JustinS
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Damn, those are some serious cabinets!
Damn, those are some serious cabinets!
Above 1200 Sq/FT Casa de Frijolee - SoCal to Hawaii - gear head style
- Thread starter frijolee
- Start date
Wokspaces above 1200 squarefeet.
jbmatth
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
I know there are alternatives to POR 15 that doesn't fade with UV exposure, but can't remember off of the top of my head what they are. I think E-Tek had some info on it in his restoration thread, but you could find it faster by going to his site. Also after reading about your RX-7 I owe you a more thorough response about my cobra that I'll PM you. Your car has some serious time, effort, and thought put into it, I can't wait to see where you go with this garage!
JB
I know there are alternatives to POR 15 that doesn't fade with UV exposure, but can't remember off of the top of my head what they are. I think E-Tek had some info on it in his restoration thread, but you could find it faster by going to his site. Also after reading about your RX-7 I owe you a more thorough response about my cobra that I'll PM you. Your car has some serious time, effort, and thought put into it, I can't wait to see where you go with this garage!
JB
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Thanks for the compliments and tips y'all. One last small bit of book-keeping before I get into the biggest project done to date.
Washer/Dryer Riser
Sometimes, it's the little stuff that makes a difference:
I have this curb that makes a step all around the perimeter of my garage. It appears to be a flat foundation for the walls, where-as the slope of the garage is sloped. Quick shot from during the acid stain effort.
Turns out my dryer output faces right into this curb. Rather than have the machines spaced out a extra 6" from the wall (that's square feet yo!) I built a riser so that I could tuck the machine back that little bit.
I stained and clear coated it because I'm a **** (plus it'll have a little better water protection this way.
Next point of contact is the gas line and I don't want that rubbing a hole in it so I have to have some clearance. Plan to hook my sink output up to this port since I already have one.
I went looking for a 90 degree fitting to change the angle of the output and thought I'd found one.
Hooked it up and smelled gas. I told the folks over at Ganahl lumber what I was looking for a 90 for an appliance run and that's what they found me. Upon closer inspection, it turns out what I had was an 90 deg adapator for pipe thread to tapered cone fitting (like an -AN fitting, but not). One bore of the fitting cut fully through the tapered seat that the dryer required. It had to seal by the thread or wouldn't seal at all, yet the threads felt so damn close on install it'd be easy to miss...
...and then blow up your garage.
So, if anyone knows of a proper 90 deg fitting for gas appliance use I'd be stoked to know that. In the meantime, I'm making due getting things as far back towards the walls as I can. I have two racks of boltless shelving in one corner now where the rear feet land on the curb and the front feet land on the floor.
If/when this washer and dryer combo die, I expect I'll be looking into a stackable set. When you're dealing with a small garage every bit helps.
-Joel
Thanks for the compliments and tips y'all. One last small bit of book-keeping before I get into the biggest project done to date.
Washer/Dryer Riser
Sometimes, it's the little stuff that makes a difference:
I have this curb that makes a step all around the perimeter of my garage. It appears to be a flat foundation for the walls, where-as the slope of the garage is sloped. Quick shot from during the acid stain effort.
Turns out my dryer output faces right into this curb. Rather than have the machines spaced out a extra 6" from the wall (that's square feet yo!) I built a riser so that I could tuck the machine back that little bit.
I stained and clear coated it because I'm a **** (plus it'll have a little better water protection this way.
Next point of contact is the gas line and I don't want that rubbing a hole in it so I have to have some clearance. Plan to hook my sink output up to this port since I already have one.
I went looking for a 90 degree fitting to change the angle of the output and thought I'd found one.
Hooked it up and smelled gas. I told the folks over at Ganahl lumber what I was looking for a 90 for an appliance run and that's what they found me. Upon closer inspection, it turns out what I had was an 90 deg adapator for pipe thread to tapered cone fitting (like an -AN fitting, but not). One bore of the fitting cut fully through the tapered seat that the dryer required. It had to seal by the thread or wouldn't seal at all, yet the threads felt so damn close on install it'd be easy to miss...
...and then blow up your garage.
So, if anyone knows of a proper 90 deg fitting for gas appliance use I'd be stoked to know that. In the meantime, I'm making due getting things as far back towards the walls as I can. I have two racks of boltless shelving in one corner now where the rear feet land on the curb and the front feet land on the floor.
If/when this washer and dryer combo die, I expect I'll be looking into a stackable set. When you're dealing with a small garage every bit helps.
-Joel
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Re: Stackable set,
Any way to place the future stacking unit inside the house? Near bed rooms?
Clothing migration distance reduction makes for a very happy laundry person. And the space can be reclaimed for proper garage stuff. Please consider this option.
Moving a laundry area upstairs where the sleeping/dressing areas are, can/may produce extremely dramatic happy dances. An, unfortunate single story dweller will never experience this uh, act of changed natural circumstance.
Good Luck, great work..
John McA
Re: Stackable set,
Any way to place the future stacking unit inside the house? Near bed rooms?
Clothing migration distance reduction makes for a very happy laundry person. And the space can be reclaimed for proper garage stuff. Please consider this option.
Moving a laundry area upstairs where the sleeping/dressing areas are, can/may produce extremely dramatic happy dances. An, unfortunate single story dweller will never experience this uh, act of changed natural circumstance.
Good Luck, great work..
John McA
Cris B
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
POR15 also do a UV resistant top coat may be worth looking into. My thought was that if the cabs are going to sit in that spot outside why not build a canopy over them to give them some shade and rain protection?
I say this because I've seen how quickly the elements can corrode a powder coated steel cab (albeit in a wetter climate). In the end I had to move it indoors but did consider building a shelter off the side of the house for the same reasons as you - I didn't want to lose the floor space in the garage.
POR15 also do a UV resistant top coat may be worth looking into. My thought was that if the cabs are going to sit in that spot outside why not build a canopy over them to give them some shade and rain protection?
I say this because I've seen how quickly the elements can corrode a powder coated steel cab (albeit in a wetter climate). In the end I had to move it indoors but did consider building a shelter off the side of the house for the same reasons as you - I didn't want to lose the floor space in the garage.
fourmotioneer
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Easily one of the most enjoyable reads I've had on the garage journal so far. Problems + Solutions. Nice. The paper mock-up of the garage is smart. I make shapes in powerpoint and drag them around, but still easier than CADing it up.
Easily one of the most enjoyable reads I've had on the garage journal so far. Problems + Solutions. Nice. The paper mock-up of the garage is smart. I make shapes in powerpoint and drag them around, but still easier than CADing it up.
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Single story and pretty small home. I'm also blessed by have my wife doing our laundry and agree with the "happy wife, happy life" story you're telling.
Unfortunately in my case, it would require a great deal of effort and likely building a specific closest, water plumbing etc. If I were working with a builder on a new home I'd be all over this, but since I'm not, I think I'll have to live with what I have for now. Our first couple apartments as a married couple involved multiple stairs and coin laundry. We've at least been getting better than that ever since.
I also 100% agree with the sentiment of keeping the garage to essential man cave things if possible. To be fair, I've found I've used the washer and dryer as work surfaces more than I care to admit... A tankless water heater and side mount garage door opener are the other two tricks I've run across, but thus far I'm making the space work.
I may need to. Eventually I'd really like to pave that area and blow a proper hole in the fence so I can have RV access. I know I could totally geek out on an automatic opener for a fence! Gnarlier mods would likely happen at the same time. I am planning on a big air compressor living outside on the opposite side of the house. That'll get a shed both for environmental protection and to help cut down on the noise.
Thanks for the kind words. If you like problem solving, the next write-up I'm working on was a serious challenge. How to build a garage attic for maximum storage (and accessibility) in a house with a low sloping roof line...
Not a great deal of space up there:
Teaser pic:
Single story and pretty small home. I'm also blessed by have my wife doing our laundry and agree with the "happy wife, happy life" story you're telling.
Unfortunately in my case, it would require a great deal of effort and likely building a specific closest, water plumbing etc. If I were working with a builder on a new home I'd be all over this, but since I'm not, I think I'll have to live with what I have for now. Our first couple apartments as a married couple involved multiple stairs and coin laundry. We've at least been getting better than that ever since.I also 100% agree with the sentiment of keeping the garage to essential man cave things if possible. To be fair, I've found I've used the washer and dryer as work surfaces more than I care to admit... A tankless water heater and side mount garage door opener are the other two tricks I've run across, but thus far I'm making the space work.
I may need to. Eventually I'd really like to pave that area and blow a proper hole in the fence so I can have RV access. I know I could totally geek out on an automatic opener for a fence! Gnarlier mods would likely happen at the same time. I am planning on a big air compressor living outside on the opposite side of the house. That'll get a shed both for environmental protection and to help cut down on the noise.
Thanks for the kind words. If you like problem solving, the next write-up I'm working on was a serious challenge. How to build a garage attic for maximum storage (and accessibility) in a house with a low sloping roof line...
Not a great deal of space up there:
Teaser pic:
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timm95
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
On the note of using the laundry machines for a work surface it might be worth the effort to build a removable... I don't know what I'd call it. Work surface?
Cut a piece of thick plywood just a bit bigger than the tops, put some sort of padding on the bottom so it doesn't scratch, add an edge on at least two sides to help quick align it when you set it on top. Then when it's time to do the wash you just pull it and sit it against the wall.
My machines are in my shop with an inconveniently placed utility sink between them and I made a quick wood cover for the sink that on the front side lines up with the front of the machines and on the back has legs coming out so when I sit It on I can just slide it back to the wall and not worry about hitting fixtures or anything. Mine happens to fit perfect in the gap between the sink and dryer when taken off thankfully but a bigger one shouldn't be to hard to find a spot for either
Also after she came home to greasy tools on the dryer when I was tearing the top end of an engine apart I built a light duty table next to it. Something simple so I would t be tempted to use it for storage or let it get weighed down with to much ****. Just a good spot to sit stuff down that isn't the dryer haha.
On the note of using the laundry machines for a work surface it might be worth the effort to build a removable... I don't know what I'd call it. Work surface?
Cut a piece of thick plywood just a bit bigger than the tops, put some sort of padding on the bottom so it doesn't scratch, add an edge on at least two sides to help quick align it when you set it on top. Then when it's time to do the wash you just pull it and sit it against the wall.
My machines are in my shop with an inconveniently placed utility sink between them and I made a quick wood cover for the sink that on the front side lines up with the front of the machines and on the back has legs coming out so when I sit It on I can just slide it back to the wall and not worry about hitting fixtures or anything. Mine happens to fit perfect in the gap between the sink and dryer when taken off thankfully but a bigger one shouldn't be to hard to find a spot for either
Also after she came home to greasy tools on the dryer when I was tearing the top end of an engine apart I built a light duty table next to it. Something simple so I would t be tempted to use it for storage or let it get weighed down with to much ****. Just a good spot to sit stuff down that isn't the dryer haha.
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timm95
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
And you know your only one heavy thing away from her askin where that new dent in the top came from. Laundry machines oil can sitting, well an oil can on them! Only takes so much until it doesn't pop back
And you know your only one heavy thing away from her askin where that new dent in the top came from. Laundry machines oil can sitting, well an oil can on them! Only takes so much until it doesn't pop back
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Attic Planning
I needed more storage in a bad way. Snowboards, Christmas stuff, spare car parts. You name it. I had no where to put it. A garage attic was a logical way to go but the problem was that the slope of my roof line was so low.
Reminder shot from earlier in the thread.
I wanted to get the elevation of the floor down a bit to keep some better volume of space up there. I wandered through Home Depot and found a bunch of product by Simpson Strong Tie that looked like they might be useful.
However, dropping the joists was going to be a challenge if I picked up the top plate via a hanger instead of the resting the joists on the wall. I wasn't quite sure how I would dodge past the angled corner gusset beams if I was trying to hang off the top plate (double stacked 2x4s) with the brackets found.
I was also worried about ditching the existing design of 2x4's just about this elevation which appearred to be the tension member associated with the roof truss.
What becomes my attic floor joist would still need to double as the tension member but it's now at the wrong elevation to do so since dropping it down makes it harder to tied in the rafters. IE, if I used the top flange hangers I wasn't at all confident the walls wouldn't be trying to spread on me since they're not designed against tension loads.
I'd also been doing some reading on span tables and the like. I looking at the tables it didn't look like I can go for a straight span while being able to carry enough weight. As such, I decided my best bet would be doing a modified attic truss design. A couple links.
http://www.concordtruss.com/pdfs/ttbconf.pdf
http://www.public.iastate.edu/~mwps_dis/mwps_web/tr_plans.html
https://courses.cit.cornell.edu/arch264/calculators/example8.1/
Something that looks a bit like this, the knee wall in the below is pretty much what I already have given the asymmetry of the roof line.
That's pretty much as far as I got on my own. After a few follow up conversations with the good folks over at Ganahl Lumber I refined my ideas a bit, bought lumber and got to work.
Pro-tip: Home Depot stocks lumber up to 20 footers. Ganahl carries both 22 and 24". Given I had a 21' span that became quite important.
Joel
Attic Planning
I needed more storage in a bad way. Snowboards, Christmas stuff, spare car parts. You name it. I had no where to put it. A garage attic was a logical way to go but the problem was that the slope of my roof line was so low.
Reminder shot from earlier in the thread.
I wanted to get the elevation of the floor down a bit to keep some better volume of space up there. I wandered through Home Depot and found a bunch of product by Simpson Strong Tie that looked like they might be useful.
However, dropping the joists was going to be a challenge if I picked up the top plate via a hanger instead of the resting the joists on the wall. I wasn't quite sure how I would dodge past the angled corner gusset beams if I was trying to hang off the top plate (double stacked 2x4s) with the brackets found.
I was also worried about ditching the existing design of 2x4's just about this elevation which appearred to be the tension member associated with the roof truss.
What becomes my attic floor joist would still need to double as the tension member but it's now at the wrong elevation to do so since dropping it down makes it harder to tied in the rafters. IE, if I used the top flange hangers I wasn't at all confident the walls wouldn't be trying to spread on me since they're not designed against tension loads.
I'd also been doing some reading on span tables and the like. I looking at the tables it didn't look like I can go for a straight span while being able to carry enough weight. As such, I decided my best bet would be doing a modified attic truss design. A couple links.
http://www.concordtruss.com/pdfs/ttbconf.pdf
http://www.public.iastate.edu/~mwps_dis/mwps_web/tr_plans.html
https://courses.cit.cornell.edu/arch264/calculators/example8.1/
Something that looks a bit like this, the knee wall in the below is pretty much what I already have given the asymmetry of the roof line.
That's pretty much as far as I got on my own. After a few follow up conversations with the good folks over at Ganahl Lumber I refined my ideas a bit, bought lumber and got to work.
Pro-tip: Home Depot stocks lumber up to 20 footers. Ganahl carries both 22 and 24". Given I had a 21' span that became quite important.
Joel
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Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
At the same time as designing my attic from a strength perspective I was also trying to figure out how to keep this as a nice looking space.
I found myself debating trying to paint things at the same time as technically I could do that ahead of time. I was pretty set on exposed joists since I didn't need the weigh of drywall up there, and it lowers the "feel" of the roof to have surfaces above and below the joists. Finally, knowing what it takes to pack 10 lbs of ish into 5 lbs spaces, I wanted to be able to use the space between joists in the future if I ever decided to.
Options I was evaluating:
Simple white everything is the best from a lighting perspective but is kinda boring.
Stain on white breaks things up a bit and looks intentional.
I spent a while debating about flipping the "good side" of the plywood down so it faces the room and clearing that (or even a whitewash stain to keep it light) and then going darker on the joists. My floor is pretty mellow looking (blues and browns, nothing super bold) so if I let the only strong colors in the room be the toolboxes I think more earth tone kinda detail on the roof with with walls might go well.
This one kinda does it for me... Stained but not very dark ceiling, white or just off white walls.
But I still want to find a way to incorporate some carbon fiber into cabinets or doors and the black might throw everything out of whack.
What would you have done? Bearing in mind I'm basically cleaning up plywood and lumber, not playing with satin finish wood siding or anything over the top elegant...
-Joel
At the same time as designing my attic from a strength perspective I was also trying to figure out how to keep this as a nice looking space.
I found myself debating trying to paint things at the same time as technically I could do that ahead of time. I was pretty set on exposed joists since I didn't need the weigh of drywall up there, and it lowers the "feel" of the roof to have surfaces above and below the joists. Finally, knowing what it takes to pack 10 lbs of ish into 5 lbs spaces, I wanted to be able to use the space between joists in the future if I ever decided to.
Options I was evaluating:
Simple white everything is the best from a lighting perspective but is kinda boring.
Stain on white breaks things up a bit and looks intentional.
I spent a while debating about flipping the "good side" of the plywood down so it faces the room and clearing that (or even a whitewash stain to keep it light) and then going darker on the joists. My floor is pretty mellow looking (blues and browns, nothing super bold) so if I let the only strong colors in the room be the toolboxes I think more earth tone kinda detail on the roof with with walls might go well.
This one kinda does it for me... Stained but not very dark ceiling, white or just off white walls.
But I still want to find a way to incorporate some carbon fiber into cabinets or doors and the black might throw everything out of whack.
What would you have done? Bearing in mind I'm basically cleaning up plywood and lumber, not playing with satin finish wood siding or anything over the top elegant...
-Joel
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56rpm
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
The offset heads on your table is so cool and really make it unique. I didn't think engineers used that side of their brain? Get job on all of it.
The offset heads on your table is so cool and really make it unique. I didn't think engineers used that side of their brain?
Get job on all of it.Bib Overalls
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
I'm digging this.
I'm digging this.
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Garage Attic Storage
OK, time for the real deal on the attic. Here’s where I started:
I knocked out the drywall above the entry walkway and confirmed that looked like usable space. That rat’s nest of pipes above the water heater doesn’t look fun.
Made a proper big mess, first real test of the floor. It’ll scratch and chip if you hit hard but generally pleased with durability.
The beam tables I found claimed 2x10s were good for a 14-15’ span with used 24” on center, but that’s loaded with 40 lb/ft^2. Attics only need to be 20 lb/ft^2 and my span is ~21’. As such I’m triangulating to the roof 7’ away from the wall ("knee wall" supports per the truss figure above but without the bonus diagonals). Should be plenty.
Dragging around 10x 22' 2x10s on a 17' trailer makes for some interesting loading. Man I hauled a lot of stuff on this trailer.
We clear coated the beams because I like the look of some natural wood scattered around.
Spend enough time at Home Depot and you learn all kinds of things about rated nails and hangers. Had some helpful advice from a few friends too. I did end up using a top flange hanger to drop these down slightly, but went with a 2x6 hanger for optomized elevations.
Locating brackets (everything lined up with the rafters for simplicity.
Demolition went down one piece and one cut at a time. I ended up taking this cross brace all the way out.
First rafter in. Extra notching for the pipes on the end.
Helpers who are cuter than me. Other than slinging the heaviest things around, this build was almost all an army of one.
Making progress.
End detail. The hanger takes the vertical load. The tie plates take any tension. Note I’m actually using the hangers from a 2x6 to set the elevation I wanted. They have the same load rating as the 2x10s. I actually ordered from home depot online so I could get the heavier-gauge-metal style hanger. It's the LB series of Simpson Strongtie hangers. They'll send you a stack of catalogs free if you need them.
Redoing garage door opener. Again, moving one piece at a time.
Cross bracing makes this worlds stiffer. After these went in I could finally sit up there. All the braces were cut to specific lengths based upon the average spacing at both ends (several varied by 1/4” here, 3/8” there). I also found out that when a long Phillips screw “cams” out, the thumping of your drill motor on the structure is enough noise to wake up the neighbors at 2 am.
Starting to sling up the plywood. It’s all 3/4" cabinet grade, because I wanted to be able to slide stuff on it and not be dealing with fragments and splinters. I also ramped the floor up against the left wall to make room for some pre-existing piping.
Starting to look like something. Notched around the gas main line.
Lots of notching up top to make these fit as well. Had to move several electrical boxes including that little guy in the corner.
This is the area about the entry walkway, plywood above and below. I actually ended up making 4 chunks of floor in this area removeable (those bits not installed below) so I can store materials in the void space.
I didn’t want to notch the joists in this area and there was some Romex I couldn’t easy move so instead I notched the plywood.
One advantage of ramping up the main floor is that it brought things almost into alignment between the new joists and the entry joist. Wouldn’t quite sit flat with the brackets I had, but a little fun with a router solved that.
Why notch the entire length of a 2x10?
So that you can tuck your pipes of course! Picture is a little out of order but it makes the point… I know, this won’t be fun if it ever leaks, but folks encase pipes in walls all the time and that won’t be fun either.
All this cutting and trimming in the roof made the floor a complete nightmare. Mrs. Frijolee was not pleased when she discovered sawdust in washing machine. My bad…
Working on the pipe tuck on the opposite end.
Almost done framing out the entry opening. Notches are for a crazy swing down ladder I’m still planning.
One side opening complete.
Back to that rats nest of pipes above the water heater. I have it half tucked against the walls but the elevations just won’t quite work with where the rest of the floor needs to be and I just can't bring myself to put another stair step in the floor just to gain 1/2"
Answer? More router action, this time stair stepping to account for the sloping pipes. About a half dozen test fitments later and it lands.
About this time I made a map of every piece of plywood on the main floor (16 total) pulled everything down, flipped and painted them all (primer and an off white top coat of leftover paint), then threw them all back up. A couple more friends had happened to stop by at a key moment and got recruited to work. Thanks fellas!!
Oh, the wires for the garage door opener are all tucked on the topside (in routed grooves so the floor stays flat.)
Anyone else line up their screw heads for maximum consistency? It’s the kind of thing I’m berating myself for doing (while doing it) but at the end of the day it makes me happy so why not.
Up top? I had some leftover boltless shelving so I cut them down I made an island of shelving. It didn’t quite fit on the flat portion (you can really see the ramp here) so I moved it over slightly and let that cross brace punch through the top shelf on one side.
One massive cleanup later and I finally have an attic.
-Joel
Garage Attic Storage
OK, time for the real deal on the attic. Here’s where I started:
I knocked out the drywall above the entry walkway and confirmed that looked like usable space. That rat’s nest of pipes above the water heater doesn’t look fun.
Made a proper big mess, first real test of the floor. It’ll scratch and chip if you hit hard but generally pleased with durability.
The beam tables I found claimed 2x10s were good for a 14-15’ span with used 24” on center, but that’s loaded with 40 lb/ft^2. Attics only need to be 20 lb/ft^2 and my span is ~21’. As such I’m triangulating to the roof 7’ away from the wall ("knee wall" supports per the truss figure above but without the bonus diagonals). Should be plenty.
Dragging around 10x 22' 2x10s on a 17' trailer makes for some interesting loading. Man I hauled a lot of stuff on this trailer.
We clear coated the beams because I like the look of some natural wood scattered around.
Spend enough time at Home Depot and you learn all kinds of things about rated nails and hangers. Had some helpful advice from a few friends too. I did end up using a top flange hanger to drop these down slightly, but went with a 2x6 hanger for optomized elevations.
Locating brackets (everything lined up with the rafters for simplicity.
Demolition went down one piece and one cut at a time. I ended up taking this cross brace all the way out.
First rafter in. Extra notching for the pipes on the end.
Helpers who are cuter than me. Other than slinging the heaviest things around, this build was almost all an army of one.
Making progress.
End detail. The hanger takes the vertical load. The tie plates take any tension. Note I’m actually using the hangers from a 2x6 to set the elevation I wanted. They have the same load rating as the 2x10s. I actually ordered from home depot online so I could get the heavier-gauge-metal style hanger. It's the LB series of Simpson Strongtie hangers. They'll send you a stack of catalogs free if you need them.
Redoing garage door opener. Again, moving one piece at a time.
Cross bracing makes this worlds stiffer. After these went in I could finally sit up there. All the braces were cut to specific lengths based upon the average spacing at both ends (several varied by 1/4” here, 3/8” there).
I also found out that when a long Phillips screw “cams” out, the thumping of your drill motor on the structure is enough noise to wake up the neighbors at 2 am.
Starting to sling up the plywood. It’s all 3/4" cabinet grade, because I wanted to be able to slide stuff on it and not be dealing with fragments and splinters. I also ramped the floor up against the left wall to make room for some pre-existing piping.
Starting to look like something. Notched around the gas main line.
Lots of notching up top to make these fit as well. Had to move several electrical boxes including that little guy in the corner.
This is the area about the entry walkway, plywood above and below. I actually ended up making 4 chunks of floor in this area removeable (those bits not installed below) so I can store materials in the void space.
I didn’t want to notch the joists in this area and there was some Romex I couldn’t easy move so instead I notched the plywood.
One advantage of ramping up the main floor is that it brought things almost into alignment between the new joists and the entry joist. Wouldn’t quite sit flat with the brackets I had, but a little fun with a router solved that.
Why notch the entire length of a 2x10?
So that you can tuck your pipes of course! Picture is a little out of order but it makes the point… I know, this won’t be fun if it ever leaks, but folks encase pipes in walls all the time and that won’t be fun either.
All this cutting and trimming in the roof made the floor a complete nightmare. Mrs. Frijolee was not pleased when she discovered sawdust in washing machine. My bad…
Working on the pipe tuck on the opposite end.
Almost done framing out the entry opening. Notches are for a crazy swing down ladder I’m still planning.
One side opening complete.
Back to that rats nest of pipes above the water heater. I have it half tucked against the walls but the elevations just won’t quite work with where the rest of the floor needs to be and I just can't bring myself to put another stair step in the floor just to gain 1/2"
Answer? More router action, this time stair stepping to account for the sloping pipes. About a half dozen test fitments later and it lands.
About this time I made a map of every piece of plywood on the main floor (16 total) pulled everything down, flipped and painted them all (primer and an off white top coat of leftover paint), then threw them all back up. A couple more friends had happened to stop by at a key moment and got recruited to work. Thanks fellas!!
Oh, the wires for the garage door opener are all tucked on the topside (in routed grooves so the floor stays flat.)
Anyone else line up their screw heads for maximum consistency? It’s the kind of thing I’m berating myself for doing (while doing it) but at the end of the day it makes me happy so why not.
Up top? I had some leftover boltless shelving so I cut them down I made an island of shelving. It didn’t quite fit on the flat portion (you can really see the ramp here) so I moved it over slightly and let that cross brace punch through the top shelf on one side.
One massive cleanup later and I finally have an attic.
-Joel
Last edited:
timm95
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Sweet! Let's see the side we would all see after you get your mess cleaned up
Sweet! Let's see the side we would all see after you get your mess cleaned up
jbmatth
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
That was a ton of work you gave yourself with all of those relief cuts, but the end result is superb. Keep posting I'm waiting with baited breath.
That was a ton of work you gave yourself with all of those relief cuts, but the end result is superb. Keep posting I'm waiting with baited breath.
dykstra
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Looks great!!!
Looks great!!!
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Anything in particular you want to see? Lights were the next big topic I was planning. I'm getting closer to current and the garage is finally functional.
It was a little weird how the constraints of space just ended up telling me what it wanted to be. Take my tie in detail for instance:
A normal joist would land on top of the top plate and be nailed into the sloping rafter from the side. That can be hard to achieve with the roof on unless the other side happens to be open (which I had, but it was still easier to have the joists fit between the top plates). Since I was using the top flange hangers I had to be in line with the rafters so the two tabs of the top flange hanger would be on either side of the rafter. There still wasn't space to swing a hammer and nail down the hangers on the upper surface of the top plate so I used Simpon's purpose built structural screws and a 90 deg drill to lock those in under the eves.
In case it wasn't clear, this is how the joists tie in on the other side.
About half of the new joists aligned with the existing joists over my entry walkway. For those I bent the brackets as shown. The ones that didn't align have 90 deg bracket from the top plat to the end of the new joist (with screws to help carry tension).
Given I had lengthwise pipes running in this area anyways, rather than move the pipes, ramping up the floor became a convenient way to make the two elevations of new attic vs. entry walkway flooring match each other. Add in a little routing to make it as perfect as I could and it all worked out.
The key was setting the elevation of the overall floor in a manner conducive to the goals I was after. That's where the research into the various hangers became very important. By the way Simpson will send you their catalogs free if you request them.
http://www.strongtie.com/literature/catalogs.html?source=topnav#conn
-Joel
Sweet! Let's see the side we would all see after you get your mess cleaned up
Anything in particular you want to see? Lights were the next big topic I was planning. I'm getting closer to current and the garage is finally functional.
It was a little weird how the constraints of space just ended up telling me what it wanted to be. Take my tie in detail for instance:
A normal joist would land on top of the top plate and be nailed into the sloping rafter from the side. That can be hard to achieve with the roof on unless the other side happens to be open (which I had, but it was still easier to have the joists fit between the top plates). Since I was using the top flange hangers I had to be in line with the rafters so the two tabs of the top flange hanger would be on either side of the rafter. There still wasn't space to swing a hammer and nail down the hangers on the upper surface of the top plate so I used Simpon's purpose built structural screws and a 90 deg drill to lock those in under the eves.
In case it wasn't clear, this is how the joists tie in on the other side.
About half of the new joists aligned with the existing joists over my entry walkway. For those I bent the brackets as shown. The ones that didn't align have 90 deg bracket from the top plat to the end of the new joist (with screws to help carry tension).
Given I had lengthwise pipes running in this area anyways, rather than move the pipes, ramping up the floor became a convenient way to make the two elevations of new attic vs. entry walkway flooring match each other. Add in a little routing to make it as perfect as I could and it all worked out.
The key was setting the elevation of the overall floor in a manner conducive to the goals I was after. That's where the research into the various hangers became very important. By the way Simpson will send you their catalogs free if you request them.
http://www.strongtie.com/literature/catalogs.html?source=topnav#conn
-Joel
timm95
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Could you take a shot at night from outside of the garage door? Lol that's pretty specific. The reason I ask is your reference photos show the whole space and how the ceilng effects the feel and from further back you can get a better feel for how it actualy reads.
You know like the stand 10 feet and get a better look at it photo.
I figured an at night/ lit garage shot would give the wood on the ceiling some good warmth in the photo.
Could you take a shot at night from outside of the garage door? Lol that's pretty specific. The reason I ask is your reference photos show the whole space and how the ceilng effects the feel and from further back you can get a better feel for how it actualy reads.
You know like the stand 10 feet and get a better look at it photo.
I figured an at night/ lit garage shot would give the wood on the ceiling some good warmth in the photo.
Bib Overalls
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Me. I'm not sure I execute on your level but I try. The "I don't give a ****" pills that the VA gives me make the occasional flub more bearable. But I don't think there is any cure for those of us who are irrationally compulsive.
Me. I'm not sure I execute on your level but I try. The "I don't give a ****" pills that the VA gives me make the occasional flub more bearable. But I don't think there is any cure for those of us who are irrationally compulsive.
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Thanks for the truss info links!
Attic Planning
I needed more storage in a bad way. Snowboards, Christmas stuff, spare car parts. You name it. I had no where to put it. A garage attic was a logical way to go but the problem was that the slope of my roof line was so low.
Reminder shot from earlier in the thread.
I wanted to get the elevation of the floor down a bit to keep some better volume of space up there. I wandered through Home Depot and found a bunch of product by Simpson Strong Tie that looked like they might be useful.
However, dropping the joists was going to be a challenge if I picked up the top plate via a hanger instead of the resting the joists on the wall. I wasn't quite sure how I would dodge past the angled corner gusset beams if I was trying to hang off the top plate (double stacked 2x4s) with the brackets found.
I was also worried about ditching the existing design of 2x4's just about this elevation which appearred to be the tension member associated with the roof truss.
What becomes my attic floor joist would still need to double as the tension member but it's now at the wrong elevation to do so since dropping it down makes it harder to tied in the rafters. IE, if I used the top flange hangers I wasn't at all confident the walls wouldn't be trying to spread on me since they're not designed against tension loads.
I'd also been doing some reading on span tables and the like. I looking at the tables it didn't look like I can go for a straight span while being able to carry enough weight. As such, I decided my best bet would be doing a modified attic truss design. A couple links.
http://www.concordtruss.com/pdfs/ttbconf.pdf
http://www.public.iastate.edu/~mwps_dis/mwps_web/tr_plans.html
https://courses.cit.cornell.edu/arch264/calculators/example8.1/
Something that looks a bit like this, the knee wall in the below is pretty much what I already have given the asymmetry of the roof line.
That's pretty much as far as I got on my own. After a few follow up conversations with the good folks over at Ganahl Lumber I refined my ideas a bit, bought lumber and got to work.
Pro-tip: Home Depot stocks lumber up to 20 footers. Ganahl carries both 22 and 24". Given I had a 21' span that became quite important.
Joel
Thanks for the truss info links!
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
It's a mess at the moment but I found one I took right after I got the lights functional. This is skipping ahead a bit, but man o' man did lights ever make a big difference...
Nice. I've seen guys who line up the slot heads on their electrical outlets. I try to keep mine to the category of "I never want to second guess what I've done" level without going completely OCD.
Welcome. If you do some searching on "beam tables" those are pretty useful as well. A typical bedroom would be 40 lb/ft^2, a typical attic space 20 lb/ft^2.
Congrats! First home? I really like the acid stain but I'm finding I am scratching it under hard use. Expect to have some added effort keeping the place clean. Little rocks my car brought in and metal bits from fab work which get caught under my mechanics jack wheels seem to be the primary culprit.
-Joel
It's a mess at the moment but I found one I took right after I got the lights functional. This is skipping ahead a bit, but man o' man did lights ever make a big difference...
Nice. I've seen guys who line up the slot heads on their electrical outlets. I try to keep mine to the category of "I never want to second guess what I've done" level without going completely OCD.
Welcome. If you do some searching on "beam tables" those are pretty useful as well. A typical bedroom would be 40 lb/ft^2, a typical attic space 20 lb/ft^2.
Congrats! First home? I really like the acid stain but I'm finding I am scratching it under hard use. Expect to have some added effort keeping the place clean. Little rocks my car brought in and metal bits from fab work which get caught under my mechanics jack wheels seem to be the primary culprit.
-Joel
Last edited:
timm95
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Thanks man, looks like it did a good job of adding some warmth to the space with out killing any of the benifits of having nearly everything else white.
I've been staring up a lot lately trying to decide were I'd like lights to be so Im looking forward to seeing what you do/ did
Thanks man, looks like it did a good job of adding some warmth to the space with out killing any of the benifits of having nearly everything else white.
I've been staring up a lot lately trying to decide were I'd like lights to be so Im looking forward to seeing what you do/ did
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Thanks! I'm planning a few added surfaces in wood and butcher block for a little bit of a juxtaposition of warm and cool surfaces. I should get most of the lighting stuff posted later today.
Thanks man, looks like it did a good job of adding some warmth to the space with out killing any of the benifits of having nearly everything else white.
I've been staring up a lot lately trying to decide were I'd like lights to be so Im looking forward to seeing what you do/ did
Thanks! I'm planning a few added surfaces in wood and butcher block for a little bit of a juxtaposition of warm and cool surfaces. I should get most of the lighting stuff posted later today.
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Lighting Research
I actually owe a great deal of the research I did to the garage journal already, but I’m cross posting my findings here so that I have all the info in once place. This was thread from earlier:
(http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=237213) but figured some of it was general enough that it was worth posting here, plus I’m documenting both research and results so why not?
Note, for inexpensive dual bulb T8 fixtures I ran across several folks who referenced a Walmart “Lights of America” fixture, but I decided I just don't really trust them so I'd rather pay a bit more.
Begin cross post (with a few added notes here and there):
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I'm bumping one of the more read t8 fixture threads since (you guessed it) I need to pick t8 fixtures.
My Info, because you always have to post your info:
-20 x 21 foot two car garage with a 14’ door.
-Garage parks one go fast car that sees lots of project work. The other side is as a work shop (4x8 welding table, big tool boxes, saws, presses, open shelves, etc. It's my own version of the 12 Gauge Garage.
-I have an acid stained floor in deep browns and blues (already done, I like it a lot, it's darkish, but will hide blemishes well).
-Exposed 2x10 joist ceiling (clear coated natural wood cause I like the look), ~9 feet high
-Plywood on top of the joists (it's a storage area above) made from the nice cabinet stuff, painted white.
-Walls are (or will be) a combination of drywall, gear, and pictures.
What I've Learned:
Bulb Family:
-Fluorescent's seem to be the best bang for the buck going in terms of life cycle costs. LED’s are coming down but payback window is still too long for my taste.
-T12's are phasing out, if you're starting from scratch don't go there. However, it is a good way to find smoking deals used if you don't care.
-T8's are a good choice for most folks.
-T5's particular T5H0 are very intense (IE you won't be happy looking at them) and better served for high ceilings which I don't have.
-Given the above, I'm looking at T8 fixtures. Hence I'm posting in this thread for clarifications.
Fixture Details:
-8 footers and 4+ bulb fixtures can save some money but come with a compromise of more localized light and you can end up spotty, especially when dealing with lots of gear and low ceilings.
-One rule of thumb just about everyone agrees on (amazing!) is to target 100 lumens per square foot. You can use online calculators and examine ceiling heights and reflector knock down factors, but at the end of the day. 2800 lumens per 32W T8 bulb divided by square footage is going to give me very decent light.
-I like the idea of common bulbs everywhere as possible so I'm sticking with 4 foot 2 bulb fixtures and will scatter them as best I can. I'm sticking one on either side of the big door and two firing through the doors details windows.
-My math says 15 four foot tubes but I’ve also seen the math at 2500 lumens which implies 17 tubes. I’m planning running 20 (10 fixtures) since it lays out well, 2 fixtures will be firing through the window as mentioned (inefficient use of light), and I do have a darkish floor. That gets me laterals and longitudinal with a bonus fixture directly over my variant of the STEEVE-O bench.
Other setup Info:
-I'm hard wiring my stuff because GFI is a mess otherwise and really it’s meant to be that way. Have several electrician friends so details of junction boxes etc is beyond the scope of this thread.
-I’m planning on three stage actuation, hallway CFLs plus workbench fixture for taking out trash is stage 1 (aka a single fixture upgrade from the piss poor lighting I’m starting from). The main 9 fixtures are the two additional stages depending on what I’m doing.
-Whether you pick a fixture with a diffuser (aka lens) is largely a matter of preference. They spread light a bit more, but are in the way when changing bulbs and are easy to break particularly as they get older.
-Placing bulbs: avoid being directly over the top of things you need to see under. Especially true for working on cars, you’ll be far better scattering light down aisles and around the car’s perimeter rather than straight above. Watch for major shadows with roll up doors.
Picking Bulbs:
-There's plenty of reading on color temperature and CFI values available. Color is mostly user preference. Some folks like the 6500 k "daylight version". For the amateur the only viable approach to picking a color is seeing for yourself. I'm going 4100k as I like the light and bulbs are easy to find. I was looking at lower temps earlier as I prefer warm light but it turns out I like this the most. [Ed note: In hindsight, I could see considering 3500k bulbs to warm up the space, I wouldn’t go any bluer than what I have, your experiences may vary].
-Bulbs are cheapest when bought in bulk from www.1000bulbs.com.
-If accurate rendering of light matters pay attention to CFI when buying.
Things I don’t [didn’t] know:
-Does commercial vs. residential mean anything (seems to the only info the big boxes tell me). [A: shielding mostly since I don’t care about radio reception I’m fine]
-How do you evaluate ballast specs on something you've never seen before. [Still looking for answers on this one if folks want to chime in]
-How critical is the reflector? With a generally white ceiling I'm tempted to go without. [I did and I’m happy with it].
Recommend me a Fixture
-Four Foot, 2 Bulb, T8 fixtures.
-Cost effective. Not going dirt cheap but $20 - $40 is fine. Prefer logic and justification if I’m straying toward the upper end of that.
-Needs to be able to mount to exposed joists (some lateral, some longitudinal), bonus if I can both surface mount and suspend since that keeps it tighter to any joist I run along. No big deal if I install some angle to the sides of joists and suspend from that.
-Planning no diffuser.
-I don't care about FM reception (sound comes in via WiFi) but I don't want them to hum either [Ed note, someone in the other thread was kind enough to mention that hum isn't an issue with electronic ballasts.
-Would really like to do a bare fixture with no reflector either. I think I’m a little high on fixture count, but I also have relatively dark floors and a lot of gear. Partly I think reflectors look terrible, are hard to match if the chosen fixture ever goes out of vogue and I don’t mind lighting up the ceiling a bit.
-Have both Home Depot and Lowes local to me.
Practical example, how would one evaluate the comparison between these two fixtures?
Lithonia Model # MNS8 2 32 120 RE M6
(Home Depot SKU # 492819)
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-Lighting-2-Light-White-Fluorescent-Lighting-Strip-MNS8-2-32-120-RE-M6/202563409?N=5yc1vZc9h7
Lithonia Model # C 2 32 120 GESB
(Home Depot SKU # 453825)
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-Lighting-2-Light-White-Electronic-Channel-Fluorescent-Strip-Light-C-2-32-120-GESB/100543144?N=5yc1vZc9h7
Is there a difference between an "instant start" electronic ballast and a regular electronic ballast? That, plus a subtle change in form factor is about all I see.
Thanks in advance,
Joel
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
End annotated cross post...
By the way the answer to the fixture comparison question was actually just form factor. I eventually ended up going with the “mini” fixture and I’m glad I did. Lighting results next…
Lighting Research
I actually owe a great deal of the research I did to the garage journal already, but I’m cross posting my findings here so that I have all the info in once place. This was thread from earlier:
(http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=237213) but figured some of it was general enough that it was worth posting here, plus I’m documenting both research and results so why not?
Note, for inexpensive dual bulb T8 fixtures I ran across several folks who referenced a Walmart “Lights of America” fixture, but I decided I just don't really trust them so I'd rather pay a bit more.
Begin cross post (with a few added notes here and there):
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I'm bumping one of the more read t8 fixture threads since (you guessed it) I need to pick t8 fixtures.
My Info, because you always have to post your info:
-20 x 21 foot two car garage with a 14’ door.
-Garage parks one go fast car that sees lots of project work. The other side is as a work shop (4x8 welding table, big tool boxes, saws, presses, open shelves, etc. It's my own version of the 12 Gauge Garage.
-I have an acid stained floor in deep browns and blues (already done, I like it a lot, it's darkish, but will hide blemishes well).
-Exposed 2x10 joist ceiling (clear coated natural wood cause I like the look), ~9 feet high
-Plywood on top of the joists (it's a storage area above) made from the nice cabinet stuff, painted white.
-Walls are (or will be) a combination of drywall, gear, and pictures.
What I've Learned:
Bulb Family:
-Fluorescent's seem to be the best bang for the buck going in terms of life cycle costs. LED’s are coming down but payback window is still too long for my taste.
-T12's are phasing out, if you're starting from scratch don't go there. However, it is a good way to find smoking deals used if you don't care.
-T8's are a good choice for most folks.
-T5's particular T5H0 are very intense (IE you won't be happy looking at them) and better served for high ceilings which I don't have.
-Given the above, I'm looking at T8 fixtures. Hence I'm posting in this thread for clarifications.
Fixture Details:
-8 footers and 4+ bulb fixtures can save some money but come with a compromise of more localized light and you can end up spotty, especially when dealing with lots of gear and low ceilings.
-One rule of thumb just about everyone agrees on (amazing!) is to target 100 lumens per square foot. You can use online calculators and examine ceiling heights and reflector knock down factors, but at the end of the day. 2800 lumens per 32W T8 bulb divided by square footage is going to give me very decent light.
-I like the idea of common bulbs everywhere as possible so I'm sticking with 4 foot 2 bulb fixtures and will scatter them as best I can. I'm sticking one on either side of the big door and two firing through the doors details windows.
-My math says 15 four foot tubes but I’ve also seen the math at 2500 lumens which implies 17 tubes. I’m planning running 20 (10 fixtures) since it lays out well, 2 fixtures will be firing through the window as mentioned (inefficient use of light), and I do have a darkish floor. That gets me laterals and longitudinal with a bonus fixture directly over my variant of the STEEVE-O bench.
Other setup Info:
-I'm hard wiring my stuff because GFI is a mess otherwise and really it’s meant to be that way. Have several electrician friends so details of junction boxes etc is beyond the scope of this thread.
-I’m planning on three stage actuation, hallway CFLs plus workbench fixture for taking out trash is stage 1 (aka a single fixture upgrade from the piss poor lighting I’m starting from). The main 9 fixtures are the two additional stages depending on what I’m doing.
-Whether you pick a fixture with a diffuser (aka lens) is largely a matter of preference. They spread light a bit more, but are in the way when changing bulbs and are easy to break particularly as they get older.
-Placing bulbs: avoid being directly over the top of things you need to see under. Especially true for working on cars, you’ll be far better scattering light down aisles and around the car’s perimeter rather than straight above. Watch for major shadows with roll up doors.
Picking Bulbs:
-There's plenty of reading on color temperature and CFI values available. Color is mostly user preference. Some folks like the 6500 k "daylight version". For the amateur the only viable approach to picking a color is seeing for yourself. I'm going 4100k as I like the light and bulbs are easy to find. I was looking at lower temps earlier as I prefer warm light but it turns out I like this the most. [Ed note: In hindsight, I could see considering 3500k bulbs to warm up the space, I wouldn’t go any bluer than what I have, your experiences may vary].
-Bulbs are cheapest when bought in bulk from www.1000bulbs.com.
-If accurate rendering of light matters pay attention to CFI when buying.
Things I don’t [didn’t] know:
-Does commercial vs. residential mean anything (seems to the only info the big boxes tell me). [A: shielding mostly since I don’t care about radio reception I’m fine]
-How do you evaluate ballast specs on something you've never seen before. [Still looking for answers on this one if folks want to chime in]
-How critical is the reflector? With a generally white ceiling I'm tempted to go without. [I did and I’m happy with it].
Recommend me a Fixture
-Four Foot, 2 Bulb, T8 fixtures.
-Cost effective. Not going dirt cheap but $20 - $40 is fine. Prefer logic and justification if I’m straying toward the upper end of that.
-Needs to be able to mount to exposed joists (some lateral, some longitudinal), bonus if I can both surface mount and suspend since that keeps it tighter to any joist I run along. No big deal if I install some angle to the sides of joists and suspend from that.
-Planning no diffuser.
-I don't care about FM reception (sound comes in via WiFi) but I don't want them to hum either [Ed note, someone in the other thread was kind enough to mention that hum isn't an issue with electronic ballasts.
-Would really like to do a bare fixture with no reflector either. I think I’m a little high on fixture count, but I also have relatively dark floors and a lot of gear. Partly I think reflectors look terrible, are hard to match if the chosen fixture ever goes out of vogue and I don’t mind lighting up the ceiling a bit.
-Have both Home Depot and Lowes local to me.
Practical example, how would one evaluate the comparison between these two fixtures?
Lithonia Model # MNS8 2 32 120 RE M6
(Home Depot SKU # 492819)
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-Lighting-2-Light-White-Fluorescent-Lighting-Strip-MNS8-2-32-120-RE-M6/202563409?N=5yc1vZc9h7
Lithonia Model # C 2 32 120 GESB
(Home Depot SKU # 453825)
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-Lighting-2-Light-White-Electronic-Channel-Fluorescent-Strip-Light-C-2-32-120-GESB/100543144?N=5yc1vZc9h7
Is there a difference between an "instant start" electronic ballast and a regular electronic ballast? That, plus a subtle change in form factor is about all I see.
Thanks in advance,
Joel
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
End annotated cross post...
By the way the answer to the fixture comparison question was actually just form factor. I eventually ended up going with the “mini” fixture and I’m glad I did. Lighting results next…
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
yes first home, built in the 1960's, the garage was built onto the house at a later time so when you pull in the driveway there is a garage but no front door, its pretty cool.
yes first home, built in the 1960's, the garage was built onto the house at a later time so when you pull in the driveway there is a garage but no front door, its pretty cool.
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Lights
Lights research and findings are already covered above, so it’s time for the execution part of the post… Brass tacks: I ended deciding on a 14 total dual bulb T8 4 ft fixtures in a 4100k color temp. All fixtures were ordered from Home Depot online (stores didn’t carry enough and are often umm.. . “well handled” before you get to them). All bulbs were ordered from: www.1000bulbs.com.
Obviously there are lots of options (this was maybe 20% of Home Depot's display).
I ended up going with the Lithonia lighting mini fixture:
-Model # MNS8 2 32 120 RE M6
-Internet # 202563409
-Store SKU # 492819
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-Lighting-2-Light-White-Fluorescent-Lighting-Strip-MNS8-2-32-120-RE-M6/202563409?N=5yc1vZc9h7
At the moment I'm running 9 fixtures in the main garage and 5 in the attic. Here's the garage layout.
Goals were 1) To spread light to as many nooks and corners as possible. 2) Keep lights in the aisles and to the sides of the car and main work surfaces. 3) Minimize shadows caused by the main garage door in both the up and down positions.
I ended up planning 3 light circuits. My piss-ant two bulbs only that the garage came with are circuit 1 (I may add another fixture above the workbench as this would give me just a little more light when I'm just taking out the trash.) Circuit 2 is all the side to side fixtures, and circuit 3 is all the fore-aft fixtures.
I'm using a branched wire layout so it's based on 12/3 or 12/2 MC cable as needed. Note, one confusing detail I didn't know before. 12/3 wire is actually 4 wires: red, black, white, green (ground). 12/2 cable is 3 wires: black, white, green. You don't count the ground wire when specifying cable. If you’ve been around home electrical for a while sure you know this. I didn’t and figured some other newbies might not either.
To run a branched wire circuit all lights share white and green while black or red alternates. The termination to power is also important because if you wire the lights to separate legs you can make the shared white wire have a superposition of waves (alternating current) such that the amplitude of the waves cancels out. Wire it wrong and you end up with superposition of waves that doubles rather than deducts.
Each of my ballasts is 0.8 amps so at the moment I just have them wired all together.
I did note that not all fixtures comes with the same ballasts, but it doesn't really seem to matter.
I made little brackets for the 4 lights which run in line with my attic joists.
This not only helps with heat (probably unnecessary but still), but it also offsets the fixtures slightly in helpful ways. Near the attic opening this means I won't be whacking lights on the way up. And at the garage door end it means that the lights are better aligned to shine through the little windows in my garage door (while in the up position).
I also got a little clever with mounting towards the sides of the garage. To keep lights useful I ended up dropping them down and mounting them to either side of the garage door rails. We'll see if they live, I can run chains from the roof if need be. I did add little isolators from Mcmaster to give them a fighting chance.
There are special clips for both single and double MC cable made to work with 1/2" knock outs. The wiring inside lights can get pretty snug with the mini fixtures if you're running a 12/3 cable passing through which simultaneously branches off to some other fixture. A standard fixture would make that easier, but given several of my lights are free floating across the joists I wanted to keep them small.
So how'd it go? Here's a before shot with my pre-existing 2 bulbs only. Camera trying desperately to compensate for the dark.
And after... I really should probably do this with the SLR on manual mode so it can't compensate for the the light it sees. It's absolutely a night and day difference.
It's bright and has almost no shadows except directly under car and under welding table. Lighting around the edges of the things intentionally worked great. I might consider 2 fixtures a floor level to help with under car, but I'd have to figure out an armored fixture. I like the light color temp a great deal. It's clearly more blue than the rest of my house but not objectionably so. If anything I think I could have done 3500k but I'm satisfied as is.
Lights along the edge of the garage door tracks work great and no issues thus far.
Lights through the windows worked out too.
I think I could have gotten a bit more out of them if I dropped them closer to the windows, but it's not worth redoing.
Having a functional space--particularly when I haven't for about half a year--just has me stoked.
-Joel
Lights
Lights research and findings are already covered above, so it’s time for the execution part of the post… Brass tacks: I ended deciding on a 14 total dual bulb T8 4 ft fixtures in a 4100k color temp. All fixtures were ordered from Home Depot online (stores didn’t carry enough and are often umm.. . “well handled” before you get to them). All bulbs were ordered from: www.1000bulbs.com.
Obviously there are lots of options (this was maybe 20% of Home Depot's display).
I ended up going with the Lithonia lighting mini fixture:
-Model # MNS8 2 32 120 RE M6
-Internet # 202563409
-Store SKU # 492819
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-Lighting-2-Light-White-Fluorescent-Lighting-Strip-MNS8-2-32-120-RE-M6/202563409?N=5yc1vZc9h7
At the moment I'm running 9 fixtures in the main garage and 5 in the attic. Here's the garage layout.
Goals were 1) To spread light to as many nooks and corners as possible. 2) Keep lights in the aisles and to the sides of the car and main work surfaces. 3) Minimize shadows caused by the main garage door in both the up and down positions.
I ended up planning 3 light circuits. My piss-ant two bulbs only that the garage came with are circuit 1 (I may add another fixture above the workbench as this would give me just a little more light when I'm just taking out the trash.) Circuit 2 is all the side to side fixtures, and circuit 3 is all the fore-aft fixtures.
I'm using a branched wire layout so it's based on 12/3 or 12/2 MC cable as needed. Note, one confusing detail I didn't know before. 12/3 wire is actually 4 wires: red, black, white, green (ground). 12/2 cable is 3 wires: black, white, green. You don't count the ground wire when specifying cable. If you’ve been around home electrical for a while sure you know this. I didn’t and figured some other newbies might not either.
To run a branched wire circuit all lights share white and green while black or red alternates. The termination to power is also important because if you wire the lights to separate legs you can make the shared white wire have a superposition of waves (alternating current) such that the amplitude of the waves cancels out. Wire it wrong and you end up with superposition of waves that doubles rather than deducts.
Each of my ballasts is 0.8 amps so at the moment I just have them wired all together.
I did note that not all fixtures comes with the same ballasts, but it doesn't really seem to matter.
I made little brackets for the 4 lights which run in line with my attic joists.
This not only helps with heat (probably unnecessary but still), but it also offsets the fixtures slightly in helpful ways. Near the attic opening this means I won't be whacking lights on the way up. And at the garage door end it means that the lights are better aligned to shine through the little windows in my garage door (while in the up position).
I also got a little clever with mounting towards the sides of the garage. To keep lights useful I ended up dropping them down and mounting them to either side of the garage door rails. We'll see if they live, I can run chains from the roof if need be. I did add little isolators from Mcmaster to give them a fighting chance.
There are special clips for both single and double MC cable made to work with 1/2" knock outs. The wiring inside lights can get pretty snug with the mini fixtures if you're running a 12/3 cable passing through which simultaneously branches off to some other fixture. A standard fixture would make that easier, but given several of my lights are free floating across the joists I wanted to keep them small.
So how'd it go? Here's a before shot with my pre-existing 2 bulbs only. Camera trying desperately to compensate for the dark.
And after... I really should probably do this with the SLR on manual mode so it can't compensate for the the light it sees. It's absolutely a night and day difference.
It's bright and has almost no shadows except directly under car and under welding table. Lighting around the edges of the things intentionally worked great. I might consider 2 fixtures a floor level to help with under car, but I'd have to figure out an armored fixture. I like the light color temp a great deal. It's clearly more blue than the rest of my house but not objectionably so. If anything I think I could have done 3500k but I'm satisfied as is.
Lights along the edge of the garage door tracks work great and no issues thus far.
Lights through the windows worked out too.
I think I could have gotten a bit more out of them if I dropped them closer to the windows, but it's not worth redoing.
Having a functional space--particularly when I haven't for about half a year--just has me stoked.
-Joel
Last edited:
timm95
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Wow! Night and day is right! Amazing.
I'd be curious to see how your under car light changes when you, Im assuming, finish the wall. I've only managed to prime one wall white and even that helped quite a bit.
Wow! Night and day is right! Amazing.
I'd be curious to see how your under car light changes when you, Im assuming, finish the wall. I've only managed to prime one wall white and even that helped quite a bit.
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
One more detail I forgot to mention.
I'm running all the MC cable for lights up and over the joists. Rather than compromise the joists, I routed little 1/2" deep slots in my plywood using a round over bit. Did this both to save joist strength, is preserves a little space if I tuck anything else up there, it gives me a "service loop" for free (rather than a point to point setup), and looks a little cleaner too.
One more detail I forgot to mention.
I'm running all the MC cable for lights up and over the joists. Rather than compromise the joists, I routed little 1/2" deep slots in my plywood using a round over bit. Did this both to save joist strength, is preserves a little space if I tuck anything else up there, it gives me a "service loop" for free (rather than a point to point setup), and looks a little cleaner too.
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Haven’t been posting much recently because I’ve been working my *** off on multiple fronts.
Good news is that at least I’ve been making some progress on the garage. Had an itch to write something worthwhile tonight after taking “$$$ JZ Money FC $$$” to task earlier today and feeling a bit like a **** about it (even if he did deserve it). So…
Tool Boxes:
I’m a pretty big fan of the Harbor Freight roller tool boxes. My wife bought me the big 56” box and top cabinet a few years back for my birthday.
http://www.harborfreight.com/56-in-11-drawer-glossy-red-industrial-roller-cabinet-67681.html
http://www.harborfreight.com/56-in-8-drawer-glossy-red-roller-cabinet-top-chest-61370.html
It’s rad but there a couple peculiarities with the top cabinet. The mesh liner they give you in the top cabinet is thin and lumpy (no such issues with the main box). The box is deeper than the 18” mesh liners HF sells so that’s not an option. I hunted around longer than I care to admit to find something that’d work and match the lower. Finally found it at Lowe’s. They have a nice thick 24” wide liner that worked perfect.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_47550-14510-1297467_1z11pfa__?productId=3137959&pl=1
The one actual issue with the 56” box are the latches on the top cabinet. If you read through the reviews on the link above you find this nugget of info:
It’s true that the top latches are different, but I didn’t think it was much of a problem until low and behold, one of them popped apart on me. All I did was accidentally let the latch slip and snap shut once. Note, it didn’t break. However, it is a reasonably poor design, but thankfully not that hard to rectify.
First off, I was not about to assume that the piece I needed was truly lost. It wasn’t that hard to pull out a few drawers and fish it out. There’s a little access port on the bottom of the latch retainer plate.
Drawer locks for the curious
So here’s the latch pulled apart. The problem is that that’s nothing retaining the finger catch against the rod. Pull it horizontally toward you and it just slips apart.
Solution: re-assemble with JBWeld.
No issues since. There's plenty of debate whether these would be up to the task of a professional mechanic, but I can say it's a heck of a lot of box for a minimum amount of dollars.
-Joel
Haven’t been posting much recently because I’ve been working my *** off on multiple fronts.
Good news is that at least I’ve been making some progress on the garage. Had an itch to write something worthwhile tonight after taking “$$$ JZ Money FC $$$” to task earlier today and feeling a bit like a **** about it (even if he did deserve it). So…
Tool Boxes:
I’m a pretty big fan of the Harbor Freight roller tool boxes. My wife bought me the big 56” box and top cabinet a few years back for my birthday.
http://www.harborfreight.com/56-in-11-drawer-glossy-red-industrial-roller-cabinet-67681.html
http://www.harborfreight.com/56-in-8-drawer-glossy-red-roller-cabinet-top-chest-61370.html
It’s rad but there a couple peculiarities with the top cabinet. The mesh liner they give you in the top cabinet is thin and lumpy (no such issues with the main box). The box is deeper than the 18” mesh liners HF sells so that’s not an option. I hunted around longer than I care to admit to find something that’d work and match the lower. Finally found it at Lowe’s. They have a nice thick 24” wide liner that worked perfect.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_47550-14510-1297467_1z11pfa__?productId=3137959&pl=1
The one actual issue with the 56” box are the latches on the top cabinet. If you read through the reviews on the link above you find this nugget of info:
It’s true that the top latches are different, but I didn’t think it was much of a problem until low and behold, one of them popped apart on me. All I did was accidentally let the latch slip and snap shut once. Note, it didn’t break. However, it is a reasonably poor design, but thankfully not that hard to rectify.
First off, I was not about to assume that the piece I needed was truly lost. It wasn’t that hard to pull out a few drawers and fish it out. There’s a little access port on the bottom of the latch retainer plate.
Drawer locks for the curious
So here’s the latch pulled apart. The problem is that that’s nothing retaining the finger catch against the rod. Pull it horizontally toward you and it just slips apart.
Solution: re-assemble with JBWeld.
No issues since. There's plenty of debate whether these would be up to the task of a professional mechanic, but I can say it's a heck of a lot of box for a minimum amount of dollars.
-Joel
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
The single biggest deficiency in the new garage has been electricity. When we moved in there were exactly two light bulbs and two outlets with two sockets a piece. I already wrote about the lights but when I posted they were still a bit jerry-rigged in there when last I left things. I'll get to that write up eventually.
In terms of sockets: between washer, drier and a sprinkler controller, there was only one lonely socket available and that was stashed behind the big tool box. I wasn’t very eager to drill into the box to mount a big power strip but I needed to do something. I started eyeballing the empty holes where the handles would go (never installed, because this doesn’t really move around)
…and came up with this.
Nice chunk of aluminum angle extrusion, plus some foam weather stripping to keep it from chaffing the box, and there we have it.
But wait, that’s just a hair crooked in the above shot and we can’t have that. Minor adjustments and OCD is happy again.
The single biggest deficiency in the new garage has been electricity. When we moved in there were exactly two light bulbs and two outlets with two sockets a piece. I already wrote about the lights but when I posted they were still a bit jerry-rigged in there when last I left things. I'll get to that write up eventually.
In terms of sockets: between washer, drier and a sprinkler controller, there was only one lonely socket available and that was stashed behind the big tool box. I wasn’t very eager to drill into the box to mount a big power strip but I needed to do something. I started eyeballing the empty holes where the handles would go (never installed, because this doesn’t really move around)
…and came up with this.
Nice chunk of aluminum angle extrusion, plus some foam weather stripping to keep it from chaffing the box, and there we have it.
But wait, that’s just a hair crooked in the above shot and we can’t have that. Minor adjustments and OCD is happy again.
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Workbench
After we moved into the new place, I sold off all the random boxes and benches I’d been using prior with an attempt to build a matched set. I’d had a couple Craftsman things (some modern some ancient) and I can say, the HF stuff stacks up pretty well against those.
I was pretty inspired by the Steevo bench from Garage Journal:
Full info here:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126086
It’s a great idea and by pulling off the casters the 44” HF tool boxes that Steevo used in his design, it ends up being a really nice height for a work bench. All these boxes are decently stout, use ball bearing rollers and generally are well built.
A few differences in my design: I’m only using 2x 44s along one wall. I wasn’t worried about having a little weight on the top deck since they are made to carry a top cabinet already. (Hence building a full up frame seem superfluous.) I already have the weld table if I need to put heavy things somewhere or be beating on the surface. I was planning on having the boxes spaces somewhat apart from one another so I could have a chair and “desk” mid span eventually. I wanted to use wood as the top surface (so I have a place to put cold beverages that won’t rust like the weld table.) ;-)
First step, making replacement leveling feet instead of casters. These are just stupid feet so I was trying to go fast and still ended up overbuilding them a bit (surprise, surprise right?). I sheared out a bunch of 1/8” plate at work rather than really go crazy and water jet the piece parts (but I at least thought about it).
Here’s the basic design tacked together.
A couple things of note: I shoved the feet all the way toward one edge to make the box just a little more stable (CA = earthquake potential). I also clocked them at 45 degrees to make a few gussets in there and spread out the load. The factory casters are 3/16” thick so I was wondering if 1/8” plate would be enough but the shop guys don’t like anyone going over 1/8” on the shear I was using.
After starring at this for a while I decided I still didn’t trust the 1/8” so I doubled up the main plate and did a quick fusion pass around the edges. For someone who’s still learning TIG, fusion (no filler) is a joy when the application works for it.
If you have access to a plasma cutter, do yourself a favor and rip the main plates out of 1/4" stock. The gussets would become unnecessary that way. I still manged to overbuild these after all (you guys never doubted me, I know).
Whenever you’ll welding a bunch on side of a work piece you always need to watch for weld deformation. I tried to mitigate by clamping two feet together before I burned in all the gussets.
I’m trying to learn how to build faster as it’s easy to get frustrated by lack of progress when time is short and you have an injured car sitting there and beginning for attention. One part of that process was using MIG rather than TIG as the appropriate technology in welding these up (I’m faster with that) and convincing myself that I didn’t need to weld both sides on every gusset. Here they are all burned in.
The leveling feet themselves are an all in one McMaster part. They have quite a few options but it’s easy to spend $25 in halves which adds up quickly and I couldn’t really see spening $200 on feet for boxes I got for $359 per (the $369 coupons are more common). Also, I really wanted something short since my feet were going to be a direct replacement for casters and not live in a long tube like Steevo’s. That said, I needed leveling feet or my top surface would never be flat. I’d already noticed that my slab has a little raised curl at the edge. While I had the boxes parked along the planned wall before doing the feet the drawers would slide open because the boxes were tipped a hair. That’s a great sign of the quality of the drawer bearings but still annoying when you don’t want it.
I ended up using McMaster P/N 4146T18
http://www.mcmaster.com/#4146t18/=zi9yua
They’re rated at 660 lb per, which seemed like enough but I wasn’t quite sure. When I got them in, they seemed crazy light weight so I almost said screw it and did something else.
65imp convinced me that geometric support is a big deal and that I should give it shot so I did. One advantage I had was that I was using 1/8” wall square tube and these are really recommended for something a touch thinner. They still drove in fine, but the thicker tube should give the edge that carries the load just a touch more support. Here they are: cleaned via some sand blasting, hit them with some clear coat to avoid rust (and match the aluminum trim a touch better), with feet assembled.
I almost forgot one step. I still did have a touch of weld deformation (edges curled up) so I bolted them together back to back like when I was welding but with a washer in the middle forcing a gap around the edges. Then I cranked down on the four corner hardware HARD and they flatted back out pretty nicely.
Time for assembly. But there’s was a flaw in my plan. I didn’t have a jack that would go low enough to drop these down onto the feet once the casters where gone (I ended up with only 1.5” or so to the floor). Unlike Steevo, I don't have a forklift at the ready. I debated calling in the troops and man-handling it with shoulder dollys, but then I spotted a few hardware points down low on the box and had an idea.
I grabbed some spare channel and made an interface for my high lift jack. Presto change-o, now I could grab the box by the side rather than the bottom edge. It’s m8 standard thread thread hardware and I can only assume were use used in the manufacturing process somehow.
Up:
Down:
One last trick, the leveling feet are pretty lightweight so when dropping down the first side it’ll be sitting at a big angle. As I started to set it down the first time I noticed the foot not looking happy so I bottomed out to have a bit better support when landing crooked.
Here we are comparing heights
And here’s both sides starting the leveling process.
I used plywood strips along three sides of the top surface and aluminum along the front edge to match the boxes factory trim.
Time to turn attention to the top deck. I have some exposed wood elsewhere in the garage (attic joists), laundry shelf, so I decided to make that a thing and warm up the look of the place a bit. I went hunting for a big piece of butcher block and eventually found that Lumber Liquidators had the best rates.
http://www.lumberliquidators.com/ll/c/lft-Maple-Butcher-Block-Countertop-Williamsburg-Butcher-Block-Co.-MABB12/10012578
I paid $359 for a 1.5” by 25” x 12’ piece. Ganahl Lumber wanted something like $540 for a 10’ stick. The 25” was a little wider than I needed since I still have aspirations for the crazy swing down stairs that would need to clear just in front of this bench. I decided to shear off 5” or so and make a stubby rear shelf integral to a stainless back splash.
Here’s the splash laid out. I sheared up a bunch of scrap and welded them all together. This was all done with TIG fusion, but I did hit both sides and filled the ends.
Went with straight butcher block oil for the top surface after some extra sanding. It’s amazing how much the grain pops when you do this. Picture gives the idea but doesn’t really do justice.
Here it is going together.
Note the end cap bits are separate from the main back splash as I wanted both ends tucked tight and I wasn’t sure I could hit that tight a tolerance building by hand. All hardware is countersunk (of course!)
The actual top deck is just under 10" long and I ended up with an nice spare chunk of butcher block that will someday become a sink surround. Use the whole buffalo or some such saying applies. Flip it around and here’s my workbench.
Last thing I'll mention is that I dig that the rear shelf floats. The ends do the brunt of the workload supporting twist while the uprights keep it from sagging.
-Joel
Workbench
After we moved into the new place, I sold off all the random boxes and benches I’d been using prior with an attempt to build a matched set. I’d had a couple Craftsman things (some modern some ancient) and I can say, the HF stuff stacks up pretty well against those.
I was pretty inspired by the Steevo bench from Garage Journal:
Full info here:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126086
It’s a great idea and by pulling off the casters the 44” HF tool boxes that Steevo used in his design, it ends up being a really nice height for a work bench. All these boxes are decently stout, use ball bearing rollers and generally are well built.
A few differences in my design: I’m only using 2x 44s along one wall. I wasn’t worried about having a little weight on the top deck since they are made to carry a top cabinet already. (Hence building a full up frame seem superfluous.) I already have the weld table if I need to put heavy things somewhere or be beating on the surface. I was planning on having the boxes spaces somewhat apart from one another so I could have a chair and “desk” mid span eventually. I wanted to use wood as the top surface (so I have a place to put cold beverages that won’t rust like the weld table.) ;-)
First step, making replacement leveling feet instead of casters. These are just stupid feet so I was trying to go fast and still ended up overbuilding them a bit (surprise, surprise right?). I sheared out a bunch of 1/8” plate at work rather than really go crazy and water jet the piece parts (but I at least thought about it).
Here’s the basic design tacked together.
A couple things of note: I shoved the feet all the way toward one edge to make the box just a little more stable (CA = earthquake potential). I also clocked them at 45 degrees to make a few gussets in there and spread out the load. The factory casters are 3/16” thick so I was wondering if 1/8” plate would be enough but the shop guys don’t like anyone going over 1/8” on the shear I was using.
After starring at this for a while I decided I still didn’t trust the 1/8” so I doubled up the main plate and did a quick fusion pass around the edges. For someone who’s still learning TIG, fusion (no filler) is a joy when the application works for it.
If you have access to a plasma cutter, do yourself a favor and rip the main plates out of 1/4" stock. The gussets would become unnecessary that way. I still manged to overbuild these after all (you guys never doubted me, I know).
Whenever you’ll welding a bunch on side of a work piece you always need to watch for weld deformation. I tried to mitigate by clamping two feet together before I burned in all the gussets.
I’m trying to learn how to build faster as it’s easy to get frustrated by lack of progress when time is short and you have an injured car sitting there and beginning for attention. One part of that process was using MIG rather than TIG as the appropriate technology in welding these up (I’m faster with that) and convincing myself that I didn’t need to weld both sides on every gusset. Here they are all burned in.
The leveling feet themselves are an all in one McMaster part. They have quite a few options but it’s easy to spend $25 in halves which adds up quickly and I couldn’t really see spening $200 on feet for boxes I got for $359 per (the $369 coupons are more common). Also, I really wanted something short since my feet were going to be a direct replacement for casters and not live in a long tube like Steevo’s. That said, I needed leveling feet or my top surface would never be flat. I’d already noticed that my slab has a little raised curl at the edge. While I had the boxes parked along the planned wall before doing the feet the drawers would slide open because the boxes were tipped a hair. That’s a great sign of the quality of the drawer bearings but still annoying when you don’t want it.
I ended up using McMaster P/N 4146T18
http://www.mcmaster.com/#4146t18/=zi9yua
They’re rated at 660 lb per, which seemed like enough but I wasn’t quite sure. When I got them in, they seemed crazy light weight so I almost said screw it and did something else.
65imp convinced me that geometric support is a big deal and that I should give it shot so I did. One advantage I had was that I was using 1/8” wall square tube and these are really recommended for something a touch thinner. They still drove in fine, but the thicker tube should give the edge that carries the load just a touch more support. Here they are: cleaned via some sand blasting, hit them with some clear coat to avoid rust (and match the aluminum trim a touch better), with feet assembled.
I almost forgot one step. I still did have a touch of weld deformation (edges curled up) so I bolted them together back to back like when I was welding but with a washer in the middle forcing a gap around the edges. Then I cranked down on the four corner hardware HARD and they flatted back out pretty nicely.
Time for assembly. But there’s was a flaw in my plan. I didn’t have a jack that would go low enough to drop these down onto the feet once the casters where gone (I ended up with only 1.5” or so to the floor). Unlike Steevo, I don't have a forklift at the ready. I debated calling in the troops and man-handling it with shoulder dollys, but then I spotted a few hardware points down low on the box and had an idea.
I grabbed some spare channel and made an interface for my high lift jack. Presto change-o, now I could grab the box by the side rather than the bottom edge. It’s m8 standard thread thread hardware and I can only assume were use used in the manufacturing process somehow.
Up:
Down:
One last trick, the leveling feet are pretty lightweight so when dropping down the first side it’ll be sitting at a big angle. As I started to set it down the first time I noticed the foot not looking happy so I bottomed out to have a bit better support when landing crooked.
Here we are comparing heights
And here’s both sides starting the leveling process.
I used plywood strips along three sides of the top surface and aluminum along the front edge to match the boxes factory trim.
Time to turn attention to the top deck. I have some exposed wood elsewhere in the garage (attic joists), laundry shelf, so I decided to make that a thing and warm up the look of the place a bit. I went hunting for a big piece of butcher block and eventually found that Lumber Liquidators had the best rates.
http://www.lumberliquidators.com/ll/c/lft-Maple-Butcher-Block-Countertop-Williamsburg-Butcher-Block-Co.-MABB12/10012578
I paid $359 for a 1.5” by 25” x 12’ piece. Ganahl Lumber wanted something like $540 for a 10’ stick. The 25” was a little wider than I needed since I still have aspirations for the crazy swing down stairs that would need to clear just in front of this bench. I decided to shear off 5” or so and make a stubby rear shelf integral to a stainless back splash.
Here’s the splash laid out. I sheared up a bunch of scrap and welded them all together. This was all done with TIG fusion, but I did hit both sides and filled the ends.
Went with straight butcher block oil for the top surface after some extra sanding. It’s amazing how much the grain pops when you do this. Picture gives the idea but doesn’t really do justice.
Here it is going together.
Note the end cap bits are separate from the main back splash as I wanted both ends tucked tight and I wasn’t sure I could hit that tight a tolerance building by hand. All hardware is countersunk (of course!)
The actual top deck is just under 10" long and I ended up with an nice spare chunk of butcher block that will someday become a sink surround. Use the whole buffalo or some such saying applies. Flip it around and here’s my workbench.
Last thing I'll mention is that I dig that the rear shelf floats. The ends do the brunt of the workload supporting twist while the uprights keep it from sagging.
-Joel
Last edited:
Duker
Well-known member
Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Looks Great Joel, enjoyed reading through the thread. I might have to try the concrete staining on a new shop I will be building.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Looks Great Joel, enjoyed reading through the thread. I might have to try the concrete staining on a new shop I will be building.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Last edited:
KCarGuy
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Wow...
Great Job.
Lots of Patience and I love the vision in what your trying to do.
Thanks for sharing and Keep them coming.
Wow...
Great Job.
Lots of Patience and I love the vision in what your trying to do.
Thanks for sharing and Keep them coming.
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Thanks. Trying to keep it a simple blend of metal and wood with the tool boxes planned as the dominate color. I really do want a functional shop first and foremost but if I can make it look nice at the same time that's a bonus.
Thanks. Trying to keep it a simple blend of metal and wood with the tool boxes planned as the dominate color. I really do want a functional shop first and foremost but if I can make it look nice at the same time that's a bonus.
jbmatth
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
Very well done, I really like the look of the bench top and the shelf is just icing on the cake. I'm also a big fan of the value of the HF boxes, I only have one for now but plan to get at least three more in the future. Two of those will become a workbench, the other will join my first in The Wall. My only complaint with them is that they don't have enough deep drawers, other than that I really like them.
JB
Very well done, I really like the look of the bench top and the shelf is just icing on the cake. I'm also a big fan of the value of the HF boxes, I only have one for now but plan to get at least three more in the future. Two of those will become a workbench, the other will join my first in The Wall. My only complaint with them is that they don't have enough deep drawers, other than that I really like them.
JB
jesse72
Well-known member
Re: Casa de Frijolee - a Gear Head's 2-car garage
your garage is coming along really nice and I really like the HF 44" cabinets built into the work bench, great idea with the feet and top too!
your garage is coming along really nice and I really like the HF 44" cabinets built into the work bench, great idea with the feet and top too!