PB Swiss leaving USA market?
- Thread starter Danglerb
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american lockpicker
Banned
I hope not.
Stuey
Well-known member
Nope. Amazon/Small Parts lowered the prices too much so the other distributors complained to PB Swiss until PB Swiss dropped them as a distributor. At least that's what all signs point to.
Jeff
Well-known member
joeswamp
Well-known member
They're about the best screwdrivers I've ever seen, even at full msrp.
Wow, that would be like Procter and Gamble dumping Wal Mart because Chugwater Minimarket whined.
slipjointed
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That's how I feel. I got really close to ordering four screwdrivers for my toolbag, and it was almost $60 with shipping. At that price, I'd just buy snap on or something.
blue dog
Banned
I am glad i went nutty last year when the PB Swiss madness was happening on amazon. I bought around $400.00 worth of pb stuff, and am very happy with it all. If i bought the same stuff at full pop, i bet i would have been into all of it for closer to a grand.
Stuey
Well-known member
It happens.
The specific language with which it was explained to me strongly suggested that one or more of the prior distributors definitely caused a fuss.
Other manufacturers have similar minimum published price policies, so it's not that far fetched to imagine.
Amazon didn't carry a large stock for very long, and so I imagine that maybe PB Swiss didn't recognize their true sales potential.
I haven't puchased any PB Swiss since my orders with Amazon, and probably won't. Maybe if Count on Tools has another 20%-off Black Friday sale, but maybe not. Even at 20%-off, their prices are a bit high for my liking.
@Stuey: For what its worth Black friday was actually 30% off but only for 1 day. Also, if you happen to be shopping in the clearance area at their website it helps too. I also have not purchased anything from them direct, but I might be tempted to get a few select things if that discount applies again. Basically it brings the super expensive down closer to what you'd pay for Klein at Home Depot.
slipjointed
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Same here.
I don't have anything personal against Count on Tools or Toollady, but the unbending high prices and lack of warranty here just are the 1-2 punch that takes them right off my list.
Being that I have to pay a large amount of what a given tool originally cost, just to get it warrantied, I'd rather just buy two of another cheaper brand. I can buy two Wera, Felo, or Wiha drivers for the cost of one PB swiss, and if you count in the cost of the one PB Swiss plus warranty, you could potentially purchase three of another brand driver.
On top of that, both of the US resellers charge minimum $10 shipping, so you're marking your cost up by 10-20% instantly depending on the size of your order.
Add the fact that I can get many other VERY high quality screwdriver brands for around $30 a set with free shipping, and the PB Swiss stuff suddenly becomes quite unattractive.
Lets hope they bring them back to amazon. I agree that pay-for-warranty thing is pretty ridiculous when you are already the most expensive in the market. If they want to be so exclusive with distribution they should really be offering FREE shipping on all orders and FREE warranty service.
There really is not room in this country for another premium tool brand that no one has heard of. Be it Beta, PB or Triangle. Joe homeowner is not going to work that hard or spend that much to get a tool that he has never heard. Brands like Klein and Proto are known by professional customers and have those brands have wide distribution. For most people in this country there is no need for these new brands.
I love picking up a good deal but feeding the Garage Journal bottom feeders is probably not the business model any of these foreign manufactures had in mind whey they came here.
I love picking up a good deal but feeding the Garage Journal bottom feeders is probably not the business model any of these foreign manufactures had in mind whey they came here.
There is no reason why, in my humble opinion, PB swiss could not develop a cult following such as the swiss army knife, if marketed in an effective manner. People already associate 'swiss' with quality, but you are right in the sense that without the right marketing, pricing and distribution that's pretty much all they will get, garage journal bottom feeders 
Stuey
Well-known member
The problem is that too little marketing was done, and so there's little brand recognition. Low demand helps sustain the high prices.
blue dog
Banned
There is no reason why, in my humble opinion, PB swiss could not develop a cult following such as the swiss army knife, if marketed in an effective manner. People already associate 'swiss' with quality, but you are right in the sense that without the right marketing, pricing and distribution that's pretty much all they will get, garage journal bottom feeders
I agree completely, it *****. I have every screwdriver,pics, torx, punches and soft blow hammers i could get my hands on after receiving my first few items from pb swiss. I am completely impressed by the quality of there products, yet outside of you guys here, nobody i know, even knows what pb swiss is.
I guess the thing that makes me laugh is when guys complain regarding the price point of pb swiss, yet will purchase snap on tools and feel justified by the price. I have SO drivers and in comparison to my pb swiss drivers, the SO can not even compare in quality in any way. Just one guys opinion. Take it for what it's worth.
Can't say I like MSRP, but $5 for up to 5 tools P&H and return shipping free isn't bad. Hard to imagine any of the PB Swiss I have looked at so far as ever requiring warranty service.
OTOH hard line MSRP may mean they are looking for "real" retail outlets and this is just storefront for the distributor like many other non USA tools have.
OTOH hard line MSRP may mean they are looking for "real" retail outlets and this is just storefront for the distributor like many other non USA tools have.
american lockpicker
Banned
There is no reason why, in my humble opinion, PB swiss could not develop a cult following such as the swiss army knife, if marketed in an effective manner. People already associate 'swiss' with quality, but you are right in the sense that without the right marketing, pricing and distribution that's pretty much all they will get, garage journal bottom feeders
Good post.
slipjointed
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The thing is, if I'm going to pay PB Swiss or Snap-on prices, I'd damn well better get Snap-on service.
Snap-on prices might be nuts, but at least you have a warranty that backs it up.
Other than that, you've got a whole pile of superb brands to choose from in the next price bracket down, and maybe the warranty isn't anything special either, but at least you're paying 1/3 as much.
blue dog
Banned
I have had so few tools ever need to be covered by a warranty that it just does not even come in to play when purchasing a tool. I think in 25 years i have taken 1 ratchet and a few sockets back to sears for replacement, thats it.
Have never had a problem with proto, armstrong, SK , cornwell, wright.
I have broken tools using them in a way that they were not designed to be used, Just looked at them, and tossed them in the trash, no big deal and my misuse.
slipjointed
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I've been working in an industrial setting for 15 years, and regularly using tools for at least 10 years before that, and I've never broken a quality tool, not a single one. I've had tools fail... but I have never broken a tool.
One of the downsides to higher quality, more wear resistant screwdrivers, is that the tips are more brittle. I've had both had high quality phillips, slotted, and even torx drivers chip or snap with just what I could apply with one hand. I've also had high quality hex bits break while almost brand new.
On certain tools I wouldn't be all that worried about the warranty, but screwdrivers is one of the ones that I am.
If I pay big bucks for a screwdriver, I expect the tip to last a long time, and I expect it not to chip or snap off. If either one of those happen, I think it should be warrantied.
Hex bolster screwdrivers especially, are made with the implication that they will be used hard. They're intended to take that hard use, and if they break while in the line of normal duty, they should be warrantied IMO.
The bottom line is, if I'm going to pay big bucks for screwdrivers, I want big bucks service. PB Swiss does not offer that.
Jeff
Well-known member
Amazon purchased Small Parts, who was a PB Swiss distributor. Shortly after the purchase is when the infamous PB Swiss started on Amazon.
slipjointed
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Interesting... so perhaps Amazon inherited Small Parts' entire PB swiss inventory, and sold it off.
Frankstools
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Stuey
Well-known member
Not quite.
Small Parts products were "fulfilled by Amazon" for some time, meaning their stock was handled by Amazon warehouses. Then the PB Swiss inventory grew and grew and grew, and then nothing happened for some time, and then the great sales started happening. 20%-off here and then. And then after a few months of that the great sell-off began.
About the same happened with Beta tools. Small inventory at first, then it expanded, then it was stagnant, and then they started firesaling.
I agree with you. I generally prefer to buy quality tools first and foremost before worrying about ease of warranty.
However screwdrivers really are the exception because the tips can get damaged so quickly. (especially phillips)
PB Swiss at full MSRP prices really needs to offer first class warranty service. I wonder if they'll even replace them based on mangled tips??
I think one of the best values in screwdrivers is the Williams hard handle sets. They're tough and inexpensive.
Other then that, there's always Sears where you'll always get a screwdriver replaced without fees or a major hassle.
These "boutique" brands of screwdrivers definitley have some disadvantages.
Maybe but $20 shipped for a standard #2 screwdriver is a bit too much.
poprockcrusher
Banned
never knew they were here
Stuey
Well-known member
What a lot of people don't realize is that the PB Tools USA site is a distributor that copied the look of the PB Swiss brand site. It's not the manufacturer's site. With that in mind, the $5 warranty fee makes some sense. I think that they might cut previous or current customers a break, and are mostly targeting the fee at those that bought their tools from Amazon.
To all of you wonderful Garage Journal guys -
No, PB is not leaving the USA market but there is certainly a difference in the current distributors.
Small Parts had old stock they were selling on Amazon but they are no longer a PB distributor and therefore cannot restock anything. Amazon wanted to be a PB distributor also but they wouldn't agree to PB's terms so PB said they could not be a distributor in the US.
As a PB distributor, all tools that I sell have a lifetime warranty WITH NO WARRANTY FEE! Nor will you pay shipping on warranted tool replacements. I do ask that you only send 5-6 tools to be replaced at one time - not 20 or 30.
When I do charge shipping for orders, I send it in the fastest and least expensive way. Shipping by UPS to a residence is more expensive than to a commercial location. I use priority mail often because for small orders it can be faster and less expensive. But I weigh all that before doing the label. And the shipping that shows on your order on my website is not necessarily what you will be charged. It usually comes out to be less. The website is NOT 'live' ordering. I process the orders in the office and call you with any questions I have.
I try to carry all the PB tools my customers want and need which is about 1000 items from the PB line. I set prices that keep me in business, not make me a fortune. PB tools are the best you can buy but it is expensive to import from Switzerland. My prices are fair for the product and if you go to News/Newsletter on my website (www.toollady.com) you can always see the current specials and information about PB and Tool Lady Inc.
Please feel free to call me (toll free at 866.TOOLLADY or 866.866.5523) with any questions about PB, their tools or my service.
I LOVE my customers and want to give you the best tool experience I can.
My best to all of you....
Barb Christy
Tool Lady Inc
No, PB is not leaving the USA market but there is certainly a difference in the current distributors.
Small Parts had old stock they were selling on Amazon but they are no longer a PB distributor and therefore cannot restock anything. Amazon wanted to be a PB distributor also but they wouldn't agree to PB's terms so PB said they could not be a distributor in the US.
As a PB distributor, all tools that I sell have a lifetime warranty WITH NO WARRANTY FEE! Nor will you pay shipping on warranted tool replacements. I do ask that you only send 5-6 tools to be replaced at one time - not 20 or 30.
When I do charge shipping for orders, I send it in the fastest and least expensive way. Shipping by UPS to a residence is more expensive than to a commercial location. I use priority mail often because for small orders it can be faster and less expensive. But I weigh all that before doing the label. And the shipping that shows on your order on my website is not necessarily what you will be charged. It usually comes out to be less. The website is NOT 'live' ordering. I process the orders in the office and call you with any questions I have.
I try to carry all the PB tools my customers want and need which is about 1000 items from the PB line. I set prices that keep me in business, not make me a fortune. PB tools are the best you can buy but it is expensive to import from Switzerland. My prices are fair for the product and if you go to News/Newsletter on my website (www.toollady.com) you can always see the current specials and information about PB and Tool Lady Inc.
Please feel free to call me (toll free at 866.TOOLLADY or 866.866.5523) with any questions about PB, their tools or my service.
I LOVE my customers and want to give you the best tool experience I can.
My best to all of you....
Barb Christy
Tool Lady Inc
kissmeimgerman
Well-known member
blue dog
Banned
Thank you for setting the info straight and for participating on a tool forum filled with opinions about all things tools. This is a great beta testing forum as the guys here use there tools and tell it like it is. There are lots of opinions here but i for one believe that pb swiss products are top notch and do not regret purchasing any of it.
Welcome to the forum.
slipjointed
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I can deal with expensive, I just can't deal with expensive and paid warranty.
Thanks for the post, I feel a little more comfortable about buying some drivers now.
I don't mind paying $50-60 shipped for four screwdrivers, as long as I know I can get them easily replaced if/when they break.
slipjointed
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Evidently Count-on, the other PB Swiss distributor. It's hard to say exactly how much they enforce it though.
slipjointed
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I don't know, although I certainly wouldn't complain about that discount, I am more worried about after sale support, which is why I hesitated in the first place. I had a set of PB Swiss all ready to go in the cart, and chickened out.
Now I'll probably go ahead and place an order.