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My Many Thermostats

Charles (in GA)

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Jan 11, 2006
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12,489
Location
50 mi south of Atlanta
As some of you may recall, in January and February of 2011 I installed My Lanair 200K BTU Used Oil furnace .

The Furnace was provided with a simple White Rodgers thermostat, that was adequate for the job. Its low range is 50°F which is what Lanair recommends as a minimum operating temperature for the heater, apparently to keep the oil from thickening in the tank. I have found the heater seems to operate just fine at lower temperatures however.

The issue I had with this thermostat was that there was no separate on/off switch. You had to take the temp slider and move it all the way to the left thru the detent and to the off position. Thus, every time you turned it on, you had to attempt to get the temp slider set in the same place to get the same temperature, which given the lack of good markings on the thermostat, was difficult to do.

Searching around, I found that Honeywell made a "garage thermostat" that had a low range of about 35°F and had a separate on/off switch. I bought one, and installed it.

The thermostats were installed on a section of finished plywood mounted on conduit clamps on the front post of the heater. It was convenient and worked well. I later moved the thermostat to a point near the door of the shop to make it easier to operate it. I documented this near the end of my heater thread.

The Honeywell thermostat, as you can see from the pics, it not the best thing Honeywell ever made. It has no reference for the temp slider, its all a guessing game and I ended up making pencil marks to mark the desired location should it get disturbed. The room temperature thermometer is a piece of junk, as you can easily rotate it to wherever you want. I'm not real sure why they installed it at all.

Recently the Habitat ReStore near me got a bunch of White Rodgers digital thermostats in, I think from a hardware store that closed up. They are simple non-programmable digital units that will work on almost any heat only or air only or heat and air system, with the exception of some of the more complex ones. The instructions show an installation for a three wire heater only, and has a note that if you have a two wire like mine to hook it up to white and Red-heat terminals. (no fan control, its a thermostatic switch on the heater itself). The specs also say that the unit will control down to 45°F and operate down to 32°F room temp (I would hope it will come on below that!!!!!!!)

Well, I installed the thermostat and test fired the heater, it seems to work well and for $8.56 including tax, it was a bargain. ($10 and a 20% discount for time on the shelf). We'll see how it operates this winter. The only maintenance is to keep two good AAA batteries installed in it.

Charles
 

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Charles (in GA)

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50 mi south of Atlanta
Well, I've been watching the digital thermostat all winter and realized that it is short cycling the heater. I cut a jumper on it that the instructions said would lengthen the cycles, but it still is way too short of a cycle.

Personally, with an oil heater, I would think you would want a wide spread between the on and off, probably two to four degrees. I have not been seeing even two degrees, and the heater, being nearly oversized, doesn't get a chance to get up to full heat and its already shutting off.

The old mechanical Honeywell has an adjustable anticipatior, so I adjusted it to a fairly wide spread (longer cycles) and reinstalled it today. We have a week of fairly cold temps coming and I'll get to see how well it works.

It seems that only the expensive digital thermostats have adjustable anticipatiors, and they all have a lot of other features I do not need.

I'll see how the old Honeywell works in these low temps and report back.

Charles
 

Random Guy

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Jun 16, 2009
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If you like the mechanical WR unit better, you could just add a separate switch in the control line to shut it off.
 
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Charles (in GA)

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50 mi south of Atlanta
Basically I want a thermostat that I can easily set to a given temp. No pencil marks, repeated attempts at trying to get it right, etc. The old round Honeywell fits the bill on this. It has two degree marks and is easy to read, and a room temp thermometer that actually works accurately. We had one in my folks home for many years.

Last nite I bought off of an Ebay seller, a NOS Honeywell round mercury switch T87F that has a 40° to 90° temp range, which I am fine with (beware, other models of the T87 have a 50° low limit rather than 40°). I also bought the base with the heat-off-cool and fan switches so I could simply switch the thermostat on and off, but I'm not sure I really need it now that I have the illuminated snap switch for power to the heater and the time delay in the thermostat circuit.

$(KGrHqJ,!nwFIJfuVM1eBSDSZZmry!~~60_14.JPG


If I don't like that one........... I also found a round Honeywell digital thermostat on Ebay model T8875C. No programming, no batteries, two wire capable, also a 40-90° range, with the ability to set the max number of cycles per hour of 1, 3, 6 or 9.

I need enough temp drop that the heater runs for a while and gets to full heat in the combustion chamber, output and chimney, before it shuts off. I don't want short cycling like I was getting with the W-R digital unit, and I wanted a lower temp setting than the 45° low limit of the W-R digital.

$(KGrHqJ,!q!FBZQt+)FIBQczCK2R3!~~60_14.JPG


Charles
 

mygarageone

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Munising , Mich
You are making to. Big a deal out of this , the biggest problem you have is the oil furnace is way to big and because of that , you will never get the room to heat properly no matter what you do with the T stat. Over sizing heating equipment is the worst thing people do , bigger is not better unless your drag racing.
 
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Charles (in GA)

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You are making to. Big a deal out of this , the biggest problem you have is the oil furnace is way to big and because of that , you will never get the room to heat properly no matter what you do with the T stat. Over sizing heating equipment is the worst thing people do , bigger is not better unless your drag racing.

Not at all. My biggest problem with the mechanical thermostats is being able to accurately set the desired room temp within a degree or two. If you look at the pics of those thermostats, especially the Honeywell, there is nothing to compare the slider to for a reference of what temp to set it to (the needle in the window is the useless thermometer that can be swiveled to any position). I have a 3 to 4 degree spread on the Honeywell right now, and it works fine, except that its a guessing game where it is set.

The mechanical W-R also works, but has ten degrees between marks and again, its a guessing game where it is set.

The digital W-R unit has a spread of about 1.2° according to their specs, way too small for a oil heater of any sort.

While I did say the heater was slightly oversized, it is fairly close to what is needed. The building is 60x60 with a 16 ft eave, a 21 ft peak, 66,600 cubic feet. It has a 56x14 ft door opening on one end that is translucent fiberglass panels, and a 12w x 14h section door on the other end that is 5 panels of glass and two of metal, and it fits a little loosely so it goes up and down without dragging. I also have a 10x10 roll up sheet door, they leak alot of air around the sides.

Need to do better sealing, but normally its not a problem, these extreme temps are causing issues we have not experienced in a loooong time.

I've been out to the shop this morning transferring used oil from a drum to the heater's fuel tank. It was holding 40° in the shop and I pushed it up to about where I remembered that 550 or 60 was, and sure enough when it finally satisfied the thermostat over an hour later, it was at 55° and drifted (rather quickly with the high 20's OAT and wind blowing) down to 52° where it fired back up.

I just want to be able to walk in and bump it up, or leave and bump it down, to a specific temperature and expect it to be right.

Charles
 
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mygarageone

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Munising , Mich
One of the issues with a furnace that's way over size Is exactly what you are experiencing.
This is a common problem with over sized equipment.
The room your trying to heat never gets balanced out. But you want to keep buying stats go for it.
 
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OccupantRJ

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May 15, 2009
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Eastern North Carolina
Heck, just install two of your thermostats with a two position A-B switch on the thermostat wires, one for occupied setting, one for not. Adjust each once and done.
 
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Charles (in GA)

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50 mi south of Atlanta
Well, about a month ago, I ordered from an Ebay seller, a NOS Honeywell round thermostat. It was made in 2002 and has a mercury vial in it. Its a model T87F 1859 thermostat with a 40°F to 80°F range. I installed it on a Q539A 1220 base to give me an on-off switch at the thermostat.

It works real well, holding temps stable and with a very slight anticipator adjustment from the factory setting, it has a on-off spread of about 2½° to nearly 3°. The dial has a pointer that is easy to accurately and repeatedly set to a specific temperature and the temperature indication/thermometer also seems accurate and very easy to read. I had a couple of cold spells to try it out, and it worked nicely and I'm quite pleased with it.

A 2½° spread is not uncomfortable at all, and the heater does not short cycle (which I already knew from using the other Honeywell thermostat, but it was a POS to try and read temp or set temp on)

Charles
 

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A_Pmech

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May 8, 2007
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IL
Well, about a month ago, I ordered from an Ebay seller, a NOS Honeywell round thermostat. It was made in 2002 and has a mercury vial in it. Its a model T87F 1859 thermostat with a 40°F to 80°F range.

That looks familiar... :)

I have two of those in the shop and I like them quite a bit.
 

EOC_Jason

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Jun 25, 2012
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11,388
Location
Bentonville, AR
We have an old round Honeywell in our house. Simple to use, works great, why on earth would anyone want something more complicated...

I will tell you this. The thermostats you get from big box stores like Home Depot & Lowes are NOT the same quality that you get from the A/C supply houses. If you know an AC guy, and you need a new thermostat, I would ask them to grab you one.
 

rkirshner

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Nov 6, 2011
Messages
11
thermostat re configuring ?

so may i ask a question that has to do with thermostats. also i apologize if i am sort of hijacking this thread
i have a new gas heater that is thermostat controlled . i live in the northeast. this is my first season with the new gas heater . frankly ,i love it . but i do have a problem that i want to remedy
i have kids and a wife . they are great at many things, but closing the garage door is not one of them . it is not unusual for me to wake up in the morning to an open garage door with my heater just blowing warm air all over the neighborhood
so i thought maybe i can put a timer in the system that deactivates the heater after like 15 minutes . or maybe i can rig up a system that wont allow the heater to turn on unless the garage door is closed .
i figured someone here might already have solved this problem. any ideas? thanks
 
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Charles (in GA)

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Jan 11, 2006
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Location
50 mi south of Atlanta
This was recently discussed in another thread. The simple solution is to put some sort of switch on the garage door so that if it is NOT CLOSED (as opposed to full or partially open) then the thermostat circuit is interrupted and the heater will not run.

You really need to work on keeping the door closed, for security, and for preventing things in the garage from freezing (such as water in the sink, or paint on the shelf).

Try the links below for threads about this.

Charles

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-220444.html

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-86513.html

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-138159.html

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-221160.html
 
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