Tools from the old world
- Thread starter Monte
- Start date
Never cared to much about coo until spending time on this forum. Now looking to try some English made tools. Currently looking for more second hand metric spanners. Does anyone know how the old British stuff compares to modern quality tools or older tools made in Germany? I've seen Bedford, old Britool, King **** and Gordon on Ebay. Thanks.
There's still new made in England tools to be had out there; try smith-Francis tools of Birmingham the owners of Snail-brand and Williams-Superslim for all sizes of spanners including Whitworth up to 2"! King **** of Birmingham still manufacture most types and sizes of spanners, Deltec industries of Fylde manufacture high quality impact sockets of all sizes as do ISS (international socket supplies) who also make spanners to, footprint tools of Sheffield still manufacture traditional plumbers, joiners and decorators tools, Visa hand tools of Leeds are the last comprehensive manufacturer of of hammers and striking tools in England and offers a vast array of hammers I didn't even know were still made!
Monument make handy pipe cutting tools in England
http://monument-tools.com/products/tools-for-plumbing-heating/copper-steel-pipe-cutters/
Maun Industries various types of pliers made in England
https://www.maunindustries.com/shop-all/
Flinn Garlick Ltd. make a large range of saws and planes
https://www.flinn-garlick-saws.co.uk/
Sheffield Spirit Levels Ltd.
https://www.sheffieldspiritlevels.co.uk/
Fisco Ltd. make tape measures
http://www.fisco.co.uk/tri-matic.html
Ashley Iles make chisels
http://www.ashleyiles.co.uk/
Melco make various tyre levers, wheel braces and stands
Norbar torque wrenches made in Banbury
https://www.norbar.com/en-us/produc...categoryname/torquewrenches/category_multid/1
https://www.norbar.com/Portals/0/No... Wrench Section.pdf?ver=2018-02-06-115904-107
http://monument-tools.com/products/tools-for-plumbing-heating/copper-steel-pipe-cutters/
Maun Industries various types of pliers made in England
https://www.maunindustries.com/shop-all/
Flinn Garlick Ltd. make a large range of saws and planes
https://www.flinn-garlick-saws.co.uk/
Sheffield Spirit Levels Ltd.
https://www.sheffieldspiritlevels.co.uk/
Fisco Ltd. make tape measures
http://www.fisco.co.uk/tri-matic.html
Ashley Iles make chisels
http://www.ashleyiles.co.uk/
Melco make various tyre levers, wheel braces and stands
Norbar torque wrenches made in Banbury
https://www.norbar.com/en-us/produc...categoryname/torquewrenches/category_multid/1
https://www.norbar.com/Portals/0/No... Wrench Section.pdf?ver=2018-02-06-115904-107
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dutchgray
Well-known member
The old stuff if not ruined from abuse or worn out is still good, you wont get modern flank drive type openings, but the best modern tools are definitely better. I would only consider Britool RJM series spanners for real use and not just collecting as they have a decent length and are nice to use, they changed them over the years, the older ones are nicer, but the small sizes tend to spread badly and are harder to find in good condition.
Er no, those Bahco jacks are standard Chinesium
Danish made Compac jacks aren't that much more
http://www.garageequipmentdirect.co.uk/contents/en-uk/d31_Trolley_jacks,_air_jacks.html
yeah you´re right. I wouldn´t buy them either. AC Hydraulic would be another choice Weber for bottle jacks.Re: English tools: https://www.thorhammer.com/
hautpot
Well-known member
Are danish people born with the instinct to lift heavy objects? I cant think of any german, english, or french hydraulic equipment LOL
IS there any way of finding this sort of thing out? I have a bit of Wera stuff and generally like it, but where their goods are made seems a little vague at best. They claim CZ for most of their gear, while folks on here seem to strongly believe that a lot of it is Taiwan. I wrote them a mail asking that very thing - from the perspective of a customer who has bought a couple of grand worth of Wera gear in recent years... I didn't get a response, which seemed quite poor to me.
So their torque wrenches... anyone know the manufacturer? If they are still ex-Norbar then the present deals are very tempting.
Okay, I should have googled before posting. Some reviews on the 7000A torque wrench showed a 'Made in Taiwan' on the packaging. This seems to have been the first in the present new series of wrenches which look quite unlike the previous ones which were clearly identical to Norbar other than the colours and marking.
So I suspect what is going on here is that Wera have broken away from Norbar and are pushing this new product line - which is presumably all made in Taiwan - with very competitive pricing. Makes sense.
So I suspect what is going on here is that Wera have broken away from Norbar and are pushing this new product line - which is presumably all made in Taiwan - with very competitive pricing. Makes sense.
steveo3002
Well-known member
It's my first crimper. Very simple to use.
It was the only model I could find in Brazil.
Similar to TE Connectivity / VW crimper
can you help with part numbers /places to buy ? id like a set of those
thanks
Thanks for the replies regarding English tools. Currently checking out the links. I suspected the old stuff may not be as precisely made and finished as modern tools. Looking into King ****, it looks like they make spanners and sockets in England but the rest of their tools are rebrands with European origins.
Disappointed their screwdrivers are not made in England considering the packaging but the quality may be better as a result. Witte?
Disappointed their screwdrivers are not made in England considering the packaging but the quality may be better as a result. Witte?
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Thanks for the replies regarding English tools. Currently checking out the links. I suspected the old stuff may not be as precisely made and finished as modern tools. Looking into King ****, it looks like they make spanners and sockets in England but the rest of their tools are rebrands with European origins.
Disappointed their screwdrivers are not made in England considering the packaging but the quality may be better as a result. Witte?
I think their screwdrivers are of German origin possibly Athlet, surprisingly the new Stanley magnum screwdrivers are made in England and are quite comprehensive in their offerings. To the best of my knowledge King-**** only makes spanners and wrenches themselves, the smith Francis Snail-brand are the best made British spanners available today, very heavy duty patterns in phosphate finish though chrome finish is available by request
Dave455
Well-known member
You're right to take notice of c.o.o, it's still about the best indicator of quality there is, especially if you factor in the age of the tool too, as these things change.
You could do worse than look at King **** tools for spanners. In my opinion they are not quite up there with the like of Snap On and Nepros, but they are decent, nicely chromed, and seem to be reasonably tough. Price isn't up there with Snap On either!
Of the older British tools, most of it is pretty top end. Certainly on a par with most American or German. Britool was always top end. Love their ring spanners, still have mine in daily use today, and like Dutch, their long series combo's were awesome! Bedford was always top end too. Makers such as Gordon and King **** were always servicable, but perhaps not quite as well finished.
You have two problems. Firstly, in the case of Britool you need to know WHEN your tool was made. Stuff from the 50's 60's and early 70's was superb. After that some items detiorated a little, though other stuff such as sockets and ring spanners were good till the late 80's. After that it all went downhill fast. Experienced users know the quality from the style of the tool and the markings, you will be best to see the tools rather than buying online.
The second problem is availability. Most of this stuff was made in A/F or Whitworth sizes, and only a little in metric. Factor in that the U.K. has a lot of tool users but few tool collectors, and you may struggle to get everything you want in metric, in good shape!
Personally, while I love British tools, I can't be bothered to faff about acquiring say a full set of Britool long combination wrenches in metric. While I have them in Whitworth and A/F sizes, I bought new foreign ones for metric.
While I say that c.o.o. is important, I'm happy to buy from any country that produces decent stuff! American tools have always been top end, but that doesn't mean buying Snap On necessarily. Wright, SK, and U.S. made Williams are all great makes to use.
German tools seem to be consistently good too. I have some Stahlwille and some Hazet and all are superb. (Hazet 600 combination wrenches are every bit as tough as the old Britool, and also very similar). You have to bear in mind that if Germany didn't have the euro, the DM would be a very strong currency and these tools would be much more expensive here. Personally I feel that for U.K. buyers, German tools bought from a competitive online dealer (TBS Aachen?) represent the best value out there at the mo!
Dave455
Well-known member
In the U.K. all the packaging is marked with the country of manufacture, so there shouldn't be shy doubt!
All the screwdrivers that I've seen are made in the Czech Republic. I have no problem with that and experience shows the blades of these drivers are very tough.
Every ratchet I've seen has been made in Taiwan. I actually bought their 1/4 inch bit ratchet knowing this, and it's great! Some Taiwanese tools have improved over the years but you need to be choosy.
In my local town I can buy these bit ratchets, or Facom 440 series spanners, and both seem decent. I can also buy 'generic Taiwanese' socket sets under many brand names, all of which are total shite!
Regarding COO of German brands KC tools in the States seem to use import documentation to determine origin. So they correctly id. this
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-075394-torque-wrench-8-60-nm-reversible-ratchet-3-8-drive/
and this
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-075393-torque-wrench-1-25-nm-reversible-ratchet-1-4-drive/
Which incidentally is more expensive Norbars in the UK.
Most Wera is Czech made
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-003692-koloss-ratchet-1-2-drive/
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-004004-zyklop-ratchet-1-4-drive-w-switch-lever/
Taiwan
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-073230-bit-ratchet-1-4-drive/
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-075394-torque-wrench-8-60-nm-reversible-ratchet-3-8-drive/
and this
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-075393-torque-wrench-1-25-nm-reversible-ratchet-1-4-drive/
Which incidentally is more expensive Norbars in the UK.
Most Wera is Czech made
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-003692-koloss-ratchet-1-2-drive/
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-004004-zyklop-ratchet-1-4-drive-w-switch-lever/
Taiwan
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-073230-bit-ratchet-1-4-drive/
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3 new Vessel screwdrivers, for <10usd.
+ Vessel 930 megadora 2+150, tang-thru. Old version, not latest Jawsfit.
+ Vessel 6300 2+100
+ Vessl 5300 8-150
The 930 megadora alone normally costs 10 usd.
all very well made. I am happy.
Yamaguchi nail puller, 2nd but unused, 300mm long
+ Vessel 930 megadora 2+150, tang-thru. Old version, not latest Jawsfit.
+ Vessel 6300 2+100
+ Vessl 5300 8-150
The 930 megadora alone normally costs 10 usd.
all very well made. I am happy.
Yamaguchi nail puller, 2nd but unused, 300mm long
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Hi,
Sorry for my bad english. I from Brasil.
This crimper is obsolete.
TE Connectivity 825514-1
http://www.te.com/commerce/Document...82A1pdfEnglishS_411-18082_A1.pdf825514-1
Link:
https://store.crimptools.com/te-con...1-crimp-tool-mfg-amp-tyco-condition-used.html
The danish and the spanish
--> http://mega.esthis:
NWS offers them:
https://shop.nws-tools.de/en/electro-joining-tools/crimping-lever-pliers/crimp-grip-pliers.html
Knipex:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B003D5ZV44/?tag=atomicindustr-21
Disappointed their screwdrivers are not made in England considering the packaging but the quality may be better as a result. Witte?
Made by SKG www.skg-tools.cz
now czech, a while ago german...
This Italian company perhaps have the largest range of jacks and vehicle lifts
http://www.omcn.it/en/automotive-car-motor-bike-truck-lifts/
Another one that even Monte doesn't mention much CIZETA s.r.l
http://cizetasrl.com/en/short-range-and-high-lift-short-range-with-end-stroke-valve/
If I did't already have a Danish Compac high lift jack I probably would of bought their CZ 20 AF model which is similar
http://cizetasrl.com/wp-content/upl...A-GRANDE-ALZATA-CON-VALVOLA-DI-FINE-CORSA.pdf
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A good example of things not being so clear is this:
https://www.kctoolco.com/wera-056491-tool-check-plus-bit-ratchet-set-with-sockets-imperial/
The individual pages on each part show the ratchet and sockets as Taiwan, while the bits and bit holder are CZ. It is then presumably packaged in CZ and the set is then sold as "Made in CZ". This is probably perfectly legit, but a bit deceptive, IMHO it should say Taiwan/CZ.
With their new range of torque wrenches, they have simply marked them "Made in Taiwan" which I respect a lot more than the above.
According to KC tools site, the Zyklop ratchet handles (the metal push-through & switch type and also the swivel head type) are all Made in CZ. Only the Zyklop mini 1/4" hex drive one is Taiwan.
Anyhow, endless discussion about COO on here, the rest of the world don't even notice much less care. Other than the sloppy fit of the 1/4" drive sockets/extensions I am very happy with my Wera stuff. The designs are clever, well thought through and very attractive - all of that is no doubt done in Germany.
Interestingly, I compared some recently purchased smooth and firm fitting Koken 1/4" drive stuff with my sloppy fitting Wera. The clearance on the actual square drive parts were as good or better on the Wera, so seems to be the ball detent geometry being not quite right to hold the accessories tightly.
Made in England.
Some of the old British spanners have a kind of a cool style to them. Like the Gordon double ring.
Another one: Mazzola
http://www.mazzola-garagequipment.com/en/carrelli.htm
these from Ravalioli look danish.....:
https://ravaglioli.com/en/products/other-products/jacks/
hautpot
Well-known member
VBW has new telescoping bolt cutters.
I think CIZETA make those floor/trolley jacks for Mazzola.
Mazzola make the more specialized stuff.
It's curious the Italian companies don't try to market their floor jacks in the US.
It's an open goal, there are no US manufacturers of floor jacks, it's mostly China jacks made of pot metal like this...Wilton 11106 vise !
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Made in England.
My Dad's got one of those Britool torque wrenches, it has a nice, definite click action!
I don't fancy the spanners much though, particularly the small ones. The heads are huge and likely to get in the way? Interesting to see though.
Gutted! Ordered Bosch 0615990H1Z (see below) grinder set from Amazon.de (seller bauxxl) on 20-March, item listed as in stock. Was marked dispatched 22-March, and was due for delivery today.
I was surprised by an email this AM to say my purchase had been refunded due to "customer return" (I neither received, nor returned it). Then emailed bauxxl to be told it was out of stock. It would have been nice if they'd told me that originally, rather than waiting 2 weeks to find they'd lied about shipping it
Will no doubt be another couple of weekends lost on my project now while I make other arrangements. Anyhow, fair warning to anyone who might come across this seller - probably worth contacting them before ordering to confirm availability.
I was surprised by an email this AM to say my purchase had been refunded due to "customer return" (I neither received, nor returned it). Then emailed bauxxl to be told it was out of stock. It would have been nice if they'd told me that originally, rather than waiting 2 weeks to find they'd lied about shipping it
Will no doubt be another couple of weekends lost on my project now while I make other arrangements. Anyhow, fair warning to anyone who might come across this seller - probably worth contacting them before ordering to confirm availability.
Might be possible. Many jacks look very similar. I guess there are just a handful of actual manufacturers...
I guess the almighty Snap-On as well as other tool trucks have their hands on the professional jack market and the private user usually don´t want to spend the money. There are some exceptions like OTC and Griots who sell spanish made jacks.
Over here the big box stores are usually (except the Bahco ones i posted) filled with cheaper jacks between 23 and 129 Euro. The professional stores usually sell AC Hydraulic or Compac.
Probably not.Is it right that the FLEX cordless tools are Milwaukee?
Chervon, Flex owner makes them most likely.http://global.chervongroup.com/
http://www.devon.com.cn/en/
Made in Russia and made in ChinaGutted! Ordered Bosch 0615990H1Z (see below) grinder set from Amazon.de (seller bauxxl) on 20-March, item listed as in stock. Was marked dispatched 22-March, and was due for delivery today.
I was surprised by an email this AM to say my purchase had been refunded due to "customer return" (I neither received, nor returned it). Then emailed bauxxl to be told it was out of stock. It would have been nice if they'd told me that originally, rather than waiting 2 weeks to find they'd lied about shipping it
Will no doubt be another couple of weekends lost on my project now while I make other arrangements. Anyhow, fair warning to anyone who might come across this seller - probably worth contacting them before ordering to confirm availability.
iirc there was a recall on the large grinders...
edit:
https://www.electricalsafetyfirst.org.uk/product-recalls/2017/01/bosch-pws-and-gws-angle-grinders/
https://www.anglegrindercare.com/en_UK/form
make sure you get the latest version...
Made in Russia and made in China
iirc there was a recall on the large grinders...
edit:
https://www.electricalsafetyfirst.org.uk/product-recalls/2017/01/bosch-pws-and-gws-angle-grinders/
https://www.anglegrindercare.com/en_UK/form
make sure you get the latest version...
Good tips Monte, thanks.
Any other suggestions at a similar price point? I'm mainly interested in the large grinder, but as I'd burned up (literally, it caught fire) my smaller Metabo while cutting concrete I thought I might replace it as well with this bundle.I see quite a few Compacs lurking in the corner of garages here in the UK.
In Australia the importer has chosen red instead of the traditional hammered green finish and the current green/ black
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Might be possible. Many jacks look very similar. I guess there are just a handful of actual manufacturers...
I guess the almighty Snap-On as well as other tool trucks have their hands on the professional jack market and the private user usually don´t want to spend the money. There are some exceptions like OTC and Griots who sell spanish made jacks.
Over here the big box stores are usually (except the Bahco ones i posted) filled with cheaper jacks between 23 and 129 Euro. The professional stores usually sell AC Hydraulic or Compac.
Probably not.
http://global.chervongroup.com/
http://www.devon.com.cn/en/
Oh no, another great company will be going down that road... I am wondering what will happen in a few years. Would it be any good tools for professionals or we all get the chinesium disposable ones?
make sure you get the latest version...
Make sure you get the made in Germany one!
Sent from my SM-A510F using Tapatalk
Have you looked at other brands like Fein, Flex, Suhner, Metabo and Makita that I think all produced certain models in Germany? Not 100% on makita.
Sent from my SM-A510F using Tapatalk
Cheers, I've ordered the Metabo W22-230MVT for £115 delivered (tomorrow allegedly), so a reasonable price, though no case. Apparently made in Germany:
So, who is currently making cast or forged bench vices in Europe and the US?
I've come up with, in no particular order;
1) FZA in Italy. They offer models made of forged steel, cast Iron or cast steel. The also now make Leinen vises and perhaps for some other tool companies too
http://www.agenziaforte.com/download/fza_mcp_morse/Catalistino-FZA-MCP.pdf
2)GRESSEL in Switzerland
http://www.gressel.ch/storage/brochures/20_AX_PS.pdf
3)RIDGID-Peddinghaus. Steel drop forged in Germany
4) HEUER. Drop forged steel made in Germany. Available from numerous outlets online so I guess the largest Western manufacturer. The smaller vises are good value in the EU. I own the 125mm version. The website shows the forged parts. https://www.heuer.de/en/vices/vice/
5)DOLEX. Forged in France.
https://www.dolex.fr/en/
6)PENN stahlgeschmiedet Austria
http://www.penn.at/stahlgeschmiedet/produkte/schraubstock/technische-daten/
7)YORK. Made in the Czech Republic. Their pre-war 1936 model is what the later Wilton bullet design was based on
http://www.york.cz/en/workshop-bench-vices-york-text
8)KUPPER. Made in Germany. Their cheaper non-forged line is cheaper than some Chinese made brands. https://www.friedrich-kuepper.de/pr...egory_name=Küpper+Schraubstöcke&no_children=1
9)KANCA made in Turkey.Their forged steel vices are similar to Heuer and Peddinghaus. Also an interesting blacksmiths vice is available. Pdf catalogue here:
http://www.kanca.com.tr/download/pdf/ElAletleri_EN.pdf
10) SCHLEGEL made in Germany up until circa 2010. Some NOS still around. Design similar to Leinen
11)BERGEON Swiss made watchmakers vices. Expensive
https://www.hswalsh.com/product/bergeon-2021-watchmakers-bench-vice-hv2021
12)UNIOR Slovenian made.
http://www.uniortools.com/cgi-bin/cm...80&prod=128663
13)WILTON. Only high end models US made. Interesting this small one looks like it was sourced from York according to the COO
https://www.zoro.com/wilton-portabl...light-duty-cbv-100/i/G2471637/#specifications
14) REED. The big ones are made in the US, the smaller stuff too ?
https://www.reedmfgco.com/en/products/vises/combination-bench-and-pipe-vises/
15) YOST. Mid-price forged steel model is made in Taiwan.Cast iron China. Are the expensive industrial grade models US made ?
http://www.yostvises.com/products/bench-vises/industrial-grade/combination-vise.html
16) SWINDENS made in England since 1928
http://www.swindens.org/our-products/4593157800
17) BISON made in Poland. Some large 10" models 61 Kg
http://www.bison-bial.com/vises/bench-vises
18) MORGAN traditional US made
http://www.milwtool.com/v_mach.htm
Photos bellow L/R
Penn, Ridgid, Gressel,
Heuer, Heuer, Kanka, Leinen
I've come up with, in no particular order;
1) FZA in Italy. They offer models made of forged steel, cast Iron or cast steel. The also now make Leinen vises and perhaps for some other tool companies too
http://www.agenziaforte.com/download/fza_mcp_morse/Catalistino-FZA-MCP.pdf
2)GRESSEL in Switzerland
http://www.gressel.ch/storage/brochures/20_AX_PS.pdf
3)RIDGID-Peddinghaus. Steel drop forged in Germany
4) HEUER. Drop forged steel made in Germany. Available from numerous outlets online so I guess the largest Western manufacturer. The smaller vises are good value in the EU. I own the 125mm version. The website shows the forged parts. https://www.heuer.de/en/vices/vice/
5)DOLEX. Forged in France.
https://www.dolex.fr/en/
6)PENN stahlgeschmiedet Austria
http://www.penn.at/stahlgeschmiedet/produkte/schraubstock/technische-daten/
7)YORK. Made in the Czech Republic. Their pre-war 1936 model is what the later Wilton bullet design was based on
http://www.york.cz/en/workshop-bench-vices-york-text
8)KUPPER. Made in Germany. Their cheaper non-forged line is cheaper than some Chinese made brands. https://www.friedrich-kuepper.de/pr...egory_name=Küpper+Schraubstöcke&no_children=1
9)KANCA made in Turkey.Their forged steel vices are similar to Heuer and Peddinghaus. Also an interesting blacksmiths vice is available. Pdf catalogue here:
http://www.kanca.com.tr/download/pdf/ElAletleri_EN.pdf
10) SCHLEGEL made in Germany up until circa 2010. Some NOS still around. Design similar to Leinen
11)BERGEON Swiss made watchmakers vices. Expensive
https://www.hswalsh.com/product/bergeon-2021-watchmakers-bench-vice-hv2021
12)UNIOR Slovenian made.
http://www.uniortools.com/cgi-bin/cm...80&prod=128663
13)WILTON. Only high end models US made. Interesting this small one looks like it was sourced from York according to the COO
https://www.zoro.com/wilton-portabl...light-duty-cbv-100/i/G2471637/#specifications
14) REED. The big ones are made in the US, the smaller stuff too ?
https://www.reedmfgco.com/en/products/vises/combination-bench-and-pipe-vises/
15) YOST. Mid-price forged steel model is made in Taiwan.Cast iron China. Are the expensive industrial grade models US made ?
http://www.yostvises.com/products/bench-vises/industrial-grade/combination-vise.html
16) SWINDENS made in England since 1928
http://www.swindens.org/our-products/4593157800
17) BISON made in Poland. Some large 10" models 61 Kg
http://www.bison-bial.com/vises/bench-vises
18) MORGAN traditional US made
http://www.milwtool.com/v_mach.htm
Photos bellow L/R
Penn, Ridgid, Gressel,
Heuer, Heuer, Kanka, Leinen
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