I am getting ready to bury a couple of downspouts. I see a lot of people around here using the green sewer and drain PVC. I assumed this was cheaper than schedule 40 (white) PVC but it's actually more expensive. What is the reason for using the green ( more expensive) than the lesser expensive white PVC? Below a is the links to the 2 different types that I cannot see a difference with
Which type of pvc should I use to bury downspouts?
- Thread starter mc1984ss
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the cheaper one will last close to a life time
UserNameAttempt3
Well-known member
For storm drainage only, no difference
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
If protected, SDR works fine, but going sched 40 will be more durable. Most of what I did at my current house was SDR, but if I was redoing it, I'd spring for 40
dcg9381
Well-known member
Same pipe, better pipe is cheaper, answer is clear to me. Especially if you're going to be driving over it, etc.
I'm surprised sch 40 is cheaper... That's not how it's priced locally.. Might be an over-supply issue. Take advantage. This is what 4" schedule 40 pipe costs here..
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
One benefit to SDR can be that it's available with a bell end, cutting down on fittings and the fittings that you do need are a lot cheaper
larry4406
Well-known member
At the day job we use SCH40 for this. It is used as its smooth bore, very strong when buried, and readily available with fittings. The green SDRC piping and fittings is less readily available.
Ends are either daylit or routed to an engineered drywell.
Ends are either daylit or routed to an engineered drywell.
strutaeng
Well-known member
Use whatever is cheaper...
Probably whatever the contractor has easy access to or on hand is what is getting installed.
I might ask are you daylighting these ?
Or are they tying into something else,? If so, what are they tying into as that might make a difference. Many around here use corrugated field tile.
I might ask are you daylighting these ?
Or are they tying into something else,? If so, what are they tying into as that might make a difference. Many around here use corrugated field tile.
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Youngandfree
Well-known member
That shows sch 40 is more expensive.Same pipe, better pipe is cheaper, answer is clear to me. Especially if you're going to be driving over it, etc.
I'm surprised sch 40 is cheaper... That's not how it's priced locally.. Might be an over-supply issue. Take advantage. This is what 4" schedule 40 pipe costs here..
dcg9381
Well-known member
More expensive here... WAY more expensive that what the OP is paying.That shows sch 40 is more expensive.
nmk_61802
Well-known member
Unless I am missing something that everyone else is seeing, ASTM2729 is not schedule 40 (it is closer to sch 30) and similar to the green pipe also posted.
This is schedule 40 solid (I would not use foam core ever)
That said it is about the same as the green in price.
My general thought are:
- Use sch 40 under driveways, or where you plan to drive over it.
- Thin wall is acceptable everywhere else unless you want to spend the extra.
This is schedule 40 solid (I would not use foam core ever)
That said it is about the same as the green in price.
My general thought are:
- Use sch 40 under driveways, or where you plan to drive over it.
- Thin wall is acceptable everywhere else unless you want to spend the extra.
SouthernIllinois
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I used solid core schedule 40 - I never want to have to think about it again.
For corrugated, I special ordered the heavy yellow stuff and used connectors from The French Drain Man.
Just playing around, we buried a scrap piece and then ran over it with a mini-excavator - it didn't crush it at all. Pretty sturdy stuff.
For corrugated, I special ordered the heavy yellow stuff and used connectors from The French Drain Man.
Just playing around, we buried a scrap piece and then ran over it with a mini-excavator - it didn't crush it at all. Pretty sturdy stuff.
BombShelter
Well-known member
You'd have to look at the ASTM standard to see the differences, usually it's what kind of **** it's moving.
I would use neither! I look at these systems all the time and most are not working, the plastic degrades and falls apart. The photo shows what I run into on a weekly basis. The other worthless product is the cheap black corrugated 4" rolls, it either clogs up in the flutes or is easily crushed. I was just looking at a clogged one three hours ago.
Personally I would use PVC Sch 40 or for a little more money Sch 80. If you want to go big-time, corrugated culvert pipe in steel or plastic with the smooth bore.
Up here everyone goes 4" but they freeze up at night and end up dropping the water right at your foundation. I would use 6" and place cleanouts every 20-30'. If you have cold winters, running heat tape through it might not be a bad idea.
I would use neither! I look at these systems all the time and most are not working, the plastic degrades and falls apart. The photo shows what I run into on a weekly basis. The other worthless product is the cheap black corrugated 4" rolls, it either clogs up in the flutes or is easily crushed. I was just looking at a clogged one three hours ago.
Personally I would use PVC Sch 40 or for a little more money Sch 80. If you want to go big-time, corrugated culvert pipe in steel or plastic with the smooth bore.
Up here everyone goes 4" but they freeze up at night and end up dropping the water right at your foundation. I would use 6" and place cleanouts every 20-30'. If you have cold winters, running heat tape through it might not be a bad idea.
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BurtEggley
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buried it will last a very long time. In the sun it may cook. I used regular PVC and painted it to match the house above ground. Been going now for 30 years. Had a rare 2" downpour yesterday - in about an hour. It handled it well.
Burt was this 4" that you have?
One run will be about 30 ft the other maybe 40' I will make sure they have plenty of pitch and am definitely installing cleanouts. They will never ever see heavy traffic only a garden tractor at most
Thanks again everyone
One run will be about 30 ft the other maybe 40' I will make sure they have plenty of pitch and am definitely installing cleanouts. They will never ever see heavy traffic only a garden tractor at most
Thanks again everyone
gahrajmahal
Well-known member
We replaced the original 20 year old green PVC with schedule 40 white. It seems to be holding up well
nmk_61802
Well-known member
I did similar to SouthernIllinois above... This was phase I. I have two more that I need to tie in to the drywell system and increase its capacity yet.
Most of the rear system has no been covered by a patio that was planned when I built the rear garage a few years ago.
Most of the rear system has no been covered by a patio that was planned when I built the rear garage a few years ago.
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fourjeepin
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I did a bunch at my place using the 4” sewer pipe. It is pretty thin but I haven’t had any issues despite occasionally running over it with my CJ or over equipment.
BurtEggley
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yes. 4". Smooth wall. Don't use the corrugated accordian stuff, it traps dirt and is harder to clean out 10 - 20 years from now when it gets a blockage from years of leaves and dirt, bird nests that wash out of gutters etc.. 4' handles something like 6 inches of rain per hour if the slope is maintained properly. I put ours around the house on both sides, catch the low spots, all the downspouts. It is absolutely wonderful. From the back of the house to the street is about 110'. Been a long time but want to say I used a quarter bubble most of the time sloping it. Everything drains so well.
Over time people lay concrete, put in plants and trees. Destroy the original grade of the property. Water backs up and damages things. Drainage is so important. Take photos, and keep drawings that you can refer to years in the future if you have to change it, or clean it out. I put this one in about 1998. This winter we had a heavy rain storm and water was exiting it slowly. I had my plumber hydrojet it clean the following week. Since it is smooth wall, it cleaned very easy, first time since 1998. Yesterday we had a torrential downpour that flooded streets not far from us. A rare 30 - 40 year rain occurence. I went out yesterday right after the storm was done, and there was no standing water. We got something like 3.84" of rain in the last 24 hours. Today I walked on the lawn with my deerskin moccasins to walk the dogs out, and my moccasins were dry when I came inside. In 1998 I added some perforated PVC with geosock on it and gravel in the trench in the lawn area so it would drain away water, and a couple surface drains. That area was firm and not muddy. Without it, this lawn would have been a standing pond 6" - 8" deep like what would happen right after I bought the home.
I want to say the pipe came from a landscape supply company here, Horizon Distributors - Sprinkler and Landscape, or something like that. They are all over the USA. They had the drainage pipe for a better price than the big box stores.
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mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I glued all of mine. Probably even did primer
Codyboy
Well-known member
A mini x with tracks is not a good test for something like that. The load on tracked equipment is really spread out over a large area.I used solid core schedule 40 - I never want to have to think about it again.
For corrugated, I special ordered the heavy yellow stuff and used connectors from The French Drain Man.
Just playing around, we buried a scrap piece and then ran over it with a mini-excavator - it didn't crush it at all. Pretty sturdy stuff.
Your test is no different than a contractor saying he compacted a pad with the dozer.
Overboost44
Well-known member
Just to put it all in one place.
The green pipe is significantly thicker than the regular thin wall white PVC and both have belled ends.
The white is .59 thickness and $1.80/ft
The green is .127 thick and $2.50/ft
Schedule 40 is .237" thick and $3.49/ft
Edited to correct for total thickness divided by 2.
The green pipe is significantly thicker than the regular thin wall white PVC and both have belled ends.
The white is .59 thickness and $1.80/ft
The green is .127 thick and $2.50/ft
Schedule 40 is .237" thick and $3.49/ft
Edited to correct for total thickness divided by 2.
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mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Pricing and availability varies a lot. HD in my area doesn't have 4" green, and sched 40 is $2.90 a ft
manwithtools
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I'm afraid there are some errors in the math in this post. Looks like @Overboost44 sutracted I.D. from O.D. and surmised that resulted in wall thickness. In actuality there are two wall thicknesses in that calculation so:
The White D2729 Sewer and Drain Pipe has a wall thickness of 0.59"
The Green PVC SDR35 Gravity Sewer Pipe has a wall thickness of 0.127"
The White PVC Schedule 40 DWV Pipe has a wall thickness of 0.237"
This makes it easy to see why Schedule 40 is so much stronger than the Sewer and Drain pipes.
Overboost44
Well-known member
You are correct. I should have at least divided by 2 and it would have been closer. My apologies.
I've seen SDR 35, Sch 40 and on one project Sch 80 specified under paved areas. Residential application, I wouldn't have an issue installing SDR 35 and have at home and for family. I also wouldn't be concerned with corrugated based on my experience.
Dodgeboy2020
Active member
When I installed it at my house I used the white schedule 35 bell end pipe and fittings as needed. I put it all together without any glue (exactly as I do when I have to install downspouts for clients) everything runs to daylight so they are easy to locate if needed but on one that has some changes in direction due to routing issues I buried a trace wire in the trench with the pipe so it can be located later on using standard locating tools.
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I'd use any form of solid pipe before corrugated. The benefits end immediately after install
Old tool guy
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And make it so you can easily disconnect the downspout from the buried part so you can clean out leaves and such.
Your post and this thread reminded me of an old Andrew Camrata Youtube video I saw, where he was testing the strength of different PVC pipes. I think any would be fine for downspouts however...but I thought this might be relevant. He runs a few over with a backhoe towards the end of the video to demonstrate their strength differences.
Of course it's useful. The SCH40 is a **** ton stronger than the others. But for water runoff through a yard that doesn't get driven over...it doesn't matter.
The average person cannot read engineering data on the subject and come to any sort of conclusion. If you can read it, more power to you.
I never said sch 40 is not significantly stronger than the others, I know it is. I didn't watch the video, but I'm sure both the thin wall and SDR 35 were crushed. Again, it is my opinion, driving over uncovered pipe is not a useful data point, but it's great you found it useful. Further up thread I did state SDR 35 would be fine for the application.Of course it's useful. The SCH40 is a **** ton stronger than the others. But for water runoff through a yard that doesn't get driven over...it doesn't matter.
The average person cannot read engineering data on the subject and come to any sort of conclusion. If you can read it, more power to you.
Regarding my loding data comment, I was not referring to the engineering data/values and formulas but rather a data sheet published the manufacturer listing allowable loading for their pipe, e.g., minimum burial depth for a load of x,*** pounds. As I said it's been awhile and I don't remember the manufacturer or the type of pipe.