Wilton Bullet Vise date stamping. show yours with or without EXP on slide

[RustyJarHead]

Hello all,

Tons of great and interesting information here!
I apologize if I missed this information throughout the previous 56 pages but it's a bit daunting trying to digest and remember it all.
Here is my Wilton No 3 Chicago Pat Pend with a key stamp of 2-945 (the "nine" didn't get stamped fully). It was my grandfathers and I had cleaned it up decades ago unaware of paint colors or year of manufacturing. I would like to do a better job of cleaning/restoring it and bring it back to the original color. Would this be a 1945 and what color would that have been (or if year is incorrect, what year and what color)?
All I did previously was clean, paint and replaced the original acorn nuts.

Photos attached.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Would this be a 1945 and what color would that have been?

Yes, 1945, and I don't know if the color was ever described or named in ads, but it was considered an industrial grey green at that time, including hospital equipment and even kitchen appliances. A very popular rattle can match with many, many modern restorations has been Rustoleum Sage Green Gloss. If you search this thread on that you will find examples to eyeball.

EDIT: Linking a vise posted on this thread last year with the most vivid, original finish I have ever seen, here.

 

[RustyJarHead]

Thanks for the quick response Pvt! I had seen previous posts about the Rustolem sage green, but not definitive data on initial year colors for Wilton. Like lots out there, been lurking in the shadows for a while. Great reading all the efforts and data collecting to help solve the historical riddles.

 

[drivesitfar]

Rusty: your granddad's old Wilton vise looks pretty good as is so what i'd do is clean it with Simple Green and put on BLO (boiled linseed oil in case you might have read a few of my posts).

on the big vise thread several of the members have been finding old Wiltons new in their boxes or with original paint so you might want to post this over there to and see what they say. I can't recall cause ORIGINAL PAINT has never been a big deal to me.

i'd almost say the 1945 Wiltons were grey like LUG mentioned, but there were also some that were a different green then the Hammered verde green so what I have to say is "it's your vise and your color". also i'm sure your Gramps would be smiling no matter what you decide knowing that you are just using his old tools.

WELCOME TO GJ too!!!!

 

[RustyJarHead]

Thanks for pointing me to the big vise thread DRIVES, I will most definitely peruse through the posts. I did see the BLO in previous posts as well (and written down already, thank you!). I like the thought of having the ol' No3 like it was when Gramps first put it in his shop and to eventually hand it down. It appears one can't know with absolute certainly how the original vise look out of the box, but I will just have to take my own liberties in that!

Thanks for the warm welcome aboard and again, all the information posted!

 

[shortykorte]

Just picked up a C2 minus base.
Here’s the stamp, anybody have ideas?

Also what is the model of the blue one? It’s also a 5” from Schiller Park. I need to check stamp again.


Sent from my iPhone using Garage Journal

 

[drivesitfar]

Shorty: i'll guess 3/79 for your date and not sure why the sideways #1 is doing there.

sorry i'm not the guy to tell you model #'s on Wilton Bullets cause the only one I have kept is the baby bullet i use quite a bit. maybe 9500?

nice finds.

also since your C2 doesn't have a swivel you might make a hitch mount on each corner of your bench or a nice stand cause that C2 is maybe the best vise Wilton made. i like another version of it a bit better with the two pins on each pipe jaw, but a C2 is a great vise.

 

[rob1964]

I'm hoping some one can help me identify my Wilton Vise. It's not like most of the others I see on this page. It is not a bullet vise. I turned it over and looked and there is not date on the slide. Can anyone help??

 

[drivesitfar]

Rob: you are correct that your Wilton is not a bullet. it was made in the USA at their plant here before they started making that style in China and my guess is about 1970's cause I don't recall those being dated for a warranty.

it looks like you might be missing your vises swivel base, but I bet it can be mounted to a bench or welded to a plate and put on a stand to work just fine.

WELCOME TO GARAGE JOURNAL too!!

 

[exmaxima1]

My first "Baby" and it's in great condition. It's a model 20SA. Not sure what the extra numbers are for in the date stamp, but it looks like 1945.

 

[drivesitfar]

Ex: Schweet!!
1945 was Wiltons first year date stamping their vises so maybe they hadn’t worked out all the kinks yet. Most of the 1945 stamps did have the extra 9 in them.

Nice find and I bet you’ll love using it.

 

[exmaxima1]

Ex: Schweet!!
1945 was Wiltons first year date stamping their vises so maybe they hadn’t worked out all the kinks yet. Most of the 1945 stamps did have the extra 9 in them.

You could be right about being the first year. Mine says "Pat Pend" on it and it has a simple bar for locking the base. I found one like that on the auction site (pic attached) so I know it wasn't homemade.

 

[zippyslug31]

Saw a new Wilton restoration vid:

I cringed when he ground down the lettering.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

My first "Baby" and it's in great condition.

Congrats!

Not sure what the extra numbers are for in the date stamp, but it looks like 1945.

1945 was Wiltons first year date stamping their vises so maybe they hadn’t worked out all the kinks yet. Most of the 1945 stamps did have the extra 9 in them.

You could be right about being the first year.

No "could be" about it; he is right. Based on bluebolt's database, which had a very high sample size, no Wilton with a date stamp earlier than 1945 has ever been reported. He's also right about the "9", although I don't think of it as extra so much as a quirky, unnecessary digit (as if their thinking ahead thoughts concluded they ought to distinguish vises made in 1945 ("945") from those they would eventually make in 2045 ("045"))!

We know that they dropped this practice in June or July of 1945.

The first number, before the hyphen, is the month.

Here is a summary of the 1945 vise markings in the database...

"1-945"
"3-945"
"4-945" (x3)(not incl. yours)
"5-945"
"6-945" (x2)
"8-45" (x2)
"9-45" (x3)
"11-45"
"12-45"

 

[exmaxima1]

Thanks for the clear explanation, very helpful. Based on that info I suspect I will need to paint it gray rather than the sage green I was planning on. Looking forward to that.

 

[lucasd2002]

Disassembled a 3” bullet (model 3HD) that I just picked up on a whim. All of the seller’s pictures coincidentally hid the “Chicago” so that was a happy surprise.

Both of the pins holding the key to the dynamic were MIA, so the key was the last part I removed from the static.

I was happy when I saw the text on the key: “9-45”. Based on the post from a few days ago, I guess this is the 4th 9-45 for the spreadsheet.

 

[drivesitfar]

Lucas: nice find!! a couple months ago one of the members had a loose key (he had his pins in the key though) and we discussed a few options on how to repair this over on the Vise Repair 101 thread if you might want to look. OR just post pictures of yours over there and ask questions if you need help.

here's the link to that thread: https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=252830

 

[eidolon]

Greeting GJ board! I picked up my first Wilton yesterday from a social media marketplace for $80 (the gent wanted $50, but I offered $80 to beat off other inquiries and ensure he'd hold it for me). It's one of the two Wiltons I have been after for many many months (other being a 450 or a 450S, which I haven't seen yet for a decent price).

I was hoping to contribute to the thread and have others assist me in attempting to date this gorgeous little guy. Photos are below; the vise has what appears to be original paint, remnants of the Wilton 2" 5 year guarantee sticker in the front, no date stamp on the slide, Chicago along with PAT PDG on the side, and two markings (shown): 920 for the model, and 13-2 (no idea here) on the underside of the swivel base. It seems like the only missing part is the raised square anvil (the indentation on the "shaped anvil" seems like it should be positioned there. Otherwise, the vise seems like it's been never used (jaws and everything else is in near perfect shape).

Based on what I gathered from the thread, it may be a very early 40's model (perhaps 41-42?); other than that, I am having difficulties.

 

[drivesitfar]

Welcome to GJ first off.

I’m taking a guess since I can’t see your pics ( maybe you need a few more posts on forum before pics start to download) that your vise might be a mid 50’s vise before Wilton moved to Schiller park.

I’ve never seen a 5 year warranty on the early ones is part of my reasoning. As I mentioned pics will help. With it not seeing much use and no date does have me scratching my head a bit though cause a ton of wiltons were sold to schools that had heavy use so those dates could have easily worn off.

In any case it sounds like you finally have a nice Wilton bullet house to use ir stick on a shelf while you look for another if you think it’s collectible.

 

[eidolon]

you are correct I needed five posts before I could add anything (hyperlinks only for the time being it seems). Let's do a second attempt at this:

It's so cute!

link to the album: https://imgur.com/a/vGVzDTM

 

[eidolon]

@drivesitfar to be frank, I wouldn't rely too much on the presence of the sticker, since those may be purchased on eBay for those recreating the "authentic" look during restorations (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Wilton-Vis...k-On-Gold-Set-2-For-Baby-Bullet-/154038326971); moreover, it would seem the vise only had the Wilton 2" sticker (not the guarantee one), so I would ignore my mention of the guarantee entirely - my screw up

 

[PghJKB]

Greeting GJ board! I picked up my first Wilton yesterday from a social media marketplace for $80 (the gent wanted $50, but I offered $80 to beat off other inquiries and ensure he'd hold it for me). It's one of the two Wiltons I have been after for many many months (other being a 450 or a 450S, which I haven't seen yet for a decent price).

I was hoping to contribute to the thread and have others assist me in attempting to date this gorgeous little guy. Photos are below; the vise has what appears to be original paint, remnants of the Wilton 2" 5 year guarantee sticker in the front, no date stamp on the slide, Chicago along with PAT PDG on the side, and two markings (shown): 920 for the model, and 13-2 (no idea here) on the underside of the swivel base. It seems like the only missing part is the raised square anvil (the indentation on the "shaped anvil" seems like it should be positioned there. Otherwise, the vise seems like it's been never used (jaws and everything else is in near perfect shape).

Based on what I gathered from the thread, it may be a very early 40's model (perhaps 41-42?); other than that, I am having difficulties.

eidolon

The anvil is not missing. It was optional, if missing there would be a threaded hole through the body to mount the raised anvil.

Welcome, nice score

JKB

 

[drivesitfar]

Yep if it’s a baby bullet even better. I think our data base has Wilton baby bullets with Chicago on their sides up to the mid 80’s

 

[eidolon]

I think our data base has Wilton baby bullets with Chicago on their sides up to the mid 80’s

I was under the impression - after reading through this thread - that the PAT PNG was no longer used after the mid-50's; perhaps it may be different for baby bullets, not sure. Still, any light as to the approximate dating would be appreciated.

 

[drivesitfar]

You might be correct, but I’m far from the Wilton or baby bullet expert and just trying to help. You should be able to post pics now and maybe with me pushing this thread back up to the top a few times will get more eyes in it and get you a better answer.

 

[eidolon]

I did include the hyperlink to the album earlier, but just in case, I'll try this again:

*edit* images still don't appear to work :/ album link is here:
https://imgur.com/a/vGVzDTM

 

[drivesitfar]

Delete the s on https snd that might work. I don’t usually click on links provided unless I know the members.

 

[eidolon]

I don’t usually click on links provided unless I know the members.

My apologies; trying as you suggested:

*edit* still no joy :/

 

[drivesitfar]

Click on paperclip in middle above where you are writing your posts and download pics sorta like an email attachment. It will show up as a thumbnail pic and viewer can click once or twice on it to enlarge it.

 

[eidolon]

Thank you very much for the suggestion; trying that now, will delete to hamper spamming if it doesn't work.

 

[drivesitfar]

Pics are visable now!!

No need to delete other posts cause it might help other members learn how to post their pics.

Looks great and it could be a WWII made vise.

 

[eidolon]

it could be a WWII made vise

That's incredible news! Especially considering the shape of this guy! I intent to inhibit the rust, clean out the grease (that seems to have been there since WWII) and keep the rest as is. If anyone has closer insight or stipulations as to a date, any information would be greatly appreciated!

 

[drivesitfar]

Before I’m convinced your baby bullet was made during WWII I’d have to consider the 5 year warranty sticker that Wilton didn’t offer til after 1945. Still a very interesting vise.

 

[Outlawmws]

EID, If no date stamp it almost certainly WWII vintage unless one "slipped out".

Wilton must have cast a zillion of the 2" bodies when they made those; as Drives mentioned the Chicago casting show up WAY past the move. It's an oddity, but its a fact, adn we documented.

As you mentioned, stickers are easy today... (Although that should have been a wet-slide decal I think?)

 

[eidolon]

Thank you for the replies. As I mentioned and from what I have seen, the round "nose" part of the bullet would not get a warranty sticker, but rather the Wilton #20 one (pic attached), the remnants of which I believe this specimen still carries.



As to the bodies used after the move, I believe (potentially erroneously), the latter 20's that were released into the wild after the move (and certainly around the 50's) would have been stamped.

Again, I can't stress enough that all this information I am quoting is based strictly from what I have gathered from these forums; I still appreciate your replies and insight.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I agree with Drives and Outlaw. That is a wartime vise. Note that the original guarantee Wilton offered, as early as February 1942, was 1 year, not 5 years. So it wouldn't have a 5-year guarantee sticker on it, anyway. The Repro Sticker Market Purveyors probably haven't caught up to that fact yet.

 

[eidolon]

Thank you for the reply; so then based on the rationale, this guy is from between 1942 and 1945, if I am understanding this correctly?

 

[Outlawmws]

I thought I had established an earlier date than 45 for the shift from 1 to 5 years? I have the books from Carla, (not currently handy) with ads from near every year. And I posted those (I should have kept specific links...)

 

[eidolon]

@Outlaw: I'm confused; I stipulated that its from between 1942 and 1945 based on what you said. A more precise year would be interesting to try and ascertain, though I am not entirely hopeful. I checked your message history; sadly, the forum only keeps the last 500, so wherever those ads are posted, alas, I am unable to locate.

 

[va.grouseman]

Eidolon, mine has the Pat. Pen on the side and no date stamp also.---Yours also has the horizontal jaw teeth instead of the cross hatching of later Wiltons.---Horizontal grips were a holdover from the York predecessor.---Yours is an oldy and in remarkable condition I might add.---In that condition I'd say the remaining sticker is original.---Nice find.