Tools of Japan

JBH · Dec 2, 2018

Two 1/4" drive ratchets I picked up from Frank a little while ago, along with two Koken x Wiha 1/4" drive ratchets that arrived last week:

In truth I wanted to like both of them more than I do. Zeal is my fault - I simply didn't notice how short it was, even though that information was freely out there. That limits its utility for me, because the tininess makes it awkward to use. Two more inches and it would be a solid endgame.

Nepros I bought thinking it would be my endgame 1/4" ratchet, used variously stubby, with the Stahlwille breaker bar as shown above, or on a Felo Ergonic spinner handle. It's a very good tool but not my favorite. The mechanism is good but I prefer Koken's feel. The square on the back grips like nothing else. I tried using it with my Felo spinner handle, and had to punch it out. Same deal when I tried cascading it on the Zeal's square. I ordered the Stahlwille QR spinner handle to use with it. Others have mentioned the socket wobbles a bit on the square. That seems common on 1/4" drive QRs.

Koken x Wihas I discovered on GJ a while ago, and managed to find on a German site a couple weeks ago. They are exactly as I expected: IMO the best ratcheting mechanism, and a very good handle that may not quite be as good as Felo Ergonic but still feels great in the hand.

Does anyone know how hard it is to remove and replace the flex head on a Koken ratchet? I'm thinking about swapping out the QR head on one of those Koken x Wiha's with a Koken bit ratchet head. They're dimensionally the same, and have the same teeth. Zeal has a ball detent, so I don't think it is compatible.

tanukiboy · Dec 3, 2018

JBH said:
Two 1/4" drive ratchets I picked up from Frank a little while ago, along with two Koken x Wiha 1/4" drive ratchets that arrived last week:

In truth I wanted to like both of them more than I do. Zeal is my fault - I simply didn't notice how short it was, even though that information was freely out there. That limits its utility for me, because the tininess makes it awkward to use. Two more inches and it would be a solid endgame.

Nepros I bought thinking it would be my endgame 1/4" ratchet, used variously stubby, with the Stahlwille breaker bar as shown above, or on a Felo Ergonic spinner handle. It's a very good tool but not my favorite. The mechanism is good but I prefer Koken's feel. The square on the back grips like nothing else. I tried using it with my Felo spinner handle, and had to punch it out. Same deal when I tried cascading it on the Zeal's square.

Hi JBH,

Yeah, the maddening search for the "endgame" 1/4" ratchet! :willy_nil

I have two Koken 1/4" ratchets (regular "NB" series and Zeal series) and a stubby 90-tooth Nepros ratchet (the regular one, not the one with the square hole like yours). They are all really tiny. You have to hold them daintily in your fingertips rather than firmly in your hand.

My favorite of the three is the regular NB Koken, despite the fact that it has the lowest tooth count. Its aggressively knurled handle helps to compensate for its tiny size. Second is the Koken Zeal, which has a higher tooth count but is let down by the lack of a quick release button (which I want), by the rubber grip (which I don't), and by the cheap-feeling and balky selector lever. Third is the Nepros, which despite its "garage jewelry" finish, doesn't have the addictively low backdrag of either of the Kokens. There is also a regular length Tone 72-tooth ratchet in my toolbox. It's a quality tool IMO, but the backdrag is even higher than the Nepros.

Although they are not "tools of Japan", I've placed an order at Amazon US for the new Tekton 90-tooth flex head ratchets in 1/4" and 3/8". Hopefully they will have reasonably low backdrag along with their high tooth count. I'm optimistic because I've been quite impressed with the quality and feel of the Tekton 72-tooth composite offset ratchet in 3/8" that I got a while ago. They are also very reasonably priced ($20 and $25, as I recall).

Good luck with your search!

BigBoreFan · Dec 3, 2018

I have a Tone 1/4 ratchet, length wise it is just about perfect.

That new Tekton 90 tooth, I may buy one, those are very inexpensive here in the US. Length looks good on it as well.

No Koken ratchets yet, but they are on my wishlist at Amazon.JP.

I mainly work on motorcycles, easy access, so the high tooth count is not a requirement for me. I don't see how car mechanics do it. I have small hands and still cannot get into the cramped spaces on a modern car. I can see where high tooth count and low back drag would be a plus there.

Nice thing about 1/4 tools, inexpensive, so you can afford to experiment.

JBH · Dec 3, 2018

tanukiboy said:
Good luck with your search!

No more search. This is as good as has been made for me, I think!

I found those after I had bought and played with Nepros and Zeal a bit. I'm still keeping Nepros. Zeal may end up in the classifieds because it is just too small for my comfort.

Maybe I'll rethink if Koken does a Felo collaboration.

I hadn't heard of Koken until stumbling onto GJ. I tried them as a lark, and became a fan of the feel right away. Koken is my best find from GJ by far.

Brian Puccio · Dec 3, 2018

JBH said:
Two 1/4" drive ratchets I picked up from Frank a little while ago, along with two Koken x Wiha 1/4" drive ratchets that arrived last week:

Sorry if this is OT, but could you drop me a link for those ratchets?

Thanks!

mercucho · Dec 3, 2018

Anex clip remover 9136 and 9136S.

Elvisidal · Dec 3, 2018

Still relatively level ...

JBH · Dec 3, 2018

Brian Puccio said:
Sorry if this is OT, but could you drop me a link for those ratchets?

Thanks!

Zeal and Nepros came from frankstools.com

Wiha x Koken is not a current product. I found two NOS from a German seller. You’ll find more on them here at GJ than anywhere else.

M6erfan · Dec 3, 2018

Love those Wiha/Ko-ken ratchets!

superautobacs · Dec 7, 2018

mr.lemons said:
Looking to upgrade my Bahco version of these shears. Any reason to choose one of these over the other? Assuming they are from different manufacturers. Would be interested which brand has the better reputation if no one has hands on experience. I don't have experience of either brand beyond reading this thread. Thanks.

Reed Prince said:
I imagine the Engineers are a re-brand. The tools look identical. I have the larger, CA-38 version of the Tsunoda (King TTC) and like them a lot.
The CA-22s outperformed Bahcos in a recent test.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/BDuQMIG5kgk" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I don't have personal experience with Japanese small cable cutters ...for lack of finding a proper terminology...the Tsunoda type (I have a Knipex one). And I agree with Reed Prince that the Engineer labeled one is re-branded. (Engineer doesn't operate a factory.

)

There are other pliers manufacturers that produce small cable shears in that style and length like Fujiya, Victor, and Shell. Other companies like Marvel, 3-Peaks, and Merry have their own design:

3-Peaks KC-22

Marvel ME-38S

A bit larger in size, but here's a Merry CCK25 and CK20:

superautobacs · Dec 7, 2018

JBH said:
Two 1/4" drive ratchets I picked up from Frank a little while ago, along with two Koken x Wiha 1/4" drive ratchets that arrived last week:

In truth I wanted to like both of them more than I do. Zeal is my fault - I simply didn't notice how short it was, even though that information was freely out there. That limits its utility for me, because the tininess makes it awkward to use. Two more inches and it would be a solid endgame.

Nepros I bought thinking it would be my endgame 1/4" ratchet, used variously stubby, with the Stahlwille breaker bar as shown above, or on a Felo Ergonic spinner handle. It's a very good tool but not my favorite. The mechanism is good but I prefer Koken's feel. The square on the back grips like nothing else. I tried using it with my Felo spinner handle, and had to punch it out. Same deal when I tried cascading it on the Zeal's square. I ordered the Stahlwille QR spinner handle to use with it. Others have mentioned the socket wobbles a bit on the square. That seems common on 1/4" drive QRs.

Koken x Wihas I discovered on GJ a while ago, and managed to find on a German site a couple weeks ago. They are exactly as I expected: IMO the best ratcheting mechanism, and a very good handle that may not quite be as good as Felo Ergonic but still feels great in the hand.

Does anyone know how hard it is to remove and replace the flex head on a Koken ratchet? I'm thinking about swapping out the QR head on one of those Koken x Wiha's with a Koken bit ratchet head. They're dimensionally the same, and have the same teeth. Zeal has a ball detent, so I don't think it is compatible.

Thanks for the photos. It's much better to see than a stock photo from Wiha's catalogue. :beer:

I wonder how long Wiha offered them for. :headscrat

In 2018 February, Ko-ken released longer ratchets and hinge handles, including the longer version of yours....the 2726z-160 which is 2.2" longer.

Might be worth adding?

Yeah, I find that 1/4 drive socketry items tend fit a bit of play on the square anvils. Zeal seems to fit with the least amount of play. I seem to recall Hazet 1/4 drive stuff being very good too.

I say try out head transplant on the bit ratchet! Then you'll have a one-of-a-kind that suits your taste and needs.

Reed Prince · Dec 12, 2018

These look very much like the Tsunoda/Engineer cutters posted here recently. All from Marvel?

mr.lemons said:
Any idea who manufactures these? Made in Germany. Would be interested if anyone else rebrands them but with dipped handles.

CplusF said:

From Orbis Will factory but using Japanese made Marvel base tool. No idea why they are laser etched “made in Germany” though.

Click to expand...

mr.lemons · Dec 12, 2018

superautobacs said:
(Engineer doesn't operate a factory. )

Thank you. I thought Engineer manufactured their own tools. Seams I've over complicated things and should just pick the nicest handle colour.

Also complicated things by mixing up two threads sorry.

Negen · Dec 12, 2018

It has been mentioned in the past that engineer is the OEM of vampliers if they are not then who is?

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madwi · Dec 13, 2018

A couple new things showed up at the house. I really dont need any more extensions but I wanted to try these out, I like the knurling on these. I already have a 1/4 drive flex head but my buddy liked it a lot when he was helping me wrench on the car so he gets one for Christmas as a small thank you. :thumbup:

Negen · Dec 13, 2018

madwi said:
A couple new things showed up at the house. I really dont need any more extensions but I wanted to try these out, I like the knurling on these. I already have a 1/4 drive flex head but my buddy liked it a lot when he was helping me wrench on the car so he gets one for Christmas as a small thank you. [emoji106]

Those are nice I am saving up for the wobble fix version in 1/4 and 3/8.

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madwi · Dec 13, 2018

Negen said:
Those are nice I am saving up for the wobble fix version in 1/4 and 3/8.

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Let me know how you like them. I normally use my Snap on 1/4 and 3/8 wobble/fixed extensions but I may pick up a set for the spare tool box. :thumbup:

Vicegrips · Dec 13, 2018

bargainhuntingking said:
Here is a quick preview. I’ll post more detailed pics in a bit.

A Marvel MN-3500 cantilever tool box and a Sakai Heavy Industries tool box with a stamp that reads SIG or SKG or SKC?

A wooden crate and metal KTC socket wrench and KTC offset wrench boxes

A peek inside:

Wow I’m so jelly of those Jap chisels! Besides riding mountain bikes, my favorite thing to do is wood carving. I’ve got one or two chisels from Japan but nothing special, one is stamped Nomi and holds a wicked edge. I mostly have euro steel. I collect vintage carving tools that go back 175years and they are some of my favorite to use. Some of my Addis chisels look like freshly cast and polished. They definitely knew how to make tools back then.

cleeny · Dec 13, 2018

Does anyone know if the Nepros wobble extensions are able to lock like the Ko-ken ones?

48548 · Dec 13, 2018

cleeny said:
Does anyone know if the Nepros wobble extensions are able to lock like the Ko-ken ones?

This picture makes me think yes, they have the square shoulder.....

looking for a pebble 4766 or any 47xx pebble hinged handle

ricleh · Dec 14, 2018

cleeny said:
Does anyone know if the Nepros wobble extensions are able to lock like the Ko-ken ones?

Yes, they can be locked.

jallyn · Dec 14, 2018

cleeny said:
Does anyone know if the Nepros wobble extensions are able to lock like the Ko-ken ones?

Yes. I have the shortest 1/4" and 3/8" drive wobble extensions and they lock straight all the way on, and wobble slightly pulled out. From what I've heard this is equivalent to Snap On's wobble plus. But the Nepros ones are shorter. That's the only size I need, since can be made longer by putting on the end of a regular extension...

superautobacs · Dec 14, 2018

mr.lemons said:
Thank you. I thought Engineer manufactured their own tools. Seams I've over complicated things and should just pick the nicest handle colour. Also complicated things by mixing up two threads sorry.

Negen said:
It has been mentioned in the past that engineer is the OEM of vampliers if they are not then who is?

Sent from my G8141 using The Garage Journal mobile app

In my mind, I compare companies like Engineer like Hozan to be similar in that they don't run manufacturing facilities (they may have in the past). Rather they develop specialty tools in partner with multiple tool manufacturers, both domestic and abroad.

The Neji-saurus series pliers are contracted out to a plier manufacturer in Niigata--a city in Northern Japan that is a major manufacturing hub and includes names like 3-Peaks, Keiba, Tsunoda, etc.

superautobacs · Dec 14, 2018

cleeny said:
Does anyone know if the Nepros wobble extensions are able to lock like the Ko-ken ones?

Yes, but results might vary depending on the socketry item you fit it. You may find that with brand x, the socket doesn't stay in the fixed position due to machining/dimensional issues. So, using it with Nepros socketry items would be the safest bet.

I only have the shortest in 1/4 drive which, like Jallyn said, is nice and stubby.

Here's a picture to illustrate the differences in machining. Note in particular, the different depths for the square "locked" position.

Caveat here is that if you're using super shallow sockets, like a Ko-ken Zeal, you won't be able to put it in the "locked" position, even though you're using one from the same brand ie. Ko-ken wobble-fix extension. This is the probably the reason why you don't see any wobble-fix extensions offered under the Zeal line.

An interesting point to note about the Nepros wobble-fix extension that even KTC's catalogue doesn't mention is that unlike all the other extensions of this kind, Nepros uses two detent balls (one on opposing ends). I think that's a fine detail on KTC's part in trying to reduce the likelyhood of a socket from getting pulled off the end of the extension.

Reed Prince · Dec 14, 2018

Vessel is coming out with a powered screwdriver. Release date according to Rakuten is Monday, December 17, and I saw it listed there for ¥ 5,556. Much cheaper than the recent Wiha, but with a non-swappable internal cell. That makes it pretty much unsuitable for anything except the lightest-duty applications. Unless you had three, with two always charging... :lol:

superautobacs · Dec 14, 2018

No low-battery warning and the rather dim LED light with the blueish hue reminds me of LED lighting from 10 years ago. Hrmm...

mr.lemons · Dec 15, 2018

superautobacs said:
In my mind, I compare companies like Engineer like Hozan to be similar in that they don't run manufacturing facilities (they may have in the past). Rather they develop specialty tools in partner with multiple tool manufacturers, both domestic and abroad.

The Neji-saurus series pliers are contracted out to a plier manufacturer in Niigata--a city in Northern Japan that is a major manufacturing hub and includes names like 3-Peaks, Keiba, Tsunoda, etc.

Interesting thanks.

cleeny · Dec 17, 2018

Thanks for all the replies.
So if I have only zeal sockets, I can wobble but not fix?!

Negen · Dec 17, 2018

cleeny said:
Thanks for all the replies.
So if I have only zeal sockets, I can wobble but not fix?!

Zeal sockets will work with any thing that fits on the square drive of the socket. You do not need zeal extension to use zeal sockets.

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ricleh · Dec 17, 2018

cleeny said:
Thanks for all the replies.
So if I have only zeal sockets, I can wobble but not fix?!

I don't have any 1/4" drive Zeal sockets so I can't check those. I tried the Nepros and Snapon wobble plus extensions on Zeal 3/8" drive sockets. The Nepros work just fine in the wobble and lock positions. The Snapon works fine in the wobble position but the extension protrudes into the socket cavity when it is in the lock position. This might or might not be a problem. The socket still has a lot of room to grip the fastener. This is only a problem on the short sockets. The deep sockets do not present this problem.

mobiledynamics · Dec 17, 2018

Going to start reading from #3785 and below

Was planning to order a 14MM Zeal Spark. In some engines, I'm using a thinwalled with two swivels on 2 6" extensions

Negen · Dec 17, 2018

mobiledynamics said:
Going to start reading from #3785 and below

Was planning to order a 14MM Zeal Spark. In some engines, I'm using a thinwalled with two swivels on 2 6" extensions

I have the 3300cz series and I would suggest getting then 3305pz series or even the 3305P-250 .

Go to page 205 in the 2018 online catalogue and you can are a their automotive line of non zeal spark plug sockets. The 14mm all have a 19mm outer diameter. The 14mm zeal Cz series is 18.4mm and the pz is 17.9mm.

The 3345P is on my wish list.

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superautobacs · Dec 17, 2018

Sorry guys. I need to elaborate/correct myself.

My earlier comment was concerning certain 1/4 drive Zeal stuff. Smaller shallow sockets like 10mm and smaller can't be operated in the "fixed" position.
My Zeal 1/4 drive Torx, In-hex bit sockets, and universal joints are like that as well.

My 1/4 drive shallow Nepros E-torx sockets also don't go into the "fixed" position using Ko-ken wobble-fix extensions. The Snap-on wobble-plus would be the same as well. But because the Nepros wobble-fix are machined with a shallow square portion, it's able to be used in the fixed position without issue.

With 3/8 drive Zeal shallow sockets, there's no issue...with the exception of the 8mm socket (which is the smallest I have in 3/8 drive).
But, like Ricleh said, when in the "fixed" position, you have the square protruding and that will interfere with the socket to fastener engagement (the smaller the socket size, the worse it becomes. Obviously, with deepwell sockets, it's not an issue.

Ko-ken 3305P and 3305PZ 14mm sparkplug sockets.
On some engines, the standard socket was giving me little to no room in the plug well, so I got the PZ version with the turned down shaft for better access to the sparkplug.

<a data-flickr-embed="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/ccassan/46361969701/in/photostream/" title="Ko-ken 12pt, 14mm Magnetic Sparkplug Sockets"><img src="https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4817/46361969701_6c00d5aeab_b.jpg" width="964" height="1024" alt="Ko-ken 12pt, 14mm Magnetic Sparkplug Sockets"></a><script async src="//embedr.flickr.com/assets/client-code.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<a data-flickr-embed="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/ccassan/32490281038/in/photostream/" title="Ko-ken 12pt Magnetic Sparkplug Sockets 3305P and 3305PZ"><img src="https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4810/32490281038_57c2a27100_b.jpg" width="1024" height="603" alt="Ko-ken 12pt Magnetic Sparkplug Sockets 3305P and 3305PZ"></a><script async src="//embedr.flickr.com/assets/client-code.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<a data-flickr-embed="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/ccassan/31422898467/in/photostream/" title="Ko-ken 12pt Magnetic Sparkplug Sockets 3305P and 3305PZ"><img src="https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4835/31422898467_d51e9e1daf_b.jpg" width="954" height="1024" alt="Ko-ken 12pt Magnetic Sparkplug Sockets 3305P and 3305PZ"></a><script async src="//embedr.flickr.com/assets/client-code.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

superautobacs · Dec 18, 2018

Tools in action:

The 3/8 drive Nepros multi-purpose ratchet mated to a Deen angle adapter and a long locking extension by FPC.

Task: to work on spring-loaded drive belt tensioner

<a data-flickr-embed="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/ccassan/46311063952/in/photostream/" title="3/8 drive 32" Long Ratchet using Deen Angle Adapter and Nepros Multi-purpose Ratchet"><img src="https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4872/46311063952_06fc4625d7_b.jpg" width="768" height="1024" alt="3/8 drive 32" Long Ratchet using Deen Angle Adapter and Nepros Multi-purpose Ratchet"></a><script async src="//embedr.flickr.com/assets/client-code.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<a data-flickr-embed="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/ccassan/46311063562/in/photostream/" title="3/8 drive 32" Long Ratchet using Deen Angle Adapter and Nepros Multi-purpose Ratchet"><img src="https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4855/46311063562_14f4630b50_b.jpg" width="768" height="1024" alt="3/8 drive 32" Long Ratchet using Deen Angle Adapter and Nepros Multi-purpose Ratchet"></a><script async src="//embedr.flickr.com/assets/client-code.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Qualitytools · Dec 19, 2018

superautobacs said:
Tools in action:

The 3/8 drive Nepros multi-purpose ratchet mated to a Deen angle adapter and a long locking extension by FPC.

Task: to work on spring-loaded drive belt tensioner

<a data-flickr-embed="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/ccassan/46311063952/in/photostream/" title="3/8 drive 32" Long Ratchet using Deen Angle Adapter and Nepros Multi-purpose Ratchet"><img src="https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4872/46311063952_06fc4625d7_b.jpg" width="768" height="1024" alt="3/8 drive 32" Long Ratchet using Deen Angle Adapter and Nepros Multi-purpose Ratchet"></a><script async src="//embedr.flickr.com/assets/client-code.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<a data-flickr-embed="true" href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/ccassan/46311063562/in/photostream/" title="3/8 drive 32" Long Ratchet using Deen Angle Adapter and Nepros Multi-purpose Ratchet"><img src="https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4855/46311063562_14f4630b50_b.jpg" width="768" height="1024" alt="3/8 drive 32" Long Ratchet using Deen Angle Adapter and Nepros Multi-purpose Ratchet"></a><script async src="//embedr.flickr.com/assets/client-code.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Thanks for sharing, that looks like a BMW engine bay

Two Speed · Dec 23, 2018

superautobacs said:
The Neji-saurus series pliers are contracted out to a plier manufacturer in Niigata--a city in Northern Japan that is a major manufacturing hub and includes names like 3-Peaks, Keiba, Tsunoda, etc.

I have a pair of pz-58 Neji-saurus, no complaints to date, and I find them very comfortable in my hand. Sure beats using an old pair of side cutters to remove security screws I don't have a proper bit for.

Alex.

superautobacs · Dec 23, 2018

Qualitytools said:
Thanks for sharing, that looks like a BMW engine bay

Two Speed said:
I have a pair of pz-58 Neji-saurus, no complaints to date, and I find them very comfortable in my hand. Sure beats using an old pair of side cutters to remove security screws I don't have a proper bit for.

Alex.

Funny you mentioned this. I had to bring mine out just the other day for removing a "tamper-proof" fastener. It was something I've never seen before--a triangular shaped one with a shallow head height.

Shallow headed triangle-head security fastener by ChrisCas aka Superautobacs, on Flickr

It was a perfect opportunity for these pliers:

3.Peaks Dia-type Pliers by ChrisCas aka Superautobacs, on Flickr

Two Speed · Dec 24, 2018

Funny you mentioned this. I had to bring mine out just the other day for removing a "tamper-proof" fastener. It was something I've never seen before--a triangular shaped one with a shallow head height.

That is an oddball alright. Thread looks like its belongs in plastic, I wonder if the head + rounded point + magnetic bit = enough wobble to locate a pre-molded hole without having to worry about tearing up a plastic housing when things don't quite align right, especially if there are multiples driven in at once.

Alex.

mrspeed · Dec 27, 2018

Just got this Engineer PR-15. I really like the feel. Opens smoothly but not loosely. And the tips are small and perfectly symmetrical. And not that it matters much, but the packaging is impressive as well. Has a shiny stripe (I presume this is harder to counterfeit... Or maybe just aesthetic) and a perforated top that makes it really easy to open. Probably the easiest tool I've ever opened, excluding tools that come loose.

Only odd thing is they're described as 125mm, but they are actually 140mm. I'm not sure exactly what they are measuring to get 125mm.

Posting a few comparison pictures next to the Knipex 25-01-140.

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mrspeed · Dec 27, 2018

One more that wouldn't upload.

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