1972 Kellogg-American 325 Compressor Re-furbish (not restore or rebuild)

hemifalcon · Mar 31, 2013

Alright..So, here are the initial pictures of what I'm starting with.. I bought this 1972 Kellogg-American 325 Compressor for $300 and I think I got a good deal.. My plan is to get it cleaned up, and looking good once again. I'm also going to re-gasket the compressor pump to hopefully eliminate any leaks and oil escape which was evident inside the tank..

Here’s where it’s basically at today…

All · Mar 31, 2013

What are you going to do about the tank inside?

gapfast · Mar 31, 2013

All said:
What are you going to do about the tank inside?

What needs to be done?

All · Mar 31, 2013

41 year old tank.

When I turned 41, I found that a lot needed to be done.

Charles (in GA) · Mar 31, 2013

You may already know, but LaPlante Compressors is manufacturing a new compressor using the Kellogg design pump, and probably can supply parts if needed.

Charles

hemifalcon · Apr 1, 2013

The interior of the tank is in VERY good shape.. I don't know where the little rust chunks had come from that were inside the tank, but it's not anywhere that can be seen. I ran my garden hose into the tank after spraying some Simple Green and Brake cleaner inside, and it's nice and bare steel. I don't plan on coating it with anything at this time. After running the hose inside for about 30 minutes--all the rust pieces had flushed out the bottom plug hole which was missing from the beginning.

hemifalcon · Apr 1, 2013

Charles (in GA) said:
You may already know, but LaPlante Compressors is manufacturing a new compressor using the Kellogg design pump, and probably can supply parts if needed.

Charles

I did not know this--I'll try to do some research and make some calls to see if they can help out.. Thank you--

Here are some additional pics as my need to detail little bits and pieces is going to get in the way here..

And the inside..

And--I'll polish all the brass amongst the gritty scratched and scraped exterior paint.. (something must be wrong with me..)

I have one question--
How does this "valve" work?? (assuming it's a valve). I don't claim to be any expert of any type with compressors--so I'm glad to take some lessons from the all-knowing..

I am going to try and clean all the grease off and keep the paint intact..

gapfast · Apr 1, 2013

Tank looks great!! Should last u another 40

On my compressor its called a centrifigal pressure release assembly.
I imagine it keeps the pump from reaching to high of pressure

nyrapscalion · Apr 1, 2013

That thing is AWESOME!. Man...what a piece of machinery...nice haul!
Solid construction, should last another 40 years.

theoldwizard1 · Apr 1, 2013

I think you could soda bast those fins on the pipes without any damage.

Trey T · Apr 1, 2013

Yup that valve is called an unloader valve. At rest, the valves open to let the air from the line/head flow to atmosphere to "unload" and pressure prior start up. When the pump spin to its steady RPM, it slowly pull back the centrifugal pin and close the schrader valve.

Schrader valve should have a rubber o-ring.

All · Apr 1, 2013

I wasn't jealous until I saw the inside of that tank. NOW I'm jealous.

And checkout that fat and flat meaty weld bead profile on those tanks seams.

They don't build 'em like that nowadays.

hemifalcon · Apr 1, 2013

Yeah--another forty would be great--as there are so many different compressors out there and the old ones seem to be worth their salt as long as they haven't been abused--so it seems..

Unfortunately I got an email from Laplante today and they apparently don't service the 325-series units.. So--I'll have to find another outfit--or I'll be trying to make my own gaskets ( no problemo..) I'll keep all of you updated.. I Just picked up an old set of oxy/acetylene torches/tanks today with a cart.. The acetylene tank had a certification date of 1962... Luckily Airgas swapped it out without any issues.. Picked up a new hose--I'll get the set cleaned up and test it out this week maybe..

justgurn · Apr 1, 2013

hemifalcon,
I have the same compressor it is a beast. You will not have a want for air. For the life of me I cannot remember the name of the shop I spoke to that still carried parts for the 325 series. There is a company in Burlingame Ks "Sealrite" I think that makes speciality gaskets. Might be an option.

imtrublue · Apr 2, 2013

Check these guys out, maybe they can help. http://www.aircompeq.com/ka.htm

hemifalcon · Apr 3, 2013

Justgurn... That's great news.. I'm hoping to not ever have to get another compressor and keep this one going. Turns out that this pump design is "obsolete", but rebuild parts are luckily available through a couple outlets. I found the guys listed below and ordered a complete kit..

Gerard Air Compressors
32C Holton Street
Woburn, MA 01801
Toll Free:1- 800- 462-1902
Fax: 1-781-933-2474

Gerardaircompressors.com

I just ordered a complete rebuild kit minus the end bearings and cups--so I'm happy about that..
Justgurn--you have a picture of yours?

hemifalcon · Apr 13, 2013

Alright.. So, the parts took a little longer to get in that expected--but I've got everything all back together.. I ended up leaving all the bearings in place and saving the new replacement parts for the future (hopefully never need them..) I replaced all the seals, cleaned everything up really good--and it's all back in once piece.. (well, all pieces are back together..)

Here's the cylinder head coming apart.. piece by piece

So here is my first look at the valves in the head--I was happy to see these all in tact with no broken springs

Here's the crank with rods and pistons intact.. End tapered roller bearings were very good--and thus reused. I didn't feel like changing the rod bearings--so those stayed too. The "oil slinger loop" (don't know technical term) was all bent up--so I had to make it "round" again.
URL=http://smg.photobucket.com/user/hemifalcon/media/1972%20Kellogg-American%20325%20Compressor%20Refurbish/DSC00621_zps506237c1.jpg.html]

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Good cross-hatch in the cylinder still.. And all piston rings were in very good shape.. I had new ones--but the old ones were much thicker and in great shape-not even showing any wear on the edges--so they were kept.

Here it is all back together. I brought the cylinder to the local NAPA and they dropped in their steam tank which washed all the cooked on oil right off. And--the paint stayed.. I was pretty happy about that..

One curious question--what type of oil are you guys running in your old A/C's??

Fixnair · Apr 13, 2013

Those K/A machines were a good machine. Looks like you are going back together with it. You have also found out you need special tools for the valves. I can supply the parts for it if you need. I will also lend my tools to you if you return them as soon as you're through with them. Scouts honor.
When I rebuild a machine I usually run the machine before I install the head. That way I know the machine will not pump oil or knock. If when you run it oil should not migrate up past the piston rings and collect on the top of the pistons. If this is going to happen it should within 15 minutes.
With the machine stopped, install the centrifugal pressure release, blow through it with your mouth. You should not be able to blow through it. Screw it in one turn at a time and try to
blow through it. Keep going 'till you can blow through it then rotate it one more turn and lock it down there.

hemifalcon · Apr 13, 2013

Fixnair said:
Those K/A machines were a good machine. Looks like you are going back together with it. You have also found out you need special tools for the valves. I can supply the parts for it if you need. I will also lend my tools to you if you return them as soon as you're through with them. Scouts honor.
When I rebuild a machine I usually run the machine before I install the head. That way I know the machine will not pump oil or knock. If when you run it oil should not migrate up past the piston rings and collect on the top of the pistons. If this is going to happen it should within 15 minutes.
With the machine stopped, install the centrifugal pressure release, blow through it with your mouth. You should not be able to blow through it. Screw it in one turn at a time and try to
blow through it. Keep going 'till you can blow through it then rotate it one more turn and lock it down there.

Fixnair--thank you for those tips.. Yeah--I also didn't mess with those valves because of the obvious need for special tools--and I think that one of the valves is letting a little oil past--but I think it may have been due to the piston ring gaps being lined up.. Not sure though.. It could also be from the compressor laying on it's side for it's ride home from the farm I picked it up from--and then to my house. Thanks for that simple tip for the valve.. If you have any additional technical information regarding the operation/assembly/upkeep of these machines--I'd like to get a hold of it..
Thank you,
John

Skin · Apr 13, 2013

hemifalcon said:
One curious question--what type of oil are you guys running in your old A/C's??

Compressor oil, especially back then, is generally 30 weight non-detergent. You can pick the stuff up at any home depot, comes in white 12 ounce bottles with the husky name on it.

hemifalcon · Apr 14, 2013

Skin said:
Compressor oil, especially back then, is generally 30 weight non-detergent. You can pick the stuff up at any home depot, comes in white 12 ounce bottles with the husky name on it.

Okay.. good to know. Any reason 10W-30 standard oil wouldn't work?? (someone school me here..)

And--here's the main power box on the compressor mounted and cleaned back up.. Anyone know where I can get a cover for the box???

fury9 · Apr 17, 2013

I have to ask you how you managed to get that bottom plug out? I had a 30" pipe wrench with my cman jack handle as a cheater bar with some heat and jumped on the freaking thing and bent both the wrench and the cheater bar!

Jim Johnstone · Apr 17, 2013

hemifalcon said:
Okay.. good to know. Any reason 10W-30 standard oil wouldn't work?? (someone school me here..)

And--here's the main power box on the compressor mounted and cleaned back up.. Anyone know where I can get a cover for the box???

Keep in mind that he mentioned non detergent oil. Some oils have detergents in them to aid with carbon build up etc. In an air compressor that is not an issue and the detergents can cause some foaming and loss of lubrication especially considering very few compressors are pressure lubricated and only splash lubed.

fury9 · Apr 17, 2013

I just managed to get the 2" bung out! I used a cheater bar, pipe wrench and my yellow bottle torch. I heated it for a few minutes around the bung and TIGHTENED it first about 1/8 turn then she come out without too much of a fuss.

Fixnair · Apr 18, 2013

If you don't want to go to the expense of synthetic oil you should use ISO 32 hydraulic oil. It is about a 20 weight but whenever anyone says "weight" in their talk about oils they immediately think automotive oil. Stay away from automotive oil for your air compressor. Stay way from heavier oils especially in colder climates. They won't splash into the upper levels of the crankcase and your wrist pin bushings will experience undue wear.

Things are starting to look good. It is cleaning up nicely

hemifalcon · Apr 18, 2013

fury9 said:
I have to ask you how you managed to get that bottom plug out? I had a 30" pipe wrench with my cman jack handle as a cheater bar with some heat and jumped on the freaking thing and bent both the wrench and the cheater bar!

I was lucky--it came out pretty easy with my monster adjustable wrench on it..

Jim Johnstone said:
Keep in mind that he mentioned non detergent oil. Some oils have detergents in them to aid with carbon build up etc. In an air compressor that is not an issue and the detergents can cause some foaming and loss of lubrication especially considering very few compressors are pressure lubricated and only splash lubed.

I had to ask about the oil as my 3-year old Sanborn 33 Gallon unit requires 10W-30 Synthetic for the pump.. So--I went ahead and picked up a quart of compressor oil and loaded it up.. Took a tad bit less than a quart to register on the sight glass..

fury9 said:
I just managed to get the 2" bung out! I used a cheater bar, pipe wrench and my yellow bottle torch. I heated it for a few minutes around the bung and TIGHTENED it first about 1/8 turn then she come out without too much of a fuss.

See--Just needed a little heat to get 'er out!!

Fixnair said:
If you don't want to go to the expense of synthetic oil you should use ISO 32 hydraulic oil. It is about a 20 weight but whenever anyone says "weight" in their talk about oils they immediately think automotive oil. Stay away from automotive oil for your air compressor. Stay way from heavier oils especially in colder climates. They won't splash into the upper levels of the crankcase and your wrist pin bushings will experience undue wear.

Things are starting to look good. It is cleaning up nicely

Thank you sir--Hoping to have it running as my primary air supply in the next two weeks.. "fingers crossed"...

Trey T · Apr 18, 2013

The compressor pump is still in a good condition, very well kept.

hemifalcon · Apr 20, 2013

And--here's where it's at today.. Just to have to reconnect all the wiring--then get the garage wiring in order for a test... (fingers x'd..) [yes--I polished all the brass and changed the old aluminum tubing over to copper so that I could polish the hell out of it..]

I told my girlfriend it's beginning to look like one of those fancy cappuccino machines..

hemifalcon · Apr 22, 2013

Guys.. Need a little help here.. When I picked up this unit, the motor's overload circuit breaker was not connected. I'd like to wire it up, just not 100% sure how to wire it.. Can y'all give me some help here.. It's only got two wires running off of it--
I'll thank any of you in advance for any assistance..
John

hemifalcon · Sep 10, 2013

Okay--been quite some time-but I needed the line for the higher voltage run in the garage and finally had it done today.
Here's the issue--I had a 20A circuit installed dedicated solely for the compressor. The motor is rated at 14.0A--and the compressor starts initially and runs but then trips the circuit. I'm hoping someone here knows--does the circuit likely need to be higher amperage for starting/running a compressor this size?
The thought my electrician had was that the motor had some internal resistance (brushes, dirty, etc.) causing some trouble for the circuit--does anyone have some additional ideas?
I'm not tossing aside the information given by the electrician--just wondering if there are some other possibilities?

Stuart in MN · Sep 10, 2013

Have you tried running just the motor without the compressor? Take off the belt and see how it acts.

Bears Fan · Sep 10, 2013

Forget about the air compressor!!! I want to see some more pics of that Chevy Suburban in the back ground and whats the plans for that (a cool vehicle to customize), oh yeah nice job on the compressor too... "They don't build trucks or compressors like that any more"

hemifalcon · Sep 10, 2013

Stuart in MN said:
Have you tried running just the motor without the compressor? Take off the belt and see how it acts.

Okay--I got it all back apart and ran the motor--it whirrrred just fine and was nice and quiet.. However--it ran for a very short period of time and the motor case was pretty danged warm with no load upon it.. hmmm.. (NOTE: it's a 6K610F motor.)

Bears Fan said:
Forget about the air compressor!!! I want to see some more pics of that Chevy Suburban in the back ground and whats the plans for that (a cool vehicle to customize), oh yeah nice job on the compressor too... "They don't build trucks or compressors like that any more"

Hey--focus.. check out my thread on 67-72chevytrucks.com if you want to know about my Sub! :shocking:

So--I tore he motor apart as I just figured it was he one thing (as always) that I hadn't looked into.. The bearing on the shaft seemed both to be in pretty fair shape. The armature and windings were all pretty clean--but the back end of the motor did not look good. Problem--I don't know the name of these parts and I cannot find a parts break down for the old Farm Duty Dayton motor. (it's a 3HP 230V motor, 1ph). So--here are some pictures if anyone can show me where I can find parts--
I think the contacts are nasty and causing some extra resistance--and not to mention their appears to be "brushes" or something else that is deteriorated in the center of the copper plates??

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hemifalcon · Oct 20, 2013

Well.. I brought the motor to one shop that said it would cost more to rebuild the motor than buy a new one.. They quoted me for a new motor at $440.00.. Pshhhh.. I already paid them $40 just to tell me mine was in bad shape-and then received it back in pieces and missing parts..

I opted to save my money and bought the same motor of an internet auction site for $115.00 less than they quoted me.. It should be here within the week--looking forward to it..

I need the real air volume to do he bodywork on my 'burban...

jontar · Oct 20, 2013

It appears to be part of the centrifugal switch, so when the motor is up to speed, it cuts out the start capacitor. The start capacitor is used to gain high torque to start from a static stop on single phase motors.

Read here for more info,

http://www.fluke.com/fluke/usen/com...ategories/motorsdrives/single-phasemotors.htm

The damage to the switch could have been a bad capacitor, causig arcing, or dirt in the switch contacts no allowing a clean break/make to happen and once again arcing. Without being their, most likely you could have cleaned up the contacts with a small file, cleaned them from dirt/debris and then tested the capacitor.

The motor shops are just interested in selling new motors, generally anything under 30 hp is a throw away and anything bigger we would have rewound or repaired, as long as it stayed below 75% of a new motor

MTW · Oct 21, 2013

That Dayton motor is probably still repairable.

You can obtain a new start switch through grainger. The worn parts in the center of the switch are the rubbing blocks that bear on the plastic ring of the centrifigual mechanisism on the shaft. As long as the plastic ring on the armature shaft is not too worn (grooved) from the rivets holding the worn rubbing blocks.

Replacing the capacitors on an old single phase motors with hard starting duty such as compressors is always a good idea, these can be sourced online or at Graingers.

Most larger motor shops cant really make too much money repairing small motors, due to the labor costs and large parts inventory required. However that dosen't mean a user can't do it cost effectively, with a little determination.

Another option would be an electronic starting switch that is mounted external to the motor shell, requiring a little wiring modification. These are starting to become OEM equipment on new single phase motors. If interested in this have a look here:
http://stearns.rexnord.com/products/Cat_902_table.asp

justgurn · Oct 21, 2013

I'm so sorry Hemifalcon, I just read your post wanting a picture of my machine. It looks like yours is ready to make some pressurized air. Here a youtube link of it running.

Fixnair if you watch the video, let me know if you think the knock normal?

Thanks JG

mmouse · Oct 21, 2013

justgurn said:
I'm so sorry Hemifalcon, I just read your post wanting a picture of my machine. It looks like yours is ready to make some pressurized air. Here a youtube link of it running.

Fixnair if you watch the video, let me know if you think the knock normal?

Thanks JG

JG, I have a 331 also that knocks and sounds like yours. I was wondering the same thing. I know that compressors shake and vibrate, but what is excessive? Mine rocks quite a bit, like the low pressure rod/piston/counterweight is out of balance. Sorry to hijack...

justgurn · Oct 22, 2013

mmouse said:
JG, I have a 331 also that knocks and sounds like yours. I was wondering the same thing. I know that compressors shake and vibrate, but what is excessive? Mine rocks quite a bit, like the low pressure rod/piston/counterweight is out of balance. Sorry to hijack...

mmouse thanks for the feedback! It knocked when my Dad had it and he never worried much about it. Now that I have it I don't want to let it destruct if I could prevent it. JG

hemifalcon · Oct 23, 2013

Well--here's the video guys.. I strapped on the new Leeson 3HP Motor I sourced online.. The repair shop gave me back my parts after I decided I didn't want to pay $440 for the same motor I found from the manufacturer for $115 less with free shipping..
Motor shop said the windings were bad and didn't make any mention of the start switch.. I think they just didn't want to mess with it--Oh well--I'm happy with the new noise in my garage.. After running it for a while--I'll plumb it to a line on the wall.. I may also consider building a cooler for the air before going into the tank--we shall see..

1972 Kellogg-American 325 Compressor Re-furbish (not restore or rebuild)

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