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Old 07-13-2017, 11:33 AM   #41
Hubscrub66
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

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Originally Posted by A_Pmech View Post
Oh hell no!

There's nothing more petty than having a rulemaking organization tell you when you can take out your trash and what color to paint your house. Its great for training compliant humans, but not much else.
Amen, I keep very clean yard house etc. No way I'm paying somebody to police my yard etc. I live near a small town in the country. I won't live in a subdivision where the neighbors house is 20 ft away and they can smell me fart In my yard. My one neighbor is family and the rest of our land is rented to a farmer. The corn is a good neighbor the beans are too. Plus were helping feed America To the OP I would drop it and go futrther.

Last edited by Hubscrub66; 07-13-2017 at 11:39 AM.
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:42 AM   #42
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

I'm fortunate to live in a nice community with no HOA. All zoning and architectural compliance is handled by the township, as it should be. My cousin lives in a townhouse community where the HOA does not allow him to have a BBQ grill on his back deck. F that. I'm happy, I can grill.
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:43 AM   #43
nh_yota
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

If I were in the OP's position and encountered this revelation, I would think:

1. Why are the sellers selling the house in the first place? Maybe because they're tired of living with a bad HOA?
2. Why was the HOA not disclosed from the start? Maybe it's a bad HOA and they're trying to pull a fast one so you don't find out it's a bad HOA until after you bought the house.

I mean the realtors should have figured this out from day one. It's not like they're trying to figure out if George Washington actually stayed overnight in the house on his way to Valley Forge.
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:52 AM   #44
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

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Originally Posted by idriveahonda View Post
I think everyone has a bad taste about HoA's regarding "freedom" and "it's my house I'll do what I like".

That is fine, don't buy a house in an HoA.

People who do buy in an HoA do so, so that they don't have to worry about their neighbors forgetting to do "regular maintenance" to their home. One bad house on a row of nice houses...makes the entire row look bad.

If my neighbor is thirty feet from me, I don't want them painting their house bright pink, or leaving their 88 Cutlass on jackstands and having the front yard filled with trash and childrens toys.

Let's be real, if we all had neighbors like the members on here...we wouldn't need an HoA. Fact is, people suck...and without an HoA many times...would let their house go to crap.
If we all had neighbors like the members on here, we'd all need a HOA.
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:52 AM   #45
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

Run away, don't close - cancel the listing on your existing house so you don't get caught with no where to live.
Also, go after your agent or the agent that didn't disclose the HOA & / or his broker.
They carry errors and omissions insurance - figure out what this has cost you and put in a claim.

HOA= you never own it, they just let you use it as long as you pay them. Don't pay= forclosure

Last edited by jdsac; 07-13-2017 at 12:58 PM.
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:53 AM   #46
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

The two times I have been under the thumb of an HOA were a nightmare. I would comb the paperwork for any reference of one or a lack of one.
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:54 AM   #47
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

Personally I would walk away. Our primary residence has no HOA. Our winter house in FL does have an HOA. I don't mind it there because they mow the lawn, do landscaping and maintain our pool. Being a part time home, I am not there to do or coordinate the work most of the year. I don't do stuff in the garage there, either. At home, I don't want a bunch of neighborhood busy bodies bitching at me about everything I do.
If you really want the house, delay closing until you get written documentation from the HOA that the outbuilding and whatever you want to do will be permitted. If they won't do it, walk away.
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:55 AM   #48
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

You not only should walk away, you might want to consider filing a lawsuit against the seller (or the real estate agency if you can prove they listed it wrong intentionally) for intentionally misrepresenting the house as "no HOA" on the disclosure statement and thus incurring loss of time & legal cost damages. Your attorney, mortgage company, title company, inspector and agent all should have found it out LONG before the closing...

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Last edited by LS6 Tommy; 07-13-2017 at 05:10 PM.
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:02 PM   #49
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

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Originally Posted by chris142 View Post
If you included no hoa in your request then tbe realiter screwed up. Me personally would not even consider a house with a hoa.

Ditto and that's a deal breaker....... I'd walk over that mistake (I call BS) that was known from the get go...

Only an idiot would live in a home they pay for, and have their life regulated by an HOA.

They are never ending bullshit with a smile.

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Last edited by pepi; 07-13-2017 at 12:14 PM.
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:04 PM   #50
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

No HOA for me. I'd rather be free to make my own choices without seeking committee approval, and deal with the possibility of a neighbor making a poor decision if need be.


Oh, and fire your agent for not figuring this out earlier.

Last edited by ptgarcia; 07-13-2017 at 12:14 PM.
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:21 PM   #51
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

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No HOA for me. I'd rather be free to make my own choices without seeking committee approval and deal with the possibility of a neighbor making a poor decision if need be.
Like my neighbor who moved a "mother-in-law" trailer onto his 12 acre property; 10' from my 6-acre property line...right outside my kitchen window. (he wanted her to have " privacy", so he put it 1000' from his house... she died within a year, 20 years later the trailer is still there- quintessential white trash rental. ...took me almost two years to sell that house, took a huge loss on it.

I moved from there into an HOA governed community; 4 moves later all have been into HOA's. I ended up serving on the Board of one for 6 years, pretty eye-opening. If people would maintain their property and care about the effects of their actions on their neighbors, there would be no need for an HOA.

Reading a lot of posts here on the GJ reinforces my decision to live in a community with reasonable restrictions. I remember one post from a GJ'er bragging about how no HOA meant he could have 4 broken down cars in his driveway and 3 in the front yard. I'll take a well-run HOA over that anytime.

YMMV.
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:25 PM   #52
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

Having lived in an older part of town for 10 years (house built in 1952), I looked in areas for my new home that did have some regulations on purpose. You can't even buy a new home in Las Vegas anymore in any sort of housing tract that does not have some form of governing body. I got tired of the dirt front yards and my neighbors parking in their front yards. I remodeled my house over the years and had the nicest house in my block when I sold it. When I agreed to purchase my new house I read through all the rules very carefully first. I had no issues that I couldn't work with and after 15 years here am now finishing my new 1200 sq. ft garage addition that they approved. It matches the design and style of my house and does not look out of place at all. I only gave them details of the outside structure since anything inside is not their concern. I am over the 1 year build they approved but they have not had an issue. It will be completed soon. None of my neighbors have had any issue either. The association had a few picky issues at first but has calmed down a lot over the years. I work on cars a lot but inside and I really like the fact that I don't have to live next to a junk yard.
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:27 PM   #53
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

We're definitely beating this to death, but another point is that there are law firms all over the country taking over HOA management rights from HOA boards that are sick of listening to all the complainers. Why? Because they can push you around all they want, fine you, take you to court, and in some states TAKE YOUR HOUSE. Search HOA foreclosures.

This example was a famous local cases where a couple had a $315K house they owned free and clear. He was deployed to Iraq. The HOA foreclosed because the wife was in a deep depression and so she didn't pay the ~$1K HOA bill. They lost the house which sold at auction for ~$3K. No court was able to get their house back, it's gone.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/fris...of-Frisco-5503
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:37 PM   #54
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

An "HOA" is not like a "RFT"...it isnt 'one thing' and it isnt always 'good' or 'bad'. People that kneejerk, based on ONLY their experiences- good and bad- dont really help.



OP- when this kind of thing happens- at closing everyone discovers there is an HOA and CC&Rs- it is almost always due to the title company doing a search and discovering there is a recorded set of CC&Rs (or a recording that notes there ARE CC&Rs, but no docs). The HOA has been defunct, the current owners never interacted with an HOA, nobody knew it was technically around. Realtors dont just spring this in the end if they can help it.

One fact: HOAs increase property value. Yes, you trade the right to 'let your unfettered flag fly"...but it protects the 99% from the 1% (when done right). Without an HOA, when a neighbor makes a 'poor decision' and decides to put in a backyard pig farm, and the county says "thats their right"- enjoy!




PS 3 weeks ago I received a call from a good friend, a realtor- He said "Do you know anyone that lives in XYZ? Im selling a home, its in escrow- and we just found out there is an HOA and CC&RS. Im trying to find a copy of the CC&Rs" So dont assume the late notice is some master evil plan....
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:45 PM   #55
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

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Originally Posted by PugetDude View Post
Like my neighbor who moved a "mother-in-law" trailer onto his 12 acre property; 10' from my 6-acre property line...right outside my kitchen window. (he wanted her to have " privacy", so he put it 1000' from his house... she died within a year, 20 years later the trailer is still there- quintessential white trash rental. ...took me almost two years to sell that house, took a huge loss on it.
Pine tree's grow pretty tall in 20 years and make for good view blocks.
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:51 PM   #56
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

I'm thinking the OP just can't pull his house off the market as I'm sure he had to sign a contract with the realtor. And if it was stated.....hopefully in a contract of some how provable ....that the OP did not want a HOA then maybe he can walk away....or see an atty.
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Old 07-13-2017, 01:18 PM   #57
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

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Originally Posted by dngrmse View Post
I'm fortunate to live in a nice community with no HOA. All zoning and architectural compliance is handled by the township, as it should be. My cousin lives in a townhouse community where the HOA does not allow him to have a BBQ grill on his back deck. F that. I'm happy, I can grill.
That's because dumbass people burn down apartments and condos that way.
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Old 07-13-2017, 01:20 PM   #58
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

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Originally Posted by jmvar View Post
...
The plan of action is to require the sellers to get an estoppel certificate from the HOA stating that:

1. There are no dues or assessments current due from the seller(s) or assessed against the property through the date of closing.
2. That the HOA has either a) approved all changes to structures or installations as they presently exist on the property or b) waived compliance with the HOA covenant for all such structures/installations as of closing.

I will be speaking to my lawyer tonight to see what my risks are assuming all goes well with the estoppel certificate.
This sounds like the right course of action, the burden is on the seller/seller's agent.

You'll have to read up if your plans about future changes will comply. If they will, then you may be okay.

Of course you should become HOA president ASAP.
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Old 07-13-2017, 01:21 PM   #59
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

Thanks for all the input. I will provide some more details and where we are.

When we started to look for a home I was not hung up on the requirement of no HOA. I knew it would be easier to get the garage I wanted without an HOA and we just happened to find this house that supposedly had no HOA.

The HOA seems to be active in that they put together community events and keep up the public areas (very few). From what I can tell, the Architectural Review Committee is not very active, there are houses in the neighborhood that definitely need a coat of paint, yard cleaned up, and general maintenance. There are also several houses that have been torn down completely and new houses built on the lot that don't match the other houses on the street. I say on the street because there are several different areas of the neighborhood that the style of house is completely different. Some ranches, some split level, some colonials. Very confusing.

When we found this house we made sure permits were pulled for the garage and we just assumed we were in the clear when we saw the permits were finaled. Now that we found that there is an HOA everything is in question per the Covenant document. Nice 6' fence completely enclosing nice back yard, driveway that goes back to the yard, and garage. If the property were to loose all of this, we would never even look at it.

If we can get the HOA to provide documentation that the house as it sits is legit, we can live with submitting proposed changes in the future. I think that the changes we want to make are positive to any rational person. Worst case scenario, we have to wait for the 3 year term limit on the ARC members that for some reason won't approve the changes.

Now the challenge is, will the ARC approve the current structure as it sits if the changes were never applied for? The house is very well taken care of, has great curb appeal, and has nothing your would ever call an eye sore, even the garage matches the house.

At this point there is nothing we can do. It is up to the sellers to get the HOA to approve the property as it sits. If they won't do it, or it doesn't get approved we walk away from the sale and go after whom ever our lawyer deems responsible for the incorrect disclosure of the HOA situation.
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Old 07-13-2017, 01:30 PM   #60
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Default Re: Closing on a house with no HOA...wait there is an HOA....

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Originally Posted by PugetDude View Post
Like my neighbor who moved a "mother-in-law" trailer onto his 12 acre property; 10' from my 6-acre property line...right outside my kitchen window. (he wanted her to have " privacy", so he put it 1000' from his house... she died within a year, 20 years later the trailer is still there- quintessential white trash rental. ...took me almost two years to sell that house, took a huge loss on it.
20 years? I would've lit the trailer on fire before then.
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