Markers of quality

[Etchase]

Without debating the details, or methodology of this video, it does bring into question a lot of commonly held views on tool buying.

Price, country of origin, you get what you pay for, race to the bottom, special steel, special heat treating, buy once cry once… really don’t explain these results.

Tools seem to be better than ever before, and modern manufacturing allows the production of awesome tools at very low cost. I was shocked at what it took to damage the edges, and the extraordinary force it took to break these things. It also seems rare that you buy pliers that you have to run lapping compound thru for an evening to get them to function properly.

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

Different designs have different trade offs which make them better at their intended purposes at the expense of others.

Models tested include a mix of normal high leverage, and advanced virtual pivot designs. Not comparing apples with apples.

Knipex, Gedore, and Snap On at the bottom of the results table. Even without considering price. That's an alarm bell about the test design.

I'm sure many of the top plier brands could make a plier to win this test, but users would probably hate it.

 

[gatewaysysop]

Different designs have different trade offs which make them better at their intended purposes at the expense of others.

Models tested include a mix of normal high leverage, and advanced virtual pivot designs. Not comparing apples with apples.

Knipex, Gedore, and Snap On at the bottom of the results table. Even without considering price. That's an alarm bell about the test design.

Agreed. Hard to take that seriously.

 

[kudakev615]

glad he tested/demonstrated how stiff SO pliers are to open and close. ive been saying this for years and ppl have just told me "you have to wear them in". pretty much only SO pliers i use daily are slip joints that dont have this issue and my pair of side cutters like the one tested in the vid b/c they are broken in.

 

[zendriver]

Didn't watch the whole thing, but the Snap On looked the crappiest of any of them.

Years ago, I purchased a set of Pittsburg long reach pliers, (when they were sold in a set of three). I think I paid $10 bucks at the time.
They might be some of the best specialty needle nose pliers I've ever used. Solid and the teeth hold up great. They are two for $10 today. Not sure if the Icons are much better.

On the Op's point maybe it's just me, but it seems now days, making a low quality and a good quality pair of pliers, takes more or less, about the same amount of effort.

 

[j3rf]

I would say it depends on what job you need the cutters for.

Knipex if you definitely need to cut through an L-shaped hex key for some reason.

 

[neophyte]

glad he tested/demonstrated how stiff SO pliers are to open and close. ive been saying this for years and ppl have just told me "you have to wear them in". pretty much only SO pliers i use daily are slip joints that dont have this issue and my pair of side cutters like the one tested in the vid b/c they are broken in.

Crescent pliers used to be like this as well, and dome Channellock pliers I have owned.
The same goes for Facom.
Most of my Knipex pliers have been fairly good out of the box as far as free movement at the rivet.
As far as opening and closing pliers to “loosen” the joint, sometimes it takes 1000 full opening and closing actions, and a bit of oil, or oil, then cleaning the joint with a solvent, then re-oiling.
A tight rivet is annoying, but still usually better than a loose rivet on cheap pliers. (Quinn)
The Icon long pistol grip pliers have faitly tight rivers that have not really loosened up for me, although the rivet is loose enough for the “expected” opening and closing distances based on the springs.

 

[neophyte]

Different designs have different trade offs which make them better at their intended purposes at the expense of others.

Models tested include a mix of normal high leverage, and advanced virtual pivot designs. Not comparing apples with apples.

Knipex, Gedore, and Snap On at the bottom of the results table. Even without considering price. That's an alarm bell about the test design.

I'm sure many of the top plier brands could make a plier to win this test, but users would probably hate it.

Knipex just came out with a newer high leverage design, with a pivot point modified for even higher leverage than the older “high leverage cutter designs”.

I have no clue whether these would be as durable, although Knipex does seem to have a decent handing on optimal overall hardnessing of tools.
I’m not sure about the particular Knopex design ProjectFarm guy tested in the recent video, but “high leverage” plier and cutter designs using the single pivot aren’t exactly new, and likely go back 50 years or more judging from older US brands, so maybe the Knipex version was just the “classic” high leverage design Knipex has been making for decades that needed a bit of an upgrade.
The Channellock cutters were the “newer” Channellock design that Channellock introduced within the past couple decades with other model updates thru out their lineup.
Despite people complaining about Channellock, I would argue the Channellock should possibly have been first in the rankings other than failure on the hex key, which only Knipex survived, despite coming in close to the bottom on the other tests.
Knipex should probably have been higher, dimply for surviving.

 

[willf650]

His test seemed a little off but not horrible. The Channelock pliers were an inch longer than the rest and the Snapon were some type of angled jaw. i would assume Snapon makes a more conventional jaw style that would be more comparable.

This test basically told me to stick with Channelocks or Klein.

I don’t know how the open the jaws width has anything to do with leverage. The pivot location in relation to the jaw makes more sense but that’s not what he was measuring. I guess maybe that's what he was trying to do in a roundabout way.

 

[AEAdam]

People legitimately want to know what tools to buy and they look to the internet to provide answers.

Somewhere in his journey, PF stopped trying to help people pick tools and instead started making irrelevant videos that get clicks due to their “unexpected” results.

Such videos help PF’s bank account only. We aren't learning anything about who makes the best pliers, or the capabilities of offshore manufacturing. Why would anyone test grips to failure? All of those pliers failed far above any semblance of normal use.

My sense is, if you want long wearing edges to cut softer materials, you want hard edges. If you are cutting hardened steels, that will lead to brittle fractures, so you need bigger softer edges.

End of the day, there’s a cynicism to PF’s videos that really rubs me the wrong way. Just like the guy from Royal Auto, they have figured out that earnest doesn’t sell. Drama and controversy sells. These are smart guys. And they know what they are posting is ****. But they do it anyway and probably tell themselves is just entertainment.

 

[zendriver]

People legitimately want to know what tools to buy and they look to the internet to provide answers.

Somewhere in his journey, PF stopped trying to help people pick tools and instead started making irrelevant videos that get clicks due to their “unexpected” results.

Such videos help PF’s bank account only. We aren't learning anything about who makes the best pliers, or the capabilities of offshore manufacturing. Why would anyone test grips to failure? All of those pliers failed far above any semblance of normal use.

My sense is, if you want long wearing edges to cut softer materials, you want hard edges. If you are cutting hardened steels, that will lead to brittle fractures, so you need bigger softer edges.

End of the day, there’s a cynicism to PF’s videos that really rubs me the wrong way. Just like the guy from Royal Auto, they have figured out that earnest doesn’t sell. Drama and controversy sells. These are smart guys. And they know what they are posting is ****. But they do it anyway and probably tell themselves is just entertainment.

Looks like they showed every comparison test measurement between the pliers brands.

"drama" aside, do you feel the test results were actually rigged, or do you just not like their findings?

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

These are smart guys. And they know what they are posting is ****. But they do it anyway and probably tell themselves is just entertainment.

My impression was that he's trying his best. It's at least plausible that he is.

 

[mike93lx]

Agreed. Hard to take that seriously.

So the same as all of his videos?

 

[WhataTool]

Flush cut pliers included with pliers of different lengths when force was measured at the handles, cutting something the 1st time so measuring how sharp of an angle they decided to grind in rather than how it performs on cut #100 of something people might actually use these for.
This group of tools is one PF got flack for how he tested years ago, good to see that current day PF is if anything just doing the same stuff but more click baity now.
If you look at how these are tested is ASTM its a whole lot of none of this

 

[AEAdam]

Looks like they showed every comparison test measurement between the pliers brands.

"drama" aside, do you feel the test results were actually rigged, or do you just not like their findings?

wow. reading comprehension. No, not rigged. No, not unhappy with the results. Did you read my post or just want to hate?

Tests were done that have NOTHING whatsoever to do with real world usage, meaning, they are irrelevant to people looking to pick pliers. And that's fairly typical for this individual, but he is by no means unique.

There is now a career opportunity for people to become "content creators". Great, they are traveling through the islands of Japan. I'm good with that. But when the content is technical and they have spent zero time using the product, are not expert users, their opinions and BS tests mean less than nothing to me. Who the F cares if it takes 273lbs to break a pliers handles or 313? None of us can generate that much force. And that measurement has no bearing on the quality of the tool, or the material it's made out of.

The culmination of these vapid YouTube videos are the "unboxing videos". For the love of all that's holy, we are paying people to film themselves opening packaging and talk about the packaging and their thoughtless first impressions of the products.

I recently watched a car review where the reviewer talked about the shiny "piano black" plastics showing finger prints. Is that something we need him to tell us about a car?

 

[AEAdam]

My impression was that he's trying his best. It's at least plausible that he is.

He's trying his best to make himself money. These videos have nothing whatsoever to do with us or pliers. It's all about attracting eyeballs to sell ads. It's just like the fake arguments on TV news. The goal is to **** us into the drama so they can get us to watch their ads. And they all do it.

Once upon a time, news was actually news. And there once were real tradesmen talking about their tools and providing real helpful information.

 

[WhataTool]

Fully agree. Also though, my last car had piano black all around the gear selector and infotainment... and never again

 

[WhataTool]

It's all about attracting eyeballs to sell ads.

I would argue it's another step further and also about Amazon link income, the number of tools included on that channel that aren't from amazon are few and the last time a tool from a tool truck won was.... pretty much never? Not to say tool truck tools are all the best, but you'd think simply as an odds game or at least on tools generally regarded to perform the best by folks who dont even like Snap-On like their torx or flarenut wrenches you'd see some at the top every once in awhile.

 

[AEAdam]

I would argue it's another step further and also about Amazon link income, the number of tools included on that channel that aren't from amazon are few and the last time a tool from a tool truck won was.... pretty much never? Not to say tool truck tools are all the best, but you'd think simply as an odds game or at least on tools generally regarded to perform the best by folks who dont even like Snap-On like their torx or flarenut wrenches you'd see some at the top every once in awhile.

Scary. That's a scary add to this.

 

[dnschmidt]

How many nails, screws, drill bits and hex keys does anybody cut through with diagonal pliers? Do any of these tests reflect how these tools are typically used which is for cutting wire. When I need to cut such things I use an angle grinder with a cut off wheel not diagonal pliers. I love Todd but he does go off on tangents from time to time.

 

[Dave455]

What a steaming pile of s##t that video was!

We’re dealing with wire cutters here. Even though some manufacturers just market them as “cutters”, that doesn’t change nature of the tool.

Use them on copper electrical wire. Use them on locking wire. Use them on piano wire if they are so rated. And we all use them on cable ties.

But they’re not for cutting nails, screws, or hex keys for goodness sake! That bears no relation to their functionality when used correctly. You might as well rate ratchet handles by how well they bang in nails!

 

[neophyte]

People legitimately want to know what tools to buy and they look to the internet to provide answers.

Somewhere in his journey, PF stopped trying to help people pick tools and instead started making irrelevant videos that get clicks due to their “unexpected” results.

Such videos help PF’s bank account only. We aren't learning anything about who makes the best pliers, or the capabilities of offshore manufacturing. Why would anyone test grips to failure? All of those pliers failed far above any semblance of normal use.

My sense is, if you want long wearing edges to cut softer materials, you want hard edges. If you are cutting hardened steels, that will lead to brittle fractures, so you need bigger softer edges.

End of the day, there’s a cynicism to PF’s videos that really rubs me the wrong way. Just like the guy from Royal Auto, they have figured out that earnest doesn’t sell. Drama and controversy sells. These are smart guys. And they know what they are posting is ****. But they do it anyway and probably tell themselves is just entertainment.

The Knipex cutters were the most durable, and survived “abusive use.
If you fo construction work in old buildings were you may wind ip needing to cut any weird **** you may randomly come across, (hardened masonry nails?), buying the Knipex may save having yo buy replacement cutters for ones were the jaws get damaged or the cutters break.

The Knipex require more force to use, so also may not be best if you have a younger or weaker person using the cutters.

As far as the “Unexpected Results” tagline, that’s youtube, and advertising in general.

 

[neophyte]

How many nails, screws, drill bits and hex keys does anybody cut through with diagonal pliers? Do any of these tests reflect how these tools are typically used which is for cutting wire. When I need to cut such things I use an angle grinder with a cut off wheel not diagonal pliers. I love Todd but he does go off on tangents from time to time.

Angle grinders create sparks, and have a blade that spins in circles.
This is dangerous to use in areas near flammable materials or gasses, as well as near stuff that could get caught in the wheel.
An oscillating tool with a fine tooth carbide blade, or just a hacksaw blade would be safer.
If you check thru one of the old H.K. Porter catalogs over on Archive the number of different types of Bolt and other cutters that were available back when angle grinders were way more expensive, and less available, is staggering, with everything from flush end bolt cutters, to diagonal bolt cutters, and straight cutters, with jaws made for different material hardnesses, and cutters made for plate steel strapping, and even carbide jawed cutters.

 

[Steel_Rain]

What a steaming pile of s##t that video was!

We’re dealing with wire cutters here. Even though some manufacturers just market them as “cutters”, that doesn’t change nature of the tool.

Use them on copper electrical wire. Use them on locking wire. Use them on piano wire if they are so rated. And we all use them on cable ties.

But they’re not for cutting nails, screws, or hex keys for goodness sake! That bears no relation to their functionality when used correctly. You might as well rate ratchet handles by how well they bang in nails!

Damn Dave! That got your feathers ruffled! I laughed out loud when I saw this, your usually a lot more reserved.

 

[zendriver]

wow. reading comprehension. No, not rigged. No, not unhappy with the results. Did you read my post or just want to hate?

Don't be surprised and I did. What did you mean by PF "just wanting clicks and making money"? That is a basic goal of almost anyone who produces Internet content.

Tests were done that have NOTHING whatsoever to do with real world usage, meaning, they are irrelevant to people looking to pick pliers. And that's fairly typical for this individual, but he is by no means unique.

It's basic, controlled functionality tests of similar competing products. Would sending a dozen pair pliers out to a "real world user" be free of bias? Doesn't seem to work that way.

There is now a career opportunity for people to become "content creators". Great, they are traveling through the islands of Japan. I'm good with that. But when the content is technical and they have spent zero time using the product, are not expert users, their opinions and BS tests mean less than nothing to me. Who the F cares if it takes 273lbs to break a pliers handles or 313? None of us can generate that much force. And that measurement has no bearing on the quality of the tool, or the material it's made out of.

Just me but it looks like PF does a fair amount of set up work beforehand, to do comparisons tests on products.

The culmination of these vapid YouTube videos are the "unboxing videos". For the love of all that's holy, we are paying people to film themselves opening packaging and talk about the packaging and their thoughtless first impressions of the products.

Don't watch them?

I recently watched a car review where the reviewer talked about the shiny "piano black" plastics showing finger prints. Is that something we need him to tell us about a car?

Do you like seeing noticeable fingerprints on black plastic, in an automobile? That seems like something competent auto designers would try to avoid.

None of it matters anyway. buy a pair of pliers, if you don't like them or they don't perform get something else. That's how it was done before the Internet.

 

[AEAdam]

What a steaming pile of s##t that video was!

We’re dealing with wire cutters here. Even though some manufacturers just market them as “cutters”, that doesn’t change nature of the tool.

Use them on copper electrical wire. Use them on locking wire. Use them on piano wire if they are so rated. And we all use them on cable ties.

But they’re not for cutting nails, screws, or hex keys for goodness sake! That bears no relation to their functionality when used correctly. You might as well rate ratchet handles by how well they bang in nails!

100%

So, I would say, were I reviewing cutters, I'd review:

1. Price of course
2. Ease of warranty replacement, if the written policy allowed replacement due to wear (I think Kleins does not) or if there's a clause about "for the working life of the tool" (pretty sure Klein has that too).
3. grip materials, shapes, comfort, with gloves, without gloves, with nitrile gloves, do they pinch
4. How flush is flush?
5. How much force to cut 12ga copper? Some might do that easier for different reasons
6. angled jaws, why that's helpful, when its not
7. Putting them nose down into a tool bag and pulling them back out. Any design features that impact basic retrievability?
8. Identifying them by their handles when store in a tool pouch? (Ex. all Snap on & Knipex stuff looks the same. Klein tends to have different handle colors, making finding the pair you want easier)

Off the top of my head, this would be a valuable review for people looking to buy.

For @neophyte, thanks for remembering what I'm up to. If it were me reviewing, I'd talk about "other" uses. I absolutely use my Channellock angled nose dikes for pulling nails, staples new and old. Some Electricians use their dikes as strippers, as hammers, as lock ring wrenches/punches. I'd try to note what pros do with their dikes. For automotive, can they fit in small spaces?

This is what tool reviews need to look like. Tool manufacturers are not tool use experts. Nor are the overwhelming majority of their customers. So there are popular tools that sell well that aren't worth a damn because the owners don't know any better. In woodworking, there are many handsaws and chisels that fit that description.

 

[AEAdam]

Don't be surprised and I did. What did you mean by PF "just wanting clicks and making money"? That is a basic goal of almost anyone who produces Internet content.

It's basic, controlled functionality tests of similar competing products. Would sending a dozen pair pliers out to a "real world user" be free of bias? Doesn't seem to work that way.

Just me but it looks like PF does a fair amount of set up work beforehand, to do comparisons tests on products.


Don't watch them?

Do you like seeing noticeable fingerprints on black plastic, in an automobile? That seems like something competent auto designers would try to avoid.

None of it matters anyway. buy a pair of pliers, if you don't like them or they don't perform get something else. That's how it was done before the Internet.

You and I are from different planets. So you liked the review and are inclined to buy the pliers he rated as top in cutting deck screws? Or you want pliers you can put in a hydraulic press to cut stuff? That made sense to you? Or, and be honest, is it the case that whatever I write you disagree with for sport? This is how you entertain yourself?

FWIW, I have Craftsman, Knipex, Channellock, and Snap on diagonals. Side by side the Snap on look to be the best quality. Fit and finish wise, they are outstanding. They are sharp and cut flush. Handles are wide and comfortable to use. And they feel rock solid, have no flex. Subjectively, between Snap on and Knipex its no contest. The Snappies are that nice.

To be 100% honest, for the rough sorts of things we do with diagonals, apart from automotive, I reach for my Kleins or Channellocks first. My black handled Craftsman dikes never really cut that well, maybe just because they are smaller, but despite a lot of use, have never really worn either. I had a full set of those. I think some were marked FRANCE but I could be mistaken. All of them are still kicking around, some in my F150. I've been using diagonals for probably 40 years and I've never once tried to cut thru a deck screw with one, so maybe that has something to do with their longevity.

More truth: I had an insulated set of Knipex I ruined a few months ago cutting through a hot wire. For electrical, I think you need a certain level of quality, but not crazy expensive because stuff like that happens. And all dikes wear and really should be replaced. I would never choose an Amazon brand that I thought wouldn't be available when I needed a replacement. Hard to beat Kleins for electrical because they are nearly always there where you buy electrical supplies. Good quality and conveniently available.

 

[tarbellb]

While some of his test are always a bit strange

there is a very real world (basically every single residential construction site) where pliers are being used and abused from task they weren't specifically made for

The ability to cut cut something incredibly hard has merit, repeatedly would be even better

 

[Gmonkee]

I judge by quality of material, ability to do promised task and long-term durability.
Ease of service plays in.

If a tool meets all those criteria, sure it's a good tool.
The disclaimer is relative to my needs. That is what differs for all of us. What YT personality can even hope to appeal to brand purists with endless money and the common slob on a budget? Someone will be offended by something.

I get by on used stuff, base consumer grade tools for 90% of my needs. I will be too old to use most before they wear out now.

If Todd or John Maleki can do a review or comparison test that reveals a fatal flaw in a new item, or demonstrate that it really isn't heads above common, more affordable stuff that's useful information. Saved us from wasting money.

A YT tree service guy uses Echo saws in professional settings. 0MG, it's not Stihl or Husqvarna?
They work, they last long term. They have a good service center near him. Win.
We get to see that in action, on a job and decide.

 

[neophyte]

You and I are from different planets. So you liked the review and are inclined to buy the pliers he rated as top in cutting deck screws? Or you want pliers you can put in a hydraulic press to cut stuff? That made sense to you? Or, and be honest, is it the case that whatever I write you disagree with for sport? This is how you entertain yourself?

FWIW, I have Craftsman, Knipex, Channellock, and Snap on diagonals. Side by side the Snap on look to be the best quality. Fit and finish wise, they are outstanding. They are sharp and cut flush. Handles are wide and comfortable to use. And they feel rock solid, have no flex. Subjectively, between Snap on and Knipex its no contest. The Snappies are that nice.

To be 100% honest, for the rough sorts of things we do with diagonals, apart from automotive, I reach for my Kleins or Channellocks first. My black handled Craftsman dikes never really cut that well, maybe just because they are smaller, but despite a lot of use, have never really worn either. I had a full set of those. I think some were marked FRANCE but I could be mistaken. All of them are still kicking around, some in my F150. I've been using diagonals for probably 40 years and I've never once tried to cut thru a deck screw with one, so maybe that has something to do with their longevity.

More truth: I had an insulated set of Knipex I ruined a few months ago cutting through a hot wire. For electrical, I think you need a certain level of quality, but not crazy expensive because stuff like that happens. And all dikes wear and really should be replaced. I would never choose an Amazon brand that I thought wouldn't be available when I needed a replacement. Hard to beat Kleins for electrical because they are nearly always there where you buy electrical supplies. Good quality and conveniently available.

Craftsman pliers marked “France” would have been made by Facom/Bost, back when Craftsman was sourcing dome tools from SK, since SK for a couple decades was owned by Facom who branded the tools as SK-Facom, and who supplied higher end tool models fir the Craftsman Professional branding, even after most Craftsman tools switched to Danaher production.
Facom and Snap-On if I’m not mistaken both use a cold forging process for their pliers, or at least the Facom/Bost produced ones, which not all the pliers were.

 

[dnschmidt]

To me the best diagonal cutters ever are the NWS Fantastico and I was surprised he didn't include these considering their reputation.

 

[zendriver]

You and I are from different planets. So you liked the review and are inclined to buy the pliers he rated as top in cutting deck screws? Or you want pliers you can put in a hydraulic press to cut stuff? That made sense to you? Or, and be honest, is it the case that whatever I write you disagree with for sport? This is how you entertain yourself?

Indeed, we are. I have zero interest in ever even googling "what are the best pliers made?" or even searching a mostly pointless video like the OP linked, which is the only reason I even watched half of it. Half of the brands I've never heard of.

I'd just buy something form HF, if if it might not be the "best in the world".

FWIW, I have Craftsman, Knipex, Channellock, and Snap on diagonals. Side by side the Snap on look to be the best quality. Fit and finish wise, they are outstanding. They are sharp and cut flush. Handles are wide and comfortable to use. And they feel rock solid, have no flex. Subjectively, between Snap on and Knipex its no contest. The Snappies are that nice.

I have some pairs of Cman and Knipex brand pliers I like just fine and I'm with you you if you like the other ones.

To be 100% honest, for the rough sorts of things we do with diagonals, apart from automotive, I reach for my Kleins or Channellocks first. My black handled Craftsman dikes never really cut that well, maybe just because they are smaller, but despite a lot of use, have never really worn either. I had a full set of those. I think some were marked FRANCE but I could be mistaken. All of them are still kicking around, some in my F150. I've been using diagonals for probably 40 years and I've never once tried to cut thru a deck screw with one, so maybe that has something to do with their longevity.

To, me they are pliers. If I thought they sucked or didn't perform I'd get something else. Most people probably thinks the same way. I'd never have a half dozen pairs of diag cut pliers, "just because".

More truth: I had an insulated set of Knipex I ruined a few months ago cutting through a hot wire. For electrical, I think you need a certain level of quality, but not crazy expensive because stuff like that happens. And all dikes wear and really should be replaced. I would never choose an Amazon brand that I thought wouldn't be available when I needed a replacement. Hard to beat Kleins for electrical because they are nearly always there where you buy electrical supplies. Good quality and conveniently available.

All good.

 

[sk farmer]

man..... lots of hate in here.


i may not agree with all of the tests he does but the fact is that he does actually test them and test them in a variety of ways. the videos seem to prove that. even if you don't like some of his results the numbers are still there. throw out the tests you don't like and use those numbers to rank them or use some of his results and then test a couple you like to come up with what you like best.

if you don't like his results do you own test and publish them.

do we still have that member ignore feature? it seems like it may be useful.

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

My impression was that he's trying his best. It's at least plausible that he is.

He's trying his best to make himself money.

I'm not defending him.

My hypothesis is that he isn't smart enough to do a more relevant test, appreciate nuances, or understand trade offs.

 

[neophyte]

It should be remembered ergonomics is subjective, and individualized, and can cary greatly with the conditions the tools are being used in, along with hand size, hand pudginess, hand strength, and whether a person is left or right handed. (The former series of Facom pliers was made for right handed use).

As far as complaints about cutting nails, they’re standard wire nails.
Wire nails are fairly soft mold steel, designed for ductility for fastening wood, with the only “hardness” being a bit of cold deformation, in the nail forming process.
The only “tough” part about cutting nails would be the diameter of the wire.
US made wire cutters, and US brands don’t even usually list diameter and hardness specifications for wire cutters, instead referring to some federal specification 99.9%+ of buyers would have no knowledge of.
Basic “Diagonal Cutters” which the average person just would call “Wire Cutters” should be able to cut, and pull wire nails, since both are routinely used for such in basic building use.
They should also be able to cut nail gun nails, however nail gun nails tend to be a harder material, with sharper pointy or square edges, which are more likely to damage wire cutter edges.
Snap-On doesn’t even list cutting capacity on their website for their cutters.
Knipex does, which is one of the reasons I started buying Knipex cutters years ago.
Channellock doesn’t list capacity either, although it is nice to know the cutters can likely keep up, mostly.
Klein has their “2000” series cutters, supposedly for cutting “cut ACSR, screws, nails, and most hardened wires”.
Does this mean the “regular” Klein cutters will get damaged by “hardened wires”?
If you don’t tell the customer actual specs you can't expect the customer to know actual use criteria.
Even the various shop teachers I had couldn’t give me accurate information in most cases, other than stupid **** like “they’re wire cutters”.
“Flush cutting” and “Semi Flush Cutting” wire cutters used to almost always be specified for “soft wire”, usually meaning copper, brass, non-ferrous, etc.
Meanwhile, Carpenters and Farrier Nippers were routinely bring made in Semi-Flush, or even “Flush Cutting” designs.
Cable cutters for wire rope are also routinely specified as “Flush Cutting” and even for wire cutting, even sometimes up to “Piano Wire”.
(The cuts are usually actually slightly angled, but close to 90 degrees).

 

[zendriver]

Maybe the "sour grapes" are from the top costly brands not performing spectacular, compared to the lower cost pieces.

The metal finish on the Snap On a real turn off jagged steel edges and what looks like pits in the metal.

 

[neophyte]

I'm not defending him.

My hypothesis is that he isn't smart enough to do a more relevant test, appreciate nuances, or understand trade offs.

He includes his test data.
If you need an easier pair of cutters to use to cut a material, you can probably use his test data to make a safe bet.
If you need to cut hardened springs, and don’t mind slipping pipes on your cutter handles for extra leverage, then buy the Knipex, and cut away.

 

[zendriver]

Based on the tests, they most all looked like they would work fine in normal use.

 

[AEAdam]

I'm not defending him.

My hypothesis is that he isn't smart enough to do a more relevant test, appreciate nuances, or understand trade offs.

I get your point. I think he's wicked smart. Smart enough to make an amazing tool review channel profitable with a million subscribers. On selecting tools, features to look for, maybe not so much.

Agree with @sk farmer that he puts a lot of thought and effort into his tests and performs them with integrity. I just don't think the tests are relevant. Which brings me to the last point I'll make in this thread:

When we talk about diagonals, we too frequently leave out the diagonals ALL of us SHOULD HAVE in our automotive tools boxes that are cheap, made in the USA, and designed specifically for our work. I don't cut 12ga wires in my car. I mess with 20ga wires.

I recommend:

Amazon.com

And while you're at it, these are amazingly helpful:

Amazon.com

This is what I think GJ should all be about. Helping folks interested in finding the right tool for the job because I think the YouTube reviewers are really just about their ad revenue.

I first saw these Xuron pliers in aircraft electricians' kits. Pretty sure Xuron invented these and patented them but there are tons of brands of these floating around and a wide range of prices. Both Milwaukee and Klein offer near identical versions. Maybe Xuron is the OEM for them. But at $12-20, I don't think it's worth it to shop around.

Regardless, these are right sized for vehicle work. The maxi-shears at top are supposed to be able to cut 12ga copper which is more than big enough for most vehicle tasks.

Xuron makes a dizzying array of these. Really too many, with no clear way to differentiate them. These 2 pairs and the smaller Micro Shears 170-II are my personal picks so far.

 

[manwithtools]

Or, and be honest, is it the case that whatever I write you disagree with for sport? This is how you entertain yourself?

Please don't take it personally, he's pretty good at doing that with every topic that comes up... He doesn't seem to focus on any poster in particular

You don't get to 30k posts by agreeing with folks.