P&C Stuff
- Thread starter jabberwoki
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Smokeshow69
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Checked it. So cool. I thought it was p&c at first but now see why it got its own thread. Excellent find!
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Private Lugnutz
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I picked up another P&C round-shank wartime military N-series DBE yesterday at the flea market (in the middle) not really paying too much attention to the number (N-92) until I got home and put it with my others and discovered that it's an anomaly. First of all, because it has a hyphen between the N and the number and secondly, because it doesn't fit the sequence. Even the WF-83 at the bottom fits the numbering-to-size sequence.
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Provincial
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I'll bet the N-92 was a size added to the sequence as an afterthought. At first, all the sizes they wanted were covered, but later it was decided that certain opening combinations would be more convenient, so they were added. It would allow deploying one wrench to cover the necessary sizes instead of two.
Private Lugnutz
Well-known member
I wouldn't take that bet. 
I think you're probably correct. None of the other wrenches have dupe ends. And lower numbers probably would've been taken.
I think you're probably correct. None of the other wrenches have dupe ends. And lower numbers probably would've been taken.d42jeep
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outofbounds
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Apparently, I have no way of sharing this here, but if you have the "letgo" app and can search P&C in Novi, MI there is an interesting looking box & tool lot for sale. That said, I think the price is obscene, but I am not an ardent collector. I tried to capture the pics to add here, but was unable to do so.
Oldtuleguy
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Nice set oob. That box is clean.
outofbounds
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But is it $300 clean?
Provincial
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Fairly late production. Good condition, but not enough items to warrant that kind of price.
I knew they existed but the first I've seen.
Char by https://www.flickr.com/photos/119819727@N06/, on Flickr
Char by https://www.flickr.com/photos/119819727@N06/, on Flickr
Char by https://www.flickr.com/photos/119819727@N06/, on Flickr
Char by https://www.flickr.com/photos/119819727@N06/, on Flickroutofbounds
Well-known member
After my comments to her, she has changed the price down to $200, (and insisted she won't budge from there), and now to $175. I told her thanks but no thanks for now (while continuing to keep an eye on it)
Oldtuleguy
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That's getting in the ballpark
Smokeshow69
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I knew they existed but the first I've seen.
That saw is in amazing shape! Where did you get it at?
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OP
jabberwoki
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Stormy comes in with a winner , ****** things NOS!!
Oldtuleguy
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That saw looks perfect
Smokeshow69
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You stole that our from under rileysan and my stomping grounds! Nice grab! If I can’t buy it, at least I can see it went to a forum member. Well done!
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OP
jabberwoki
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Good mate, funny thing I was just thinking of you today. Whats the bet they **** can Portland swap this year?
Smokeshow69
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Jabberwoki- I really hope not! I have been really looking forward to it all year. Who knows?
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Rileysan
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Great find!
As Smoke stated - in my backyard. But I can't be everywhere at once. And with Mr X hanging around in Atlanta, there ought to some good stuff left for us!
Brian
Rileysan
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Unfortunately, it appears that is going to be the case as the governor just announced a ban on all events with more than 250 people, for the next 30 days. Not to put too fine a point on it, but ****!
Brian
Smokeshow69
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She doesn’t do jack for Oregon but sure jumps in on this [emoji849] way to go !
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r_olson_06
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Sorry to hear that guys. Is that the biggest swap of the year in OR?
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Smokeshow69
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Yes by far! I believe it is also one of the biggest in this part of the nation?
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Rileysan
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For those who aren't following the news here in the Pacific Northwest, all events with 250 or more participants have been banned in both Oregon and Washington for at least 4 weeks.
The Portland Automotive swap meet is advertised as the biggest event of its type west of the Mississippi, and I believe it. Nothing I can say will do it justice. It's enough to say that 4 days are not enough time to stop at every vendor, of which there are thousands, and sort through all their stuff. Vendors and buyers alike come from every western state to participate.
This event has been the source of some of the rarest and most unusual tools in my collection. It's the one event I take time off from work to attend.
I am seriously bummed!
Brian
bmwrd0
Well-known member
I am with Riley and Smoke and Jabber and all the other PNWers. It really ***** and I was looking forward to it. I take two days, get a hotel room and bring a three-wheel bike to hit the race track section. There is nothing else like it. I hope that it can be resheduled.
Smokeshow69
Well-known member
I am so sewered that words can’t describe how disappointed I am. I look forward to this event all year! Like Riley said, I usually find my best plomb and p&c at this event. I am trying to get over the disappointment by finishing other projects and the like but it has become a spring ritual so now my spring will be off [emoji23][emoji30][emoji24]
FYI- all state schools are now closed for 2 weeks...
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r_olson_06
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That is a major bummer guys. Hopefully they reschedule it. Our big swap meet here is at the end of April hopefully it goes on as planned.
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David Jackson
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Rileysan
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Re: P&C Numbering
All are model/part numbers. The 2240 and 2252, round shank DBE wrenches are common, pre-war or wartime wrenches sold to the public. Plomb Tool (Proto) bought the company in 1942, and immediately started using the manufacturing facility to make tools to fulfill US Government contracts. The N89 is a WWII government contract tool, that is from ca. 1942 through the end, if not a little after the war.
The 27(36) combo wrench is post-war, and uses the Plomb/Proto numbering convention. The last two digits (which are missing from your wrench) are the size in /32". 36/32" correlates to 1-1/8"
Brian
All are model/part numbers. The 2240 and 2252, round shank DBE wrenches are common, pre-war or wartime wrenches sold to the public. Plomb Tool (Proto) bought the company in 1942, and immediately started using the manufacturing facility to make tools to fulfill US Government contracts. The N89 is a WWII government contract tool, that is from ca. 1942 through the end, if not a little after the war.
The 27(36) combo wrench is post-war, and uses the Plomb/Proto numbering convention. The last two digits (which are missing from your wrench) are the size in /32". 36/32" correlates to 1-1/8"
Brian
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d42jeep
Well-known member
Re: P&C Numbering
Most WW2 tool purchases by the military branches used the conventional numbering system as well. As Brian says, the N marked wrenches were for specific contracts likely for just the Navy.
-Don
Most WW2 tool purchases by the military branches used the conventional numbering system as well. As Brian says, the N marked wrenches were for specific contracts likely for just the Navy.
-Don
David Jackson
Well-known member
Thanks Brian and D42! If it weren't for experts on this site I never would have known what those numbers mean.
I would imagine that the "N" prefix wrench (or at least its mangled half) could have been sold postwar as surplus?
And ... thanks for the last two digits on the combo; one of those is faintly visible "in person" so to speak, the other just a dent in the metal.
I would imagine that the "N" prefix wrench (or at least its mangled half) could have been sold postwar as surplus?
And ... thanks for the last two digits on the combo; one of those is faintly visible "in person" so to speak, the other just a dent in the metal.
Rileysan
Well-known member
Happy to help!
Regarding government contract tools - yes, they were auctioned off to the public after the war, and they are still readily available - even some that are new in box. The government bought a LOT of tools!
David Jackson
Well-known member
Where would a person go to find some of those tools still available, and maybe even some new in the box!
As a former pistol collector the phrase "new in the box" really gets my attention! NIBw/all!
As a former pistol collector the phrase "new in the box" really gets my attention! NIBw/all!
Rileysan
Well-known member
You can find some stuff on eBay. Here's a listing for commonly found NOS Plomb sockets. https://www.ebay.com/itm/PLOMB-WW-I...372050?hash=item4da4faa752:g:zt8AAOSwJsla~dWs
As for wrenches, that's another matter. NOS typically means they were sealed in cosmoline and shipped in sealed boxes. The contents are blackened and are often discarded because those who find them don't know any better.
The first photo is from the current eBay auction.
The second is a Vchek wrench I found at a swap meet in 2018. The seller had a nearly full box of these cosmoline covered wrenches for $10 (all). I didn't want/need the entire box, which was falling apart, but I wanted a single example of that wrench so I offered him a dollar, as well as information on exactly what he had. Forgive the poor quality photo, which was taken with my broken phone. If I can locate the wrench (I've since moved), I'll take a better photo.
Brian
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David Jackson
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Hi Rileysan,
Well I guess these kinds of things are where you find them! I was thinking, somehow, that there might be some big government warehouse which sells new old stock tools. Keep dreaming, right?
Nice examples of some nos stuff, thanks for sending them.
DJ
Well I guess these kinds of things are where you find them! I was thinking, somehow, that there might be some big government warehouse which sells new old stock tools. Keep dreaming, right?
Nice examples of some nos stuff, thanks for sending them.
DJ
Provincial
Well-known member
The government may still be surplussing WWII tools, if they turn up in old, inactive warehouses. Most have already been disposed of, going to persons buying at auction in the last 60 years or so. Many of these lots have been sitting in surplus buyer's possession ever since, because they didn't seem desirable. Steel being too cheap to scrap, and too much work to separate and sell piecemeal.
Speaking of unused government warehouses: During the Vietnam War, a group of National Guard troops was sent to Ft. Lewis, WA for annual maneuvers. The post had no empty barracks due to the War, so they were sent to an old empty warehouse to bivouac. They noticed that the place wasn't completely empty. It had some wooden crates in one corner, so they investigated, and found them full of 1873 Springfield 45-70 rifles! They had probably been there since WWi. Not being in inventory, most left with the Guardsmen!
Who knows what is still out there? Perhaps even the Lost Ark!
Speaking of unused government warehouses: During the Vietnam War, a group of National Guard troops was sent to Ft. Lewis, WA for annual maneuvers. The post had no empty barracks due to the War, so they were sent to an old empty warehouse to bivouac. They noticed that the place wasn't completely empty. It had some wooden crates in one corner, so they investigated, and found them full of 1873 Springfield 45-70 rifles! They had probably been there since WWi. Not being in inventory, most left with the Guardsmen!
Who knows what is still out there? Perhaps even the Lost Ark!
David Jackson
Well-known member
That was a neat find!
Rileysan
Well-known member
In the GS thread, I posted my about my big score last Saturday. There are still boxes to go through but among the things that were easy to access are these uncommon P&C X-3209 ratchet repair kits, in the original boxes. One box contains new and used parts, and I found the instruction sheet separated from the box, and a box with new parts and instruction sheet.
In case you're wondering, I also got two 3209, 3/8" drive ratchets as well.
Brian
In case you're wondering, I also got two 3209, 3/8" drive ratchets as well.
Brian
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