Spreading the Bonney affliction!

Private Lugnutz · Jan 19, 2020

No worries.

These photos will provide a visual idea of what I was referring to. I forgot that I had done this comparison before. They are actually the same exact size. It's just the difference in the trays that gives the Bonney box the illusion of being squatter.

So, as I said, I like the deeper tray. I can pile a lot more tools in there and still have a lot of knuckle clearance. Not so much with the 41-B-1840. Unfortunately, that deeper tray makes for a very shallow main compartment. As I've said before, I keep my various wrench roll-ups (DOE engineers, DOE electrical, and DOE tappet) down there as well as the midget set and some other things that are relatively flat. But I couldn't keep anything of any real bulk under the tray or pile things up like I can with the 41-B-1840, which I've mostly emptied out to show the depth.

Farmer J. · Jan 19, 2020

LesserSon said:
An eggbeater would correct that last failing pretty quick. Or not (just read your edit.)
Obviously, it’s for fun-loving alternate-reality / revisionist fans, like in Dirty Dozen, Inglourious Basterds, or even Sucker Punch, not for serious historic realism. We have to think about how some of the rest of this stuff (not just “correct” stuff) is going to survive into the future, when the World of Tanks players of today are growed-*** men stuffed behind desks (or cringing in caves), looking for something to man-up their offices.
On a more realistic vein, most of the tools we’re imagining putting in that box are probably not GMTK tools either, though they may better fit the specs. But if I understand your previous comments on that topic, it’s a bottomless pit to argue over.
In parallel to this, I have a buddy who didn’t like the Revenant because parts of it were filmed in Alberta, British Columbia, and Argentina, thus incorrectly substituting species of trees and terrain for those in the presumed setting of the alleged original events. Similarly, he won’t watch the Good the Bad and the Ugly because it was filmed in Spain. I tease him because he loves Jeremiah Johnson, which was filmed in Utah instead of Montana and Wyoming. And then there’s my favorite Last of the Mohicans filmed in North Carolina instead of New York (displacement even crept into dialog with Kantuckee lying to the west of Albany). And what ALL these have in common is the stories are not even in the vicinity of real history. I see a Bonney box with GMTK-corresponding tools in it as being of the same inspiring - but not accurate - ilk.

'The Dirty Dozen' was filmed on location on my farm, and some local village and road scenes, for all of it except the last scenes in the French Chateau. I think my Father got paid around £100 as a location fee for them to build that prison camp set in the field, my Mother says the crew were always coming in to the farmhouse and borrowing our telephone, and the cost of the 'phone bill they ran up was hardly covered by what we were paid!
Most local people with direct experience of WW2 said it conveyed the mood and it was a good 'story', despite many small details not being accurate to the period and they always had great fun pointing them out!

I realise that this post is 'off topic' and nothing to do with Bonney Tools, so I will have to carefully watch it again now and see what tool boxes are in the movie!

LesserSon · Jan 19, 2020

Lugz- thanks for re-dispaying. That certainly makes a clear comparison. IF a person HAPPENED to find a Bonney-decal-bearing Union box with missing tray and tray supports, it might be a FUN LARK to substitute a regular-depth tray and reposition the supports higher, or alternately, and perhaps less reprehensibly, paint a Union box red and attach a repro Bonney sticker under the lid for the same effect.

Farmer J- that's a wonderful family inheritance!

Maybe we should move the conversation to the Ford Script thread(s)? I’m probably guilty of promoting the “tinkers’s dam” view of history...Once upon a time, I was at lunch with a colleague, who shared something he had heard with potential adverse fallout (to us). When I challenged his “facts,” he insisted, “That’s the rumor.” Said I, “Let’s change the rumor” (to something more to our benefit). He laughed at the notion, but isn’t that exactly what history is?

Private Lugnutz · Jan 19, 2020

LesserSon said:
I’m probably guilty of promoting the “tinkers’s dam” view of history...

Haha. Nah. I just think you have 'selective hearing'. I've seen you with an exacting curator's eye when it comes to some objects. I wouldn't dream of modifying this box, but I do think it would be fun to grab that one in Harmony PA that needs to be stripped, leave the tray supports and tray as is, mask off the decal, paint it OD green, stuff it with wartime Bonney GMTK tools, and fob it off as a wartime Bonney GMTK set. (Just as a side-note, you can't make a 100% single supplier GMTK, with any single mfgr. I've looked at that very hard. But some guys do mfgr-themed boxes in which the majority of tools come from a single mfgr.)

LesserSon · Jan 19, 2020

It’s closer to our brethren just over the Ohio border.
Call me a Zouave, but I’d keep the Bonney red...Wouldn’t a crackle-red finish look dandified on a Jeep?
That’s a good nugget, about the non-100% nature of the kits.

Private Lugnutz · Jan 19, 2020

LesserSon said:
Wouldn’t a crackle-red finish look dandified on a Jeep?

On an OD green MB, yes. On a red CJ-2, no.

outofbounds · Jan 19, 2020

LesserSon said:
It’s closer to our brethren just over the Ohio border.
Call me a Zouave, but I’d keep the Bonney red...Wouldn’t a crackle-red finish look dandified on a Jeep?
That’s a good nugget, about the non-100% nature of the kits.

I received a private message requesting details as to finding the listing, from a GJ member near to it's location. He was attempting to make contact today, so hopefully he'll be posting fresh pics soon, indicating that he was able to acquire it.

misterbill · Jan 23, 2020

After a week of patient coordination, I was able to pick up the Bonney box that OoB posted about. I'm not sure I would have paid more than $10 for it. Looks like it spent a fair amount of time in the elements. The inside has a lot of surface rust (especially the tray) and the paint is generally faded. It's missing one of the corner "protectors". But, it is pretty solid otherwise.

Bill

Private Lugnutz · Jan 23, 2020

Good snag, Bill! That thing is just waiting to be stripped and repainted. The lipstick red should be an easy color to match with a common rattle can, but let me know if you want me to email you some close-up photos. You see what I mean about squat now? How shallow the bottom is and how the deep the tray is compared to our beloved 41-B-1840? Pretty nifty, huh?

misterbill · Jan 23, 2020

Private Lugnutz said:
Good snag, Bill! That thing is just waiting to be stripped and repainted. The lipstick red should be an easy color to match with a common rattle can, but let me know if you want me to email you some close-up photos. You see what I mean about squat now? How shallow the bottom is and how the deep the tray is compared to our beloved 41-B-1840? Pretty nifty, huh?

I started to wipe it down with some WD40. The original paint appears to be a crinkle finish. I'm thinking for now I may just clean it as much as possible and put some wax on it to keep it from rusting until I decide what to do with it. They're only original once, right?

Bill

Private Lugnutz · Jan 23, 2020

Right. As I have said many times, including on my Refinishing thread, sometimes the 'Preserve or Restore?' call is a hard one to make.

Crinkle, huh? That's interesting. Mine is flat.

d42jeep · Jan 23, 2020

Bill,
Recently I poured a thin coating of evaporust into the bottom of a socket box with a good layer of surface rust. After I dumped it back into the evaporust bucket the following morning, it had really done a good job on the surface rust and saved me a lot of work. You might give it a try. It’s interesting that Union switched to the McAleer style of tray supports for that lower tray rather than using their customary vertical supports.
-Don

outofbounds · Jan 23, 2020

misterbill said:
After a week of patient coordination, I was able to pick up the Bonney box that OoB posted about. I'm not sure I would have paid more than $10 for it. Looks like it spent a fair amount of time in the elements. The inside has a lot of surface rust (especially the tray) and the paint is generally faded. It's missing one of the corner "protectors". But, it is pretty solid otherwise.

Bill

Nice work, Mr. Bill! I was quietly wondering if that was going to pan out. Seemed like the seller was a general "picker" based on the other items on offer, and very well might have found that in Grandpa's barn, or on the side of the road somewhere.Glad it's in the hands of someone who who cares now.

Mikeske · Jan 24, 2020

I out today and found a nice MEB8H 8MM Bonney wrench today at the Habitat for Humanities thrift store for 25 cents. Nice little guy and better shape then my original 1983 wrench. I do know the dating of the original as I bought then with my set.

bmwrd0 · Jan 24, 2020

misterbill said:
I started to wipe it down with some WD40. The original paint appears to be a crinkle finish. I'm thinking for now I may just clean it as much as possible and put some wax on it to keep it from rusting until I decide what to do with it. They're only original once, right?

Bill

This what I would do. That paint, the sticker, any dents or dings; all of those are part of the box and its history. To lose them would be sad in my eyes.

leg17 · Jan 24, 2020

misterbill said:
..... They're only original once, right?
Bill

Modified for emphasis

Oldtuleguy · Jan 24, 2020

Unless they are really bad I just clean them up. The worst case is the spray bomb.

Private Lugnutz · Jan 24, 2020

Usually I am in the preserve camp, but there's something about this one makes me want to mask the decal and do a nice 'barn find' look resto. Maybe because I have a clean one. I'll be eager to see Bill's clean-up.

misterbill · Jan 24, 2020

Private Lugnutz said:
Usually I am in the preserve camp, but there's something about this one makes me want to mask the decal and do a nice 'barn find' look resto. Maybe because I have a clean one. I'll be eager to see Bill's clean-up.

Been mulling it over all day. I think I'll first wipe it down real well with some Dawn detergent in warm water (keeping it away from the decal) to remove any grease/dirt and follow it up with a wash of WD40 to displace the leftover water. The tray is going to require some attention. I'm going to try shop towels soaked in Evaporust and see how it turns out. If it looks passable I'll just give everything a good coat of wax and maybe line it with some cork and call it done for now. (I think I've got maybe a handful of Bonney tools to put in it!)

Bill

Private Lugnutz · Jan 24, 2020

I had a good hard discussion with our founder on this topic once. I think the thread was about one of those YouTube guys doing a full-blown chassis-off type resto on an antique fuel pump or something like that. I took the preserve side, as usual, and he was making the point, and making it well, about it not being a litmus test thing, but a case by case thing, with moving criteria, and no right or wrong. And he's right. More recently, don long did a full resto on a big Blackhawk jack that I would've preserved. But when you see the results, like it just came out of the factory, it's hard to argue with that back-to-its-glory reasoning as well.

I'm sure you'll do it justice and proud either way, Bill.

Private Lugnutz · Jan 24, 2020

Speaking of fuel pumps and fuel pump wrenches...

Bonney was apparently supplying these single offset DBE twisters to Gray Marine Motor Company, probably for many years. There is an unmistakable Bonney-looking "BV" date code forged into one end of the shank. When I picked this up this morning at the flea market and reported it in the 2020 Garage Sale thread, I didn't even see the date code, so it was a nice surprise after clean-up. Gray Marine was established in 1906. Based on the markings (which resemble the Bonney prewar markings on DBE wrenches...), I am thinking 1930 rather than 1944 on this one.

LesserSon · Jan 24, 2020

misterbill said:
If it looks passable I'll just give everything a good coat of wax and maybe line it with some cork and call it done for now. (I think I've got maybe a handful of Bonney tools to put in it!)

In its as-found condition, and for the price you paid, you can do whatever you want to it without guilt. Doing nothing other than cleaning and waxing is both the hardest and easiest thing. Hard, because you’d rather make it look like it never saw neglect, but easy because it involves less steps. I think the label is telling you what to do. Bonney did not make the box. The label is the only thing distinguishing it. Remove it and the box isn’t Bonney anymore. I think it will look best if the condition of the label and the condition of the box are kept alike.

Private Lugnutz · Jan 24, 2020

Also picked up this prewar Bonney No. 4001 (15/16" blade width) drag link bit this morning.

misterbill · Jan 25, 2020

Well, the die was cast when it cleaned up fairly well. The rust was truly surface rust and the Dawn/WD40/Evaporust trio did their work. Is it perfect? Not even close. The original color was, as Lugz said, a beautiful Jessica Rabbit lipstick red. The exterior has obviously faded but lots of original paint remains inside. The exterior was definitely a very gentle crinkle finish. I hope I was able to capture it in the photo. Once it dries and the steel warms up I'll put some liner in it and start filling it up!

Bill

Private Lugnutz · Jan 25, 2020

Looks terrific, Bill. Kudos on saving that decal. That can be delicate, vexing, anxious work, wanting to save it, and improve it, but not wanting to ruin it in the process.

LesserSon · Jan 25, 2020

Beautiful, Bill! I did not imagine you could get that label to look that good.

bmwrd0 · Jan 25, 2020

Private Lugnutz said:
Looks terrific, Bill. Kudos on saving that decal. That can be delicate, vexing, anxious work, wanting to save it, and improve it, but not wanting to ruin it in the process.

Ain't that the truth!

Nice job Bill.

outofbounds · Jan 26, 2020

misterbill said:
Well, the die was cast when it cleaned up fairly well. The rust was truly surface rust and the Dawn/WD40/Evaporust trio did their work. Is it perfect? Not even close. The original color was, as Lugz said, a beautiful Jessica Rabbit lipstick red. The exterior has obviously faded but lots of original paint remains inside. The exterior was definitely a very gentle crinkle finish. I hope I was able to capture it in the photo. Once it dries and the steel warms up I'll put some liner in it and start filling it up!
Bill

Looks great, Bill! Glad to see you are rewarded with a worthy "keeper" after originally heading out to simply save the box from oblivion.

LesserSon · Jan 28, 2020

(In best Church Lady voice) “Well, isn’t THAT interesting?”
A Bonney Laddie tool set display on eBay.

Oldtuleguy · Jan 28, 2020

Wow! That looks alot better

Skooch · Jan 29, 2020

Greetings. I'm looking for a 23714 (7/16" combo) to complete a set that belonged to my late brother. I have various other Bonney wrenches for trade.
Thank you

bonneyman · Jan 30, 2020

Skooch said:
Greetings. I'm looking for a 23714 (7/16" combo) to complete a set that belonged to my late brother. I have various other Bonney wrenches for trade.
Thank you

Shouldn't be too hard to secure. The satin combos weren't as popular as the full polish so get overlooked alot.

Skooch · Jan 31, 2020

bonneyman said:
Shouldn't be too hard to secure. The satin combos weren't as popular as the full polish so get overlooked alot.

That's what I was thinking. Just looking to do a little horse trading.

MR.X · Jan 31, 2020

Private Lugnutz said:
Speaking of fuel pumps and fuel pump wrenches...

Bonney was apparently supplying these single offset DBE twisters to Gray Marine Motor Company, probably for many years. There is an unmistakable Bonney-looking "BV" date code forged into one end of the shank. When I picked this up this morning at the flea market and reported it in the 2020 Garage Sale thread, I didn't even see the date code, so it was a nice surprise after clean-up. Gray Marine was established in 1906. Based on the markings (which resemble the Bonney prewar markings on DBE wrenches...), I am thinking 1930 rather than 1944 on this one.

This is the same wrench as the 41-W-1495-100 for the Detroit Diesel 6-71's, right?

Private Lugnutz · Jan 31, 2020

That's the engine. I don't really know much about the FSN wrenches. Do you have one? I thought I had a Bonney wrench just like it but marked differently, but there's not one in my Bonney box, so maybe it's an FSN wrench I was thinking of. If so, I'd have to scout around for it. Maybe I should reconsider 1944 instead of 1930.

MR.X · Jan 31, 2020

Hi. I'm 3,000 miles form my wrenches, not that i could find it anyway, but pretty sure I have it as a Bonney made "KMO" Kent Moore.

MR.X · Jan 31, 2020

I just did a quick search and the wrench# I'm talking about shows up in a M36 Tank Destoyer Tm online. Can't find a landing craft one with the Marine mod version of the 6-71 but I imagine it might be in one of those TM's too.

Private Lugnutz · Feb 1, 2020

I had a very interesting find this morning. As first reported on the 2020 Garage Sale thread, I was pretty sure this was a Bonney wrench, but the markings were throwing me. After clean-up, things became a little clearer. What I think I have here is a double-offset double box end wrench made by Bonney in July 1940 (see the forged-in "GR" date code) for Nubo Tools LTD (see "< NUBO >" logo), a British outfit operating from the late 30's through the 1960's. That "W181A" marking is a Nubo number, not a Bonney number. Whitworth sizing. The milled openings are 5/8" x 1/2".

Private Lugnutz · Feb 1, 2020

The only references I can find for Nubo Tools LTD is this snippet view from a British 1948 trade rag (see pic attached below), a 1939 Nubo catalog that has not yet ben digitized, linked here, and a set of Nubo DOE wrenches posted on the 'Tools of the Old World' thread up on the Genera Discussion forum back in 2016, linked here.

humber2 · Feb 4, 2020

I have the 1939 NUBO Catalog and a few tools.

Pre WW2 most NUBO tools were marked FOREIGN denoting German manufacture.

Post WW2 British Made was what was noted on the tools and contemporary Catalogs.

The marketing Company was Gerald Stains Ltd of Underwood St London N1

Interesting the Bonney 1940 date and that the tool is marked USA Made.

I do wonder if the order was placed on Gray of Canada?

Spreading the Bonney affliction!

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