy made good money doing a piss poor job and I'm supposed to lose my *** fixing it because you went bargain shopping and got exactly what you paid for.

I don't miss that one damn bit. Now I can pick and choose the jobs I want or don't want to do and feel guilty about it.

Jeep is turning out amazing Cam. I had no doubt that it would. The owner should be happy as hell with that.

 

[zmotorsports]

I see a major issue here... the Jeep is becoming too Pretty to be a desert Jeep! It has all turned out great! [emoji1531]

So how does the guy feel about an engine swap.... I know a guy in Utah....!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

So ya think I went too far rubbing out and waxing the paint?

Heck mikes got this down pat, I bet the owner could just hang out for the day and drive it home that night.

And thanks Duke.

You guys are too kind.

Thanks.

 

[LXCam]

Awesome work.

Is the winch wound backwards?

Very nice LXCam

rngr1

Jeep is turning out amazing Cam. I had no doubt that it would. The owner should be happy as hell with that.

Thanks again guys, much appreciated

All the stuff is bolted on for life now. I got the back end all detailed out including a couple stupid little bezels that I installed some orings on to help keep some of the dirt out, time will tell on those. I also counter sunk the set screw into the rod so it stays in a fixed location. Made the blank plate and said screw a gasket and just used a bead of silicon on it. All I've got left is wiring up the winch and machining some standoffs for the tow bar, wash, finish waxing and then I'll try to get some decent pictures.

 

[zmotorsports]

Looks awesome Cam. The details really put it over the top my friend.

 

[LXCam]

Looks awesome Cam. The details really put it over the top my friend.

And the details just don't wanna seem to end. But more on that in a minute.

Yesterday went not so good. A buddy of mine came over to charge new AC system I installed. One thing I never did was ever test any of it. So when we were ready to start the charge I inserted the last relay and couple fuse, fired up the jeep, turned on the fan annnnnnd.........no fan, nudda, nuttin. Also the vacuum actuators weren't actuating. So the first thing I did was pull out the controls hoping maybe I left something unplugged. Unfortunately in checking all the plugs I broke the mounting tabs that hold the position indicator to the lever base. At the commencement of this project and while installing the system it seemed like 9 out of every 10 tabs broke. There must be something about 20yr old sun baked plastic that hates me. I must have lost just a couple days total fixing all that ****, Sunday's loss of a couple hours dealing with this was no exception.

But moving past that none of those were my problem. So back out comes the dash and low and behold the main connection locking tab must have broken when I installed it and wasn't making contact even though it looked like it was together. Once that was dealt with and the interio back together most everything worked...imagine that


Once I fired her off the vacuum actuated doors didn't seem to be working all that well which really freaked me out. One of the things you have to do when installing this so called factory kit is cut in one new flapper and add a couple lines to the system. And once again I thought it must be something I screwed up. So apart comes the connections and I test them with my brake bleeder, damn it - they work, WTF. So under the hood I go and end up finding a couple rotted 90's on the system. Well once that was fixed all was right with the world, I was able to charge the system and we finally have cold air. Mighty handy in the middle of winter I might add


Now back to the Fab work. I started Sunday morning in the shop at 7 with the intention of just wiring the winch and the aforementioned AC stuff and being all wrapped up. However it was 8pm before I walked back into the house and nothing of any substance got done to the winch stuff.

So back in I go early this afternoon only to come to two realizations when I got into it. One, I was not pleased with the idea of the positive lead straight off the battery being out in front exposed to some kind of unknown damage. Granted as you'll see I mounted the control box in a place that keeps it as protected as it can get but still after almost 4 decades as a sparky things like this bug the F outta me. I like to mitigate potential fobbars as much as possible. So I run over and buy a 150amp disconnect switch to mount under the hood. Well **** that means a bracket too.










Once that got done and painted I wired the control box on the bench using some of the old cable for the winch portion and new cables to the source. The winch leads seemed long enough and I had planned on routing them behind the winch under the swaybar cover. But once I had the box in place soon found out not one single thing about that plan was going to fly plus my leads were too short to do something else.



As luck would have it they were long enough to come around the front and all though they sat low enough to clear the winch cable I was just not comfortable with that idea. So looking backing into my collection of garbage grabbed a piece of .092 wall 1" tubing and flattened it our a bit, welded on a couple tabs and walla! I also did a couple layers of heavy shrink tubing around the areas that could possible chaff but I think that was overkill. And for the terminations broke out my super badass Y750 crimper and did the connections up right n tight.







My apologies for the long post but I needed to vent as the wife isn't around to kick. Looks like it'll be another afternoon back on this tomorrow after work.

 

[LXCam]

Just couple more pictures since I can't post more then 7 off my phone.

 

[royce]

LXC,
I've heard it said, that the devil is in the details and you have covered them very nicely.
Well done

Royce

 

[Boosted1]

Nice attention to detail.
Looking forward to completed pics of Jeep.

 

[zmotorsports]

Nice routing of the winch power cables Cam. I like the tube idea.

You may want to convince the owner to either buy a roller fairlead for cable or switch over to synthetic rope as that cable will chew up that Hawse style fairlead in short order.

Looking forward to seeing the whole thing completed and polished up ready to be picked up.