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Snap-On Dual 80 Origins Uncovered!!!

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ngk22r

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ok here it is (note: these ratcheting wrenches were made before the dual 80 ratchets came out.)

This Blue-Point wrench I picked up in 2006 just to let you guys know:

(sorry for the cell phone pic)

Here is a good ol' 13mm Blue Point Ratcheting Wrench:
5150649366_c9167d34ce_z.jpg


Now you flip the wrench to the back to expose the snap ring, remove ring and collar:
5150649542_3fc2e39cd7_z.jpg


And now all the guts come out to expose the inside, which looks very familiar I might say....
5150039701_978b54d07a_z.jpg



And the insides of a dual 80 snap-on ratchet:
dual80broke2.jpg
 
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mrholeshot

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Thanks for taking the time to do this and show it to us. While other may not want to know the truth I for one do. I can't say for sure where the internals are built but feel pretty sure if they were made in the US the ratches would still have USA on them. Nobody can convince me otherwise.
 
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ngk22r

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I'm not saying the parts are from Taiwan, just pointing out that Snap-on had the design before the Dual 80 ratchets officially came out. You know that Snap-on designed the system, I think it was tested in the Blue-point wrenches then made into the Snap-on version of the Flank drive plus ratcheting wrench and then brought into the ratchet.

BY NO MEANS AM I SAYING THAT THE DUAL 80 IS NOT MADE IN THE USA.

Another thing I noticed is on the Blue-point parts a number is stamped on each pawl. I just posted this to show the origin of the system and the great R&D into it.
 
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4000xt

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ngk22r said:
I'm not saying the parts are from Taiwan, just pointing out that Snap-on had the design before the Dual 80 ratchets officially came out. You know that Snap-on designed the system, I think it was tested in the Blue-point wrenches then made into the Snap-on version of the Flank drive plus ratcheting wrench and then brought into the ratchet.

BY NO MEANS AM I SAYING THAT THE DUAL 80 IS NOT MADE IN THE USA.

Another thing I noticed is on the Blue-point parts a number is stamped on each pawl. I just posted this to show the origin of the system and the great R&D into it.
Click to expand...

I would be surpised if the part was not from Taiwan if they already make it over there. With the USA stamp being taken off the ratchet. I know someone said they took it off due to other reason but people do lie folks. I dont trust most people as far as I can throw them even more so with people I don't know wanting my money.
 
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ngk22r

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One more thing, at this point I really dont care anymore about the USA stamping. To me its now a new generation styling of a clean design (and maybe the USA is a vintage thing now). The tools are still the best quality I have ever used. We can all ***** and moan about the stamp but I now look at the engineering of the tool. The thing I wish is that the 3/8 ratchets would have the same logo as the 1/4 and 1/2 but it did not stop me from buying up a ridiculous amount of the new Dual 80 ratchets.
 
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mrholeshot

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ngk22r said:
One more thing, at this point I really dont care anymore about the USA stamping. To me its now a new generation styling of a clean design (and maybe the USA is a vintage thing now). The tools are still the best quality I have ever used. We can all ***** and moan about the stamp but I now look at the engineering of the tool. The thing I wish is that the 3/8 ratchets would have the same logo as the 1/4 and 1/2 but it did not stop me from buying up a ridiculous amount of the new Dual 80 ratchets.
Click to expand...

Will you feel the same way when a company like Duralast comes out with a Dual 80 design for 1/3 the money? The style of the ratchet is very old, do you really think a USA stamp takes away from the overall design of the ratchet. They could have stamped the ratchet in the handle where the model number is and not messed with the clean design. USA a "Vintage thing" I don't think so.
 
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ngk22r

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I dont have any issue with duralast, actually I have their finetooth 3/8 ratchet and it work great!
 
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Spam16v

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Didn't they show the making of this ratchet on How It's Made? These ppl definitely look 'merican to me. Bunch of big ornery looking bearded dudes, and some women doing the small parts work, doesn't look to be done overseas.


yeah, here it is.
 
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cglasgow

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They couldn't fit "Assembled in the USA from foreign and domestic components" on the ratchet head.... ;-)
 
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mrholeshot

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I was under the impression that the Snap-On rep didn't give a straight answer. Whiel it may seem like beating a dead horse to you Snap-On guys it's an topic of concern to some of the end users. If it was a non-issue you Snappy guys wouldn't be holding back the USA marked units for yourself. That alone tells you it's an issue. Maybe the issue is just more of an issue than to others. That dead horse isn't really dead, just a Taiwan induced coma
 
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lipadj46

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mrholeshot said:
I was under the impression that the Snap-On rep didn't give a straight answer. Whiel it may seem like beating a dead horse to you Snap-On guys it's an topic of concern to some of the end users. If it was a non-issue you Snappy guys wouldn't be holding back the USA marked units for yourself. That alone tells you it's an issue. Maybe the issue is just more of an issue than to others. That dead horse isn't really dead, just a Taiwan induced coma
Click to expand...

No he asked the CEO at some company convention and the he said they were made in the US. There is an epic thread around somewhere with that bit of info in it. Personally I don't care if the pawl or gear is made in Taiwan.
 
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Black89LX

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lipadj46 said:
No he asked the CEO at some company convention and the he said they were made in the US. There is an epic thread around somewhere with that bit of info in it. Personally I don't care if the pawl or gear is made in Taiwan.
Click to expand...

Same here, dual 80s kick ***
 
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jk47

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Spam16v said:
Didn't they show the making of this ratchet on How It's Made? These ppl definitely look 'merican to me. Bunch of big ornery looking bearded dudes, and some women doing the small parts work, doesn't look to be done overseas.


yeah, here it is.
Click to expand...

Watch closely... The gear going into the ratchet is not fine tooth...
 
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cranky

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products made in taiwan could still be good quality. i dont know why people get so touchy about the USA. there was a thread on here a couple days ago about some stanley screwdrivers which were made in USA and the quality is very poor. the USA stamp is not like it used to be as there is more poor quality stuff with the stamp now than before. as long as snap on are still making good tools and they do the job they will not drop places on my list of the best tools.
 
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MrMark

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The problem for the people that believe the SO ratchet is not marked USA because of foreign components is that SO also stopped marking their pliers USA and there is no doubt those are made here.

Snap-on has done marketing research and most of their customers (as is well seen on this site even) don't care about COO, just whether they can get it warrantied and on credit and whether it works. Kind of like most of America today. I think that the Tool Truck operators will tell you that their customers never raise COO. Most Americans buy strictly on price and would rather collect 10 lower quality items than 1 good one. It works just fine is the new American mantra.

Get your Snap-on while you still can if you care about it being made in the USA.
 
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Hiball

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jk47 said:
My bad... Still does not show that component being manufactured.
Click to expand...

They dont show the Screws being Made either but that doesnt take away from the fact that the Dual 80 tech ratchets are one of the Best selling Ratchets ever made. Im not a big fan of the Missing USA stamp but theres no Questioning the Quality or Companies willingness to stand behind there product. I guess in the End it comes down to buying a product that is gonna fit your Needs and fulfill your expectations as a Consumer. I can honestly say after using the Ratchets for Over a Year i have yet to have a Workmanship complaint.
 
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scott37300

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It would be great if snap on would give a deffinate answer one way or another to set this to rest. The website says USA, pretty sure snap on's lawyers wouldn't let them put that if it wasn't true.

I do think that if they are made in the US than snap on should be proud to put that on the ratchet. China tools are proud to write the COO on their tools. And I do agree that by snap on not putting the COO on the tools leads people to think bad things are to come.

I do agree that there is no point to arguing any of this since nothing can be proved one way or the other, just speculation until snap on comes out and proves one way or another. But it would be a sad day if snap on followed the ways of mac and others by moving production over seas. Hopefully removing the made in US stamp isn't a hint on where snap on is heading.
 
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GeorgiaHybrid

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lipadj46 said:
No he asked the CEO at some company convention and the he said they were made in the US. There is an epic thread around somewhere with that bit of info in it. Personally I don't care if the pawl or gear is made in Taiwan.
Click to expand...

I don't know about Chad but I was at the Orlando dealer convention and talked to a LOT of people about this issue. I even talked to the guys working in the plant they are made at and yes, they talked a foreign language to most of you. Luckily enough, I understand Southern and can tell you that they are made here in the good old USA.

Word on the street is that some idiot higher up at Snap-on took the USA stamp off to get people used to the idea and to appease some "overseas" buyers. I still think it is a load of BS but for now, they are made here.
 
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jk47

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Hiball said:
They dont show the Screws being Made either but that doesnt take away from the fact that the Dual 80 tech ratchets are one of the Best selling Ratchets ever made. Im not a big fan of the Missing USA stamp but theres no Questioning the Quality or Companies willingness to stand behind there product. I guess in the End it comes down to buying a product that is gonna fit your Needs and fulfill your expectations as a Consumer. I can honestly say after using the Ratchets for Over a Year i have yet to have a Workmanship complaint.
Click to expand...

No complaints with the quality what so ever. My gripe with SO is the COO issue's that have been slowly popping up with numerous tools. I would like to see the savings of cheap foreign labor passed on to the consumer, that's all.
 
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Hiball

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scott37300 said:
I do agree that there is no point to arguing any of this since nothing can be proved one way or the other, just speculation until snap on comes out and proves one way or another.
Click to expand...

Im Quite sure there has been numerous Customer Service Emails stating that its a "Globalization" movement. They are not the only company that is interested in venturing into this market.

From the Wrights home page.

Although we are made in the U.S.A., our reach is global. We're supporting the global infrastructure with reach in areas such as Dubai, Spain, and Russia. We make heavy-duty hand tools you have come to depend on in industries such as Refinery, Power Generation, Distribution & Transmission, Mining, and Wind Turbines. All around the world end-users know if they need a heavy-duty hand tool they can rely on and keep them safe, they need a Wright Tool

 
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oldtools

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Just keep thing simple.

No "USA" stamp = not made in America
"USA" stamp = made in America
 
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Hiball

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jk47 said:
No complaints with the quality what so ever. My gripe with SO is the COO issue's that have been slowly popping up with numerous tools. I would like to see the savings of cheap foreign labor passed on to the consumer, that's all.
Click to expand...

Have you noticed any decline in Quality from this alledged "Cheap foreign Labor" ? Yeah.. Me neither..
 
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MrMark

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Scott, I agree with you but China Tools are not proud to put COO on their tools. Far from it. Very seldom do you actually see China Tools with China actually on the tool. They usually put it in 4 point font on the packaging that gets thrown away and the only reason that they put it there is that US law requires it, for the most part. Gearwrench, for example, does not even put Taiwan on their tools, let alone China, where most of them are now made.

If you are Snap-on, and in the business of making money, and your customer base is mainly insensitive to COO as long as quality can be maintained, what are you going to do? You almost have an obligation to outsource to return maximum shareholder value. That is why this endless COO debate always needs to begin and end with the consumer and the purchasing power of the consumer.

The ONLY way Snap-on has been able to be so successful for so long and have high prices and US manufacturing is the Tool Truck Credit model whereupon mechanics finance high value and expensive tools that they could not otherwise afford.
 
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Bull

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MrMark said:
It works just fine is the new American mantra.
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I don't have any dog in the SO COO race.

But I would like respectfully to submit that the above quote isn't true. The original American mantra was about being thrifty, paying cash, not going into debt by using credit, saving for the future etc. That often meant making do with what you had, buying stuff (tools, groceries, cars) that would satisfy your needs for utility without flash or extravagance or perhaps even excellence. This is a similar philosophy to what allowed the Japanese people to rebuild their economy after WWII. I know about this philosophy because I am a child born to parents who grew up in the depression, and whose grandparents were poor farmers and coal miners who came here from Poland, Lithuania, and Germany and busted *** to find a toehold in the New World.

Then, people started buying way, way above their actual means by relying on credit and payment plans. Every average shmuck wanted the best car, house and yes, tools. Isn't this how so many folks buy SO tools, on credit?

Credit and debt have been the "new" American way, much to our detriment. Now that the economy has been in the crapper for a while, maybe people are getting back to their thrifty roots, which are partially responsible for the originally powerful nature of our entire society.
 
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