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Fillet Knife Build......

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Rhyno

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I need another Fillet Knife, but this time I want one with my "features."

I am not an experienced "Knife Builder", either......

With my need, and a little internet inspiration, and a memory of an uncompleted "BoyScout" project, I set forth.

This is what the blade started out as.....

028874348042.jpg


DEWALT 12-in 6-TPI Bi-Metal Reciprocating Saw Blade

http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/028874/028874348042.jpg

..
 
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Rhyno

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I didn't take any pics, in the process, but I did use an Oxy/Acet torch and RoseBud to get the blade "Cherry Red."

A lot of people believe that a magnet is necessary to evaluate the Molecules "readiness to conform." I didn't use a magnet.....The blade was almost a "floppy noodle," though.

I put an old OliveOil bottle, that was filled with Vegetable Oil, in my saw dust can. Just in case I made a mess when I was trying to "Quench."

IMAG3802.jpg


http://i1219.photobucket.com/albums/dd424/BlueLightRhyno/Fillet Knife/IMAG3802.jpg

IMAG3803.jpg


http://i1219.photobucket.com/albums/dd424/BlueLightRhyno/Fillet Knife/IMAG3803.jpg

IMAG3804.jpg


http://i1219.photobucket.com/albums/dd424/BlueLightRhyno/Fillet Knife/IMAG3804.jpg

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Rhyno

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I'm not an expert on "Heat Treating", either....

I put it in a "Pre-Heated", 500 degree oven. I planned on leaving it in there for an hour. It took me twenty minutes to figure out that others do it for 20 minutes at 400 degrees.

So, I turned off the oven and let it sit inside, to cool over-night.


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Rhyno

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Then some filing, sanding, drilling, etc.

IMAG3805.jpg


http://i1219.photobucket.com/albums/dd424/BlueLightRhyno/Fillet Knife/IMAG3805.jpg

I had some small Oak Scraps, that I used for the scales. (I think that it was some sort of Cabinet Trim.) I also had some scrap brass, that I used for cross pins. I should have sharpened one side of the brass prior to hammering through. I created a small crack on the rear pin/wood junction.

Some 5 Minute Epoxy, paper towels, and some clamps.....

IMAG3807.jpg


http://i1219.photobucket.com/albums/dd424/BlueLightRhyno/Fillet Knife/IMAG3807.jpg

IMAG3806.jpg


http://i1219.photobucket.com/albums/dd424/BlueLightRhyno/Fillet Knife/IMAG3806.jpg
 
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Rhyno

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I'd love to hear from someone with more "Metallurgy knowledge."

I don't know what I have created, "metal-wise."

The knife blank, after heat treat and temper, was difficult to drill, (with some HSS drill bits) but then I switched to my "Machinist Bits" and I was able to complete my holes and "cut chips."

1G915.jpg


http://shop.neobits.com/greenfield_...ll_bit_set_115pc_1_16_to_1_2in_1033966196.php

It sanded easily, and ground easily, but the sharpening stones were not "easily." :lol:

This is what I sharpened it with....

Lansky_Knife_Sharpening_Kit.jpg


http://lansky.com/files/7613/2176/2406/Lansky_Knife_Sharpening_Kit.jpg

But mine has a Black Box and a Green Plastic on one of the stones.

It'll slice through a Grocery Store News paper Ad, folded in half, like it's nothin'.........for whatever that means....:lol:

..
 
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Rhyno

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rlitman said:
Wait, why'd you heat treat it? The blade would have been heat treated before it was painted.
Click to expand...

The original blade was flexible, and I wanted to keep that trait, but move the hardness from the teeth tips to the new spot,.....the edge.

I took a guess......

Dewalt claims that this is a "BiMetal" blade. I'd imagine that just the tooth/teeth tips are "flash Hardened."

Once I made it through the teeth, it seemed to be "softer." Of course this is just "RedNeck Perception", though.:lol:

So at that point, I decided to use vegetable oil, versus a petroleum oil, because of less carbon introduction while quenching.

Some more "RedNeck Perception".......:lol:

I took a little bit of knowledge, and guessed.....

Time will tell, if it will hold an edge.
 
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Engine

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Looks great!
But...
...quenching a red-hot blade into a little bottle of oil while it is inside a can of sawdust could get interesting real quick...
 
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Rhyno

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After reading through a few things, and also evaluating what was done,......I decided to take a file to the blade and test it. Not surprising to some, the file easily removed material. I tested a spot on the spine and also where the blade meets the handle.

So,.....it is too soft.

I'm gonna keep it, for a short time, to test it.

But I'm also gonna make another.......hopefully, I'll have more success.
 
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Maxmartens

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The problem with the softness of the blade was the carbon content. blades that like are not designed to be hardened. The company use cheap mild steel that does not have a high enough carbon content to harden properly. You are off to a good start i would say but you need to use a better material. Try using an only file they have a high carbon content so high that they are heat treated when they come from the factor. You will need to soften it buy getting it to red hot a cooling is slowly in ashes or sand. Then work it to a knife shape then heat treat it you will get a much better result. But thats just my 2 cents!
 
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Rhyno

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Maxmartens said:
The problem with the softness of the blade was the carbon content. blades that like are not designed to be hardened. The company use cheap mild steel that does not have a high enough carbon content to harden properly. You are off to a good start i would say but you need to use a better material. Try using an only file they have a high carbon content so high that they are heat treated when they come from the factor. You will need to soften it buy getting it to red hot a cooling is slowly in ashes or sand. Then work it to a knife shape then heat treat it you will get a much better result. But thats just my 2 cents!
Click to expand...


Thanks....
 
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48RON54

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Rhyno, there is another guy on here that made a few awesome knives out of rasps/files........ I tried to search for the topic but of course the search function is meh at best IMO.........maybe someone else will chime in with the link to that topic?
 
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DoghouseForge

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As stated before the blades are a cheap mixture of whatever metal was priced best at that time. The teeth are of a highter carbon content, but the material that's left after you remove them isnt worth much...Lots of Chromium and molybendium alloys (soft and flexible).

I have had luck with files and rasp, but for what your looking for I would suggest a Band saw blade. A nice 1" resaw would be ideal. As long as you were patient with the grinding and kept it quenched below 400 deg or so, you wouldnt need to heat treat it at the end. The entire blade is the same steel, not just the teeth.

band saw blades are usualy -

L-6 tool steel

heres a link to the properties and tolerances you will need to know to work it.
As I mentioned you wont need to worry about this if you dont exceed the current temper when grinding it, but if your wanting to play around this is how you will need to do it.

http://www.simplytoolsteel.com/L-6-tool-steel-data-sheet.html



Files are typicall W-1 and W-2 high! carbon steel. Good for knives but in my opinion tricky to maintain the flexiblity. Better for thicker more ridgid blades its a fun steel to learn.

If you wanna learn more about using them the link in my signature for "blacksmithing Journal" will have it listed. Ive advanced the process several times since the beginning so skim through and you should find what you need.

I just replaced the resaw blade on my bandsaw (108") so I would gladly send you a few feet. Just message me with your address.

Welcome to the party...it becomes all consuming! :thumbup:

JP
 
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Rhyno

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DoghouseForge said:
As stated before the blades are a cheap mixture of whatever metal was priced best at that time. The teeth are of a highter carbon content, but the material that's left after you remove them isnt worth much...Lots of Chromium and molybendium alloys (soft and flexible).

I have had luck with files and rasp, but for what your looking for I would suggest a Band saw blade. A nice 1" resaw would be ideal. As long as you were patient with the grinding and kept it quenched below 400 deg or so, you wouldnt need to heat treat it at the end. The entire blade is the same steel, not just the teeth.

band saw blades are usualy -

L-6 tool steel

heres a link to the properties and tolerances you will need to know to work it.
As I mentioned you wont need to worry about this if you dont exceed the current temper when grinding it, but if your wanting to play around this is how you will need to do it.

http://www.simplytoolsteel.com/L-6-tool-steel-data-sheet.html



Files are typicall W-1 and W-2 high! carbon steel. Good for knives but in my opinion tricky to maintain the flexiblity. Better for thicker more ridgid blades its a fun steel to learn.

If you wanna learn more about using them the link in my signature for "blacksmithing Journal" will have it listed. Ive advanced the process several times since the beginning so skim through and you should find what you need.

I just replaced the resaw blade on my bandsaw (108") so I would gladly send you a few feet. Just message me with your address.

Welcome to the party...it becomes all consuming! :thumbup:

JP
Click to expand...

Thanks for coming forth and sharing some info. I have been following one of your threads and have pondered, as to how I could get your opinion.

Being that the blade, that I used, was cheap.....maybe $3 and change, I didn't really have high expectations. At least not with the final result. I did have expectations on my learning though.... :D

Not to be disrespectful,.....all of the chromium that I have been involved with, has been extremely hard. It's "recipe" is referred to as "Chrome #9." One of its uses, is in Valve Bodies at different Refining "Joints." I'm not sure how that refers to your reference, though.

While sanding and grinding, I did it without using gloves. That way, when it started to get warm, I could feel it and "somewhat" control the heat input.

I do have a few old files waiting for my "skills and knowledge" to catch up to my enthusiasm. :)

Thanks again, for finding this.. :)
 
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Rhyno

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48RON54 said:
Rhyno, there is another guy on here that made a few awesome knives out of rasps/files........ I tried to search for the topic but of course the search function is meh at best IMO.........maybe someone else will chime in with the link to that topic?
Click to expand...

Thanks for the possible direction. Maybe you are referring to DogHouseForge? I have been following one of his threads, too. It looks like JP has found this, though.

:)
 
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