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Hot Deal on Super High Value Speakers for Garage!

pauls_workshop

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Not a tool, but one of my hobbies is high end audio. There is a legendary speaker designer named Andrew Jones who has been working with Pioneer and making some cheap but excellent sounding speakers. The little ones here just got Stereophile Magazines budget component of the year. On sale right now from Newegg for $50 after rebate. (It was $42 but they removed a coupon code they had).

Well, that is a super deal. What I also like about these is they have a metal mesh cover over the drivers, so if in garage or shop use or with kids around, some protection this way. Most speakers don't have that. You can only do the rebate one per person/address. They also have some great floorstanding ones that go with it. These are basically the best speakers available at anywhere near these prices. You can do much better, but at 10x the price or more. - Paul

http://slickdeals.net/permadeal/108...-bookshelf-loudspeakers-pair?page=13#comments
 
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Boyd

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Paul - I have a pair of the SP-BS22s in my garage and absolutely love them. But I do have a question that you seem uniquely qualified for.

My garage is insulated, but it isn't heated or cooled. It sees temperatures as low as 30dgs in the winter and 100dgs in the summer.

My question is, will the temperature extremes cause the woofer surrounds to fail prematurely? If so, is there anything I can do/apply to "condition" them?
 

71goldss

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Sounds like a great deal if I didn't have four Klipsch kg1's hooked up to an old Denon AVR3000 in my garage already. Amazing base coming out of those kg1's!
 

JZHeyde

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I tried to order and it Appears the 10% off coupon is no longer valid. Probably still a good deal.
 
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pauls_workshop

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Paul - I have a pair of the SP-BS22s in my garage and absolutely love them. But I do have a question that you seem uniquely qualified for.

My garage is insulated, but it isn't heated or cooled. It sees temperatures as low as 30dgs in the winter and 100dgs in the summer.

My question is, will the temperature extremes cause the woofer surrounds to fail prematurely? If so, is there anything I can do/apply to "condition" them?

Hi Boyd, well, it depends! I've rebuilt woofer surrounds before on some old Advent speakers I once had. The type of speakers that use the older foam surrounds will indeed rot over time, but we are talking about 10-20 years in normal indoor rooms. In a hot/cold/humid garage, maybe much faster for those types. I don't know, but you might have to rebuild them in 10 years or less. More modern speakers usually use a rubber type surround and not the foam type. I've probably gone through at least 20 different pairs of speakers in my life and the only ones I ever had to repair the woofer surrounds on were those Advents.

I ordered a pair of these $50 small ones I'm thinking of using for surrounds in a system. (I actually just use a boom box in the garage for the moment). I don't know what kind of surrounds these have. If they are the foam type, then maybe not the greatest choice in a garage after all. I figure at this price, really can't go wrong with these and so thought I would share. I also missed the 10% off that isn't going on anymore, but still a super deal. People seem to be liking the towers very much too, but not quite as awesomely as the tiny little ones. - Paul
 

MDSPHOTO

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This thread is useless without pics! Let's see your high end system.
 
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pauls_workshop

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Sounds like a great deal if I didn't have four Klipsch kg1's hooked up to an old Denon AVR3000 in my garage already. Amazing base coming out of those kg1's!

You are rather set with those Kilpsches and the Denon! This hot deal is especially for those who don't know about what "good" gear is and want to dabble in real hi end sound for little investment. That is how I started about 30 years ago becoming an audiophile. I rarely buy new gear but I've gotten some killer equipment at garage sales and craigslist over the years for not much at all. - Paul
 
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pauls_workshop

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This thread is useless without pics! Let's see your high end system.

Ha ha. Mine won't fit in the width or height constaints of this little email window box my friend!

:)

My main system:

Linn Sara 9 and Sara x 2 (center, rears) speakers
Active Linn Keleidh front tower speakers with Linn active 100 wph amps
Paradigm Reference Servo 15 Sub
Acurus ampllifiers, 3x150 wpc rear/center
Acurus Act II 7.1 channel pre-amp
AR ES-1 Rosewood Turntable
5.1 channels of equalization to custom match everything sonically
Sony Playstation V1.0 cd player (laugh if you like but extremely high end sound for $15 at Goodwill- research it! - only the ones with RCA cable outputs are any good - much better than Yamaha, Sony , Rotel mid fi cd gear I also have)
Working on computer interface to play computer 24_96 flac files direct through the stereo
Various interconnects, wire brands etc.

Now I got a little toddler at home. Gotta move out the Linns! Pioneers in the rear with driver grill protection! I have some old DCM TimeWindow towers I'll use for the fronts that were once my main speakers for about 12 years straight through college. If those get killed, not too terrible. M..u..s..t P...r...o...t...e...c...t LINNS at all cost! :) 10 more years, out will come the LINNS again! Maybe I can fashion some metal grills to slip behind the fabric grills on the DCMs as a project... - Paul
 
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pauls_workshop

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Do you think these speakers will fit behind the seat of a 1990 Chevy reg cab pickup?

I think the dimensions are all listed at NewEgg. You can check that out. One thing with these is they don't seem to have mounting options. Designed to sit on a shelf or speaker stand so you may have to get creative to try to mount them. Also, be aware these are 6 ohm load. Most home speakers are 8 but almost all receivers can handle 6 ohms no problem. My super amps can go down to 2 ohms no problem but few can do that. For car, most speakers are 4 ohm loads. So in a car, these would not put out as much loudness with the 6 ohms for the same car head unit. Be aware of that. If you have 50 watts in your car/truck, no problems. But if you have 5 or 10, may not want to do that. - Paul
 

Ah4449

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These seem like some quality reasonably priced speakers, I may have to get a pair. Another question if you don't mind Paul, what would you recommend as far as an amplifier/receiver to hook these up to the tv in the garage? Something small in size would be ideal. Would be awesome if it had a Bluetooth connectivity function as well...
 
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wmartin

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I saw those on slickdeals.

I wish that they were more efficient. I have this thing for Class T amps anymore and don't know if they'd push those things. It's a crackup to have a $20 amplifier that sounds fine.
 
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pauls_workshop

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These seem like some quality reasonably priced speakers, I may have to get a pair. Another question if you don't mind Paul, what would you recommend as far as an amplifier/receiver to hook these up to the tv in the garage? Something small in size would be ideal. Would be awesome if it had a Bluetooth connectivity function as well...

Hi Ah, well there are probably hundreds of choices of amps or receivers you could use. These Pioneers, even at 6 ohms, can be driven by almost any receiver. I did read that these are pretty inefficient, meaning that the 87 db sensitivity is fairly low for a modern speaker, so for the same wattage, these won't be as loud as say Klipsh speakers would be (they might be twice as loud as these for the same watts, but Klipsh are super efficient). Efficiency has little to do with sound quality, so don't let this bother you, but they will want watts. 100 wpc would be a good rating for these to play at fairly loud levels or even a 150 wpc receiver or amp would not be a problem. I've never ever had a speaker go bad by giving it TOO much power, only too little when asking it to go loud is what will blow tweeters or woofers. You could probably use as little as 30 wpc with these but don't try to go super loud with that.

There are many modern amps and receivers that are good and also many older used ones that are as good or better! I recommend you get a copy of Stereophile magazine. Just this last month they had their once a year recommended components issue. That is a super place to start. They do cater to very expensive gear, but there are some recommendations at lower price points too. Also Absolute Sound magazine is great. I would subscribe to both of those and have for many years. One thing with the high end audio, there are many US companies still that make super gear but at very expensive prices. But you can pick these up used sometimes for only a bit more than a new lower end item. That is a great way to get good gear. These high end components last 20-30 years or more and are much much higher quality than the low end foreign audio gear in general from say China. I'm talking mainly about amps, pre-amps, processors, that sort of thing, but also speakers too. The good ones can last decades without any problem. It is kind of like investing in an older Mercedes or BMW. More money up front but you end up with a really good long term payback for doing so for a quality product and get to enjoy it too. - Paul
 

MDSPHOTO

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Ha ha. Mine won't fit in the width or height constaints of this little email window box my friend!

:)

My main system:

Linn Sara 9 and Sara x 2 (center, rears) speakers
Active Linn Keleidh front tower speakers with Linn active 100 wph amps
Paradigm Reference Servo 15 Sub
Acurus ampllifiers, 3x150 wpc rear/center
Acurus Act II 7.1 channel pre-amp
AR ES-1 Rosewood Turntable
5.1 channels of equalization to custom match everything sonically
Sony Playstation V1.0 cd player (laugh if you like but extremely high end sound for $15 at Goodwill- research it! - only the ones with RCA cable outputs are any good - much better than Yamaha, Sony , Rotel mid fi cd gear I also have)
Working on computer interface to play computer 24_96 flac files direct through the stereo
Various interconnects, wire brands etc.

Now I got a little toddler at home. Gotta move out the Linns! Pioneers in the rear with driver grill protection! I have some old DCM TimeWindow towers I'll use for the fronts that were once my main speakers for about 12 years straight through college. If those get killed, not too terrible. M..u..s..t P...r...o...t...e...c...t LINNS at all cost! :) 10 more years, out will come the LINNS again! Maybe I can fashion some metal grills to slip behind the fabric grills on the DCMs as a project... - Paul


Sounds awesome, but you could have pulled this off any audiophile website, pics or it didn't happen.:)
 

Bull

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If I have these speakers in my garage, replacing whatever is out there now, what am I going to notice differently? When I am cranking metal, rock or punk, what are high end components going to do for me?

These are serious questions coming from an ignoramus.
 

larryq

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If I have these speakers in my garage, replacing whatever is out there now, what am I going to notice differently? When I am cranking metal, rock or punk, what are high end components going to do for me?

These are serious questions coming from an ignoramus.

^^ with Bull on this. Any advice appreciated, my ignorance regarding stereo equipment is very complete.
 
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PassnThru

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If I have these speakers in my garage, replacing whatever is out there now, what am I going to notice differently? When I am cranking metal, rock or punk, what are high end components going to do for me?

These are serious questions coming from an ignoramus.

Bull - do not fall into the "high end audio" trap. These guys make a SnapOn fetish look cheap.
 

sdguy55

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Hope Paul doesn't mind if I offer an insight on this bull but what you will get out of it is highly dependent on YOU.

There are a lot of people out there that a $100 dollar system sounds just as good as a $10,000 dollar one. And a lot of it has to do with what you like to hear. Some people like really bright, rich highs. Others are bassheads (me).

But, I will try to give you a view point as to what I look for when I'm auditioning any speaker/system.

First play music that you are VERY familiar with. And while your listening try to stand in the center of the system to start with. Now as the music cues up I like to close my eyes to help me break down the music.

As the music is playing you should be able to clearly pick out where every player and instrument is in the song. And if you listen VERY closely you will start to hear what the artist put in for layers to the song. That parts kinda hard to describe without you hearing it specifically. Bass should be punchy and notes shouldn't carry over to the next one. So double drum hits should sound crisp and powerful. Guitar should have some good meat on it, where you can almost feel the individual cords being plucked out.

A really good test for you and a speaker is to see if the bass guitar gets lost in the mix, for me this is usually the one instrument that is the hardest to find in the music.

Vocals should always sound like they are coming from in front of you.

Another thing to try out is once you are fully swept up in the music try moving a little to the left or right. This will show you how tight or wide the speakers sweet spot is. Some are very focused others are very wide.
 
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pauls_workshop

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sdguy: Some good pointers there. Critical listening over time is key to learning about what you may never have noticed in the music.

Well, but not everyone is meant to ever become an audiophile! Some don't have the hearing. Not everyone can tell the difference between something really good and something totally average in terms of sound quality. If you love MP3s and that is all you need, then sound quality is not for you! As you get older, or are exposed to noise for years, you tend to lose hearing also. What sounds great to you then might sound absolutely terrible to someone with better hearing, as you would really like speakers that are louder in the frequencies you are missing but someone else might cringe, so that what you "hear" then is the flat response you need but for someone else it has bad peaks and valleys in frequency response.

Some just don't like music or appreciate music much. If there isn't any song or any artist that really means anything for you, and any music is just for background, then you probably aren't meant to be an audiophile!

None of the above is bad in any way either if that applies!

But for some, better sound leads to better enjoyment of music. That's what it is about. Like most things in life, there are lower, middle, and higher end grades of things. Much like our tools - China, Taiwan, then US. Usually the higher end stuff costs more, but not exclusively so. There are some bargains out there that let people see what it is all about and decide if it matters to them or not. Spend some time with your first Snap On or Knipex or Proto and see if it is worth it for you, so to speak, while buying it from a garage sale! :)

I just found an old rusty beat up pair of Klein wire cutters and linesman's that I forgot I had and pulled them out for some electrical work. Those 30-40 year old Kleins are just magical. Work much better than a brand new china pair of cutters I had that was nearly an identical copy of those Kleins. Well those Kleins are "high end" to me and I love them. Someone else might prefer the china $2 wire cutters instead. To each their own.

Also, I'm not telling anyone they should get these. I'm just letting people know the deal is out there if they are interested and they can research more as they see fit if interested. - Paul
 
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pepi

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These seem like some quality reasonably priced speakers, I may have to get a pair. Another question if you don't mind Paul, what would you recommend as far as an amplifier/receiver to hook these up to the tv in the garage? Something small in size would be ideal. Would be awesome if it had a Bluetooth connectivity function as well...

Crown or McIntosh should fit the bill nicely, if you decide to go reel to reel.

Have a very nice REVOX I would consider letting go of, quick change hubs 10 in reels, heads are perfect, even sell the reels of tape rock & roll & Jazz recorded.
 
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pauls_workshop

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Sounds awesome, but you could have pulled this off any audiophile website, pics or it didn't happen.:)

MDS, with all due respect, it is NOT my job to provide you photos of anything I own and I'm not going to. If this bothers you, you don't have to participate in the text based discussion. I really also could care less whether you think I own a stereo component or not or what you think I own if you do! Please stop obsessing. Although I have some valuable gear, I got it all cheap over many years, but it is worth more than the car I drive, valued at about $3k or so now! And no, I'm not going to send you a photo of my car either. - Paul
 

thebreeze2012

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If I have these speakers in my garage, replacing whatever is out there now, what am I going to notice differently? When I am cranking metal, rock or punk, what are high end components going to do for me?

These are serious questions coming from an ignoramus.



I'm no Audiophile but if your listening to a cheap system and then listen to a Hi quality system, speakers/amp, you'll hear things/sounds in songs that you've never heard before.

I guess one example would be it's like watching a older tv in 480p then watching a new hdtv in 1080p, it's a lot more clear and realistic.

As mentioned everyones ears are different and if your half deaf it won't be as noticeable as someone with a good set of ears.
 
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pauls_workshop

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^^ with Bull on this. Any advice appreciated, my ignorance regarding stereo equipment is very complete.

Hey Bull and Larry,

Better systems with better speakers should reveal these kind of things:

1. Smoother frequency response, so boomy bass should not be there and peaky shrill treble should not be there. Human voice should be well represented and sound like a human voice. This is called good "midrange" response where the human voice is.

2. High frequencies should be present and sound more realistic. Cymbal crashes should sound like cymbals. Drums should sound like drums.

3. There should be more dynamics present. From quiet to loud and back should be more "lifelike". You should be able to hear more micro dynamics too - things like guitar plucks or piano keys being struck or similar things that you may not have heard on a lesser system.

4. There should be more "air" and "ambience" around the instruments. You should start to see a stereo image in space with the music, not just hear the music. Like going from mono to stereo. Good systems will have the sound project behind and above and to the sides of each speaker to give an image of a "stage". My main system does that. Drums are over there on the left. Vocals in the center of stage. That bass is over on the right. That sort of thing in 3d space. This is called "imaging".

5. Basically the better the system, the closer to a real life performance it will get. Today, you can get amazingly close to real life, but systems that do that are in the $50,000 kind of range. For a $2k system, you can get about 70% as good as that $50k system. It is also worth noting, that good headphones can get you much much closer to lifelike than most speaker systems. Rule of thumb is about 10x. So a $100 pair of good headphones should be about as good as a $1000 pair of speakers. A $2k pair of headphones is about as good as a $20,000 pair of speakers. So if on a budget, get some nice headphones first and a decent headphone amp!

I don't know exactly how awesome these little cheap Pioneers are since I don't own them yet, but based on the reviews, I'll give them a try. I'm expecting the $50 ones to be as good as anything up to $250 or less on the market or I'll be disappointed. Every speaker has pros and cons. These are supposed to be well balanced and smooth, not harsh at all. They won't go very low in the bass. You need a subwoofer for that. This is understood. The designer sacrificed efficiency to get a well behaved response. This was a good design tradeoff I think. - Paul
 

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Paul, all what you say is true so long as your hearing is perfect. :)

I survived the HiFi audio era of the 1970's and 1980's without going overboard because my hearing isn't perfect, probably due to cranking the audio up and a few live rock concerts. My best system cost me about $1500 (1980s) which was typically a mid-range system and I was happy with it. Others however weren't as impressed with my audio system. These were people that preferred electron tube sets over digital because they "could tell the difference."

But I could hear some differences in their systems over mine. Higher high-notes were the most noticeable difference. The cost difference though kept me from making the leap. It really boils down to personal preference and cost benefit. You can get spoiled though listening to a superior audio system because you will hear things that you never heard before in the same music with cheaper systems.

But I will go ahead and say that my current little Bose system is awesome and worth the money.

Steve
 
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pauls_workshop

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Paul, all what you say is true so long as your hearing is perfect. :)

I survived the HiFi audio era of the 1970's and 1980's without going overboard because my hearing isn't perfect, probably due to cranking the audio up and a few live rock concerts. My best system cost me about $1500 (1980s) which was typically a mid-range system and I was happy with it. Others however weren't as impressed with my audio system. These were people that preferred electron tube sets over digital because they "could tell the difference."

But I could hear some differences in their systems over mine. Higher high-notes were the most noticeable difference. The cost difference though kept me from making the leap. It really boils down to personal preference and cost benefit. You can get spoiled though listening to a superior audio system because you will hear things that you never heard before in the same music with cheaper systems.

But I will go ahead and say that my current little Bose system is awesome and worth the money.

Steve

Steve, thanks for sharing! Yes, sounds like what you have is appropriate for what you should have. This may be different for each person. I'm not much a fan of Bose though - I find their approach to lead to a few problems with speakers, trying to cram too much in too small a space - but that is fine. They do image very well in general. Small speakers in general can image in 3d space much better than larger ones and many like small speakers even as the main front speakers for this reason alone, coupled with a subwoofer for the bass handling parts.

Although I love live music and go whenever I can manage it, for rock concerts I always bring ear plugs! The sound levels are insane sometimes. This is one way I've preserved my ears to middle age. Also, I always use some little foam ear plugs whenever I do work in the garage or shop. I met a young mechanic the other day air impact driving away all day in his garage. I told him to consider using ear plugs while doing that work to preserve his hearing. Tooo many people lose hearing they don't need to lose over time.

For people that do have damage but can detect better sound with a better system, you can use equalization on each channel like I have to correct one ear as needed. This may not be good if you live with others! But you can do that these days. Boost the highs or midrange or lows or what have you. I boost my right front speaker about 3 db in the 4k and 8k treble range because my right ear has some damage (formerly ruptured ear drum). Doesn't slow me down at all in the enjoyment of the better sound.

For people that become interested in better sound and want a better system, in general, first I would learn about what is actually good out there - brands, then models. I would go to garage sales. My first set of Linn Sara speakers I got at a garage sale for all of $10 each and that was with steel stands! These things originally retailed for like $2k a pair. Well it was a divorce sale and the speakers either played bass or treble but not both and the ex wife wanted them OUT as they were ex hubbies'. Well I took it home and found the bi amp connector plate was just missing so I made a new one. These are set up to allow a separate amp for the bass and separate for treble if you wanted, but that wasn't connected was all. Then I got another set later on for all of $300 off ebay for rears. The Linns are from Scotland and known for their turntables mainly but also make everything else well. People don't think of Linn for speakers, which is how I knew to grab them when I could as there was not that much interest. The Saras go down to 2 ohms too and need big amps to sound good! Sound like garbage on most receivers if they play at all! :)

Later on I got the Linn Kaleidh towers from a friend, including 2 active Linn amps and the controller for all of $500 used from him. This also would have tallied about $2-3K just for that when new. My Paradigm 15 inch sub was about $2200 new. I waited about 5 years, then found one off craigslist for $500. The guy just bought a smaller and better JL Audio sub and so out with the old. He was a very wealthy person and didn't think twice about selling it fast for not much money. Well, the Paradigm is an awesome sub! One of the top 5 in the world at the time (early 2000s). Will go down to like 12 hz, so thunder sounds just like thunder. It can shake the whole house no problem! So that was an easy choice and good one. My Acurus pre and amps I got off an ebay deal for about $1k total for those 10 years back. Originally about $4-5k for those. The company was out of business for years when I got those but I knew what they were so grabbed them. Very good amps. The Pre-amp could be a little better in some ways though for frequency response and DAC, now outdated for technology for digital conversion.

Someday I might upgrade the preamp to something more modern, but it also has a non-processed full 7.1 set of inputs, so right now I'm trying to get a computer hooked into the stereo and just let the computer do the dac conversion into it and not use the pre for that anymore. Then it will be awesome again. I'm moving towards almost all computer based new music now, getting higher than cd resolution files in 24 bit 96 khz or 24/48 or even 24 bit/196 khz files. All cds are 16 bit 44khz for comparison. These have like 100x more musical bits of content than cds do! Let me tell you, the difference in sound is staggering from these newer high resolution computer music files! Detail, micro dynamics, imaging all get much better with the higher resolution files than cds.

So you see, you can get good gear but not for tons of money over time if you know what to get when you find it and then go find the deals. I rarely pay more than 25% of new for any of my used audio buys. Buying old made in USA high end gear is not much risk vs. new - most stuff performs the same for decades... Now if I could just find some good TUBED gear cheap! Like some Macintosh or Audio Research! That would be an upgrade! I love tube sound but have never owned anything tubed.

For those wanting to hear the things described without paying one cent, all major cities in the US have high end audio dealers that carry the really expensive gear. You can go visit them and bring some of your music along. You can play your music on the systems and just go to explore. Almost all will be gracious and let you learn about the differences. It is all free of course. Also, many places have audio clubs were people in the club will play their systems for the club members and rotate. Great way to learn about the hobby and what is good to you and what is not. You can also subscribe to the mailing catalogs of Audio Advisor out of Michigan and also Music Direct. These two sell good stuff and send catalogs in the mail still. Great way to learn about some products out there.

Really good systems tend to make every kind of music sound really good, but some do better for rock and roll and some do better for say classical. Rock and roll likes good micro dynamics and detail and bass control and output, so brands like Klipsch or Wharfdale or NHT, maybe some Polks, old 90's Aragon or Acurus or Adcom or modern Outlaw Audio amps or similar muscle high power transistor amps, etc. would be brands to be aware of. There are dozens of others. JL Audio makes the best subwoofers right now, but Paradigm and PSB and REL are great, HSU Research (Outlaw makes a version) is great too.

Also, anyone can PM me anytime if you like if I can ever help anyone with anything at all. I love to talk as you can tell ! (My wife tells me this every once in a while.... ) - Paul
 
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txusa03

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Sounds like a great deal if I didn't have four Klipsch kg1's hooked up to an old Denon AVR3000 in my garage already. Amazing base coming out of those kg1's!

I am not an audiophile expert. My music listening was limited to car stereo.

Then I got myself some klipsch professional (gold looking thing and not the klipsch at best buy not that there are anything wrong w/ klipsch at best buy) and all of a sudden my hearing feel like 100% better.

I never really tested any other speakers but I am sure there are way better speakers out there but I got a decent price on the klipsch so I went for it and have no regrets.:thumbup:
 
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pauls_workshop

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I am not an audiophile expert. My music listening was limited to car stereo.

Then I got myself some klipsch professional (gold looking thing and not the klipsch at best buy not that there are anything wrong w/ klipsch at best buy) and all of a sudden my hearing feel like 100% better.

I never really tested any other speakers but I am sure there are way better speakers out there but I got a decent price on the klipsch so I went for it and have no regrets.:thumbup:

The horn tweeters in the Klipsch do wonders with the micro dynamics and are extremely "fast" speakers. They have always done bass very well. Really, Klipsch is a great choice for a rock 'n roll based system. They do make super high end speakers too, so mid fi but also high fi for their more pricey ones. Ironically, Klipsch ended up buying the Acurus and Aragon amp company I use, but unfortunately, they didn't do anything with them. They should revive those amp designs and improve them and revive those brands. Would be awesome.

The only problem with horns is they are not so good with smooth and balanced frequency response except in the real expensive ones. For rock 'n roll you may not notice or care about that tradeoff. But they tend to not be best for say classical or jazz or smooth vocals as other choices. Slam, impact, and dynamics, bass, efficiency (loud with low power amps) and detail they are kings with though and good value!

For those who want the above but also smooth frequency response that works for other kinds of music well, check out Wharfdale from the UK or NHT from the US or some Polks too. Some Monitor Audio from the UK also are among the fastest speakers known to man but very smooth. Forgot to mention Magnepans. Those are super fast ribbon based speakers, but not generally rock and roll speakers. My Linns are super fast but have a slightly warmer sound to them which I love. Tubelike just slightly without tubes in the system. Vocals are lifelike. Not for AC DC! But will make AC DC sound fast, loud, with slam and bass control but also warm and friendly! - Paul
 
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wmartin

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Bull - do not fall into the "high end audio" trap. These guys make a SnapOn fetish look cheap.

It's an odd world.

I'm around pro audio people (both post and live) a lot more than guys with fancy home stereos, but the few I know really love their brands and magazines (and sometimes have sketchy hearing and taste). I guess it's no different than a Snap on vs. Chaiwanese wrench war, just more expensive.

It always seemed to me that a lot of the hifi world really is built around coloring the sound in different ways rather than doing the best possible job of putting a signal through a system with no changes.

If you forced me to buy loud gear for the house, I'd probably just get a Yamaha P5000S and a pair of NS10s (and any old CD player) or something. Then, to make it sound 'good', plug in some sort of upstream box for modifying the signal. YMMV, big time.

Of course, none of this has anything to do with listening to AC/DC in the garage. Those on sale speakers do look like a bargain.
 

MDSPHOTO

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Nov 10, 2011
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^^ with Bull on this. Any advice appreciated, my ignorance regarding stereo equipment is very complete.

i don't know these speakers so I can't comment on them directly. As an audiophile myself, we design our systems to accurately reproduce the live musical event or studio session as it was recorded. These systems produce a 3-D soundstage creating air between the instruments and performers and allow us to hear nuances not heard on mass market systems. Also, audiophiles primarily listen to well recorded jazz, classical and vocal arrangements where those nuances can be most appreciated.

Is this better than jammin out to AC/DC in my garage on my POS Nakamichi system, no, just a different listening experience. Would I put audiophile grade speakers in my garage, no. IMHO music in my garage is just background noise while I'm working out there. I am not doing what audiophiles call "critical listening", that is having no other outside stimulus while you are engulfed in the music. Additionally, audiophile speakers require proper placement and good associated equipment to allow you to hear major differences. In a working garage, we have **** everywhere which would get in the way of proper system set-up.

So, should you put audiophile speakers in your garage it's up to you, but my old Nakamichi system sounds just fine cranking out Breaking Benjamin and there are still a bunch of tools I need to buy first.
 

BD1

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Newegg has some awesome deals. You must monitor their pricing, it can change daily. i bought the Polk Audio 45 B to go with my monitor tower speakers from them. The prices were from $229 down to $120 and in between. I got them at $120 and next day they were up to $190. This price was for a pair.
I was never a Pioneer guy, started out with JBL 100's in the old days. Then bought a Polk Audio 5 speaker set up for the living room. Sounded great so I stuck with them. I really like the Monitors for the money. :beer:
 
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pauls_workshop

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i don't know these speakers so I can't comment on them directly. As an audiophile myself, we design our systems to accurately reproduce the live musical event or studio session as it was recorded. These systems produce a 3-D soundstage creating air between the instruments and performers and allow us to hear nuances not heard on mass market systems. Also, audiophiles primarily listen to well recorded jazz, classical and vocal arrangements where those nuances can be most appreciated.

Is this better than jammin out to AC/DC in my garage on my POS Nakamichi system, no, just a different listening experience. Would I put audiophile grade speakers in my garage, no. IMHO music in my garage is just background noise while I'm working out there. I am not doing what audiophiles call "critical listening", that is having no other outside stimulus while you are engulfed in the music. Additionally, audiophile speakers require proper placement and good associated equipment to allow you to hear major differences. In a working garage, we have **** everywhere which would get in the way of proper system set-up.

So, should you put audiophile speakers in your garage it's up to you, but my old Nakamichi system sounds just fine cranking out Breaking Benjamin and there are still a bunch of tools I need to buy first.

Hey MDS, agree with all your points here! Right now, I use a boombox in my garage (I like Phillips/Magnavox brand boom boxes for better sound btw than your typical Sony or JVC as they tend to be balanced better). Some day, I'll put some speakers and a little system out there or in my basement workshop, but haven't gotten to that yet. For the $50 price though, those little pioneers should make any garage sing with almost any receiver. Add a $15 Sony Playstation cd player or a portable Sansa Fuse V1 player plugged in playing native flac computer music files up to 24/96 and you will have killer cheap sound easily the equal of what any $1500 system would have been making only 15 years back for less than $500 easily, $300 if you are careful about it on the receiver choice. - Paul
 

Nick Danger

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Bull - do not fall into the "high end audio" trap. These guys make a SnapOn fetish look cheap.

It's not a trap, exactly, but there is always something better than what you have. You need to be aware of your limits.

In the 1990s, I was invited to a demonstration of high end speakers. The speaker cable alone cost $600 a meter-pair. Retail price was almost $2000 just to connect two speakers.

The speakers sounded great, but a few of us agreed that they weren't $20,000 great.

I'm not sure why I got an invitation, because I was definitely a mid-range guy.
 

Ray916MN

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Apr 15, 2012
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Orono, MN
Kudos for trying to flag a good deal for GJ members.

Audio quality in today's world is wildly diverse. The advent of home theater, portable audio, and digitized audio has dramatically changed what qualifies as good audio.

Home theater audio is mixed and engineered for impact and entertainment more than fidelity. Engineered to playback through 5 speakers and a subwoofer, as opposed to two stereo speakers. It is engineered to directly reproduce the reflected sound we hear in live environments.

Portable audio dominates the majority of the public's "listening" experience these days. Here there are only 2 in or over ear speakers with no chance of natural audio reflection from the environment.

Digitized audio creates a huge span of quality. While digital can be used to provide greater audio accuracy than analog audio, it can also be used to save on storage or transmission capacity. With respect to Internet streamed audio or portable player audio, generally audio quality is significantly sacrificed to save bandwidth/storage space.

What makes a good speaker these days depends on whether you want to listen to home theater surround sound or music and on the audio source.

In my opinion, if you care about audio quality and you're listening to AM radio, streamed audio or typical "MP3s", you should consider using FM, HD FM or a CDs as an audio source. This may be a less expensive way to improve sound quality than new speakers.

Lastly, listening environment matters allot and garages generally **** as listening environments so in some ways considering audio quality in a garage is like optimizing the performance of a Chevette. I've got a 5.1 setup with Paradigm speakers, a couple of Yamaha powered subwoofers and a Denon 7.2 receiver with HD radio in my workshop and the sound quality "*****" compared to what I use in my home. No one engineers consumer sound for concrete floors, and metal walls.
 

sdguy55

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I am so glad this spurred on a good audio discussion :) I could talk about this just as much as I could talk about tools and cars!

My setup is very modest. But I got it CHEAP.
Harman/Kardon 5.1 with Harman sub. Denon receiver.

I got the Harman speakers from a pawn shop my first year in college and cost me 150 bucks it was one of those H/T in a box deals got the denon receiver from when one of the big box stores sold out a couple years ago (circuit city? Really have no idea) and got it brand new for 150.

The speakers lack any real midrange and the sub was built to try and and make up for it so it is built to play higher than what a sub normally should so the bottom end suffers.

But for 300 dollars and some very fine EQ adjustments it will sound decent enough
 

djb2

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Apr 3, 2010
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Redwood forests
Most people here are still talking about gear that is reasonable.

Audio quality generally improves as price goes up to the "pro-sumer" range, then goes sideways and even down.

The high end is full of crackpots, frauds and imagined benefits. Like granite turntable bases, speaker cable suspension towers, and overpriced wires. They are fixing imagined problems, while sitting beside designs that are filled with engineering compromises.

(Yes, I feel qualified to make these statements: one of my favorite courses at MIT, while I was getting an EE degree, was Acoustics taught by Dr. Bose.)
 
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