To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

Koken Reviews and Photos!

superautobacs

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
3,997
Location
Vancouver, BC
Nice stuff JK.

How does the Zeal ratchet compare with the 80-tooth CM (I believe it's a single-pawl like a ratcheting wrench)?

How much did that standard 3/8" Zeal ratchet cost you?
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

jk47

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
453
Nice stuff JK.

How does the Zeal ratchet compare with the 80-tooth CM (I believe it's a single-pawl like a ratcheting wrench)?

How much did that standard 3/8" Zeal ratchet cost you?

The Zeal is much smoother, and has significantly less ratcheting resistance. I sold the 2 CM's this weekend. Durability... I'll tell you in a couple years.

The Zeal was $45, not as nice a discount as the regular Koken line, but I like it :thumbup:
 

ricleh

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 2, 2007
Messages
1,447
Location
Sacramento, CA
Some of my Koken stuff

L1010247.jpg


L1010248.jpg


L1010249.jpg
 

superautobacs

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
3,997
Location
Vancouver, BC
The Zeal is much smoother, and has significantly less ratcheting resistance. I sold the 2 CM's this weekend. Durability... I'll tell you in a couple years.

The Zeal was $45, not as nice a discount as the regular Koken line, but I like it :thumbup:

Significantly less resistance than the CM, eh. :thumbup: for Ko-ken



@Ricleh

If you had to pick between Zeal and Nepros, which would you pick?
 

ricleh

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 2, 2007
Messages
1,447
Location
Sacramento, CA
@Ricleh

If you had to pick between Zeal and Nepros, which would you pick?

Koken has smoother action on the 3/8 ratchets, but overall Nepros are the best hand tools I have ever used or seen. Koken are the same quality as Snapon, KTC, Hazet and Stahlwille IMO. Nepros quality is just pretty damn impressive. I know many on GJ were upset at the Nepros price increases, but their tools are still very reasonable at current prices. I bought a couple sets of their tools before the price increases because I didn't think the low initial prices could last. I think I got a great deal. If you don't own any Nepros tools I suggest you try a few. It is impossible to describe the quality, fit and finish of those tools. You just have to see for yourself.

By the way - I picked up the super low profile universal adapters from Koken, and they are really nice. I compared them to my Nepros universal adapters and they are the same size, but the Nepros have a little more flexibility and range. The Nepros are standard design whereas the Koken are a ball and socket design. Both are considerably more compact than Snapon, Hazet or Stahlwille.

I personally like the spring retention system on the Koken spark plug sockets better than the magnetic retention used by Nepros on their spark plug sockets. The Nepros magnets are stronger than any other magnetic spark plug sockets I have used though. I have some T handle universal spark plug sockets that have spring retention similar to the Koken. The T handles are from Japan, but I don't know who the manufacturer is. I think the company makes specialty tools for working on motorcycles.
 

jk47

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
453
Significantly less resistance than the CM, eh. :thumbup: for Ko-ken



@Ricleh

If you had to pick between Zeal and Nepros, which would you pick?

Yup, my un-scientific test proved it. I held the drive portion of each ratchet, with the handle pointed vertical at 12 o'clock. Nudged the handle and let them swing down and around. Zeal, almost 9 o'clock or 270 degrees, CM premium, close to 7 o'clock, Nepros, also close to 7 o'clock. A well worn SK palm control almost went to 9 o'clock as well.

I returned to the Great White North for Thanksgiving, so I had a chance to fondle my Nepros :willy_nil Nepros up North, and Koken down South except for a Zeal set up here. I will wait until I purchase a house, to bring the Nepros south of the 49th.

Side by side, the Nepros feels more solid. Like a 90's Mercedes Benz, compared to a similar era Audi. Both very nice, but the Benz had a little more polish and vault like feel.

@ricleh

Your collection of tools and tool storage is amazing!!! Are you or were you involved in 2 or 4 wheel road racing?
 

jk47

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
453
2 wheel - many years ago.

Superbike, GP, or drag? Roberts, or Rainey and Schwantz era? I was a big fan of GP when Rainey, Schwantz, and Doohan battled in the late 80's early 90's.
 

ricleh

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 2, 2007
Messages
1,447
Location
Sacramento, CA
Superbike, GP, or drag? Roberts, or Rainey and Schwantz era? I was a big fan of GP when Rainey, Schwantz, and Doohan battled in the late 80's early 90's.

You'll have to go back a bit further. It was GP in the '70s. This was pre-superbike era. Mike Hailwood with MV Augusta and then Honda and Giacomo Agostini with MV Augusta and later Yamaha are names I remember. Kenny Roberts was just getting started.
 

superautobacs

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
3,997
Location
Vancouver, BC
Koken has smoother action on the 3/8 ratchets, but overall Nepros are the best hand tools I have ever used or seen. Koken are the same quality as Snapon, KTC, Hazet and Stahlwille IMO. Nepros quality is just pretty damn impressive. I know many on GJ were upset at the Nepros price increases, but their tools are still very reasonable at current prices. I bought a couple sets of their tools before the price increases because I didn't think the low initial prices could last. I think I got a great deal. If you don't own any Nepros tools I suggest you try a few. It is impossible to describe the quality, fit and finish of those tools. You just have to see for yourself.

I totally agree with you on your points.
First time I heard of Nepros was in 2007, when I read a Japanese tool magazine. I didn't purchase anything until I discovered Nepros.net and spoke with Eri Inoue. I made about 4 purchases in total from them, all very small in quantity. Everything I got, except for one ratchet, I've been happy with and met my expectations. The 3/8" compact, stubby flex operated fine except for the quick-release button which I thought was hard to depress all the way down to disengage that ball. I believe they sent me their older version; the newer, revised version has chamfered edges around the circumference of the quick-release button to make it easier to depress the button all the way. In any case, I was able to return it and got some other stuff in exchange.

I wasn't too happy with the price increase, but given the quality that you're getting, it's still a great value. There really is no other company in the world that runs a hand tool production with the care and precision that they do. I'm a total fan of KTC/Nepros. Nepros really sets the bar high--they are the benchmark.



By the way - I picked up the super low profile universal adapters from Koken, and they are really nice. I compared them to my Nepros universal adapters and they are the same size, but the Nepros have a little more flexibility and range. The Nepros are standard design whereas the Koken are a ball and socket design. Both are considerably more compact than Snapon, Hazet or Stahlwille.

Yeah, there's no one else that produces an universal joint like Nepros. You just can't beat the smoothness in operation compared to the other conventional 3-peice types, not to mention the overall length is shorter like you said.
Ko-ken's balljoint-type universal is not the first of its kind, but the splined construction makes it more durable, especially when comparing it with the conventional 3-peice designs. And yes, it's also short in length which is always a plus.



I personally like the spring retention system on the Koken spark plug sockets better than the magnetic retention used by Nepros on their spark plug sockets. The Nepros magnets are stronger than any other magnetic spark plug sockets I have used though. I have some T handle universal spark plug sockets that have spring retention similar to the Koken. The T handles are from Japan, but I don't know who the manufacturer is. I think the company makes specialty tools for working on motorcycles.

The T-handle you mention could be from Kowa.



Yup, my un-scientific test proved it. I held the drive portion of each ratchet, with the handle pointed vertical at 12 o'clock. Nudged the handle and let them swing down and around. Zeal, almost 9 o'clock or 270 degrees, CM premium, close to 7 o'clock, Nepros, also close to 7 o'clock. A well worn SK palm control almost went to 9 o'clock as well.

I returned to the Great White North for Thanksgiving, so I had a chance to fondle my Nepros :willy_nil Nepros up North, and Koken down South except for a Zeal set up here. I will wait until I purchase a house, to bring the Nepros south of the 49th.

Side by side, the Nepros feels more solid. Like a 90's Mercedes Benz, compared to a similar era Audi. Both very nice, but the Benz had a little more polish and vault like feel.

Hah, I do a similar test as well. ....just have to keep in mind of the differing weight/length of the ratchet handles you compare. :)

Yeah, I find that there's a difference in feeling between using Nepros and Ko-ken. I like them both for their own reasons. :)
 

ricleh

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 2, 2007
Messages
1,447
Location
Sacramento, CA
The T-handle you mention could be from Kowa.

I just checked and you are correct. The T-handles are Kowa. I was unable to find any information on that company when I looked.

I totally agree with you concerning Nepros. I was fortunate enough to be able to purchase 2 of the master sets and quite a few other Nepros tools when the prices were low. I still think Nepros tools are a good value at current prices.
 
Last edited:

jk47

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
453
Some goodies that arrived via Frankstools...

The six piece set has a rough metallic/diamond coating on the tips, while the two combo +/- drivers do not. The handles may look familiar, as Stanley use the same style with some of their products.

All in all, a great set of screwdrivers for a reasonable price. $35 for the set of tang through drivers, $6 and $7 for the stubby and regular respectively.
 

jk47

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
453
pics are not showing in the post above
 

Attachments

  • 2011-12-19_20-03-40_730.jpg
    2011-12-19_20-03-40_730.jpg
    147 KB · Views: 147

jk47

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
453
I tried resizing the photos...
 

Attachments

  • phpQq7Ig1AM.jpg
    phpQq7Ig1AM.jpg
    142.1 KB · Views: 121
  • phpoDBmV5AM.jpg
    phpoDBmV5AM.jpg
    141 KB · Views: 124
  • phphZEZbPAM.jpg
    phphZEZbPAM.jpg
    63.6 KB · Views: 117
  • phpFCiDwrAM.jpg
    phpFCiDwrAM.jpg
    142 KB · Views: 156
  • phpcbFL9bAM.jpg
    phpcbFL9bAM.jpg
    137.1 KB · Views: 98

ricleh

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 2, 2007
Messages
1,447
Location
Sacramento, CA
How do the koken zeal sets compare to the snap on low profile set?

They compare very well. I prefer the Snapon ratchet, but I think the zeal universal adapter is better than the Snapon universal adapter. The sockets and extensions from both Snapon and Koken Zeal are both excellent. I think you would be happy with either one.
 

ricleh

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 2, 2007
Messages
1,447
Location
Sacramento, CA
Are you interested in the 1/4" or 3/8" or both? I can check tomorrow.

Forget the 1/4" size - the Zeal only come in 3/8" as far as I can tell. I have 2 sets of the Zeal, but they are both 3/8" drive. They are hard to get to right now, but I can check them tomorrow against the Snapon low profile set.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

ricleh

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 2, 2007
Messages
1,447
Location
Sacramento, CA
Thanks mate, I appreciate that it. Some real world pics would be great if you can.

Koken Zeal set on top, Snapon low profile set on bottom

P1000054.jpg


Koken Zeal ratchet on left, Snapon low profile ratchet on right. Snapon is slightly lower profile.

P1000055.jpg


17mm Koken Zeal on left, Snapon low profile on right. Virtually the same height.

P1000056.jpg


8mm Koken Zeal on left, Snapon low profile on right. Snapon is lower profile on the smaller sockets.

P1000057.jpg


14mm Koken Zeal on left, Snapon low profile on right. Snapon is lower profile overall.

P1000058.jpg


14mm Snapon standard ratchet & socket on left, Snapon low profile on right

P1000059.jpg


Koken Zeal universal on left, Snapon universal on right. Snapon does not make a low profile universal.

P1000060.jpg
 

superautobacs

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
3,997
Location
Vancouver, BC
Ricleh,

Nice pictures.

It may not be obvious, but the Snap-On low profile sockets are dedicated for their own low profile ratchet. The sockets will not fit on a standard 3/8" square drive as the broaching is too shallow. The Ko-ken sockets on the other hand are interchangeable with any standard 3/8" square. Likewise, unlike the Snap-On low profile ratchet, the Ko-ken ratchet will fit any standard 3/8" drive socket.



JK47,

Nice screwdrivers. Those handles are really impressive with how much grip they provide, and I love their double-ended 1/4" bits that fit in those handles with absolutely zero play. :thumbup:

I don't think I've posted my hacked rotator ratchet with a Ko-ken handle and a 3/8" female drive on the end. Much better grip than the original handle. :thumbup:


attachment.php


attachment.php
 

typeshige

Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2010
Messages
9
If I'm just starting off with my collection, should I get the surface drive or just the normal 6-point?

Someone said there seems to be more play and so I wonder if it's not as good for everyday use on bolts in good condition.

Thanks.

Also, can someone suggest a good starter set for automotive use? What ratchets and what sockets.

I should be looking at the Zeal line, right?

Thanks,
Shige
 

jk47

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
453
If I'm just starting off with my collection, should I get the surface drive or just the normal 6-point?

Someone said there seems to be more play and so I wonder if it's not as good for everyday use on bolts in good condition.

Thanks.

Also, can someone suggest a good starter set for automotive use? What ratchets and what sockets.

I should be looking at the Zeal line, right?

Thanks,
Shige

The Zeal line is a normal 6 point type socket, and the Zeal sets skip some socket sizes. I prefer normal 6 point sockets to surface drive myself, but to each their own.

What kind of autos will you be working on? Japanese, German, or domestic? Each has their own sizes that you will see frequently, ie.

Japanese: 10,12,13,14,17,19,22,24
German : many sizes in between those posted above
Domestic : Almost anything is possible

You may want to purchase a Zeal set and buy the missing sizes individually, or buy a Zeal ratchet, extensions, universal adapter, and the regular Koken sockets in a set. Koken sets are available without any sizes skipped if you want.

There are many opinions on what a good starter set should consist of, and I'm sure others will chime in soon...
 

typeshige

Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2010
Messages
9
The Zeal line is a normal 6 point type socket, and the Zeal sets skip some socket sizes. I prefer normal 6 point sockets to surface drive myself, but to each their own.

What kind of autos will you be working on? Japanese, German, or domestic? Each has their own sizes that you will see frequently, ie.

Japanese: 10,12,13,14,17,19,22,24
German : many sizes in between those posted above
Domestic : Almost anything is possible

You may want to purchase a Zeal set and buy the missing sizes individually, or buy a Zeal ratchet, extensions, universal adapter, and the regular Koken sockets in a set. Koken sets are available without any sizes skipped if you want.

There are many opinions on what a good starter set should consist of, and I'm sure others will chime in soon...


We have several Hondas/Acuras, a BMW and a Mazda. On the Hondas, the 10,12,14, 17 seems to be the most common and like you said German cars will use 13, etc.

Thanks. I'll do some more research and put up my list here. Hopefully I can get some feed back on it.

Ironically, these will go into an old Snap-on case (the old logo) replacing mostly Craftsman.

Thanks. I don't think it'll improve my skills any but I'm a sucker for new toys.
 

jk47

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
453
We have several Hondas/Acuras, a BMW and a Mazda. On the Hondas, the 10,12,14, 17 seems to be the most common and like you said German cars will use 13, etc.

Thanks. I'll do some more research and put up my list here. Hopefully I can get some feed back on it.

Ironically, these will go into an old Snap-on case (the old logo) replacing mostly Craftsman.

Thanks. I don't think it'll improve my skills any but I'm a sucker for new toys.

You could always keep the Craftsman sockets to cover the skipped sizes for now.

Which Zeal set are you considering? If you have the $$$ to spare, get the larger one with the breaker bar and extensions :beer:

Getting a multi-bit screwdriver would save some $$$ and space over a full set too.

Are you looking to fill your tool box exclusively with Japanese tools?

Here is a usefull page on Japanese (JIS) bolts

http://www.ex-500.com/wiki/index.php/Bolts,_bolts,_and_more_bolts

and a thread here on common sizes

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14585
 
Last edited:

typeshige

Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2010
Messages
9
Thanks.

I just looked through the Japanese PDF on their site and I think I'm going with the Z-EAL "full set" which includes:

3725Z Ratchet Handle
3768Z-250 Spinner Handle
3760Z Extension Bars (75mm, 125mm, 250mm)
3771Z Universal Joint
3756Z Quick Spinner
3400MZ 6 point sockets (5.5, 6, 7, 8, 10,12, 13,14,17, 19, 21, 22)
3300MZ 6 point deep sockets (8, 10, 12, 14)
3300CZ Spark Plug Sockets (14, 16, 20.8)

Does anyone know if they make feeler gauges?
 
OP
G

Globy

Active member
Joined
May 17, 2011
Messages
30
Hey to everyone, it's been a while since I've posted here :drool:
Bring your tools out of the box and show us :beer:
thanks
 

Dave.R

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 31, 2011
Messages
383
Location
Grand Rapids MI
Ricleh,

Nice pictures.

It may not be obvious, but the Snap-On low profile sockets are dedicated for their own low profile ratchet. The sockets will not fit on a standard 3/8" square drive as the broaching is too shallow. The Ko-ken sockets on the other hand are interchangeable with any standard 3/8" square. Likewise, unlike the Snap-On low profile ratchet, the Ko-ken ratchet will fit any standard 3/8" drive socket.

I have the S-O set and they fit on all my other 3/8s just fine, they don't set all the way down, but they still lock onto the ratchet ok.
 

jk47

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
453
Latest goodies from Frankstools...

I like the speed handles in 1/4" and 3/8" , the 1/4" socket set is sweet too. The newer plastic case with foam insert makes it easy to add to my KTC "Easy Buggy".

The ratchet is almost a carbon copy of the old Proto design, but with a knurled handle. Koken's knurling is my favorite, not too sharp and striped for a very positive grip.

The ratchet plate is held on with screws that are peened, so I would have to destroy the screws to get at the insides. I remember a thread a while back where a fella messed things up by forcing them out. For now I'll leave things be, for a low tooth count ratchet it's very smooth and offers low resistance. I would not buy one separately, unless I was a die hard old style Proto fan, or they were going for a song.
 

Attachments

  • 2012-04-30_12-23-04_896.jpg
    2012-04-30_12-23-04_896.jpg
    150.1 KB · Views: 197
  • 2012-04-30_12-23-20_771.jpg
    2012-04-30_12-23-20_771.jpg
    152.8 KB · Views: 259

egfdevos

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 4, 2012
Messages
57
Location
The Netherlands,Terneuzen
It's a stud bolt setter 4103M-10.
Going to use it om some threased rod's.

"Special socket for installing a stud bolt. The bolt contacts witah a steel ball to prevent the bolt from sticking onto the socket."

4103M-10_1.jpg

4103M-10_2.jpg
 

JDS968

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 14, 2012
Messages
247
Location
Miami Beach, FL
Thanks.

I just looked through the Japanese PDF on their site and I think I'm going with the Z-EAL "full set" which includes:

3725Z Ratchet Handle
3768Z-250 Spinner Handle
3760Z Extension Bars (75mm, 125mm, 250mm)
3771Z Universal Joint
3756Z Quick Spinner
3400MZ 6 point sockets (5.5, 6, 7, 8, 10,12, 13,14,17, 19, 21, 22)
3300MZ 6 point deep sockets (8, 10, 12, 14)
3300CZ Spark Plug Sockets (14, 16, 20.8)

Does anyone know if they make feeler gauges?
Do you have the Craftsman standard length and deep sockets to fill in the gaps? If so, getting the Koken sockets in the sizes you expect to use most could be a great way to use your money most effectively [although I cannot figure out why they would include a 5.5mm and not an 11mm, when was the last time anybody saw a 5.5?]. However, if you don't have all of the gaps filled in, you might want to reconsider getting a more complete Koken set or alternately you could fill the gaps with individual sockets of your choice. Even if you go years without using them, it just takes one anomalous part (or a side job on a car you you don't usually work on) to make a "skipped" socket seem like a real false economy.
 

superautobacs

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
3,997
Location
Vancouver, BC
A mystical(?) Ko-ken spanner...... no longer offered ...... not made in Japan..... but by Beta, in Italy.

Too bad the beam is so thin. :( ...but I guess it's a shallow profile type.
 

Attachments

  • DSC_1648.JPG
    DSC_1648.JPG
    130.9 KB · Views: 758
  • DSC_1650.jpg
    DSC_1650.jpg
    115.7 KB · Views: 786
Last edited:
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!
Top Bottom