Overwhelmed again, why can't I break the cycle!

Strouty · May 10, 2012

Once again, my shop is so messy I feel like a gymnast trying to get from one side to the other. I have a project going that was suppose to be quick (aren't they all) in and out. I know the only way to eat an elephant is one bite at a time, but it is getting silly with me. I feel like every few months this vicious cycle starts all over again. Maybe I just hate myself :eye crazy: who knows.

Anyone else overcome this problem or do you recreate the same situation over and over? To give you an example, the first time this happened I had recently moved into the building and I bought some shelving to make a stockroom. This got everything off the floor so it looked neat, but it was not organized. I bought hundreds of small plastic bins for the shelves, no the mess is in smaller hiding spots, but it looks good. Then I bought a forklift and some pallet racking, next thing I know instead of a shop I now have a warehouse! Go figure, I am not a hoarder, but I do like a deal. I sell stuff all the time and lately a lot less is coming home with me. What do you guys have for advice?

BD1 · May 10, 2012

what kind of work do you do in the shop ?

drooartz · May 10, 2012

This is a hard thing to tackle, and I think most of us face this every now and then -- more now than then I think. I've been on a mission to simplify the life down over the last few years and I've got to tell you, it feels good to be on the other side of that struggle. It's well worth it, though, as a good pruning trip through your hobby/tthings-you-do list really allows you to focus on the things you really enjoy.

Interesting viewing if you're interested:
http://www.ted.com/talks/barry_schwartz_on_the_paradox_of_choice.html

Strouty said:
I am not a hoarder, but I do like a deal.

Think long and hard about this statement -- do you like the "deal" more than the thing you wind up with? Do you find yourself saying things like "yeah, but I got a great deal" on this thing that has been sitting on the shelf for the last few years (or decades).

I find that it is usually cheaper to buy what you need when you need it (at whatever price) than to pick up all the "deals" along the way on things you might need later. By cheaper I mean in time and storage and mental space as much as financial.

Good luck.

Strouty · May 10, 2012

BD1 said:
what kind of work do you do in the shop ?

I am semi unemployed due to injuries, so I just store stuff and try to fix my personal vehicles there. I hope to have surgery this year to solve most of my issues. Once I get my issues resolved, even if I don't I need to figure out something to do that will make me money for the long term. I have had pretty good luck buying and selling or fixing and selling things.

drooartz said:
Think long and hard about this statement -- do you like the "deal" more than the thing you wind up with? Do you find yourself saying things like "yeah, but I got a great deal" on this thing that has been sitting on the shelf for the last few years (or decades).

I find that it is usually cheaper to buy what you need when you need it (at whatever price) than to pick up all the "deals" along the way on things you might need later. By cheaper I mean in time and storage and mental space as much as financial.
Good luck.

I have a master plan for the things I get, do to my injury, I don't have the money or ability right this second. I feel like I balance the deals with reality for the most part. I just brought a truckload of stuff to the auction a few weeks back and got $1800 for a bunch of unwanted stuff.

Climber · May 10, 2012

Same as you I think I am not a hoarder. But I have exactly same problem. Do you think hoarder have no idea he/she IS hoarder. Like crazy person deny to be crazy. Hmmm...I need to talk to my doctor. Thankfully my doctor always with me, he is following me together with alien. LOL. Just kidding. But seriously this mass of overwhelming stuff is ... well overwhelming.

tatra · May 10, 2012

will be watching this one....just picked up the book, you are not so smart .... bought it 4 mos. ago and started reading it again from the start at 4 times now...... alittle off topic but pertains to the feeling of being overwhelmed by projects at times.......drooartz, some very insightful thoughts there, care to share more?.......

Strouty · May 10, 2012

Climber,
I feel that if I was a hoarder or such, I would never be able to get rid of anything. I have dumpster that gets dumped 2 times a month and it is almost always filled. I also sell things on a regular basis and now I rarely buy as much as I sell. I think I am beating myself up with stuff sometimes. I guess I would feel better and worse without my stuff surrounding me. My biggest problem is everything turns into a project and I never finish them.

Thruxton · May 10, 2012

Strouty said:
Climber,
I feel that if I was a hoarder or such, I would never be able to get rid of anything... My biggest problem is everything turns into a project and I never finish them.

Who cares what the label is, hoarder, compulsive, whatever? And you got it together enough to finish this message to the list. An old Frenchman once said, "action is the only reality". You know what you need to do, just go ahead and do it. Looks to me like problem=project. Forget creating projects and just go to work.

KPSquared · May 10, 2012

make sure everything has a place. don't start on a project or put anything inside unless it has a specified place to go. one you have that set up don't ever leave the shop unless everything is back in it's place. i clean up and put away tools even if I'm not done the project. i know where they are so it's easy to get them out again the next day. If i don't have a place for something i either make one or get rid of that something. it's way to easy to think, "I'll put that away later"and then never get to it. It takes discipline. . .something most people lack.

Strouty · May 10, 2012

Thruxton said:
Who cares what the label is, hoarder, compulsive, whatever? And you got it together enough to finish this message to the list. An old Frenchman once said, "action is the only reality". You know what you need to do, just go ahead and do it. Looks to me like problem=project. Forget creating projects and just go to work.

Good point, I never thought of it quite like that. My problem seems to come from lack of skills/abilities (at least in my head) or money/supplies, then we could get into the fact that I take the mantra it isn't worth doing if you can't do it right.

egnorant · May 10, 2012

I feel your pain! I have been doing my work in a one car garage and under the trees for a long time, even while I have a perfectly good 40x80 shop full of the accumulation of at least 3 generations. My first move was to STOP buying new projects until I reach my goal of a functional shop. In this I have failed, but I have trimmed a LOT of junk out of the way.

Best recent move was to get electricity to the shop! Next best move was to get a timer that I set to remind me to clean up stuff. If I have an hour to play, I set the timer for 45 minutes. Last 15 minutes are to straighten things up.

2 years ago I got serious about decluttering my life and I guarantee that I have a larger mess that most people.

Past 2 weeks have been a few full days of cleaning, but most days I just set the timer to give me 15 or 30 minutes of cleaning.

You cannot aim a duck into the pot!

Bruce

Thruxton · May 10, 2012

Strouty said:
Good point, I never thought of it quite like that. My problem seems to come from lack of skills/abilities (at least in my head) or money/supplies, then we could get into the fact that I take the mantra it isn't worth doing if you can't do it right.

How about, "it isn't worth doing unless you want to." I don't want to sound like a ****, but I grew up with exactly what you quoted, well, a little different, "first class or not at all". Believe me, it's total ****. Do what you want, do what makes you happy, we're not here long enough to worry about much more. The point is, DO!

Strouty · May 10, 2012

Thruxton said:
How about, "it isn't worth doing unless you want to." I don't want to sound like a ****, but I grew up with exactly what you quoted, well, a little different, "first class or not at all". Believe me, it's total ****. Do what you want, do what makes you happy, we're not here long enough to worry about much more. The point is, DO!

Point taken, and you sounded like someone giving good advice.

brwbier · May 10, 2012

This may sound stupid at first, but think about it. Set smaller goals, smaller goals are easier to obtain. Once you have met some goals it gets easier to keep going.
Oh ya, also promis your self a beer when you are FINISHED.
Brwbier

waggie · May 10, 2012

I have noticed I too goes into this cycle when I have a dedicated space for "shop stuff"

when I was in a 2 car garage where a car took over half of the garage, I was way more organized. Since the car had to be pulled in every night, I spend almost 40 minutes cleaning up after myself at the end of the day.

Now I'm still in a 2 car garage, but now my truck live outside full time. So the garage is pretty much dedicated to "shop stuff." Now everything is either: I'll-get-to-it-tomorrow, or I'm-gonna-need-this-tomorrow-so-why-put-it-back-into-the-toolbox? It wasn't long before my welding table became piled with stuff, and I'm doing fancy kung-fu moves just to get to my welder. Once I got to my welder, I can't weld, since there's too much stuff on the welding table.

Here's the my pattern (not saying OP's pattern is the same): I'll work on my project til i'm dead tired and too lazy to clean up. At first I thought this was commendable, since I'm working hard, right?

turns out, this was not working-smart. Not cleaning up was creating a mess for me to deal with the next day. But I'm ready to work the next day, and don't want to be bothered with cleaning up, since the stuff that's piled up on the welding table is needed anyway. So, the piles get bigger and bigger, and nothing gets done.

So, now I have brought back the cleaning session at the end of each day. If I want to quit at 10, I stop work at 9. I put stuff away, broom, mop... whatever, and when I come to the garage the next day, it's ready to go. Nobody likes to come into a messy workspace. A clean workspace makes it more enjoyable to work in.

pipsters · May 11, 2012

My thing is do it right. But you need to do it, make it happen. I have been in my house for 4 years and now FINALLY getting around to doing the garage. In the past 2 months I finished the garage (drywalled and painted), put up lights, and just finished 4 shelves over the garage door.

I needed to do that to get access to my 850 to swap the ****** (spare in the garage). Once that is done the spare ****** and engine will be gone. Next up cabinets and such. Step by step. Do it right, plan it out and do it in stages.

langss · May 11, 2012

brwbier said:
This may sound stupid at first, but think about it. Set smaller goals, smaller goals are easier to obtain. Once you have met some goals it gets easier to keep going.
Oh ya, also promis your self a beer when you are FINISHED.
Brwbier

This is what I finally had to do. I was raised with the "Anything Worth Doing Is Worth Doing Right" mind set, so that's been a problem, but by doing things I could accomplish a little at a time I am getting caught up.

darkk · May 11, 2012

I was the same. The problem I see is you are probably a hoarder of sorts. You just have too much stuff you really don't need. I used to pick up anything that looked good. I save good stuff from the junk. I'm the same way with equipment. How many saws do I need? How many bench grinders etc? I finally had to let my youngest son kinda take over the garage set up. He just says, one of these, one of those, one of that. You don't need one of every brand. Anything that hasn't been used or unboxed or is hidden away for months/years goes....throw away or sell off or trade for something we really do need. You need someone else to make that decision because you are not capable of rational action. It's hard but it works. Now my son does the organising. Good luck.

drooartz · May 11, 2012

Strouty said:
I have a master plan for the things I get, do to my injury, I don't have the money or ability right this second. I feel like I balance the deals with reality for the most part. I just brought a truckload of stuff to the auction a few weeks back and got $1800 for a bunch of unwanted stuff.

If that $1800 represented some profit on the deal, then well done. I that was just some cost offset, then it may just be feeding the problem.

The hard question to ask yourself is "is my master plan realistic in a reasonable amount of time given my resources" -- you've got some constraints obviously given your health issues and financial situation and you can't do everything. Since you've started this conversation here then I can assume that your present situation isn't really working for you the way you need it to.

Another video of relevance (some language, so possibly ****) -- Steve Jobs in 1997 explaining to Apple developers why they were killing off some of their projects. The key line here is "Focusing is saying no":

We're all in this with you, that's for sure. Most people I know (myself included) have struggled with this either in regards to physical stuff or over-committments of time. Good luck!

IndyGarage · May 11, 2012

I have a similar problem. I have a ton of shop space and still find myself crawling around things. I envy those folks with huge expanses of empty floor.

I found that when I had some back problems a few years ago, my mind still wanted to work at 100% but my body just couldn't do it. I simply could not get the tools up off the floor sometimes. I would get 1/2 way through something and simply couldn't continue because of the pain and it might be a week or two before I got back to it.

So jobs started piling up on top of one another. I decided I needed to get myself healthy before I could get control of it. For about two years I've been working on the healthy part, and only for the past six months have I really felt like my old self.

Unfortunately, I've reached the age where things start breaking almost as fast as I can fix them, but I'm determined to fix them. I got a couple nagging health issues fixed. I started stretching, then yoga for my back. I started a heavy weight training program for my arm, leg and core strength and more recently I changed the way I eat to get rid of my fat ****. Interestingly, the weight, which I've had difficulty controlling for 15 years, is falling off in conjunction with the other stuff.

And I slowly noticed my life has started to clean itself up - I'm not back to where I want it to be yet, but I can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

Perhaps Strouty, you have the same problem.

mdlbldrmatt135 · May 11, 2012

.......

Strouty · May 11, 2012

IndyGarage said:
I have a similar problem. I have a ton of shop space and still find myself crawling around things. I envy those folks with huge expanses of empty floor.

I found that when I had some back problems a few years ago, my mind still wanted to work at 100% but my body just couldn't do it. I simply could not get the tools up off the floor sometimes. I would get 1/2 way through something and simply couldn't continue because of the pain and it might be a week or two before I got back to it.

So jobs started piling up on top of one another. I decided I needed to get myself healthy before I could get control of it. For about two years I've been working on the healthy part, and only for the past six months have I really felt like my old self.

Unfortunately, I've reached the age where things start breaking almost as fast as I can fix them, but I'm determined to fix them. I got a couple nagging health issues fixed. I started stretching, then yoga for my back. I started a heavy weight training program for my arm, leg and core strength and more recently I changed the way I eat to get rid of my fat ****. Interestingly, the weight, which I've had difficulty controlling for 15 years, is falling off in conjunction with the other stuff.

And I slowly noticed my life has started to clean itself up - I'm not back to where I want it to be yet, but I can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

Perhaps Strouty, you have the same problem.

I am at the ripe old age of 35, yet I have herniated two discs around 24 years old (L4 and L5), now I have some uncommon issue with my hands that is related to my forearms (chronic exertional compartment syndrome CECS) and am 18 months into finding a solution.

drooartz said:
If that $1800 represented some profit on the deal, then well done. I that was just some cost offset, then it may just be feeding the problem.

Some was pure profit, some was just selling stuff off, so I don't know how to measure the profit. It was all paid for and had been run through my business, so I guess it was profit.

The hard question to ask yourself is "is my master plan realistic in a reasonable amount of time given my resources" -- you've got some constraints obviously given your health issues and financial situation and you can't do everything. Since you've started this conversation here then I can assume that your present situation isn't really working for you the way you need it to.

As IndyGarage said, my mind is still 100% so I can see the goal, taste it, I guess I just can't touch it. Does that mean I should stop?? I think I am being realistic with goals, but maybe I need to be a little looser on my time line.

We're all in this with you, that's for sure. Most people I know (myself included) have struggled with this either in regards to physical stuff or over-committments of time. Good luck!

Sometimes just saying this stuff out loud is enough to get me back on track, but you guys help even more with the support! That is why I love this site, no one really judges you, well most of the members anyways. :lol_hitti

drooartz · May 11, 2012

Strouty said:
Sometimes just saying this stuff out loud is enough to get me back on track, but you guys help even more with the support!

Very true -- just talking things over can be all it takes sometimes for things to clarify in your mind. Keep at it, you'll get there. :thumbup:

Red Leader · May 11, 2012

Strouty said:
Once again, my shop is so messy I feel like a gymnast trying to get from one side to the other. I have a project going that was suppose to be quick (aren't they all) in and out. I know the only way to eat an elephant is one bite at a time, but it is getting silly with me. I feel like every few months this vicious cycle starts all over again. Maybe I just hate myself :eye crazy: who knows.

Anyone else overcome this problem or do you recreate the same situation over and over? To give you an example, the first time this happened I had recently moved into the building and I bought some shelving to make a stockroom. This got everything off the floor so it looked neat, but it was not organized. I bought hundreds of small plastic bins for the shelves, no the mess is in smaller hiding spots, but it looks good. Then I bought a forklift and some pallet racking, next thing I know instead of a shop I now have a warehouse! Go figure, I am not a hoarder, but I do like a deal. I sell stuff all the time and lately a lot less is coming home with me. What do you guys have for advice?

Wow. So someone else wrote down how I feel about 90% of the time I go out to my shop??

I feel ya, brother. It's hard. In the past year I've probably had about 15 cleaning sessions and each one averages about 2 hours. Some have gone a lot longer.

It just keeps getting messy.

But! Slowly but surely, it will change. Just keep at it. One thing that has helped is just making up my mind on stuff that my shop doesn't need, even if it isn't quite trash worthy. As you start getting rid of stuff, the piles will grow smaller. Also, the suggestion about getting the 'yard' stuff out of the garage is so true. The lawn mower takes up more floor space than my cabinet saw!!!

It may be slow, but keep at it. You are definitely NOT alone.

Racecarl · May 11, 2012

I, too, feel your pain. I am slowly trying to get things staightened up and put away after getting my garage mostly finished almost exactly one year ago. The building process, including tearing down an old barn for lumber, has taken five years. In that five years of haste, not everything got put away like it should. That is the secret for me--everything must have a place.

To that end, I built a large cabinet to hold handheld grinders, saws, and other related woodworking equipment. That really helped with some clutter. This past summer I got some metal shelves that my employer was scrapping, so I put them together and now have some places for more tools and supplies. I have a small storage area in the front of our carport which will be the storage area for seasonal equipmemt like the mower or snowblower. I still have some small parts and tools in this room that I will move to my shop, and then I can get all the yard/gardening equipment together.

My ultimate plan is to have a place for everything and I will get there someday. I will not allow myself to get started on any more large projects until I get the garage the way I want it, so I go out there almost every night and work on making places to store my stuff. My goal is to have nothing on the floor other than my motorcycle lift that cannot be moved. I have a 12'6" ceiling and an attic storage area so I should be able to keep floor clutter to a minumum.

Overwhelmed again, why can't I break the cycle!

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