Show Your Heritage Logo Love

JoCoSawdust · Aug 24, 2020

Frank. I was mistaken about the date on this grinder. It's a 56, not a 53. Given the fact that it was produced late (October) in that model year, it doesn't necessarily debunk the 30th Anniversary theory. I've learned from researching tool boxes that when a significant change appears in a catalog, that change usually hit the ground late in the year prior. This grinder may be an example of that.

I don't discount the 30th Anniversay theory, I just question it since there is no, to my knowledge, verification of that being the case for the Power Bronze paint schemes. We do know that Power Bronze was used past 1957 as evidenced by the number of machines wearing Crown logo that are painted Power Bronze. The logo change from Heritage to Crown occurred in toolboxes sometime late in 1958, I can only assume the logo change on machines occured pretty much around the same time.

The biggest hole in the 30th Anniversary theory that I see is that I can find zero mention of it in any literature that I have access to. I would expect a tagline of "Celebrating 30 years of Craftsman Tools" or something of that nature out of Sears. Instead, the color just shows up without fanfare, hangs around for a few years, then quietly goes away.

I think there's plenty of anectdotal evidence to support the theory but no proof. That's what keeps me scratching my head. One of those many Craftsman things we'll probably never know with certainty.

FrankLee · Aug 24, 2020

JoCoSawdust said:
Frank. I was mistaken about the date on this grinder. It's a 56, not a 53. Given the fact that it was produced late (October) in that model year, it doesn't necessarily debunk the 30th Anniversary theory. I've learned from researching tool boxes that when a significant change appears in a catalog, that change usually hit the ground late in the year prior. This grinder may be an example of that.

I don't discount the 30th Anniversay theory, I just question it since there is no, to my knowledge, verification of that being the case for the Power Bronze paint schemes. We do know that Power Bronze was used past 1957 as evidenced by the number of machines wearing Crown logo that are painted Power Bronze. The logo change from Heritage to Crown occurred in toolboxes sometime late in 1958, I can only assume the logo change on machines occured pretty much around the same time.

The biggest hole in the 30th Anniversary theory that I see is that I can find zero mention of it in any literature that I have access to. I would expect a tagline of "Celebrating 30 years of Craftsman Tools" or something of that nature out of Sears. Instead, the color just shows up without fanfare, hangs around for a few years, then quietly goes away.

I think there's plenty of anectdotal evidence to support the theory but no proof. That's what keeps me scratching my head. One of those many Craftsman things we'll probably never know with certainty.

Well said and I agree... there's no mention anywhere of 30 years... even on the Craftsman chronology webpage.

There were fewer and fewer references to gray enamel machines in catalogs leading up to '58. The cover of the '59-'60 catalog features a power bronze radial arm saw. The first mention of the name "power bronze" (that I found) is in the '59-'60 catalog for the 10" table saw.

Provincial · Aug 24, 2020

One thought is that the Marketing Department may have decided that the Gold color was good for sales, and kept it "in production" longer than anticipated. But there is another important factor to consider.

There was a booming economy during the first half of 1957, but the US entered a sharp recession about mid-year that lasted into early 1959. There may have been a lot of inventory that was't sold or finished after July of 1957, and if the contracted products were not "finished" the newer badges were probably installed to keep the product "up to date."

FrankLee · Aug 24, 2020

Provincial said:
One thought is that the Marketing Department may have decided that the Gold color was good for sales, and kept it "in production" longer than anticipated. But there is another important factor to consider.

There was a booming economy during the first half of 1957, but the US entered a sharp recession about mid-year that lasted into early 1959. There may have been a lot of inventory that was't sold or finished after July of 1957, and if the contracted products were not "finished" the newer badges were probably installed to keep the product "up to date."

That is a good point. To stay on topic and support Provencial's thought, below are a few quotes from my drill press thread with a very late Heritage drill press in power bronze.

Note the factory repaint of the base in my update from 9/13/2016. It looks like the original color was the later charcoal gray.

FrankLee said:
9/13/2016

I just got home with dp#23... a very nice bench model. It came with a nice Craftsman vise and mortising fence/hold-down. Oh, and a very nice MSA!

This one has me puzzled though. I thought it was a 1956 or ’57 model. It’s clearly a Craftsman 100, but the model number is 103.24520. That tells me it was made after 1957. There was no power tool catalog in 1958 when the 150’s were introduced. The motor is dated 2-58, so this one must be a very late Craftsman 100 made in early 1958.

9/15/2016

The vise cleaned-up nicely!

9/16/2016

The hold-down cleaned up nicely too!

FrankLee said:
Outlawmws said:

Frank, that one has a 150 table and paint job...

What other differentiating features does it have?

Taumac, if the spring broke near the end, I've repaired similar torsion springs by grinding the requisite notches or reforming the end...

Click to expand...

9/13/2016

I'm fairly certain that the table is original to this 100. The tilt table was discontinued as a standard feature in the 1956 model year. The tilt table was an option for a couple years after.

This dp has the pivoting motor mount. I was never sure when that was introduced. It also has a rapid-adjust feed stop and tapered lock handles.

Power Bronze paint was also introduced in 1956. I thought maybe it was repainted, but if it is, it was an excellent job. I'll have to pull the head frame trim and badge off and look for more evidence. I really think it's original.

9/17/2016

Dp#23 in pieces.

9/19/2016

The base, table, head frame and MSA are cleaned.

9/20/2016

Column, table lock, head frame lock, and spindle pulley cleaned. It's going back together.

I swapped-out the pivot motor mount with a stationary mount.

This drill press gave me the opportunity to use my home-made pin spanner for the first time to remove the chuck. It worked great! I've got the chuck soaking in ATF.

To remove the snap ring from the quill, I clamped a vise-grip on each end of the snap ring and used spreading pliers to open the ring enough to remove it.

The spindle pulley assembly, the quill/spindle assembly, and the pinion/spring/hub assembly are cleaned, reassembled and reinstalled into the head frame.

9/21/2016

Refurb is complete. This one is very nice!

wrenchguy · Aug 24, 2020

113 27521 10" table saw with 1-55 stamped on the model tag. Not sure what color it is, suppose tobe? Runs and cuts fine.
I got this and some other craftsman stuff at a live farm auction last friday at good prices. Not many people there. (1st live auction of the year for me.)

What's the arrowhead shaped thing? I believe that miter goes to the "Underline C" saw i got at the sale, kinda lumped together stuff there.

Motor with 11-54 stamp.

Smokeshow69 · Aug 25, 2020

I don’t know if I have ever posted this metal box before. I paid $3.50 for it years ago and use it to hold my cadmium plated plomb made circle u 1/2 drive set. It fits in it perfectly but can’t hold the speed handle but I like its size

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Provincial · Aug 25, 2020

I have one like that that came with an early SK set in it. I think it is a little later, since it doesn't have the heritage logo, just CRAFTSMAN on the lid.

Smokeshow69 · Aug 25, 2020

Provincial said:
I have one like that that came with an early SK set in it. I think it is a little later, since it doesn't have the heritage logo, just CRAFTSMAN on the lid.

I have been trying to find this box in the catalogs... I can find the box but not that logo. It jumps from long c logo inside the lid to a heritage logo on the front of the box but not on the lid like this one? Is this box rare or just didn’t appear in catalogs ?
1943- long C logo
1944- box is n/a.... I assume war time restrictions
1945- heritage logo on the front, not embossed into the lid
1946... same logo on front, not lid

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JoCoSawdust · Aug 25, 2020

Smoke, I call that a "transitional" box going from the blue Long C clamshells to the hammered gray ones with the Heritage waterslide decal on the top outer lid. Hard to pick them out in the catalogs but I see the 1/4" drive version as late as 52. Easy to pick it out since it had a unique socket compartment in it. No clue on the actual date range for this type of clamshell even with the catalogs. Could just be a lazy artist re-using old imagery. As for the catalog images of clamshells with Heritage logo on the front of the case, I've never seen one like that and believe that's just the artist showing logo on the box that, with the given angle, wouldn't otherwise be seen. You can find exaggeration/incorrect placement of logos a lot in the catalogs. That set would have had just the sockets, a hinge handle and a tommy bar in it.

JoCoSawdust · Aug 25, 2020

I think this is your box right here Smoke. 1948. If you look closely you can see the 3 line embossing in the lid. I've never seen a clamshell from any era, with any logo, with the logo on the front edge like this. I think it's artistic license.

Screen Shot 2020-08-25 at 7.33.40 PM.jpg

Oldtuleguy · Aug 25, 2020

Joco the 1/4 inch sets persisted in that style for sure, as I have run into a couple with mdf and circle u.

Provincial · Aug 25, 2020

I looked at my box again, and it has rounded corners. It is later and the design is different.

Never mind!

bmwrd0 · Aug 25, 2020

I have one I picked up a while back. I think they are wartime, at least that is what I recall from what Rileysan said.

Smokeshow69 · Aug 25, 2020

JoCoSawdust said:
I think this is your box right here Smoke. 1948. If you look closely you can see the 3 line embossing in the lid. I've never seen a clamshell from any era, with any logo, with the logo on the front edge like this. I think it's artistic license.

Scott, i think you found it :bowdown:

I asked Rileysan but he was working and didnt reply

I was working as well but had a chance to flip through the catalogs but i missed the embossing you found. We know artistic license certainly ran its course during this time period. Thanks for finding that! I know mine shouldnt have a ratchet in it but it fits

I do need to find a circle u tommy bar and universal joint now to complete the set

Smokeshow69 · Aug 25, 2020

bmwrd0 said:
I have one I picked up a while back. I think they are wartime, at least that is what I recall from what Rileysan said.

That box is really in nice shape! Great pickup.

JoCoSawdust · Aug 25, 2020

Makes sense OTG. I'm sure they would have used up stock till they ran out. Hard to tell how long some of this stuff was still hitting the streets.

bmwrd, I think probably late in the war. The last tool specific catalog they put out was 42. Those didn't kick in again till 48. In the lurch all I have access to are the big books. 43 shows them still sellings socket sets and tool sets in pre-war boxes. 44 has no sets available, only individual sockets and drive tools. 45 is the first time I see the Heritage logo and it's on the "transitional" clam shells although they still show a midget set in a pre-war case. If they're showing in a 45 catalog they would have had to have gone into production sometime the previous year.

JoCoSawdust · Aug 25, 2020

Rileysan is probably pinned under a stack of Deluxe Rollers, you'd better go check on him!!

I'll look tomorrow but I don't think the U tommy bar is marked in any way.

Smokeshow69 · Aug 25, 2020

JoCoSawdust said:
Rileysan is probably pinned under a stack of Deluxe Rollers, you'd better go check on him!!

I'll look tomorrow but I don't think the U tommy bar is marked in any way.

I believe your right, most craftsman tommy bars are not marked but some are

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DaveT · Aug 25, 2020

FrankLee said:
The first mention of the name "power bronze" (that I found) is in the '59-'60 catalog for the 10" table saw.

FrankLee: I have the power bronze table saw from the 59-60 catalog in all original paint. This was the first piece of vintage Craftsman I bought. It’s in amazing all original condition and looked like it never had a spec of rust on it ever.

So I have a question what would you call this logo in the Craftsman logo history?

Smokeshow69 · Aug 25, 2020

DaveT said:
FrankLee: I have the power bronze table saw from the 59-60 catalog in all original paint. This was the first piece of vintage Craftsman I bought. It’s in amazing all original condition and looked like it never had a spec of rust on it ever.

So I have a question what would you call this logo in the Craftsman logo history?

Dave- what you have there is not a table saw but a cabinet saw. It was the nicest, most expensive saw sears sold at the time. That logo only appears on that particular saw model. It is right in that time period of heritage/ crown top logo change over. I don’t know what you call that logo but that is the nicest unrestored original saw I have ever seen. Very nice find!

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JoCoSawdust · Aug 25, 2020

Damn Dave...all I can think of to say is "Wow"!

Oldtuleguy · Aug 25, 2020

that is a jaw dropper!

DaveT · Aug 25, 2020

Smoke: Yes you are correct it is a cabinet saw! I know I got extremely lucky on this find. I will tell the story below.

JoCo: LOL It really is a beautiful piece of machinery. I think I have walked downstairs before for no other reason other that to just take a look at it

A couple years ago I decided I would begin to put a little basement wood-shop together. I had a Craftsman 10” contractor saw that I bought new in 1991. So I started looking on Craigslist and Marketplace for a bandsaw and drill press. Well I found an ad for a old bandsaw for $50 I think. After I loaded it in the truck the guy says to me that his wife was kicking him out of the garage so he had to sell his stuff. I asked what else he had and he said I have an old table saw and proceeded to walk me inside to look at it. It was a little dusty but I knew it looked like a much nicer saw than what I had. I said how much and he says how about $100. Well I couldn’t get it loaded fast enough before he changed his mind! I got it home and went through and cleaned everything up and couldn’t believe what amazing condition it was in. Seams like it had barley ever been used. So I had not even ripped a board on it before cleaning it. First board I went to rip a 2x4 and the blade nearly stalled out. I though what the heck my contractor saw had more power than this. Good news is the problem was the motor was wired incorrectly. It was wired in the configuration for 230 Volts but the saw had a 115V cord and plug on it. Switched the wires around on the motor for 115V configuration and wow what a difference. Runs great I have ripped through 2 1/2” ash with ease now. Makes me wonder if the reason this saw is in such great shape for a 60 year old saw might be because it has been wired wrong since it was new and therefore never used much because it was thought to be underpowered. If so that’s a blessing for me!

Oldtuleguy · Aug 25, 2020

Great story. Just goes to show you never know what else is for sale in someone's garage!

Smokeshow69 · Aug 26, 2020

DaveT said:
Smoke: Yes you are correct it is a cabinet saw! I know I got extremely lucky on this find. I will tell the story below.

JoCo: LOL It really is a beautiful piece of machinery. I think I have walked downstairs before for no other reason other that to just take a look at it

A couple years ago I decided I would begin to put a little basement wood-shop together. I had a Craftsman 10” contractor saw that I bought new in 1991. So I started looking on Craigslist and Marketplace for a bandsaw and drill press. Well I found an ad for a old bandsaw for $50 I think. After I loaded it in the truck the guy says to me that his wife was kicking him out of the garage so he had to sell his stuff. I asked what else he had and he said I have an old table saw and proceeded to walk me inside to look at it. It was a little dusty but I knew it looked like a much nicer saw than what I had. I said how much and he says how about $100. Well I couldn’t get it loaded fast enough before he changed his mind! I got it home and went through and cleaned everything up and couldn’t believe what amazing condition it was in. Seams like it had barley ever been used. So I had not even ripped a board on it before cleaning it. First board I went to rip a 2x4 and the blade nearly stalled out. I though what the heck my contractor saw had more power than this. Good news is the problem was the motor was wired incorrectly. It was wired in the configuration for 230 Volts but the saw had a 115V cord and plug on it. Switched the wires around on the motor for 115V configuration and wow what a difference. Runs great I have ripped through 2 1/2” ash with ease now. Makes me wonder if the reason this saw is in such great shape for a 60 year old saw might be because it has been wired wrong since it was new and therefore never used much because it was thought to be underpowered. If so that’s a blessing for me!

Great story Dave! I agree as to the wiring issue helping it to stay so nice! You sure got lucky!

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CKS1955 · Aug 26, 2020

Beautiful saw. I use that badge as my avatar (an earlier version).

Jay

Rileysan · Aug 26, 2020

JoCoSawdust said:
Rileysan is probably pinned under a stack of Deluxe Rollers, you'd better go check on him!!

I'll look tomorrow but I don't think the U tommy bar is marked in any way.

Not too far off from the truth. At about the time of your posting, yesterday, I was trying to finish repairing a shot blast machine the size of an average garage when the conveyor belt on the bucket elevator tore, leaving a mess of buckets, conveyor belt, and hundreds of pounds of steel shot at the bottom of the elevator. I nearly went home "sick" after that!! %$!$@!^!@^(&()&@&
:rant:

Smokeshow69 · Aug 26, 2020

Rileysan said:
Not too far off from the truth. At about the time of your posting, yesterday, I was trying to finish repairing a shot blast machine the size of an average garage when the conveyor belt on the bucket elevator tore, leaving a mess of buckets, conveyor belt, and hundreds of pounds of steel shot at the bottom of the elevator. I nearly went home "sick" after that!! %$!$@!^!@^(&()&@&

That sounds horrible [emoji15][emoji36]

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Provincial · Aug 26, 2020

The bigger they are, the harder they fall!

JoCoSawdust · Aug 27, 2020

Chronological Long Handle Line Up. Say that three times really fast! I'm missing one of the ten variants, the big boy from 1946. It's a center-lock box that measures 12" across the end. If you have one you're willing to part with, please shoot me pics and price. Thanks.

Oldtuleguy · Aug 27, 2020

Impressive line up! I think i have one of those, the second from the left.

DaveT · Aug 28, 2020

CKS1955 said:
Beautiful saw. I use that badge as my avatar (an earlier version).

Jay

Good looking avatar! Do you have one of the floor model saws?

outofbounds · Aug 28, 2020

JoCoSawdust said:
Chronological Long Handle Line Up. Say that three times really fast! I'm missing one of the ten variants, the big boy from 1946. It's a center-lock box that measures 12" across the end. If you have one you're willing to part with, please shoot me pics and price. Thanks.

Just a thought, but there's a lot of backyard there to stretch that chronology a lot further......just sayin!

Smokeshow69 · Aug 30, 2020

I am getting really close to completing this early heritage Circle Hcarry -1/2 drive set! I need to find a circle H universal joint, 9/16 8 pt socket and also need a tight hinge handle and possibly the speeder with the rotating grip on the forehand. I cut contact paper cork drawer liner sheets to match the inside of the box but I don’t remove the backing paper so the adhesive isn’t exposed to stick down. It protects the paint inside the box and looks vintage! 1948 catalog listing!

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Semi-hole mechanic · Sep 1, 2020

Smokeshow, I have a similar box that was my Dad's. It's not nearly as nice as yours. The only original pieces are the box, the speeder, breaker bar, and two sockets (15/16 and 1). It's on about the 5th ratchet. For the longest time it had a butterfly ratchet in it. What's left of the leather handle is held on with baling wire and has been as long as I can remember. The only gray paint is on the inside of the lid. Dad received it for HS graduation in '48 so it saw a lot of IH tractors in it's day. I still use the set and thought about restoring the box but the greasy paintless condition is the way I always remember it ( I wasn't born til '70).

DaveT · Sep 1, 2020

Semi-hole mechanic said:
Smokeshow, I have a similar box that was my Dad's. It's not nearly as nice as yours. The only original pieces are the box, the speeder, breaker bar, and two sockets (15/16 and 1). It's on about the 5th ratchet. For the longest time it had a butterfly ratchet in it. What's left of the leather handle is held on with baling wire and has been as long as I can remember. The only gray paint is on the inside of the lid. Dad received it for HS graduation in '48 so it saw a lot of IH tractors in it's day. I still use the set and thought about restoring the box but the greasy paintless condition is the way I always remember it ( I wasn't born til '70).

I would say that greasy paintless patina is priceless! Sounds like some great memories.

Smokeshow69 · Sep 1, 2020

Semi-hole mechanic said:
Smokeshow, I have a similar box that was my Dad's. It's not nearly as nice as yours. The only original pieces are the box, the speeder, breaker bar, and two sockets (15/16 and 1). It's on about the 5th ratchet. For the longest time it had a butterfly ratchet in it. What's left of the leather handle is held on with baling wire and has been as long as I can remember. The only gray paint is on the inside of the lid. Dad received it for HS graduation in '48 so it saw a lot of IH tractors in it's day. I still use the set and thought about restoring the box but the greasy paintless condition is the way I always remember it ( I wasn't born til '70).

If the 2 biggest socket are indeed original then your set was made by plomb- it has the Circle U marking. The butterfly ratchet is not original to the set and was probably replaced under warranty? These sets, made by plomb were sold from 1945-1948 so your timeline fits! You could find the missing circle u marked sockets but then it would get rid of a lot of the sentimental value in my book? Maybe just start by cleaning everything up and fixing the handle? Believe it or not but that is the remnants of the original handle. Great set either way!

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Semi-hole mechanic · Sep 1, 2020

Smokeshow you are correct the sockets are circle u and the breaker bar is a circle H (New Britain). I know that the butterfly ratchet was a warranty replacement. It was probably the second or third ratchet (the one in it now is the fourth or fifth). It had the "wings" broken off it for as long as I can remember. I also know that it's the remnants of the original handle but its looked like that for as long as I remember including being held on the one side with baling wire. All of the other SAE sockets are either -v- or =v= replaced as they were broken or lost.

Oldtuleguy · Sep 1, 2020

Nice to see a set that got used

d42jeep · Sep 2, 2020

I found this partial set at a Berkeley estate sale in 2016. Paid $25.00 for it and sold it on eBay for $30.00. Nothing but profit.
-Do

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