The VISES of Garage Journal

[royce]

Thanks all
Dkroth
Smitty
Old Radar
Kevin
RBarnes

It was a fun build

Royce

 

[losdudes]

Great job!

 

[Shiftless]

For the back story on Royce’s fantastic vise stand check out his build thread.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=8291596#post8291596

Pictured below is the only vise stand I have ever owned.
Pretty sad isn’t it? (I didn’t make it)
It did fit into the back of my car for the trip down to trade it away to loydski. Maybe he has done something to improve it. That’s a Reed 406r back there with it.


.

 

[dannyr]

thanks for your information folks - I'm getting a good picture - despite the busy Sheffield, Birmingham and Lancashire activity in tool and machine tool making, I think they were so fond of their blacksmith type leg vises that they let the US get ahead by some years when it comes to parallel action slide bench vises.

[The vice thread is on mig-welding.co.uk in forums - Ithink it's 'show us your vice']

 

[va.grouseman]

Now Shift, yours was an example of a set-up that is useful but not priceless.---Royce's is just too darn pretty to be useful.---Nobody in there right mind would pinch a drive shaft or a piece of plate steel in that thing.---It needs to be roped off like in the museums with signs that say ''Look But Don't Touch''.---Yours on the other hand will get a lot of work done.---Both set-ups have their calling, just in different directions.

 

[Shiftless]

You’re right va.

When I bought that 406r I tried to leave the stand behind. The seller told me that if I wanted the vise, I HAD to take the stand with it. Since he was asking only $75 for the vise and stand, of course I relented and took the stand. He told me he got the stand with the vise bolted to it FREE!

 

[dutchgray]

There seems to be a lot of knowledge on this forum/thread - I asked similar on a UK forum - no clear answers yet:----
so question-

When were the first 'classic' American bolt down bench vises made? - I guess I mean by this cast iron (or maybe cast steel) main body with jaw inserts and steel screw.

I don't mean blacksmiths wrought iron leg/staple vices or their similar bench derivatives.

In the UK I don't see much before a flurry of quick release etc patents 1875-90,and then we suddenly have whole ranges of this type bench vises (eg Parkinsons) (and wood-working vices).

Confession - question partly triggered by acquisition of a very large (to me) Parkinson's Perfect (pre 1900, rusty, but 6 1/2in quick release, over 100lbs, £50 =$65 will post photo later) - and this after I swore to stick to size 00 (in UK = a proper bench vice, but only 2 1/4" wide jaws, typically 5lbs, many makes).

Thats a 3 piece Parkinson vice then? Those in QR form are not that common.
Parkinson's 1940 catalogue claims they were the first to make what we now know as the typical English mechanics vice when they started the company in 1882, and then the perfect vice (QR) in 1884, both would have been 3 piece vices.
If this is accurate then the Americans were definitely ahead of us brits when it comes the the square slide parallel vice.

 

[bsaint]

Dannyr

The first US vise patent have found is #127, granted to Linus Dean of Oneida, New York. It does not use a screw, but a rack. 1837



The first non post vise that I have a patent for is #2315, granted to William Sim of Schenectady New York. This appears to have a half round slide. 1841



The first standard three holed, rectangular slide patent, #11137, was granted to Charles Parker of Meridan, Connecticut (THE Chas Parker). 1854



I am sure I am missing some, but there were fires at the US Patent Office in 1836 and 1877 that destroyed many patents.



Am always looking. Maybe something else will show up.



JKB

Look how fast the patent numbers increased


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[Outlawmws]

Royce, as always your Workmanship is spectacular!

 

[Smitty]

I got this stand from a biker in the desert for forty bucks.

Your move Royce!


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[ifirefight]

I’ll play... Record 3VS MADE IN England
Columbian 501 Made in Cleveland baby!





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[ifirefight]

Don’t mind the missing jaw on the Columbian .. I’m in the process of milling new jaws for her..


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[rusty65]

Don’t mind the missing jaw on the Columbian .. I’m in the process of milling new jaws for her..


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How did you get such a good hammered effect on the paint of that Columbia’s?


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[royce]

Thanks Outlaw

Smitty,
Looks good to me
Well done

Royce

 

[ifirefight]

How did you get such a good hammered effect on the paint of that Columbia’s?


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This here yonder.. I don’t reckon they sell it in the states no more.. They use to, but probably has some banned ingredients or tide pods in it...[emoji849]



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[Vise]

Royce - Let me join the chorus of "oohs" and "ahhs" on that beautiful stand and vise. Just beautiful.

Shift - Tell me about that 406 - Did it have factory replaceable jaws or were they milled out?

 

[KMScott]

Any one seen a Maneby before. Looks pretty interesting. I like it, What does not make sense is the rotating slots, the sides and the rear can not work together.

 

[ZRX61]

I’ll play... Record 3VS MADE IN England

I changed the color of mine slightly...


https://scontent-lax3-1.**.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/225062_1881202842571_3892944_n.jpg?_nc_cat=100&_nc_eui2=AeFFUNQrBHgWLpqDQfb_CigXdRtYInvjZpaHl8kEU7z9pLFUdaKmAroQvZRcIhPWtdU-xZEtTQ0cUnaHfEHcA6PCWmcro7k9vo8eq0oJ6nS0Ug&_nc_ohc=ju9eJXkIqEYAX_pCZ9s&_nc_pt=1&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-1.**&oh=cf33d8b62c6e10071a9d97184fd0f4e8&oe=5E9CCDA2

 

[Fierljeppen]

Any one seen a Maneby before. Looks pretty interesting. I like it, What does not make sense is the rotating slots, the sides and the rear can not work together.

Found a photo of the other side with a Hoar's patent date. It looks like it might be some kind of swivel device?

New England Vise Co. is new to me. Nice find KMScott!

 

[chrisnazzy]

I've acquired three nice Rock Island 571's over the last few years of collecting. These are 3" jaw, swivel base, weigh about 28lbs and disassemble nicely to fit in a large USPS flat rate box.

I'm interested in trading one for a similarly sized and valued vise.

The two I'd trade are both 1944 date codes. One I restored a couple years ago and it's finished in Rustoleum Sienna Mist. The other is stripped bare and ready for the finish of your choice!

PM me if interested and with pics of vise offered in trade. Thanks.

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[Outlawmws]

Pretty sure they can Dr. Scott. The back has to be both longer and at a greater radius, but should still swivel. The lock bolts are missing however.

Cool Vise!

 

[IdahoMan]

Re: Millscott Streamliner 4.5

Kevin Scott fixed me up with a lovely Starrett vise after he got it all dolled up.
Been thinking about this stand for quite some time.
Wanting something with a Art Deco, streamlined look with retractable landing gear, this is what I came up with.

Royce

Incredible. What are the functions?

 

[ifirefight]

I changed the color of mine slightly...


https://scontent-lax3-1.**.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/225062_1881202842571_3892944_n.jpg?_nc_cat=100&_nc_eui2=AeFFUNQrBHgWLpqDQfb_CigXdRtYInvjZpaHl8kEU7z9pLFUdaKmAroQvZRcIhPWtdU-xZEtTQ0cUnaHfEHcA6PCWmcro7k9vo8eq0oJ6nS0Ug&_nc_ohc=ju9eJXkIqEYAX_pCZ9s&_nc_pt=1&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-1.**&oh=cf33d8b62c6e10071a9d97184fd0f4e8&oe=5E9CCDA2

Looks good, there is A LOT of hoopla about these particular vises .. very different markings,stampings etc.. some will say it’s a Chinese made Vise unless it says MADE IN ENGLAND on it... what does the other side have stamped on it? Best Regards


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[va.grouseman]

Dannyr
The first US vise patent have found is #127, granted to Linus Dean of Oneida, New York. It does not use a screw, but a rack. 1837

The first non post vise that I have a patent for is #2315, granted to William Sim of Schenectady New York. This appears to have a half round slide. 1841

The first standard three holed, rectangular slide patent, #11137, was granted to Charles Parker of Meridan, Connecticut (THE Chas Parker). 1854

I am sure I am missing some, but there were fires at the US Patent Office in 1836 and 1877 that destroyed many patents.

Am always looking. Maybe something else will show up.

JKB

PGH, (2) questions.---(1), How did the Parker 1837 vise using a rack look exactly?---I can't picture it in my mind.---But then again, not much to work with.

(2), Did the Double Swivel Jaw, Combination Parker come with a 3 holed base , or just what is a 3 holed slide pattern?---This 1854 Parker looks like it's a through the bench swivel base or is missing it's base.

These pics and much info are found in the ("Oldest Known Parker Vise") thread.---This vise seems to have a half dozen patent dates, what is the reason for that?---Woops that's (3).

 

[va.grouseman]

Found a photo of the other side with a Hoar's patent date. It looks like it might be some kind of swivel device?

New England Vise Co. is new to me. Nice find KMScott!

KM, I believe that the slots are synchronized with each other and would rotate accordingly as far as the slots would allow.---Also an offset.---Pretty interesting vise.---I saw that one in Pinterest when looking up offset vises one day.

 

[KMScott]

Looking at the top view it seems the arc's are on the same center. Lovely casting process on this vise. Thanks Fierljeppen.

 

[royce]

Re: Millscott Streamliner 4.5

Incredible. What are the functions?

Thanks Idaho,
Can you clarify your question.

Royce

 

[royce]

Any one seen a Maneby before. Looks pretty interesting. I like it, What does not make sense is the rotating slots, the sides and the rear can not work together.

Boy Howdy Kevin,
That vise sure has some lovely lines, soft curves and beautiful script.
Some kind of handsome.

Royce

 

[IdahoMan]

I'm starting to fix up my vise, a Morgan Chicago 145 as seen in post #67779.

In picture one with the jaws removed surface 1 has a convex shape and surface 2 has concave shape to it, but fit when closed (pic2). Holding the steel jaws on with my hand without the screws there is a lot of gap as you can see, and they wobble. Kind of odd?

There are a few minor chucks taken out of the body of the vise here and there too (circled).

Questions:

I. Is there an official diagram of this model somewhere?
II. What material is the vise made of? (Ductile iron?)
III. Should I include some kind of washer/thrust-washer between the screw and body?
IV. How should I get the steel jaws to fit better? (Just file on surfaces 1 and 2?)
V. I have a welder friend who could fill those chunks. Doable? What kind of metal/rod to use?

 

[IdahoMan]

Re: Millscott Streamliner 4.5

Thanks Idaho,
Can you clarify your question.

Royce

The two lower handles, what do they do? I'm guessing the lowest one raises the base off the floor so it can roll/be moved?

Thanks.

 

[Shiftless]

Vise:
My 406r had replaceable jaws. I assume that was factory original.

 

[royce]

Re: Millscott Streamliner 4.5

The two lower handles, what do they do? I'm guessing the lowest one raises the base off the floor so it can roll/be moved?

Thanks.

Yes, the lower one is threaded and acts on a carriage that houses 2 wheels, to raise and lower the stand
The upper one is a lever to keep the vise level and to steer when moving.
Here is a pic that may help to understand.

Royce

 

[IdahoMan]

Re: Millscott Streamliner 4.5

Yes, the lower one is threaded and acts on a carriage that houses 2 wheels, to raise and lower the stand
The upper one is a lever to keep the vise level and to steer when moving.
Here is a pic that may help to understand.

Royce

Perfect.

Thx.

 

[bastel]

Hi. I asked about that (probably Wilton old style) C3 two or 3 pages back. The thing is, while the pipe jaws are there, the swivel base is incomplete, only the pictured base remains. What parts are missing? I saw little metal plates with indentations and I also saw big metal plates doing the same thing better I guess. What is the correct part for the old style c3? So my friend can decide what it will cost to make them or get them.

I know you guys know your Wiltons

Thanks in advance.

 

[dutchgray]

This here yonder.. I don’t reckon they sell it in the states no more.. They use to, but probably has some banned ingredients or tide pods in it...[emoji849]



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Hammerite was changed here some years ago as well, new stuff is nowhere near as good as the old.

 

[PghJKB]

Found a photo of the other side with a Hoar's patent date. It looks like it might be some kind of swivel device?

New England Vise Co. is new to me. Nice find KMScott!

PGH, (2) questions.---(1), How did the Parker 1837 vise using a rack look exactly?---I can't picture it in my mind.---But then again, not much to work with.

(2), Did the Double Swivel Jaw, Combination Parker come with a 3 holed base , or just what is a 3 holed slide pattern?---This 1854 Parker looks like it's a through the bench swivel base or is missing it's base.

These pics and much info are found in the ("Oldest Known Parker Vise") thread.---This vise seems to have a half dozen patent dates, what is the reason for that?---Woops that's (3).

VA

The 1837 patent was not a Parker patent, but one by Linus Dean. (FJ if you can explain to feeble minded me, I can include the larger images rather than the reference URLs)

There were only 44 patents issued 20 June 1854 (including a paint brush, burglar alarm and breast pump) The only patent issued for a vise (and also to Parker) was for the metal bar that serves as the slide strengthener. The patent illustration shows a vise with the standard three holed fixed base.

Back then, patents had a lifespan of 17 years. If the vise used features that still had enforceable patents, the patent references could be included by the manufacturer/patent holder (I have a Dexter/Schlage lock with 7 patents cited). If three features were still covered, the manufacturer could include the three patents. There is no law or rule that expired patents cannot be displayed on a product. So, depending on how the company was run, the patents references could "accumulate".

I will provide references to all the patents on that first Parker later today.


Fierljeppen

Hoar was issued two patents and a reissue of his first.
JS Hoar patents:
19 June 1866 #55656
14 May 1867 #RE2606 reissue of above
28 May 1867 #65081

Hope this helps

Dean Patent:
https://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageN...PALL%26S1=0000127.PN.%26OS=pn/127%26RS=PN/127

Parker patent:
https://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageN...%26S1=0011137.PN.%26OS=pn/11137%26RS=PN/11137

Hoar patents:
https://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageN...%26S1=0055656.PN.%26OS=pn/55656%26RS=PN/55656

https://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageN...%26S1=0065081.PN.%26OS=pn/65081%26RS=PN/65081

JKB

 

[Vise]

Vise:
My 406r had replaceable jaws. I assume that was factory original.

I saw that in the pic, but have never seen a 406 with replacemeable jaws. Very cooling if those are factory. Is this the one you sold awhile back?

 

[AngryBeaver]

I saw that in the pic, but have never seen a 406 with replacemeable jaws. Very cooling if those are factory. Is this the one you sold awhile back?

the 400 series as well as the C series got replaceable jaws in the mid 60's. for some reason, reed never did this to the 100,200, 300, series until the very late 70's when they went to the columbian jaws. check out the reed date thread for lots of pics of replaceable jaws. later 406's,405,404-1/2's with replaceable jaws are not very common.

 

[Outlawmws]

Picked up another Machinists at a yard sale today - It pays to ask if they have stuff! My first Long C vise! 5186

Some of the original blue paint left...

25 bucks

 

[Shiftless]

I saw that in the pic, but have never seen a 406 with replacemeable jaws. Very cooling if those are factory. Is this the one you sold awhile back?

Yes it is.
I traded it away to loydski29


Outlaw:
That was a great score. And you got a great price too.
Looks like a good candidate for Evaporust.

.