Wolverine DIY Status

Hi All,

I just wanted to give you a little update. Bill will be working Monday Tuesday and Wednesday of next week (February 25th, 26th, and 27th)... He won't be working on Thursday or Friday the 28th & 29th... That means that you need to ask your questions and be ready to place your orders by Monday... March 3rd...

No one will be answering questions after the 1st...

WolverineCoatings said:

Hi All,

I just wanted to give you a little update. Bill will be working Monday Tuesday and Wednesday of next week (February 25th, 26th, and 27th)... He won't be working on Thursday or Friday the 28th & 29th... That means that you need to ask your questions and be ready to place your orders by Monday... March 3rd...

No one will be answering questions after the 1st...

Click to expand...

Eric, the status of Wolverine has unfortunately left a bit of a bad taste in my mouth. You are the one posting here all the time, yet you keep talking about how Bill is leaving, so the DIY crowd is SOL. Shouldn't Bill be the one posting on this site?

Frankly you've left me hanging here and I feel a little responsible for the good people who have purchased from you, and those who have not installed yet. I was the one who actually purchased your product (through Budget Bob) and I was the first to put it down. Many people saw what I did and a number of them bought your product. Also you are the one who suggested a contest and a what not to the first few people who bought your product. You created a hype and now you leave us hanging. The last time I was used like this, I at least got a good time out of it.

Eric if you've got the time to respond on here as much as you do, then you can handle the Garage Journal crowd. By the way what happened to that box store that was going to carry your product?

You will notice that I haven't complained about what you sell, just how you are going about it. I feel that you and your company needs to step up and do a better job concerning continuing customer care. You started pushing here on this forum and maybe you have did it on other forums too, as I have seen you posting on a construction forum in the past, however I am only speaking about this forum. To say that no questions will be answered past a certain date tells me that you are not committed to long term, or short term customer care. Hopefully you treat you big time commercial customers better.

Flame suit on Eric. Fire away.

Obviously this question can only be answered by Wolverine but from an outsiders perspective, I'd rather a company "give-up" a certain part of the market if they don't have the resources to fully support it than continue taking orders (and money) and falling flat on post-sales support due to lack of man power.

I'm pretty sure Wolverine meant that all questions/concerns regarding NEW sales/orders need to be asked before the deadline. I can't imagine that he'd leave any existing customers out in the cold.

What can I say, other than go back and read some of Wolverines posts. They were wanting a bunch of people to be customers so they could learn from the DIY "beta" group, with full intention of being in a big box store early this year. Bill's status I can only imagine was not something that was sprung upon Eric. So something had to go wrong or change and unless I am proven otherwise, I don't believe it was because of Bill's change of careers. Do you?

Despite all of this I still believe the product is good, and as someone mentioned before, all it would take is a comprehensive web page with step by step instructions with user experiances and the time spent would be minimal. I would even suggest that there be a Wolvering classification on this website, if it could be worked out, where the members here could help each other, like we already do.

A garage journal private label maybe ? Having done this once I reckon I can help others quite a bit. I did have some issues but I just called Eric and asked him some questions and it worked out very well.
Otherwise it was a pretty straightforward job; if a little labor intensive. Not sure I would do this professionally though.

Navi, I see where you're coming from but I can't imagine this decision type of decision was reached easily for a small business owner.

I'm sure with a modest time/money investment, a comprehensive website would be relatively self sustaining from a sales point of view but once DIYers start calling with issues, many of them mundane and probably covered on a typical website DIY, it can be overwhelming. I've seen this kind of stuff happen to a good friend of mine who expanded his billet aluminum parts business to the internet - he quickly was overwhelmed and didn't properly plan the resources to accommodate.

Plans change. I'd rather see Wolverine pull-out of the market than make a half-hearted attempt to stay in and support.

gesoffen said:

Navi, I see where you're coming from but I can't imagine this decision type of decision was reached easily for a small business owner.

I'm sure with a modest time/money investment, a comprehensive website would be relatively self sustaining from a sales point of view but once DIYers start calling with issues, many of them mundane and probably covered on a typical website DIY, it can be overwhelming. I've seen this kind of stuff happen to a good friend of mine who expanded his billet aluminum parts business to the internet - he quickly was overwhelmed and didn't properly plan the resources to accommodate.

Plans change. I'd rather see Wolverine pull-out of the market than make a half-hearted attempt to stay in and support.

Click to expand...

I understand your point of view, but like I mentioned, go back and read some of Wolverine's posts. They were going to have a website almost done by now and wanted pictures of completed garages for their website.
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13274&highlight=wolverine+big+box

Eric, the status of Wolverine has unfortunately left a bit of a bad taste in my mouth. You are the one posting here all the time, yet you keep talking about how Bill is leaving, so the DIY crowd is SOL. Shouldn't Bill be the one posting on this site?

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I don't deserve what you have written. I made the post because I'm 'the one posting here all the time' and Bill isn't. And, the DIY crowd is not SOL nor have we left anyone out in the cold. We didn't have to give any warning about this... but we did. The folks that have bought our products have all been taken care of... and so will anyone else who places their order. We plainly said that anyone who places an order by March 1st (which was extended to Monday March 3rd) will be serviced. People who are not ready haven't invested any time or money in us and can order from whomever they would have ordered from when the time comes.

Frankly you've left me hanging here and I feel a little responsible for the good people who have purchased from you, and those who have not installed yet. I was the one who actually purchased your product (through Budget Bob) and I was the first to put it down. Many people saw what I did and a number of them bought your product. Also you are the one who suggested a contest and a what not to the first few people who bought your product. You created a hype and now you leave us hanging. The last time I was used like this, I at least got a good time out of it.

Click to expand...

I never sold anything to you nor promised you anything. I did tell you that we were thinking about having a contest and if we did we would try to include you... This was AFTER you had already purchased and applied your product. No one used you... it neither costed you anything nor took anything away from you. I didn't have to call you and we didn't gain anything from it. At the time, it looked as though we might have the extra time to do the contest... but... then we got blasted with 3 months of orders in a week. Most people comment on seeing my posts... The job that is clearly the most popular and has given us the most attention BY FAR is FFPL's floor and I don't see him trying to hold it over our heads. This is all just a little bit self-serving for you... at my expense.

Eric if you've got the time to respond on here as much as you do, then you can handle the Garage Journal crowd.

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I'm afraid that even if I completely gave up posting here... I wouldn't gain enough time to even help 1 customer per week.

By the way what happened to that box store that was going to carry your product?

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It's true that we have been approached by a 'Big Box' store. However, selling through these types of stores is not all it's cracked up to be. Agreements with big companies don't happen overnight. It's alot of headaches and I'm NOT leaning toward making an agreement at this time. We're not exactly hurting for sales and it's alot of headaches. However, we haven't said 'No' yet either.

You will notice that I haven't complained about what you sell, just how you are going about it. I feel that you and your company needs to step up and do a better job concerning continuing customer care.

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You are the only person complaining about how we are treating our customers... You're stating things 'as facts' in this post that are NOT facts. First, you are slandering us (actually it's libel) by stating that we have poor customer care when you have absolutely no basis to do so. You've never been a customer of Wolverine Coatings and you don't know how we treat our customers. I wonder what an actual customer (like maybe FFPL) would say about how we treat our customers.

You started pushing here on this forum and maybe you have did it on other forums too, as I have seen you posting on a construction forum in the past, however I am only speaking about this forum.

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Now, you are calling me a liar since I have repeatedly stated on this forums that we are ONLY working with the Garage Journal. You have NEVER seen Wolverine Coatings selling products on ANY other forums. I have been a member of Contractor Talk for a couple of years and have NEVER attempted to sell anything to anyone on those forums. You are making this statement to 'illude' to something that you know is false.

To say that no questions will be answered past a certain date tells me that you are not committed to long term, or short term customer care. Hopefully you treat you big time commercial customers better.

Click to expand...

Where did we say that we would not service what we sold? The only thing we have said is that after March 1 we will not answer anymore information requests which is how you start the process to place a new order. If someone has already placed their order... they will call... we will answer... we will help them.

Flame suit on Eric. Fire away.

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Navi... You might want to consider switching to decaff. I have never used you nor given you any reason to be angry... you're just hoping to stir up a 'flame storm' at someone elses expense. You bought product from Budget Bob and posted your experience and pics on your own. I nor anyone else ever asked you to do it nor did anyone use you in any way.

You are suggesting that the glass is half empty when it's really half full. No one has been screwed as you suggest. I've stated plainly that anyone who has their order placed by March 1 (which was extended to Monday the 3rd) will be serviced. And, anyone who is allowed to order from us will be taken care of.

I think this is a pretty cheap shot from a guy who takes pride in stirring up trouble. The bad taste in your mouth is the taste of deceit. You owe me an apology.

* I want to apologize to the rest of you that had to read all of this negativity. I'm sure that most of you know that we all value what we work hard for. I've worked hard to become known as a man of integrity and for Wolverine Coatings to be known as a company of integrity. We've serviced all of you well... we havn't been pushing these products anywhere but here just like I've said... And, anyone who has EVER ordered from us OR who EVER will... they will be serviced.

Obviously this question can only be answered by Wolverine but from an outsiders perspective, I'd rather a company "give-up" a certain part of the market if they don't have the resources to fully support it than continue taking orders (and money) and falling flat on post-sales support due to lack of man power.

I'm pretty sure Wolverine meant that all questions/concerns regarding NEW sales/orders need to be asked before the deadline. I can't imagine that he'd leave any existing customers out in the cold.

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Thanks... we WILL answer questions from anyone who orders directly from us. And, one of the reasons we are suspending these sales during Bill's leave of absence is that the rest of us are all maxed out. If I were willing to just hire someone with no knowledge then I would have just continued to let Tammy and her son (Budget Bob's daughter and grandson) continue selling. However, there are ALOT of variables and I know that an inexperienced person can't give the level of service it takes to ensure successful applications.

So, our choices were:
1)to suspend sales until we had someone in place who could actually service the sales...
2) just keep taking money with no prospects of giving post-sale help...
3) hire someone with no experience to let the blind lead the blind.

We feel like anything other than option 1 would be stealing. I think I've made that pretty clear in numerous posts.

A garage journal private label maybe ? Having done this once I reckon I can help others quite a bit. I did have some issues but I just called Eric and asked him some questions and it worked out very well.
Otherwise it was a pretty straightforward job; if a little labor intensive. Not sure I would do this professionally though.

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Thanks FFPL... You have really been a pleasure to work with. It's the people like you that we will miss helping.

Navi, I see where you're coming from but I can't imagine this decision type of decision was reached easily for a small business owner.

I'm sure with a modest time/money investment, a comprehensive website would be relatively self sustaining from a sales point of view but once DIYers start calling with issues, many of them mundane and probably covered on a typical website DIY, it can be overwhelming. I've seen this kind of stuff happen to a good friend of mine who expanded his billet aluminum parts business to the internet - he quickly was overwhelmed and didn't properly plan the resources to accommodate.

Plans change. I'd rather see Wolverine pull-out of the market than make a half-hearted attempt to stay in and support.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately, there isn't really any such thing as a modest investment of time and money. We did manage to make the most comprehensive set of instructions that I've ever seen. And, hardly anyone we gave the special price to actually took the time to send us the pictures with the critique of our instructions. However, we've received TONS of calls from a few people who obviously didn't read the instructions. In fact, we have one guy in Greenville, SC that did not mix the Resin and Hardener together with a drill. He said he did... until we sent an expert PE Civil Engineer over to figure out why his floor didn't cure. Then, he admitted that he stirred it with a bent piece of metal instead of using a mixer attachment on a drill. That guy came from this board... an engineer who claimed that he had done this before... and... I've personally spent at least 18 hours verifing our product quality, making 2 trips to the garage, and racking my brain because I gave the guy the benefit of the doubt. I was miffed because at least 3 other people from this board used the exact same products and batch numbers. Not to mention, the same product and batch number has probably also been used at a dozen industrial jobs. So, what have we offered this guy? Even though it's not our fault we will offer enough product (Same product and batch numbers) to redo the garage. It's alot of time... It's ALOT of investment... * And... if you're reading about yourself here... well... you haven't been identified...

We don't do anything half way. My dad taught me that if you're going to do a job, do it once... do it right. I think the website would help... but... based on what we have seen it wouldn't be enough. If people on this board don't read the instructions you can imagine what is going to happen with the general public. I think a company that is planning on being successful in the market must have people who can handle the calls.

WolverineCoatings said:

I wonder what an actual customer (like maybe FFPL) would say about how we treat our customers.

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I don't want to get too involved in this but as far as I'm concerned (if my opinion means anything) I was extremely happy with the experience I had in dealing with Eric and Bill and indeed the wolverine company.
I'm usually really really hard to please (just talk to my gc about my garage build) but in the case of the floor I've got nothing bad to say at all. I hope others that have dealt with wolverine have had the same experience.

In any case, I've moved on to my next job of planning/installing the compressor/cabinets/lift etc. However, I've never felt that I won't get any service from Eric (wolverine) if I have future issues or questions regarding my floor, and I won't hesitate to call them if I do.

WolverineCoatings said:

I don't deserve what you have written. I made the post because I'm 'the one posting here all the time' and Bill isn't. And, the DIY crowd is not SOL nor have we left anyone out in the cold. We didn't have to give any warning about this... but we did. The folks that have bought our products have all been taken care of... and so will anyone else who places their order. We plainly said that anyone who places an order by March 1st (which was extended to Monday March 3rd) will be serviced. People who are not ready haven't invested any time or money in us and can order from whomever they would have ordered from when the time comes.



I never sold anything to you nor promised you anything. I did tell you that we were thinking about having a contest and if we did we would try to include you... This was AFTER you had already purchased and applied your product. No one used you... it neither costed you anything nor took anything away from you. I didn't have to call you and we didn't gain anything from it. At the time, it looked as though we might have the extra time to do the contest... but... then we got blasted with 3 months of orders in a week. Most people comment on seeing my posts... The job that is clearly the most popular and has given us the most attention BY FAR is FFPL's floor and I don't see him trying to hold it over our heads. This is all just a little bit self-serving for you... at my expense.


I'm afraid that even if I completely gave up posting here... I wouldn't gain enough time to even help 1 customer per week.



It's true that we have been approached by a 'Big Box' store. However, selling through these types of stores is not all it's cracked up to be. Agreements with big companies don't happen overnight. It's alot of headaches and I'm NOT leaning toward making an agreement at this time. We're not exactly hurting for sales and it's alot of headaches. However, we haven't said 'No' yet either.



You are the only person complaining about how we are treating our customers... You're stating things 'as facts' in this post that are NOT facts. First, you are slandering us (actually it's libel) by stating that we have poor customer care when you have absolutely no basis to do so. You've never been a customer of Wolverine Coatings and you don't know how we treat our customers. I wonder what an actual customer (like maybe FFPL) would say about how we treat our customers.



Now, you are calling me a liar since I have repeatedly stated on this forums that we are ONLY working with the Garage Journal. You have NEVER seen Wolverine Coatings selling products on ANY other forums. I have been a member of Contractor Talk for a couple of years and have NEVER attempted to sell anything to anyone on those forums. You are making this statement to 'illude' to something that you know is false.


Where did we say that we would not service what we sold? The only thing we have said is that after March 1 we will not answer anymore information requests which is how you start the process to place a new order. If someone has already placed their order... they will call... we will answer... we will help them.



Navi... You might want to consider switching to decaff. I have never used you nor given you any reason to be angry... you're just hoping to stir up a 'flame storm' at someone elses expense. You bought product from Budget Bob and posted your experience and pics on your own. I nor anyone else ever asked you to do it nor did anyone use you in any way.

You are suggesting that the glass is half empty when it's really half full. No one has been screwed as you suggest. I've stated plainly that anyone who has their order placed by March 1 (which was extended to Monday the 3rd) will be serviced. And, anyone who is allowed to order from us will be taken care of.

I think this is a pretty cheap shot from a guy who takes pride in stirring up trouble. The bad taste in your mouth is the taste of deceit. You owe me an apology.

* I want to apologize to the rest of you that had to read all of this negativity. I'm sure that most of you know that we all value what we work hard for. I've worked hard to become known as a man of integrity and for Wolverine Coatings to be known as a company of integrity. We've serviced all of you well... we havn't been pushing these products anywhere but here just like I've said... And, anyone who has EVER ordered from us OR who EVER will... they will be serviced.

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Eric that is the most self serving bunch of garbage I've heard in a long time. "cheap shot" at what? All I have did is called you on your posts about promises or whatever you want to call them that you have made. I've pointed out and suggested that people read your posts and make their own decisions. In the meantime you are posting about how great your product is,(and as I have stated other than the Bondtite being UV sensitive I have not said anything negative) whipping up sales and you knew full well a long time ago that your sales would be suspended. So now about that deceit. Kind of looks like you Eric.

For the record I am not selling anything, I have no financial interest in this site or any other product concerning garage's in the least, yet according to you Eric my motivation is what again? Oh yeah, trouble maker. Grow up buddy. I am stating the obvious and I am sorry that you don't like it, but maybe you can learn to do research first, before money is exchanged in the future. Because face it Eric you used the people on here for your research.

You used a captive audience to sell your product to, found out you couldn't handle the questions, or it wasn't cost effective, and now you are not selling your product to the DIY crowd because of the time. Did I miss anything or am I still stirring up trouble with the facts?

So now about the slander. Exactly how did I do that by asking you to step up for the customer? Got me on that one Eric. I said step up for continuing customer care because you said no questions would be answered after the 1st of the month. You didn't say that was only for new orders.

Was this not your post at the start of this thread?
"No one will be answering questions after the 1st"

Now for the liar ****. Re-read it Eric.

"You started pushing here on this forum and maybe you have did it on other forums too, as I have seen you posting on a construction forum in the past, however I am only speaking about..."

I said "maybe" and that I was only talking about this forum. Where is the lie in that?

As for FFPL's experiance. He went to you Eric because of me.

Junior Member

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Status: FFPL is offline

Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 25
Location: Massachusetts Re: My Floor With Budget Bob

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I'm interested in looking at this product. Navi, is your impression still favorable ?
Is there a way I can avoid buying 'off spec' product from Budget Bob i.e can I buy it directly from Wolverine (for a good price, of course) ?
Re: My Floor With Budget Bob

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Quote:
Originally Posted by FFPL
I'm interested in looking at this product. Navi, is your impression still favorable ?
Is there a way I can avoid buying 'off spec' product from Budget Bob i.e can I buy it directly from Wolverine (for a good price, of course) ?


In a word, YES. The epoxy is really hard, I mean so hard that I dropped, by accident a pretty big crescent wrench and nothing. It just bounced right off the floor and no chips and we've been parking on it for a while now with no problems.

As for customer care it's pretty good. I recieved my 3qt touch up paint today and I am just waiting on the clear to go with it. With the touch up paint I filled my cracks and you can't tell the difference at all. So color match is not a big deal. The only caution I would mention is that the tan is not UV resistant. I painted outside the doors and I do notice it's darker, but for me that's no big deal.

My other suggestion is to not go with the tan but maybe the light grey instead, and order maybe 20% more than Budget Bob says.

I guess you could ask me if I would use it again, and I would say yes. The epoxy is very thick and for a little over a buck a foot it's a great deal. I don't think you would get the same price from Wolverine and they may not deal with you because you are a non-commercial user. Just a guess on my part though.

Good luck, and go for it.
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So yeah Eric I do feel responsible. After all over 2300 people viewed my first post about your product and your sales were because of me. If I hadn't have posted, there is no garauntee that you would have made any sales on this board.

By the way Eric I am still waiting for my refund and an apology.

Below is a private message sent by Eric to me. Maybe now the rest of you folks can see where I am coming from. Normaly I wouldn't display a private message, but due the name calling by Eric I feel it is necessary.

Hey Navi,

ERIC here... lol Who's Chris? Have you been cheatin' on us with some other paint people? lol...

I think that you have helped us out here and that it's only fair that we help the people who help us! Our prices (~86.?? per gallon) for non-reject material are a good bit higher that Budgetbobs ($75). We are planning on giving everyone that helps us a price of around $59 per gallon. We are still working that price out so it might change a bit. By the way, don't share any of this... We're sold out until the middle of January of anything that is not in stock so we don't want to get too many orders in the next few weeks...

Anyway... back to the subject at hand. Giving you enough material to redo your entire garage floor is a bit more than the difference... but... we'll consider something. Going into the DIY field is going to be Bill's baby so I feel like he should be included in that decision. At the very least, we'll issue you a credit of the difference of what you paid Budgetbob and what we charge the others. So, I'm not saying 'no' ... I'm just not going to say 'yes' until I talk with Bill and he's good with it too. Also, we should talk about your first born and left kidney... lol... we're collecting those this week.

Now, let's assume that you are going to re-do your garage. We have at least 30 colors of chips in stock... What would you do differently?

Anyway, we DO appreciate how you have helped us here. I hope that you recognize (and I think you do) that men of lesser character would have never felt a need to do anything for a previous customer. I've had alot of people that I have helped over the years who never said 'thank you' nor remembered us later. We're not those kind of people. We're pretty much a group of people who are just trying to make their way through the world, raising kids, paying taxes... buying groceries... and... well... Bill is a grampa!

We'll be back to you on this in the next couple of... hmmm... might be weeks... soon...

Thanks,
Eric
Quote:
Originally Posted by 04 Navi
Quote:
Originally Posted by WolverineCoatings
Hey Navi,

Sometime soon we are going to announce a contest where someone could win the cost of their materials for their garage floor. Bill and I have discussed it and we're going to make it retroactive back to your floor... We haven't worked out all the details yet but we're going to have some hoops to jump through like critiqing our instructions and giving us lots of pics... and then... maybe the first 10 people to qualify will be voted on by the guys on the board...

So... when you see it posted... you won't have to feel like you should have waited.. lol... Good Luck!

What do you think?




Here is my response to Eric. I had called Eric, chris for some reason.


First of all Chris(?) thanks for thinking of me, I do appreciate it.

Secondly though, I do have a few reservations, one of them being that I never did have any instructions to speak of concerning preperation of my floor. I had asked Bob several times for prep, and I never really got a definitive answer, so I etched anyhow.

Trust me I am not complaining here about you guys, only about Bob's incomplete instructions. I had sent several emails to Bob about customer service and only after numerous attempts and telling him that I was going to post my experiances on this board, did he start returning answers to my questions. Frustrating for sure.

Now as for the competition, Chris I have to ask, would you guys be getting this much interest from the board, concerning the DIY customer if I hadn't taken the plunge and bought reject Wolvering material from Budget Bob? We both know the answer and you know what? Eventhough I don't know you personally, I do like to promote a USA company (and I am Canadian to boot) when I can.

So yeah I would like to be in the competition but, I do think that I should win because I paved the way for you guys with this crowd. I don't want money, necessarily, but would rather love to have enough material to redo my floor, mostly because Budget Bob said, "no need to fill cracks with this product" and so because of that I had to do a patch job.

Are you sure you guys want to get into the DYI crowd. We're pretty much a bunch of **** retentive whiners, who are trying to recapture some space in the house as our own. Take care, and take some salt, tequila, and lime with what I say.

Man this is getting a little carried away. Sounds like the man made a business decision and that is his choice. He gave fair warning and anyone that wants it can buy it elsewhere. Private messages should be just that unless someone is making threats to you or your family. Now you have also aired out his pricing for the world to see. Sounds like he was trying his best to help you out and now you do this over something so minor?

I personally see no need for all of this and think the mods should do away with the thread.

Ok, here is where I say don't punish all of us over this thread. From what I have read in all of Eric's posts they have some of the best option for painting a garage floor and it sounds like they will have very complete instructions. I just bought a house and really cannot do my garage floor until at least next year. Wolverine's products sound like the longest lasting and sound like they will have the best instructions for non-home improvement geniuses like me. I just hope this experience doesn't deter them from eventually jumping into the DIY market with both feet when they are ready and that I will be able to use said product.

I also must say Eric's various posts on this board have been very helpful and informative, even on posts that do not deal with his company's products. It has helped me learn quite a bit.

nova65ss said:

Man this is getting a little carried away. Sounds like the man made a business decision and that is his choice. He gave fair warning and anyone that wants it can buy it elsewhere. Private messages should be just that unless someone is making threats to you or your family. Now you have also aired out his pricing for the world to see. Sounds like he was trying his best to help you out and now you do this over something so minor?

I personally see no need for all of this and think the mods should do away with the thread.

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I agree. I oringinally wrote what I did because that is how I felt. Considering that you also sell to members on this board, it would be obvious how you feel and I've got no problem with that.

As for the pricing and what not, well when you get called a liar and a number of other things, then we will see how long you keep taking it on the chin. I can see however that you've set the benchmark to threats on your family, well for me that level is set lower.

I also agree about Erics posts in the past being helpful and i haven't said anything negative about him and if you read some of his posts I have even chimed in with a positive response. What some of you guys are missing is that I feel that Erics post about stopping sales after such a short time is wrong. I didn't say anything for a number of days and I thought long and hard and spoke my mind. Never did I call him any names, instead I felt that he should step up and take care of the current crowd. That statement was based on his statement about not answering any questions after the 1st of the month.

It was Eric's choice to take apart what I said and respond with harsh words and legal language, not to mention statements based on not thoroughly reading the text in the first place.

csimian said:

Ok, here is where I say don't punish all of us over this thread. From what I have read in all of Eric's posts they have some of the best option for painting a garage floor and it sounds like they will have very complete instructions. I just bought a house and really cannot do my garage floor until at least next year. Wolverine's products sound like the longest lasting and sound like they will have the best instructions for non-home improvement geniuses like me. I just hope this experience doesn't deter them from eventually jumping into the DIY market with both feet when they are ready and that I will be able to use said product.

I also must say Eric's various posts on this board have been very helpful and informative, even on posts that do not deal with his company's products. It has helped me learn quite a bit.

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Let me be the first to welcome you to the board.

WolverineCoatings said:

If I were willing to just hire someone with no knowledge then I would have just continued to let Tammy and her son (Budget Bob's daughter and grandson) continue selling.

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In response to Erics post earlier, we have just as much knowledge in the product we sell as budgetbob had. We have been studying all of the material on our products and have a good understanding of it. Also we have the support of our manufacturer and they are more than willing to help us with any questions we may have.
We are happy to continue selling one of the same high quality product
for which budgetbob was known.
These products are not production overruns but are directly manufactured for our product line.

04 Navi said:

Eric, the status of Wolverine has unfortunately left a bit of a bad taste in my mouth. You are the one posting here all the time, yet you keep talking about how Bill is leaving, so the DIY crowd is SOL. Shouldn't Bill be the one posting on this site?

Frankly you've left me hanging here and I feel a little responsible for the good people who have purchased from you, and those who have not installed yet. I was the one who actually purchased your product (through Budget Bob) and I was the first to put it down. Many people saw what I did and a number of them bought your product. Also you are the one who suggested a contest and a what not to the first few people who bought your product. You created a hype and now you leave us hanging. The last time I was used like this, I at least got a good time out of it.

Eric if you've got the time to respond on here as much as you do, then you can handle the Garage Journal crowd. By the way what happened to that box store that was going to carry your product?

You will notice that I haven't complained about what you sell, just how you are going about it. I feel that you and your company needs to step up and do a better job concerning continuing customer care. You started pushing here on this forum and maybe you have did it on other forums too, as I have seen you posting on a construction forum in the past, however I am only speaking about this forum. To say that no questions will be answered past a certain date tells me that you are not committed to long term, or short term customer care. Hopefully you treat you big time commercial customers better.

Flame suit on Eric. Fire away.

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Navi.

I am surprised you cannot see your post for what it is. Your post is full of accusations, putting an incredibly negative spin on what has transpired. It is as if because things did not turn out the way Eric anticipated in regards to their DIY business, Eric is not trustworthy. Life (and business) are full of unexpected changes. The true measure is how well you respond to them. I think Eric has responded very well.

Chill. Sometimes there isn't an evil motivation behind what people do.

Jim

shocksystems said:

Navi.

I am surprised you cannot see your post for what it is. Your post is full of accusations, putting an incredibly negative spin on what has transpired. It is as if because things did not turn out the way Eric anticipated in regards to their DIY business, Eric is not trustworthy. Life (and business) are full of unexpected changes. The true measure is how well you respond to them. I think Eric has responded very well.

Chill. Sometimes there isn't an evil motivation behind what people do.

Jim

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Please quote me as to where I did not say he is trustworthy. I asked him to step up and take care of the people that he has sold to, because based on his opening remark he was not going to. Hindsight, due to Eric clarifying himself by then saying he would take care of existing customers would not have provoked me to make my first post.

My subsequent posts were because of his name calling.

So Jim do you think Eric handled himself well by pretty much calling Bob's kids unqualified to sell his product? I assume you know the details of Bob?

If I could do it all over again, I would only word my posts a little less harsh, but in no way would I change my message. So in two words Jim: Chill Yourself

BudgetBobjr said:

In response to Erics post earlier, we have just as much knowledge in the product we sell as budgetbob had. We have been studying all of the material on our products and have a good understanding of it. Also we have the support of our manufacturer and they are more than willing to help us with any questions we may have.
We are happy to continue selling one of the same high quality product
for which budgetbob was known.
These products are not production overruns but are directly manufactured for our product line.

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My only suggestion is don't get into this thread. I enjoyed my transaction with your Dad, and yeah sometimes he did not respond fast enough for me after a $1600.00 transaction, but when he did respond he succinct and kind and to the point.
Here is one his emails.

This shipped WED DHL # 90070703796

Looking forward to doing continued business with you.. Deal with me straight and direct.. I am 65 yrs. old.. and holding my own!!! Still have 3 Harleys' that I really ride!! My Ole Lady is 48 and and applying this stuff! professionally, !! No more ********!!! We have a new product for Carwash walls??? You could probably become a regional distributer???? All is well.. Budgetbob


Jr, I am sorry that you were dragged into this and after a bit I would suggest you contact the mods on this forum so you can be an official vendor here. By you guys responding to questions about your product in public, it will definitely cut down on questions in the future. Good luck.

Navi, if it was a simple misunderstanding of what Wolverine's intentions were regarding existing customers, this whole thread could have been avoided by a courteous question. I don't have any history with you (or Wolverine for that matter) so take this from an outsiders perspective - this thread is not kind to your image and its your posts that are doing the most damage to your reputation. Your included messages about Wolverine's DIY competition further illustrate this point.

How many times have you bought something only to learn that they are of business or the local support is gone? It's a ***** isn't it. At least they were up front and told everyone what was going to happen before it happened.

Personally, I applaud Eric for coming out and letting people know in advance that if they aren't a customer and aren't planning to be by a certain date that the opportunity will pass. He and his company could have easily just faded away without letting anyone know, but they didn't. Business plans and needs change. They are reacting to it the best they can.

Wow... What can I say?

I want to thank you all for the support here. I'm going to keep my comments brief... Sometimes forums can be brutal. There are two ways to have the tallest building in town; you either build yours up... or... tear everyone elses down. I only responded publicly to this thread because I felt like it was a personal attack on me and Wolverine Coatings. These forums can be viewed by anyone on the web. Was it self-serving? Of course it was... if defending yourself is self-serving. Let's face it, when someone 'calls you out' on a public forum it's not because they have some high moral calling. I hope that we would all consider sending a PM to each other in times of questioning instead of starting wars here. I don't know about you guys, but when I hit these forums I'm sittin' in my boxer-briefs on the couch eating 'Good & Plenty' with my hot little wife next to me giving me the 'don't even think about it big boy I've got a headache' look on her face. So, the last thing I need is drama... and I'm bettin' you guys are here to relax as well.

gesoffen said:

Navi, if it was a simple misunderstanding of what Wolverine's intentions were regarding existing customers, this whole thread could have been avoided by a courteous question. I don't have any history with you (or Wolverine for that matter) so take this from an outsiders perspective - this thread is not kind to your image and its your posts that are doing the most damage to your reputation. Your included messages about Wolverine's DIY competition further illustrate this point.

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What are youtalking about? Eric brought up his competition not me. Get over it.

As for my reputiation, I am just fine, but thanks anyhow.

WolverineCoatings said:

Wow... What can I say?

I want to thank you all for the support here. I'm going to keep my comments brief... Sometimes forums can be brutal. There are two ways to have the tallest building in town; you either build yours up... or... tear everyone elses down. I only responded publicly to this thread because I felt like it was a personal attack on me and Wolverine Coatings. These forums can be viewed by anyone on the web. Was it self-serving? Of course it was... if defending yourself is self-serving. Let's face it, when someone 'calls you out' on a public forum it's not because they have some high moral calling. I hope that we would all consider sending a PM to each other in times of questioning instead of starting wars here. I don't know about you guys, but when I hit these forums I'm sittin' in my boxer-briefs on the couch eating 'Good & Plenty' with my hot little wife next to me giving me the 'don't even think about it big boy I've got a headache' look on her face. So, the last thing I need is drama... and I'm bettin' you guys are here to relax as well.

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Touchet Eric. You said I was attacking your morals, now you again did the same and to boot you told us what you do in your private time on a public forum. That's sort or wierd buddy, but whatever floats you boat

If I were willing to just hire someone with no knowledge then I would have just continued to let Tammy and her son (Budget Bob's daughter and grandson) continue selling. However, there are ALOT of variables and I know that an inexperienced person can't give the level of service it takes to ensure successful applications.

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I also want to apologize for the way this is worded and expressed. I'm going to blame it on the late hour it was posted but it is giving me some pain to read it like I wrote it. It wasn't my intention to tear down Tammy and her son's building. Obviously, we are not going to be competing on here and I really don't have any motive to do that. I was attempting to respond to the question of why we don't just get someone else and did a really poor job. I really should not have mentioned Tammy and her son. I hope that the Budget Bob team will be sucessful.

So... here is my 'do over'... I don't think I've had one on here yet... One mulligan per round... right?

If I were willing to just hire someone with no knowledge then I would have just hired someone off the street with some computer skills.

04 Navi said:

What are youtalking about? Eric brought up his competition not me. Get over it.

As for my reputiation, I am just fine, but thanks anyhow.

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I take it you don't care to hear what this looks like from a 3rd party - fair enough. Best of luck changing Wolverine's mind for him.

gesoffen said:

I take it you don't care to hear what this looks like from a 3rd party - fair enough. Best of luck changing Wolverine's mind for him.

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Thanks for the encouragement, but the only thing I would like Eric to do is continure selling to the Garage forum members. Like I said before the product is great, as I have had it down for a number of months now and it is holding up extremely well. I actually just came in from the garage where I washed and quick detailed my truck, and then put me feet up a watched a few minutes of Two and a half men.

The point is that Wolverine has a good product and I feel that after using Griots Garage floor paint, (which I thought was great) Wolverines is much better, and remember I had the reject stuff. So because it's so good, if you want it put on your floor you will have to go through a professional to have it done. By doing that, there goes DIY price, because a floor pro needs to make money too.