The Best Ratchet Lube Has Been Discovered

[M.Jay]

Good point: SuperLube wasn't developed to be a better lubricant. It was developed as a food safe alternative to other oils and greases used in food processing equipment. There are other (better) sythnetic oils and greases out there.

True, depending on the use case there may be better alternatives, but I think the reason many people like it is, because Super Lube managed to create a really good multi-purpose product which can replace numerous other grease/oils.

 

[Copymutt]

Bless me lord for I have sinned. Never lubed my ratchets. Some Ive had for 50 yrs.

 

[lardy1]

I found that each individual ratchet likes what it likes and others won't tolerate the same lube. Generally speaking, I find the modern high tooth count ratchets seem to like light oil where coarser ones do better with some type of grease. But, tbh, I stopped trying to find the ideal lube. Ratchets actually don't generate enough heat to even need lube and I believe most of the "smooth" we experience is a bit of a fantasy in that it cushions and quiets which gives an illusion of smooth. There's no doubt in my mind that a properly lubed ratchet will experience less backdrag. But, in the end, I also found it to be a big waste of my time. I hear a few of the oldtimers talk about soaking the entire, assembled head in ATF and I think on an unsealed head that works about as well as anything.

 

[M.Jay]

and I believe most of the "smooth" we experience is a bit of a fantasy in that it cushions and quiets which gives an illusion of smooth. There's no doubt in my mind that a properly lubed ratchet will experience less backdrag.

Because of personal interest, I actually once measured a new ratchet before and after greasing it, using a high-precision torque indicator that measures in Newton-Centimeter. The difference after lubrication was around 0.2 cNm = 0.002 Nm. So it's completely negligible in everyday life.

 

[CHI_Tool&Die]

My Matco ratchets hate grease. I oil them every couple of months with some basic Starrett tool oil and they work smoothly afterwards. The only ratchets that like the gummy, colored grease are my Proto Palm-Control ratchets.

 

[AEAdam]

I found that each individual ratchet likes what it likes and others won't tolerate the same lube. Generally speaking, I find the modern high tooth count ratchets seem to like light oil where coarser ones do better with some type of grease. But, tbh, I stopped trying to find the ideal lube. Ratchets actually don't generate enough heat to even need lube and I believe most of the "smooth" we experience is a bit of a fantasy in that it cushions and quiets which gives an illusion of smooth. There's no doubt in my mind that a properly lubed ratchet will experience less backdrag. But, in the end, I also found it to be a big waste of my time. I hear a few of the oldtimers talk about soaking the entire, assembled head in ATF and I think on an unsealed head that works about as well as anything.

Again- its really important to understand the reason why grease is used in ratchets. Its not for the teeth or to prevent tooth wear. Grease in gear teeth actually accelerates wear by reducing the contact area, increasing stress. So everyone who has "quieted" their ratchet really did the wrong thing. They made the tool weaker and reduced its life span.

Grease is used in ratchets to reduce friction between the back of the gear and the inside of the body. The relative motion here occurs only during the ratcheting action. Many of us hold our ratchet heads in our palms and quickly twist our wrists to ratchet. During this action, we may be applying down pressure to keep the socket engaged. Its not tons of load, but with no lubricant or with a thin lubricant like ATF, it would be metal on metal.

With nothing at all on the gear, my guess is, within a week's use, you'd start to wear the finish off the back of the gear. Depending on your environment, that could lead to corrosion, followed by accelerated wear. For those of you who have rebuilt ratchets, you have probably seen wear or even scoring under the top plate. This is where we want grease. It must be thick enough to generally stay there, but not so thick it reduces back drag (which a thick grease with decent shear properties absolutely would do).


I just found this picture on the internet. Here you can clearly see the score marks on the bottom side of the top plate at left. You can also see the loss of finish on the outer edge of the gear. While this wear was taking place, this ratchet was performing more poorly than it could have been.

There are other scuff marks under the top plate from the pawls. You would similarly want grease between the pawls and the body. This is the interface that should have the least wear. Under the gear will be worse.

If I'm not mistaken this is a "sealed" Dual 80 ratchet. I see a decent amount of dirt inside the body. From where it is, it looks to be dirt that got in past the top plate. But it also could be the finish that was removed from use.

BTW, anyone else notice it looks like there was no grease in this ratchet. Was it washed out with ATF soaks? Or did the rebuilder just wipe away the old SuperLube?


In a perfect world, you'd disassemble and clean all this. Then decide if you need to replace any components or just regrease and carry on. If you could dunk all these parts in a light oil and make sure every tooth is clean, that would be best. Then you would grease only the areas I marked in red.

For those of you who have seen Snap On reps rebuild these ratchets, they basically squeeze half the tube of grease under the gear, then the rest on the back of the top plate, which is consistent with my recommendations here. A little around the pawls is the only detail that I'm not sure they address, but wear there is probably both minor and insigificant to the function of the tool.

Bless me lord for I have sinned. Never lubed my ratchets. Some Ive had for 50 yrs.

We get the point. Your ratchets have functioned well enough for you all these years. But let's not take this too far, like its a good idea. If you want performance, and people pay extra for high performing ratchets, they probably tend to maintain them. You could probably drive a car for a really long time without changing the motor oil. But is that a good idea? I change the oil in my cars, grease my heavy equipment, and occassionally rebuild ratchets I use frequently.

 

[ChevyEFI]

Again- its really important to understand the reason why grease is used in ratchets. Its not for the teeth or to prevent tooth wear. Grease in gear teeth actually accelerates wear by reducing the contact area, increasing stress. So everyone who has "quieted" their ratchet really did the wrong thing. They made the tool weaker and reduced its life span.

Grease is used in ratchets to reduce friction between the back of the gear and the inside of the body. The relative motion here occurs only during the ratcheting action. Many of us hold our ratchet heads in our palms and quickly twist our wrists to ratchet. During this action, we may be applying down pressure to keep the socket engaged. Its not tons of load, but with no lubricant or with a thin lubricant like ATF, it would be metal on metal.

With nothing at all on the gear, my guess is, within a week's use, you'd start to wear the finish off the back of the gear. Depending on your environment, that could lead to corrosion, followed by accelerated wear. For those of you who have rebuilt ratchets, you have probably seen wear or even scoring under the top plate. This is where we want grease. It must be thick enough to generally stay there, but not so thick it reduces back drag (which a thick grease with decent shear properties absolutely would do).


I just found this picture on the internet. Here you can clearly see the score marks on the bottom side of the top plate at left. You can also see the loss of finish on the outer edge of the gear. While this wear was taking place, this ratchet was performing more poorly than it could have been.

There are other scuff marks under the top plate from the pawls. You would similarly want grease between the pawls and the body. This is the interface that should have the least wear. Under the gear will be worse.

If I'm not mistaken this is a "sealed" Dual 80 ratchet. I see a decent amount of dirt inside the body. From where it is, it looks to be dirt that got in past the top plate. But it also could be the finish that was removed from use.

BTW, anyone else notice it looks like there was no grease in this ratchet. Was it washed out with ATF soaks? Of did the rebuilder just wipe away the old SuperLube?


Perfect world, you'd disassemble and clean all this. Then decide if you need to replace any components or just regrease and carry on. If you could dunk all these parts in a light oil and make sure every tooth is clean, that would be best. Then you would grease only the areas I marked in red.

For those of you who have seen Snap On reps rebuild these ratchets, they basically squeeze half the tube of grease under the gear, then the rest on the back of the top plate, which is consistent with my recommendations here. A little around the pawls is the only detail that I'm not sure they address, but wear there is probably both minor and insigificant to the function of the tool.


We get the point. Your ratchets have functioned well enough for you all these years. But lets not take this too far, like its a good idea. If you want performance, and people pay extra for high performing ratchets, they probably tend to maintain them. You could probably drive a car for a really long time without changing the motor oil. But is that a good idea? I change the oil in my cars, grease my heavy equipment, and occassionally rebuild ratchets I use frequently.

Subtle troll job. I wonder who else caught it.

 

[Hohn]

If you have a sealed ratchet head and it has no yellow metal in it, the best lube is synthetic gear oil. Honestly, gear oil is optimal for MANY general lubrication applications where you want minimal wear in a sealed environment. The oil you put in that oil can you keep handy? Yeah, it should have gear oil in it. Preferably a full synthetic gear oil with the highest "w" rating you can get (think 85w-140). The reason for the high viscosity is that you are generally lubricating things at home with low relative surface velocity, which means you need more viscosity to great film separation.

Most of the time, though, you won't even have full film lubrication, but rather boundary lubrication. This is where gear oils absolutely crush most other lubricants.

If you want to add the versatility of working with yellow metals, just be sure you are using a GL-4 rated or Synchromesh style gear oil (like the Pennzoil synchromesh you can find at many autoparts stores).

It takes like 2 drops of gear oil to lube a ratchet. IN fact, just wipe off all the excess with a lint free cloth. Just the thin film remaining is plenty to lube the ratchet and it will prevent puking a bunch of oil out of the front plate.

Lubrication is always a surface phenomenon. SO you don't need an oil bath to lube a ratchet. A thin residue is quite sufficient. Put a couple drops on, wipe off all excess, good to go for years more.

 

[General Geoff]

Lubrication is always a surface phenomenon.

This is why I prefer a thin grease to a thick oil. Sticks better where it needs to, especially in non-liquid-sealed cavities like ratchets.

I just recently found a vendor to sell me some NLGI 00 Super Lube grease which I've been using to great effect as a ratchet lubricant. It straddles the line between oil and grease, right out of the tube, with the consistency of honey. No mixing needed.

 

[autobon7]

I'm tempted to try some Corn Head Grease from John Deere. Really thin 00 I believe. Put it in a leaky gearbox on a Woods brush hog and worked great. Might get some seepage on extremely hot/humid midwest summer days but nothing like the oil leak it had.

 

[Ditchdigger]

I once got so tired of listening to a coworkers dry as a bone Craftsman 1/2" 30 tooth ratchet clanking away that I opened it up and squirted in a blob of grease when he went to the *******.

He came back and after a minute or two was screaming trying to figure out what happened. He didn't like that it was quiet and smooth now. "No, they are supposed to sound like that. That is how you know they are working!" He thought it was broken because it was too smooth

 

[ER70S-2]

I messed up my Craftsman raised panel ratchets by adding too much red love. No biggie, I hate those ratchets anyway.

I'm surprised that you were able to make them worse. Worst POS ratchets ever. They don't even deserve a spot in the backup tool bag, car bag, kitchen drawer, etc. They belong in the trash.

 

[AEAdam]

I once got so tired of listening to a coworkers dry as a bone Craftsman 1/2" 30 tooth ratchet clanking away that I opened it up and squirted in a blob of grease when he went to the *******.

He came back and after a minute or two was screaming trying to figure out what happened. He didn't like that it was quiet and smooth now. "No, they are supposed to sound like that. That is how you know they are working!" He thought it was broken because it was too smooth

Good story!

He was probably right and you were probably wrong. “Smooth” or “quiet” are not attributes of a fine ratchet. Using grease to make a ratchet smooth and quiet could well weaken the tool and accelerate its demise.

 

[PCustoms]

Using grease to make a ratchet smooth and quiet could well weaken the tool and accelerate its demise.

Please explain how/why

 

[Professor Gascan]

I bought a small bottle of 200 cst silicone oil and a needle tip oil bottle. I wanted something thin enough to wick into non serviceable ratchets and ratcheting wrenches and something that is also o ring safe for the ratchets with o ring seals.

As a bonus, it works great to keep car door seals nice and supple.

 

[ChevyEFI]

I once got so tired of listening to . . . . thought it was broken because it was too smooth

Good opportunity to tell him to head to Sears for a kit.

 

[AEAdam]

Please explain how/why

sure. This post on page 1 might help a bit.

Here are some more details:
When we say a ratchet is "quieter", what does that mean? The click we hear is the pawl slamming home against the gear. If you put grease in the gear teeth, that grease dampens the metal on metal clicking sound. In the best case, you are displacing most of the grease in that tooth as the pawl slams home. But the spring pressure, which effects back drag, is often not strong enough to displace 100% of the grease in the teeth. This means the grease that's making the ratchet noticeably quieter is also reducing the contact area between the pawl and the ratchet gear. Those gears are pretty tiny. So even a few thousandths of grease film could be significant. For people using really heavy greases or greases with tackifiers like assembly lubes (RLL etc), the contact patch reduction could be quite significant. With less area, wear would be accelerated and strength would eventually suffer.

"Smooth" is similar to "quiet" in that we aren't feeling the mechanical click because the pawl isn't going home.

I described in a couple posts above what the purpose of the grease is, where it should be applied etc etc.

I have a lot of respect for @Hohn who posted above about using a heavy oil. I am NOT a lubrication expert. Every time we have this discussion, every time I have some new vehicle, I have to refamiliarize myself with the various SAE and NLGI specs.

@Hohn is recommended a heavy oil, and not much of it, probably exactly for the reasons I'm stating here. That 85W oil is almost like a light grease. Its viscosity is somewhere between NLGI 000 and NLGI 00. Note that Snap on ships their tools and rebuild kits with NLGI 00 SuperLube. It's a light duty grease. I have described the rebuild technique I have witnessed and is shown on YouTube, which is consistent with my advice. Gear oil is fine. For my purposes, I just stick with Super Lube. And food safe is a benefit for me. Ever take a break from working quickly wash your hands or wipe them off and have a sandwich? There's a really high chance we have all injected the materials we all use in our workshops and garages. More and more, I've turned to non toxic food safe finishes and materials. But I can't let go of WD-40.

 

[senlow]

For my purposes, I just stick with Super Lube. And food safe is a benefit for me. Ever take a break from working quickly wash your hands or wipe them off and have a sandwich? There's a really high chance we have all injected the materials we all use in our workshops and garages. More and more, I've turned to non toxic food safe finishes and materials. But I can't let go of WD-40.

I prefer to ingest my Super Lube.

 

[CoThG]

I'm surprised that you were able to make them worse. Worst POS ratchets ever. They don't even deserve a spot in the backup tool bag, car bag, kitchen drawer, etc. They belong in the trash.

They make great makeshift hammers...

 

[drokihazan]

It's pretty rare that I have to open and service any of my ratchets, but when I do I use regular old Super Lube and I thin it with a squirt of CRC 3-36. Not because I think it's the best, but because Super Lube works well and I already have it, and because I buy CRC 3-36 by the gallon and use it for everything.

 

[dnschmidt]

I'm tempted to try some Corn Head Grease from John Deere. Really thin 00 I believe. Put it in a leaky gearbox on a Woods brush hog and worked great. Might get some seepage on extremely hot/humid midwest summer days but nothing like the oil leak it had.

This is what I use in my grinder and polisher gear cases. It's thixotropic, meaning it thins with shear forces but reverts to thin grease when not sheared. Doesn't leak as badly as you would think.

 

[Hohn]

sure. This post on page 1 might help a bit.

Here are some more details:
When we say a ratchet is "quieter", what does that mean? The click we hear is the pawl slamming home against the gear. If you put grease in the gear teeth, that grease dampens the metal on metal clicking sound. In the best case, you are displacing most of the grease in that tooth as the pawl slams home. But the spring pressure, which effects back drag, is often not strong enough to displace 100% of the grease in the teeth. This means the grease that's making the ratchet noticeably quieter is also reducing the contact area between the pawl and the ratchet gear. Those gears are pretty tiny. So even a few thousandths of grease film could be significant. For people using really heavy greases or greases with tackifiers like assembly lubes (RLL etc), the contact patch reduction could be quite significant. With less area, wear would be accelerated and strength would eventually suffer.

"Smooth" is similar to "quiet" in that we aren't feeling the mechanical click because the pawl isn't going home.

I described in a couple posts above what the purpose of the grease is, where it should be applied etc etc.

I have a lot of respect for @Hohn who posted above about using a heavy oil. I am NOT a lubrication expert. Every time we have this discussion, every time I have some new vehicle, I have to refamiliarize myself with the various SAE and NLGI specs.

@Hohn is recommended a heavy oil, and not much of it, probably exactly for the reasons I'm stating here. That 85W oil is almost like a light grease. Its viscosity is somewhere between NLGI 000 and NLGI 00. Note that Snap on ships their tools and rebuild kits with NLGI 00 SuperLube. It's a light duty grease. I have described the rebuild technique I have witnessed and is shown on YouTube, which is consistent with my advice. Gear oil is fine. For my purposes, I just stick with Super Lube. And food safe is a benefit for me. Ever take a break from working quickly wash your hands or wipe them off and have a sandwich? There's a really high chance we have all injected the materials we all use in our workshops and garages. More and more, I've turned to non toxic food safe finishes and materials. But I can't let go of WD-40.

Superlube is a fine product and very well suited to ratchet mechanisms, at least if you can find it in the NLGI 00 and 000 grades, which are quite thin. Apply it to a very clean and well-degreased tool per Adam's excellent post on page 1 of this thread.

It's pretty easy to lube a ratchet effectively, but I suppose also easy to screw it up. Heck, even a gun oil works well to lube a ratchet.

I realized on further reflection that while gear oil does have a superb anti-wear and EP additive package, those additives are likely not activated in the low temperatures and stresses of a ratchet application. It's just not severe pressure enough to activate the gear oil's best additives.
So gear oil will work and work well, but not necessarily any better than any number of other lubes.

I think the only clearly inferior lubes would be engine oils because they have so many detergents and such that are not applicable to to the requirements. Note: “clearly inferior” is not necessarily insufficient. Any numbers of lubes are likely to be quite sufficient.

 

[Ohio Andy]

This is why I prefer a thin grease to a thick oil. Sticks better where it needs to, especially in non-liquid-sealed cavities like ratchets.

I just recently found a vendor to sell me some NLGI 00 Super Lube grease which I've been using to great effect as a ratchet lubricant. It straddles the line between oil and grease, right out of the tube, with the consistency of honey. No mixing needed.

I bought a bunch of this as recommended by many companies... Great stuff.

 

[General Geoff]

Any numbers of lubes are likely to be quite sufficient.

As the saying goes, any lube is better than no lube!

 

[dscheidt]

This is what I use in my grinder and polisher gear cases. It's thixotropic, meaning it thins with shear forces but reverts to thin grease when not sheared. Doesn't leak as badly as you would think.

it's commonly used in Land-Rover swivel balls, which enclose the front axle u-joints, which run in an oil bath. They're chromed, and after the chrome gets pitted, the seals get chewed up, and they leak. The factory started using somehting similar at some point.

 

[Kscardsfan]

Because of personal interest, I actually once measured a new ratchet before and after greasing it, using a high-precision torque indicator that measures in Newton-Centimeter. The difference after lubrication was around 0.2 cNm = 0.002 Nm. So it's completely negligible in everyday life.

The fact a German man went to the effort to test these theories is not helping stereotypes any, just saying.

 

[Kscardsfan]

As the saying goes, any lube is better than no lube!

Spit on that thing.

 

[toolenthusiast]

Spit on that thing.

I believe that it’s “thang”, technically

 

[Ohio Andy]

Please explain how/why

I thought he did. not going back to check, but, I thought he specifically said the problem is when you used the wrong lubrication in the wrong spot. A thick grease on the teeth, not the sign for it can prevent things from touching. That should touch and that can put extra stress. Or something like that.

 

[Hohn]

I once got so tired of listening to a coworkers dry as a bone Craftsman 1/2" 30 tooth ratchet clanking away that I opened it up and squirted in a blob of grease when he went to the *******.

He came back and after a minute or two was screaming trying to figure out what happened. He didn't like that it was quiet and smooth now. "No, they are supposed to sound like that. That is how you know they are working!" He thought it was broken because it was too smooth

That's a good way to end up with some missing or damaged tools in your own box.
Never touch another man's tools without permission.

 

[Hohn]

sure. This post on page 1 might help a bit.

Here are some more details:
When we say a ratchet is "quieter", what does that mean? The click we hear is the pawl slamming home against the gear. If you put grease in the gear teeth, that grease dampens the metal on metal clicking sound. In the best case, you are displacing most of the grease in that tooth as the pawl slams home. But the spring pressure, which effects back drag, is often not strong enough to displace 100% of the grease in the teeth. This means the grease that's making the ratchet noticeably quieter is also reducing the contact area between the pawl and the ratchet gear. Those gears are pretty tiny. So even a few thousandths of grease film could be significant. For people using really heavy greases or greases with tackifiers like assembly lubes (RLL etc), the contact patch reduction could be quite significant. With less area, wear would be accelerated and strength would eventually suffer.

"Smooth" is similar to "quiet" in that we aren't feeling the mechanical click because the pawl isn't going home.

I described in a couple posts above what the purpose of the grease is, where it should be applied etc etc.

I have a lot of respect for @Hohn who posted above about using a heavy oil. I am NOT a lubrication expert. Every time we have this discussion, every time I have some new vehicle, I have to refamiliarize myself with the various SAE and NLGI specs.

@Hohn is recommended a heavy oil, and not much of it, probably exactly for the reasons I'm stating here. That 85W oil is almost like a light grease. Its viscosity is somewhere between NLGI 000 and NLGI 00. Note that Snap on ships their tools and rebuild kits with NLGI 00 SuperLube. It's a light duty grease. I have described the rebuild technique I have witnessed and is shown on YouTube, which is consistent with my advice. Gear oil is fine. For my purposes, I just stick with Super Lube. And food safe is a benefit for me. Ever take a break from working quickly wash your hands or wipe them off and have a sandwich? There's a really high chance we have all injected the materials we all use in our workshops and garages. More and more, I've turned to non toxic food safe finishes and materials. But I can't let go of WD-40.

I never got around to replying to this post, but there's some content in it I believe to be mistaken that I'd like to gently rebut for the sake of accuracy.

On the contrary, grease increases the contact area rather than decreases it. Lubricants work (in general) by filling in the micro-asperities in a surface. This is quite significant. Sometime look up the difference between linear distance along the coast of Norway vs the coastline distance. The jagged coastline has a much longer distance.

Likewise, microscopically the surface asperities have much larger area than just the contact of the "high spots" that contact without lubrication. When you add lubrication, you drastically increase the area that is carrying pressure load, which dramatically lowers the load because load (pressure) is Force per unit Area. More area for the same pressure means less force. This is the essence of how lubricants work.

There is no conceivable scenario in which the addition of excess grease will *increase* wear. it may cause functional issues with the pawl not fully returning as fast or as far as you want, but it will not cause wear.

Anyway-- the Lubrication 101 would not be complete without mentioning the Stribeck Curve:



When a ratchet mechanism is loaded, it has essentially zero velocity. The pawl teeth are engaged and therefore the lubrication of the surface is 100% "boundary lubrication." This is where solid lubricant particles (PTFE powder) as well as other EP additives (MOS2, MoDTC) excel.


At zero relative surface velocity, viscosity is irrelevant because anything of finite viscosity is too thin. Any lubricant will be squeezed out under load, leaving only the boundary lubrication of the thin film. This is true of all greases and oils.

Gear oils are actually lower viscosity than engine oils in many cases-- they do not use viscosity to protect the gears, it's all about the extreme pressure (EP) additives. This is what gives gear oil that distinctive odor. Those additives are pressure-activated and provided superior lubrication under boundary lubrication and high load-- as in the contact of gear teeth.

That said, a grease with good EP performance is likely to work well also. While polyurea greases like Lucas XTRA (the green stuff) are superb for rolling-bearing contact (it meets lube for life requirements) it's not ideal for non-rolling applications where sliding contact is the norm.

These days my preferred "Frank's Red Hot" grease is Valvoline Synthetic NLGI #2. I put that stuff on everything. Why? The combination of PTFE and moly gives this grease incredible boundary lubrication performance and doesn't need high temps to achieve it. It also never separates; it's a paste, for all practical purposes.

One of the most counterintuitive things in lubrication as the more oil or grease doesn't mean more lubrication. If there's enough to generate a film in the contact area, there's enough. And more doesn't do anything. That's one reason I've come to prefer the "as little lube as necessary" approach.

The wear seen on the ratchets picturing in Adam's posts have almost everything to do with dirt ingress and almost nothing to do with lack of lubrication. A ratchet that is cleaned inside and regularly lubed-- even with cheap sewing machine oil-- will last nearly forever.

 

[FTG-05]

I'm surprised that you were able to make them worse. Worst POS ratchets ever. They don't even deserve a spot in the backup tool bag, car bag, kitchen drawer, etc. They belong in the trash.

What are "Craftsman raised panel" ratchets and why are they trash?

Except for one 1/2" Icon G2 ratchet, all my ratchets (6-7) are Craftsman; bought back when Sears and Craftsman were still good (i.e. +35 years ago).

 

[Hohn]

What are "Craftsman raised panel" ratchets and why are they trash?

Except for one 1/2" Icon G2 ratchet, all my ratchets (6-7) are Craftsman; bought back when Sears and Craftsman were still good (i.e. +35 years ago).

I had many of these that were not good.


I believe these are the raised panels, and they aren't good. This was 1990s and beginning of the end, IMO.

 

[M.Jay]

The fact a German man went to the effort to test these theories is not helping stereotypes any, just saying.

Don't get me started about that one time I dissembled a dozen ratchets to take photos of the internal mechanism and measure backdrag. Everyone thought I was nuts. This is why I am here now.

I never got around to replying to this post, but there's some content in it I believe to be mistaken that I'd like to gently rebut for the sake of accuracy.

On the contrary, grease increases the contact area rather than decreases it. Lubricants work (in general) by filling in the micro-asperities in a surface. This is quite significant. Sometime look up the difference between linear distance along the coast of Norway vs the coastline distance. The jagged coastline has a much longer distance.

Likewise, microscopically the surface asperities have much larger area than just the contact of the "high spots" that contact without lubrication. When you add lubrication, you drastically increase the area that is carrying pressure load, which dramatically lowers the load because load (pressure) is Force per unit Area. More area for the same pressure means less force. This is the essence of how lubricants work.

There is no conceivable scenario in which the addition of excess grease will *increase* wear. it may cause functional issues with the pawl not fully returning as fast or as far as you want, but it will not cause wear.

Anyway-- the Lubrication 101 would not be complete without mentioning the Stribeck Curve:



When a ratchet mechanism is loaded, it has essentially zero velocity. The pawl teeth are engaged and therefore the lubrication of the surface is 100% "boundary lubrication." This is where solid lubricant particles (PTFE powder) as well as other EP additives (MOS2, MoDTC) excel.


At zero relative surface velocity, viscosity is irrelevant because anything of finite viscosity is too thin. Any lubricant will be squeezed out under load, leaving only the boundary lubrication of the thin film. This is true of all greases and oils.

Gear oils are actually lower viscosity than engine oils in many cases-- they do not use viscosity to protect the gears, it's all about the extreme pressure (EP) additives. This is what gives gear oil that distinctive odor. Those additives are pressure-activated and provided superior lubrication under boundary lubrication and high load-- as in the contact of gear teeth.

That said, a grease with good EP performance is likely to work well also. While polyurea greases like Lucas XTRA (the green stuff) are superb for rolling-bearing contact (it meets lube for life requirements) it's not ideal for non-rolling applications where sliding contact is the norm.

These days my preferred "Frank's Red Hot" grease is Valvoline Synthetic NLGI #2. I put that stuff on everything. Why? The combination of PTFE and moly gives this grease incredible boundary lubrication performance and doesn't need high temps to achieve it. It also never separates; it's a paste, for all practical purposes.

One of the most counterintuitive things in lubrication as the more oil or grease doesn't mean more lubrication. If there's enough to generate a film in the contact area, there's enough. And more doesn't do anything. That's one reason I've come to prefer the "as little lube as necessary" approach.

The wear seen on the ratchets picturing in Adam's posts have almost everything to do with dirt ingress and almost nothing to do with lack of lubrication. A ratchet that is cleaned inside and regularly lubed-- even with cheap sewing machine oil-- will last nearly forever.

Awesome post, this is why I love this forum! Where else can you have a discussion about ratchet lubrication and people start rolling out physical formulars?

 

[ecotec]

I know that 00 SuperLube comes with Snap-on rebuild kits, but my ratchets do fine with regular tubes of SuperLube. Maybe 1 in 20 ratchets start slipping from too much grease. If they slip, I take some of the grease out and they are fine.

I have cleaned and greased the vast majority of my vintage ratchets, and have greased the vast majority of the ratchets that I bought new.

 

[David99]

I had many of these that were not good.

I bought my first tool set in 1984 or early 85 and the ratchets were all that style (Tri-wing) and they are still kicking, the 3/8 is probably the most used and still the one I grab for oil changes (am I sub-consciously protecting my nicer Snap-on & other ratchets or is it just what I've always used?) and the only care they've had is maybe some oil dropped in.

 

[AEAdam]

On the contrary, grease increases the contact area rather than decreases it. ....The pawl teeth are engaged and therefore the lubrication of the surface is 100% "boundary lubrication." This is where solid lubricant particles (PTFE powder) as well as other EP additives (MOS2, MoDTC) excel.

Reminder I am not a grease guy.

Here's how I think about it. When we smear grease into a ratchets gear, then pack grease in around it such that the ratchet no longer makes a clicking sound, I think the grease is preventing the pawl from going home. Plain and simple.

If I thought about it, I would say the pawl springs are typically at their weakest in the home position. As you push the pawl out of the gear, the spring force increases (with back drag). I doubt the spring in its home position is exerting enough force to displace thick grease. This is why manufacturers probably suggest thinner greases.

Less pawl engagement means higher stress, means lower strength and greater wear. And on fine toothed ratchets, that contact patch is pretty tiny, so .005" of grease "interference" could be a significant % loss of the contact area.

HEY: time for an engineering joke (in a thread full of engineers).

4 Engineers are taking a road trip in a rental car when the car breaks down. Each of the 4 engineers, in this cross functional team takes a crack at diagnosing the problem and coming up with solutions:

1. (because every good engineering joke needs an ordered list) The Mechanical Engineer says the issue is with the fuel pump. Obviously the bearings have over heated and seized, robbing the engine of fuel. We should wait until they cool down, then we can restart the car and continue our journey
2. The electrical engineer suggests moisture could have gotten into a wiring harness creating a short which has fed the ECU bad information. We should disconnect all the engine harness connectors that feed data to the ECU.
3. The aerodynamicist suggests its cavitation in the fuel manifold and that if we abraded the inner surfaces of the manifold, we could trip the boundary layer and improve fuel flow.
4. The Computer Engineers says, "I have no idea why the car isn't working, but let's all get out, shut the doors, then get back in".

 

[M.Jay]

Here's how I think about it. When we smear grease into a ratchets gear, then pack grease in around it such that the ratchet no longer makes a clicking sound, I think the grease is preventing the pawl from going home. Plain and simple.

I believe that's the biggest misconception many people make when it comes to applying grease. A ratchet isn't a ball bearing, it doesn't need to be packed with grease. Just a thin coat on all moving parts is enough.

If I thought about it, I would say the pawl springs are typically at their weakest in the home position. As you push the pawl out of the gear, the spring force increases (with back drag). I doubt the spring in its home position is exerting enough force to displace thick grease. This is why manufacturers probably suggest thinner greases.

I don't think the spring is the real problem as long as the gear teeth are still able to engage. Once that happens the pawl will be wedged between the gear and the head and excess grease will be squeezed out. But of course, if the ratchet is packed to the brim and there is no space left to go for the grease, problems will occur.

HEY: time for an engineering joke (in a thread full of engineers).

Just being a lousy bike mechanic, I feel honoured.

 

[AEAdam]

I don't think the spring is the real problem as long as the gear teeth are still able to engage. Once that happens the pawl will be wedged between the gear and the head and excess grease will be squeezed out. But of course, if the ratchet is packed to the brim and there is no space left to go for the grease, problems will occur.

Asking (anyone): I don't think there's anything about the geometry of our ratchets that forces the pawl in toward the center of the main gear besides the pawl spring is there?

If you don't have a pawl spring or if grit, grime, or something soft like grease is stopping the pawl from going fully home, no amount of load on the gear will change that relationship, correct?

 

[Hohn]

Reminder I am not a grease guy.

Here's how I think about it. When we smear grease into a ratchets gear, then pack grease in around it such that the ratchet no longer makes a clicking sound, I think the grease is preventing the pawl from going home. Plain and simple.

If I thought about it, I would say the pawl springs are typically at their weakest in the home position. As you push the pawl out of the gear, the spring force increases (with back drag). I doubt the spring in its home position is exerting enough force to displace thick grease. This is why manufacturers probably suggest thinner greases.

Less pawl engagement means higher stress, means lower strength and greater wear. And on fine toothed ratchets, that contact patch is pretty tiny, so .005" of grease "interference" could be a significant % loss of the contact area.

HEY: time for an engineering joke (in a thread full of engineers).

4 Engineers are taking a road trip in a rental car when the car breaks down. Each of the 4 engineers, in this cross functional team takes a crack at diagnosing the problem and coming up with solutions:

1. (because every good engineering joke needs an ordered list) The Mechanical Engineer says the issue is with the fuel pump. Obviously the bearings have over heated and seized, robbing the engine of fuel. We should wait until they cool down, then we can restart the car and continue our journey
2. The electrical engineer suggests moisture could have gotten into a wiring harness creating a short which has fed the ECU bad information. We should disconnect all the engine harness connectors that feed data to the ECU.
3. The aerodynamicist suggests its cavitation in the fuel manifold and that if we abraded the inner surfaces of the manifold, we could trip the boundary layer and improve fuel flow.
4. The Computer Engineers says, "I have no idea why the car isn't working, but let's all get out, shut the doors, then get back in".

Pawls are self-engaging once contact is initiated. The spring is only there to get the pawl to initially engage. Once engaged, the mechanism forces the pawl into harder and harder contact proportional to applied torque.

So either the pawls don't engage at all because the spring wasn't strong enough to initiate the snowball effect, or it catches.
If the lubricant viscosity is too thick, the ratchet will "skip" briefly until the spring has returned the pawl sufficiently far to create engagement. With sufficiently high viscosity, it's possible the springs are too weak to create the initial engagement.

So you are correct that the returns springs are their lowest force ("weakest") in the home position. But that's because the engagement force of the pawls is not depending on that spring strength at all.

This is all partly why I prefer a thin film of EP-laden gear lube. No need to worry about over-packing or such. Even a super thin film works quite well. No separation, no leaking out.
I think the Superlube ISO 100 might be the "perfect" ratchet lube.
If you have a premium PAO- based air compressor oil that would be awesome, too.