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The Canted Castle - 26'x22' rescue and rebuild

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ModClean

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Hi everyone. I’ve been around the boards here for a while, but haven’t done much posting, as my garage space was pretty well complete and in use over the last several years. Our old place was a rental, so I refrained from any big projects. That will not be the case here! We bought this place back in August, and we expect to be here probably 6 or 7 years minimum, so we plan to do things right. Please excuse the general trashiness of many of these early photos—we’re still trying to get on top of all the **** the previous owners left behind.

I have been planning for my next shop (which is now this shop) for a long time. I hope to catalogue as much of my progress here as possible; hopefully some of it will provide ideas and motivation to others as so many others here have done the same for me. As you’ll see from the pictures, this story starts in a pretty sorry state. It’s clearly a building that has not seen a craftsman in a long, long time.

Here it is from the corner of our back deck. It’s 26’ deep by 22’ wide (old garage was 20’ deep by 16’ wide). The patio furniture there is sitting on an 8’x20’ concrete slab. The Boss says I cannot convert that (or even half of it) to garage or shed space because it would narrow the fully-fenced yard too much.

View media item 54625
Front. Cheap door, but it is 8’ tall, which is nice. I have a 40-year old trailered boat stored elsewhere that probably needs 7'+ clearance, so this will open up some much-needed maintenance options.
View media item 54626
Here’s a terrible shot of the back. When I took the photo I was aiming for that trashy little mini-slab in front (which I have since demolished and removed). However, you can also see the 4’x18’ slab running along the back wall. Now, this space I AM allowed to use. It will likely become an ~4’ x 16’ enclosed lean-to, with a compressor closet in the very back and the rest as garden shed storage.
View media item 54627
Now, if you were looking closely at the first two pictures--and title--you may have noticed that the structure has a certain… casual posture, shall we say? Here is a 4’ level set plumb at the main door left trim.
View media item 54628
It is the same story on the other side: the whole structure is leaning sideways at least 3” over the 8’ height.

Front-back lean is a different story. Main door left is plumb
View media item 54630
Main door right is… not so plumb. At least 4” lean.
View media item 54629
Two big issues in this next shot. 1.) That front trim piece is trying to hide the severe collapse of the header (which I’ve not examined yet, but must be all kinds of incorrect to have allowed that to happen). 2.) When you look at the roof… you can’t see it. The corrugated metal roof (and 2 layers of shingle under it) have negative overhang; the double-stacked 1x4 trim has almost 1” entirely uncovered. It’s the same in the back.
View media item 54631
For giggles I’ll also share one of the many “structures” I removed from inside the garage upon moving in. Can you guess what it is?
View media item 54632
If you guessed anything where the above picture would represent even a semi-optimal design, you’re wrong. It was a shelf.
View media item 54633
So, I will end it there for now. Later I’ll show some of the other atrocities along with their respective corrections. I’ve already done significant electrical revamping—I’ll post that soon. Getting the structure sitting plumb and level will probably have to be next, as it is preventing so many other things from getting started.
 
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ModClean

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Tim the Tool Man's POWER!!

Electrical... Aww Geeze, what some people will do. It appears that, originally, the garage service ran to the house through a buried 2" PVC conduit. And that was great, until at some point the house service was moved over 10 feet.

At this point, someone decided that for that 10', conduit would be eschewed, in favor of direct burial. And the wire they decided to bury was 12-2. :sad: Oh, the humanity.

So, not a ton of photos here, but original garage service looked like this:
View media item 54634
Then,
  • dug a 10' trench
  • Ran 10' conduit to link up with existing
  • ran 2x CAT6a data cable inside 1/2" LFNC
  • pulled 2-2-4 al, bare ground, and 1/2" LFNC inside main conduit
  • drove 2 ground rods at garage
  • installed 125a 12-space QO Main lug and Eaton disconnect

So now I have this:
View media item 54635Haven't decided where to route that LFNC yet. The CAT6a it's carrying will be used to make a 2GB/s trunk line to the house network.

In the middle of all this I corrected the extreme crookedness of the PVC rise at the garage end. The rectangular hole is where the wiring used to pass through. The circular hole is where I now pass through my conduit. Somebody really missed the mark on "vertical". I dug up the PVC and heated it until I could twist it enough to come out of the ground straight.
View media item 54636
It was a PITA; pulled the 2-2-4 and LFNC at the same time, through 360 degrees of bends! But it's done. Circuits to be wired up later will be:
  • 40a 240v to compressor closet
  • 50a 240v to 240v outlets
  • 20a 120v to multipurpose outlets, x2
  • 20a 120v dedicated to electronics workbench
  • 15a 120/240v to lighting

I'm going to try harder at taking pictures! Though I will confess I already missed taking the most interesting shot of my next post...
 
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ModClean

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Concrete anchors are for pansies

Now we get into the real meat and potatoes... and winching. Today I started in on the structure itself. Oh boy--close examination was not for the faint of heart. I have learned that creativity knows no bounds, especially in those who don't allow themselves bounded by things like level, square, and structurally sound.

I did not start in on any rafter/roof tie work yet, but I had to share these two photos. It was hard to capture well, but I'm looking at the ties that were raised to accommodate the 8' main door. First, they were raised significantly more than they should have been. Second, their raising was so... creative. The builder/artist managed to splay them at 5 different angles, managing to avoid "level" each time. Level is soooo over-done, folks.
View media item 54694
View media item 54693
While is was up there I also determined that the header over the main door was nothing more than 2x 2x4's laid flat--exactly what you would expect if there were no door there at all! It should be 2x 2x12's or better. But, that's a project for another day.


The bottom right and top left corners of the back wall each got a dose of these.
View media item 54691Those are 3/8" lags. It's pretty lightweight hardware for the task of righting a building, but that was my intention; I want the bolts to rip out before anything breaks for real.

Now we start winching
View media item 54696
Not surprisingly, I got some good movement right away, but then it started to really tighten up. I will be coming back and tightening it over several days, probably. In the meantime, I moved to the front wall.

At the front--in addition to both sides leaning left--the right side of the wall is leaning back and is twisted at the bottom. Extending the right-side sill plate would line you up about 10" in front of the left wall. Which brings me to one of my other big discoveries: NO WHERE is this building anchored to the concrete! I could not find a single fastener through a sill plate anywhere!
View media item 54697
I marked where it sits now. Want to move this back about 1.25" while leaving the corner where it is.
View media item 54695
Lack of fasteners made it easy. I jacked up under the opening and slid it back. Doesn't really look like it here but it's moved 1.25".
View media item 54690I must apologize for not taking a picture of my jacking setup. It was ridiculously ghetto looking. A 90lb floor jack sitting on top of 2 chimney cinder blocks pressing up a 5' 2x12 LVL beam. But it got it done.
 
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jgschroeder99

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It's nice to see buildings fixed instead of torn down! Does the floor extend outside of the building, or is that another slab? Since the building isn't anchored to the concrete, might want to at least get a treated sill plate under the walls...
 
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ModClean

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The floor does not extend outside the building; both the side and rear slabs are separate pours.

Yes, I've thought about a treated sill plate as well. There are some places where it has significant rot, occasionally even spreading to the very bottoms of the studs. I've considered supporting one wall at a time on jacks, cutting off the bottom 3.5", and running a treated 4x4 on the bottom. This would be a lot of work that I really don't want to do, but it would be for the best.
Not sure when or even if that project would happen, but if anyone has some other methods or resources, I'd be happy to hear them!
 
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Back wall is approaching square. Down to less than 1" total lean, so better than 2/3rds of the way there.

View media item 54718
Slow going overall, though. Aside from the one wall I jacked up, I need a come-along for pretty much every step. May have to buy me a second one so I can work elsewhere while waiting on one wall to shift.
 
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Thanks, Basher. Yes, slow indeed!

I did pick up two more cheapie come-alongs at the store... Hopefully they won't explode in my hands--they are not reassuring compared to the nice one I've been using! I need to make some decisions on the rafter tie framing and then track down the necessary lumber, but then I should be able to attack the ties with two winches while the third winch is tilting walls.
 
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There is a post here by a man that jacked his whole garage about 18" higher (maybe more) and built a fresh bottom sill / knee wall to set it down on. He was 'raising the roof' to make roof for a lift. His work was simple and direct, some lift beams, bottle jacks and cribbing. His work is pretty much exactly what you want to do.
You could ready jack up the building one side at a time and easily do what you desire, setting a new treated sill. Then bolt it all down to the slab when you are done, and re-align things. In fact if you want to do that you might want to stop your straightening efforts until you've changed out the sill.
 
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Hey Rayra, thanks for the link. That is one end of the spectrum of what I'm considering, with leaving the sill alone entirely on the other end.

I'm currently leaning towards installing treated 4x4 as a new sill. This would have the advantage of being able to simply wedge posts up under the rafter ties along the wall, cut, replace, knock posts out. It wouldn't even require jacking and would keep the building square the entire time. Also has the advantage of only needing to get at one wall at a time; more flexible in working around all the **** currently strewn about.

On the other end, I could lift up the whole building and do whatever I wanted with the sill (I would go concrete block, probably). This is pretty much 100% added work and expense over the 4x4 option (still have to cut and replace anyway), but of course would have the benefit of being able to increase the overall height. I'm entirely fine with the current height, but I'm not sure what I will end up doing to the floor (severely cracked and uneven); some of my schemes would be pretty thick, at which point extra height may be nice. To my current thinking though, it just wouldn't be worth it.

In any case, I want the walls square and properly braced against both racking (sway bracing) and bowing (rafter ties) before I start lifting it off the ground in any significant fashion! So, I'm going after the walls and ties for now--in the meantime the sill plans are constantly rolling around in my brain.
 
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Most people don't think of this when squaring up an old building. When you have it square and your ceiling joists in place run 2"x4" braces on top. They should originate in the corners and run at a 45 degree angle to the joists. Even better is a ceiling made out of plywood or OSB. This type of reinforcement will keep the top plates of the walls square. If the top plates can not move from a rectangle to a diamond shape the walls will have a hard time racking. Good luck!
 
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Bib Overalls

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PS. Can you put your location in your profile? You don't want Lousiana specific answers to your questions if you live in Michigan.

PPS. What size conduit did you run your wire through?
 
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ModClean

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Bib, if I'm picturing your suggestion correctly (big "X" brace across top plates?) it would only affect asymmetrical racking? Am I picturing it wrong? Typically opposite walls move relatively symmetrically. In any case, I have plans to leave cathedral ceilings in part of the space, so horizontal x-bracing would detract from that!

The main problem leading to racking in older buildings of this sort is that there is no triangulation in the walls themselves; the interior is often bare, and the wood siding provides very little sway bracing. As a wall sways each piece of siding is able to slide across the adjacent pieces. When I am done squaring it up, the walls will get metal sway bracing, and eventually both interior and exterior sheathing as well--I will be unconcerned with any future racking at that point.

Conduit was 2".
 
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"Racking" usually means the top plate shifting forward or backward relative to the sill plate, but (more or less) in the same plane. 1x6" boards. let into the studs and nailed, were the traditional bracing running at 45° from the corner top plate down to the sill plate in each corner.


Going back to a question I asked before. Is the floor and foundation level ?

Using a tape measure, make a mark on each stud 12" (or 24" or 48") up from the floor all the way around. Then using a water level (check YouTube), starting at one corner as you reference, check all of your marks. If there is a difference, mark it with a different color. less than 1/2" difference is what you want. About 1" you really need to do something about it.
 
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theoldwizard1

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ModClean said:
I have plans to leave cathedral ceilings in part of the space, ...
Click to expand...

You have to use rafter ties (1/3 the way up the distance between the top plate and the ridge board) or collar ties (2/3 the way up the distance between the top plate and the ridge board) or the walls will push out.

As you replace those collar ties, carefully measure the distance from top plate to top plate across the width of the garage at each rafter. The point of a rafter/collar tie is to maintain a uniform distance across the space.
 
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ModClean

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Old Wizard; the floor is not level in all parts. This will be at least partially addressed when/if I address the sill plate.

theoldwizard1 said:
You have to use rafter ties (1/3 the way up the distance between the top plate and the ridge board) or collar ties (2/3 the way up the distance between the top plate and the ridge board) or the walls will push out.

As you replace those collar ties, carefully measure the distance from top plate to top plate across the width of the garage at each rafter. The point of a rafter/collar tie is to maintain a uniform distance across the space.
Click to expand...

Rafter ties are indeed for tensioning against the outward forces created by roof loading, however, collar beams are not intended to serve the same purpose and are not a substitute! If they were interchangeable, there would be no reason for the bottom 1/3 (rafter) and top 1/3 (collar) zones--a tie at 1/2 would be just as good. The reality is that they are designated to two different rafter heights because they serve two different purposes which are mechanically advantaged in different places. The crooked ties I pictured above are effectively collar beams/ties. Not surprisingly, the side walls are bowed out and the ridgeline is sagging at that location, as nothing else was done to assume the rafter ties' load.

The fix above the main door will be simple; winch the upper walls back together and install longer and lower ties within the acceptable height (bottom 1/3 of rafter, as mentioned). The cathedral ceiling portion will require a ridge beam, as there is no other practical way to absorb the side-loading that would otherwise be produced. AND, beams have another purpose that just about everyone here on the Journal knows and loves, especially when they're steel...:pimpflash
 
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ModClean

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Just placed an order at the yard for all the rafter lumber--going to be about two weeks. In the meantime, I plan to start winching on the side walls, start preparing the rafters for the ridge beam, and try to track down a local beam source. Need to get quite a bit of work done inside the house too though, so things may slow down over the next few weeks.
 
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ModClean

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Well, more issues today, not surprisingly. I wanted to get anchors in at the bottom of the front, right corner, as this is where I need to anchor to pull the right side wall and the front wall straight (then straightening is done). But, when I pulled off the trim boards, things were not looking so healthy...

View media item 54742
View media item 54743
Real bad rot at the bottom, then again about 5' up. Sill plate should pretty much be lined up with the bottom corner of that newer piece of siding on the bottom right of the picture, but it's just a void... So, now I'm going to need to replace the corner studs and the sill plates for the right front and right side walls before I continue with the racking. I'm just getting over a cold though and didn't have the energy to tackle that today.

Instead I took down the garage opener (in the way of proper rafter ties) and found more fun absurdities. The opener was only anchored at the front wall. It appears that the rafter tie it's sitting on here was made specifically to support the opener--however the opener was not attached to the tie, it's just resting on it!

View media item 54747
They also didn't (of course) put the front bracket on straight. And the opener was so far out of adjustment that the carriage would slam into the opener at full "up" travel and jam the whole mechanism. I got it all straightened out though and it will now go up on Craigslist. If I ever do want an opener (probably won't) I'll go jackshaft.

View media item 54744
Also got plates on most of the rafters at the ridges. The rafters over the back half of the building will be supported by ridge beam in the future. This can introduce some tension loading at the ridge joint, so I wanted some bracing against that, so they got plates on both sides. The rest got plates on one side, at least 10 nails in each plate.

From this...
View media item 54745
to this...
View media item 54748
Ahhh, shiny. Also started putting some plates from rafter ties to top plates. Not expecting a change in loading here, but after everything else I'm finding, everything I can't see is suspect, including these joints. The plates help give me that warm, fuzzy feeling, even though they won't take any load unless something shifts.
View media item 54746

Tomorrow, if I have the energy, I may attack the sill plates. All the heavy stuff is against that wall though :(
 
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You'll want it all tied together anyway, before you try taking the weight off the sills to replace them. And it's starting to look like the paint is the only thing holding that building up ;)

Boy if it wasn't for the money it would be easier to demolish and build anew, than rectify all the faults in that thing. Might have to do some triage and figure what you HAVE to replace, because once you start chasing one deficiency it just leads to another and another and another. Sills, corners, rafters / truss bottoms. Afraid to ask what condition the roofing is in. Any mold trouble?
 
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ModClean

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It's not as bad as all that, though it feels like it at times! Rotting is mainly just occurring where you would expect; at the sills, corners, and windows. Other than that, the structural wood is all pretty solid. While the roof needs more overhang, it is not leaking detect-ably anywhere. And no mold.

My feeling is that the building was probably built to fairly typical standards for its time, which leads to the corner and sill rot (windows were put in later), and the racking. I think that everything else is someone other than the builder coming along and mucking things up. (I'm sure the original main door was smaller, which means whoever installed the current door cut out the original header and raised the rafter ties). I won't be surprised if whenever I get to the roof I find that someone hacked back the original overhang for some reason.
 
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ModClean said:
Here it is from the corner of our back deck. It’s 26’ deep by 22’ wide (old garage was 20’ deep by 16’ wide). The patio furniture there is sitting on an 8’x20’ concrete slab. The Boss says I cannot convert that (or even half of it) to garage or shed space because it would narrow the fully-fenced yard too much. If I’m being completely objective… She’s right. Dang it.

...

Here’s a terrible shot of the back. When I took the photo I was aiming for that trashy little mini-slab in front (which I have since demolished and removed). However, you can also see the 4’x18’ slab running along the back wall. Now, this space I AM allowed to use. It will likely become an ~4’ x 16’ enclosed lean-to, with a compressor closet in the very back and the rest as garden shed storage.
Click to expand...

Since you have found out that the structure isn't tied down, how about moving the entire thing forward 10 feet or so, and making your 4'x16' lean-to a nice 14'x16' shop extension instead? :thumbup:

Alternately, you could move the garage backward 4', and build 10-12 feet or so of new garage onto the front. That would give you a great opportunity for a new garage door with everything square... And it would look nice from the street too. :thumbup:
 
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theoldwizard1

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ModClean said:
From this...
View media item 54745
to this...
View media item 54748
Ahhh, shiny.
Click to expand...
Very unusual construction ! I think I would have FIRST checked the top plate all around for "square" (measure from diagonal corners, checking for the same length). If you have to pull them into square you are going to have a problem with those plates in there.

Also, addition to those nailer plates I would have cut so 2x6s to the exact spacing between the rafter and cut the one edge to fit the peak and nailed them in.

ModClean said:
Also started putting some plates from rafter ties to top plates. Not expecting a change in loading here, but after everything else I'm finding, everything I can't see is suspect, including these joints. The plates help give me that warm, fuzzy feeling, even though they won't take any load unless something shifts.
View media item 54746
Click to expand...
Again, very unusual construction ! Cutting those rafters horizontal greatly reduces their load carrying capacity.
 
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fergus

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I'd second the use of rafter ties. Though, probably I'd use a 1x4 or 1x6 since that's what is typically used. I used 2x4s on my garage for rafter ties and regretted it - heavier to hold, a little harder to pull them up real tight against the rafters.
 
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ModClean

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fergus said:
I like your style dude. You made this look easy. It's looking good.
Click to expand...
Thanks Fergus, that means a lot from someone who's been there. I've been through your first derelict thread a couple times though, and you were starting off from a much more difficult position than I am!

Off-Street Parking said:
Since you have found out that the structure isn't tied down, how about moving the entire thing forward 10 feet or so, and making your 4'x16' lean-to a nice 14'x16' shop extension instead? :thumbup:

Alternately, you could move the garage backward 4', and build 10-12 feet or so of new garage onto the front. That would give you a great opportunity for a new garage door with everything square... And it would look nice from the street too. :thumbup:
Click to expand...
Dangerous thinking Off-Street, but I like where your head's at :thumbup:. To be honest I had not considered those options and you had me scheming for a bit. But, ultimately a big shift wouldn't really fit into the layout of the house and yard very well, and a small shift just wouldn't be worth the effort to me. I don't think... Damn you...


theoldwizard1 said:
Very unusual construction ! I think I would have FIRST checked the top plate all around for "square" (measure from diagonal corners, checking for the same length). If you have to pull them into square you are going to have a problem with those plates in there.

Also, addition to those nailer plates I would have cut so 2x6s to the exact spacing between the rafter and cut the one edge to fit the peak and nailed them in.

Again, very unusual construction ! Cutting those rafters horizontal greatly reduces their load carrying capacity.
Click to expand...

These plates have no bearing on the top plate distortion you're describing. The rafter cuts at the top plate are a concern; unfortunately reasonable fixes for that are limited; I'm still scheming on that one!

fergus said:
I'd second the use of rafter ties. Though, probably I'd use a 1x4 or 1x6 since that's what is typically used. I used 2x4s on my garage for rafter ties and regretted it - heavier to hold, a little harder to pull them up real tight against the rafters.
Click to expand...

Don't worry guys, due to the way the rafters are cut at the top plate, the torsional load is practically non-existent. Even if they sat full height at the top plates, the metal plating I put on at the ridge would be more than enough to absorb it (rafters in torsion introduce tension at bottom of ridge joint, which the plates cross). The ridge beam will introduce the potential for new, stronger torsion loads though, so in the area of the future ridge beam I will be installing torsion bracing, however I don't intend to brace the rafters that will just have rafter ties.
 
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theoldwizard1

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ModClean said:
These plates have no bearing on the top plate distortion you're describing.
Click to expand...

Sure they do ! I may not be explaining it well.

Imagine slicing off the roof at the top plate. You want to check if all 4 corners are square. Measure the distance across the diagonals. If they are equal, it is square and likely none of the walls have NOT pushed out at the top.

If you installed a cable with turnbuckles on the long diagonal with the roof in place and start shortening that diagonal and the rafters are firmly attached to the top plate, the rafters are going to want to move. That joint where the 2 rafters **** up against each other WILL move. Typical construction would have a 1x6 or 1x8 running down the length of the roof peak. For one thing, it gives you something for the rafters to better nail into.
 
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ModClean

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Old Wizard, "move" is a vague term. You'll need to be specific to have any chance of convincing me.

Scenario 1:
  • Walls have bowed out at top plate due to lack of rafter tie tension.
  • If both side walls bowed the same amount, top plates are still "square" corner to corner.
  • If side walls bowed asymmetrically, top plate is no longer a parallelogram (not a square or diamond). Doesn't matter to the ridge joint though.
  • To allow (cause) this motion, rafters have collapsed/flattened at the ridge-line
  • Essentially the top of the ridge joint has gone into increased compression, the bottom towards tension.
  • IF the collapse is so great as to overcome deformation at the top of the ridge joint and actually try to gap the ridge joint at the bottom, plates are NOT going to stop that. You're talking about a lever arm the length of the rafter under the weight of the roof being stopped by a plate with a lever arm of maybe 4-6" (similar to why collar beams are not a substitute for rafter ties)

Scenario 2:
  • Rafter ties are in place, top plates have not bowed.
  • Top plate has moved to a "diamond" shape due to lack of triangulation IN THE WALLS
  • Nothing interesting has happened to the rafters except that the joint with the top plate has been torqued out of square. They are still the same length bottom-to-bottom and are still parallel with the corresponding top plates. They are triangles along for the ride.

Now, scenario 2 assumes that--like my garage--the roof is boarded, not sheathed. If the roof was sheathed in large panel, then that roof would help resist asymmetrical (diamond) racking--but not symmetrical (still square)-- racking of the walls to a far greater extent. However, that would still be independent of the ridge joint plates. To suggest that plates at the ridge joint are a reinforcement against racking is simply not true.
 
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Chandler, AZ (from west NE)
lLoks a lot like my first 24x24 detached garage. It was rotated 4" off the slab on each corner, with anchor bolts, too! The rafters also had no ridge beam and was sagging 3" in the center with the tops of the side walls pushed out accordingly. I pulled the side walls into square and installed 2x4 ceiling joists at each set of rafters, before jacking each pair of rafters up into level, plated both sides with a notch for a 2x6 ridge beam and added a vertical 2x4 below the centers ans a couple of diagonals to the midpoint of each side, kind of making a roof truss with an offset lower. Probably not to code, but the roof is still straight 38 years later. The building was covered with Stucco and I didn't have any way to jack it up at the time and rotate it square to the slab, so I just poured a sort of new footing all around the sides of the existing slab with rebar tied into the original concrete. I was a lot less informed in 1979 and there was not a GJ to help me through the process; not even a Home Depot, lol( We did have a new Pay'n'Pak though.)

You've made a great start on salvaging this structure and it seem like you have all the right fixes laid out befor you. Good luck continuing the project, keep us informed of your progress and thanks for sharing!
 
O

Off-Street Parking

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 1, 2015
Messages
351
Location
Midwest
ModClean said:
Dangerous thinking Off-Street, but I like where your head's at :thumbup:. To be honest I had not considered those options and you had me scheming for a bit. But, ultimately a big shift wouldn't really fit into the layout of the house and yard very well, and a small shift just wouldn't be worth the effort to me. I don't think... Damn you...
Click to expand...

:D:D:D

So what if I also mentioned that your neighbors garage looks longer and/or further forward, and adding the extension to yours would just even things out? Or that a larger garage would increase your property values? :D

Fitting into the layout of the house and yard is easy... You're moving the garage entrance closer to the house, so it's less of a distance to carry groceries in the rain. And you could make it really nice in the weather if you added a carport onto that front extension as well. Plus it would be less driveway to shovel in the winter, and you know you hate shoveling. :D
 
C

CNGsaves

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 26, 2012
Messages
13,233
Location
KS and OK
^ ^ ^ +1 to seriously consider Off-Street idea to extend garage up front. BIG garage = Good!

Since you have to re-do header anyway . . and front "walls" beyond garage door are shot . . . tear that **** out and rebuild entire front on new slab poured that gives garage door a level seal. Also I like the "notch" in finishing concrete so garage door sits just below level of garage floor so that leaves/dirt/snow can't blow into garage past the bottom seal of garage door.

. . . . . YES . . . . Damn Him . . . . . but it's Great Idea !!! :thumbup:

I'd also scrap idea of pressure treated 4x4 as your sill plate. Instead put in concrete stub wall after you cut off bottom rotted sill and 2x4's . . . ie AFTER you've tweaked and pulled and strained and come-a-longed the thing back into square and plum !!! New treated sill plate would sit on top on concrete stub wall and you'd never have rot problem again down at ground level.

By concrete stub wall, I just mean those narrow/long concrete blocks that are slightly wider than 2x4's. You can drill holes into slab and epoxy in anchor bolts that would go up through concrete blocks and through your new sill plate. It will be tougher to do after-the-fact with building held up, however you're tackling pretty tough problem already !! ;)

Keep pics and progress coming. LOVE these threads that save/improve existing garage!! :thumbup:
 
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OP
M

ModClean

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 4, 2013
Messages
120
Location
Americus, GA
Off-Street Parking said:
:D:D:D

So what if I also mentioned that your neighbors garage looks longer and/or further forward, and adding the extension to yours would just even things out? Or that a larger garage would increase your property values? :D

Fitting into the layout of the house and yard is easy... You're moving the garage entrance closer to the house, so it's less of a distance to carry groceries in the rain. And you could make it really nice in the weather if you added a carport onto that front extension as well. Plus it would be less driveway to shovel in the winter, and you know you hate shoveling. :D
Click to expand...

See, this is why some people have to stop coming on these boards; too many bad influences!

CNGsaves said:
^ ^ ^ +1 to seriously consider Off-Street idea to extend garage up front. BIG garage = Good!

Since you have to re-do header anyway . . and front "walls" beyond garage door are shot . . . tear that **** out and rebuild entire front on new slab poured that gives garage door a level seal. Also I like the "notch" in finishing concrete so garage door sits just below level of garage floor so that leaves/dirt/snow can't blow into garage past the bottom seal of garage door.

. . . . . YES . . . . Damn Him . . . . . but it's Great Idea !!! :thumbup:
Click to expand...

See? Enablers everywhere...;)

Really the issues are time and money (aren't they always?). I can't justify putting additional funds into this just to increase the size, especially when it's already so much more space than I used to have (and I got a lot done in the old, smaller shop). The other issue is time; I want to get the structure done so I can move forward on other things. As it is, I know the overall structure has been standing a long time, but I don't know how long ago someone screwed up the rafter ties. I'd really prefer this thing comes a long way before seeing any snow load.

CNGsaves said:
I'd also scrap idea of pressure treated 4x4 as your sill plate. Instead put in concrete stub wall after you cut off bottom rotted sill and 2x4's . . . ie AFTER you've tweaked and pulled and strained and come-a-longed the thing back into square and plum !!!
Click to expand...

Too late! Pictures to follow soon... Originally I planned to get it square and braced before I started lifting anything, but I can't really pull it square until I fix that rot at the front right corner.
 
OP
M

ModClean

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 4, 2013
Messages
120
Location
Americus, GA
Got a pretty late start today--didn't get as far as I wanted, but still got a lot done. Guy from Craigslist already came and got that door opener out of my way!

Here's where I started. As I said before, lots of heavy stuff against that right wall, including workbench and the 400+lb Quincy hiding back in the corner. The place is a walled-in disaster, at this point.
View media item 54765(When we first moved in, I thought that that track lighting was a bit silly in a garage. Now I'm not so sure. While it would be great to have great light everywhere, it is really nice to be able to aim spot lighting at an area)

After hauling everything towards the center, I ran some 2x4 supports along the studs just under the top plates. Then a cut a 2x4 support at each stud to be about 2" longer than floor-to-support 2x4 distance. This is done all along the right sidewall, the right front wall next to the main door, and 8' of the back wall.

View media item 54766
After I go up and down the line several times, taking a mallet to the bottom of the supports, I have the structure lifting. Isn't leverage great? The right 8' of the slab is cracked and slanted down towards the side, so my intention was to lift this side of the garage about 1.5". So, it will be 1.5" taller on the right than the left (in relation to the floor), but the top plates will now be level (or more nearly so). If in the future I level the floor, everything will be peachy.

View media item 54768
Also, I have to apologize for my gross exaggeration earlier; I said that there were no anchors to the concrete anywhere. Turns out that wasn't the case--there was this guy right in the middle of the side wall. Didn't see it camouflaged by all the rot around it...
View media item 54767
Anyways, so the sidewall is now 1.5" high, the back wall is 1.5" high at the corner, but just floating at 8' in, and the front wall is 1.5" high at the corner, about .5" high at the door (before I started I measured it being 1/2" shorter than the left side).

Then I went and marked 5" from the floor all around and started cutting. Look Ma, no sills!
View media item 54769
New sills are AC2 4x4 with standard 2x4 on top. I laid sill gasket also, 'cause while the sealing of this place is laughable at this point, hopefully that won't always be the case!. I got 32' of new sill laid, still have to do the back corner (below photo) and the front wall. Here you can see the back wall. Notice the siding is no longer parallel to the slanted floor.
View media item 54770
During the process I had to remove the access door that has been screwed shut since we moved in. I don't know why--there didn't seem to be anything mechanically wrong with it. If I'm being picky though... I don't want a interior-grade hollow wood door as my garage access. So once things are all squared up a new door will go in.
View media item 54773Those two dark spots are screws running into the frame... Why? I dunno, and I'm learning not to ask...

So, have quite a few non-garage things to get done tomorrow, but hopefully I can get this done (yes, garage is still suspended!) and get back to cranking towards square again.
 
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