How Did You Trim & Seal Your Folding Attic Ladder

DonPowers · Dec 12, 2015

I'm in the process of installing a folding attic ladder in the garage. Went through the instructions and they are fairly straight forward. What is missing is trim and sealing ideas. Looked on line and didn't see anything that stood out as looking good and functional

The ladder that I have is the Louisville aluminum, AA2210.

The trusses are currently exposed in the area that I want the ladder. I will be installing strapping and sheetrock on the ceiling.

First question I have to self is: Do I want the door flush to the ceiling with a trim strip around the outside? Or: Do I want to have the door flush with the strapping then glue /screw sheetrock to the door to make it flush with ceiling.

Second Question to self: Do I want to put trim on the door so it overlaps the ceiling?

As far as insulating, will most likely make box with foam cover to insulate.

What have you done for trim, sealing air leaks and insulating?

Do you have photos that you could share?

Thanks

Don

sublime68charger · Dec 12, 2015

Don, Im in this boat as well just just posting up so that I can find this thread to reference when I need to!

Good luck hoping you get some awesome replays so that I benifeit as well As!

BMW Rider · Dec 13, 2015

I have a similar attic ladder but wooden not aluminum. I built a raised frame above the ladder opening and installed a custom built insulated door with weather stripping. I couldn't figure out any way to seal and insulate the ladder itself without imparing it's function. I just have to climb up the ladder and then push open the second hatch to gain access to the attic. I rigged up an old hatchback lift cylinder to hold it open.

DonPowers · Dec 13, 2015

Thanks BMW Rider, might be able to do something like that using the trusses as the frame. I saved a couple cylinders from an old hot tub cover that might work.

DC73 · Dec 13, 2015

DonPowers said:
Do I want the door flush to the ceiling with a trim strip around the outside? Or: Do I want to have the door flush with the strapping then glue /screw sheetrock to the door to make it flush with ceiling.

What have you done for trim, sealing air leaks and insulating?

Most of the ones I've seen have the door flush to the ceiling and trimmed like an interior door.

Would the sheetrock idea make the door too heavy for the springs thereby letting it always sag open? If you go this route, consider light weight sheetrock and test it before permanently adhering the sheetrock.

I built a foam box for mine out of polyiso foam board insulation and foil tape. I used generic weatherstrip on the door to seal the opening.

DC

NotV8 · Dec 13, 2015

I just pick up the same one yesterday, will be installing it today and will be watching this thread for ideas...

DonPowers · Dec 13, 2015

I'm framing it in today and decided to go flush with the ceiling, mostly because I don't want to deal with having to make extension jams for the frame and don't see where it would help getting a tight seal anyways, at least without a lot of ********.

With regard to sealing, I have some left over garage door weather strip. Once the stairs are up and adjusted, will see if these strips can be used.

coljar · Dec 13, 2015

I have the same setup in my house. HD sells an insulation tent that goes over top of the fold up stairs. This works great if you're not up there very often, which we aren't, but you might want to check it out. It works great for my needs.

CNGsaves · Dec 13, 2015

OP . . . you're on track with the flush mount and trim around opening with molding like a door.

+1 to use weather stripping to seal the lip where attic ladder closes.

Those foam domes/tents are good idea and you can use framing to create another lip where you can use weather stripping for good seal. Quite a few good videos on YouTube.

DonPowers · Dec 13, 2015

Today I finalized the stair location, put in the headers and mocked up ceiling woth scrap strapping and sheetrock.

Tomorrow, or the next day I'll hoist the stairs up using a sheetrock lift and fasten it in.

TerryH · Dec 13, 2015

We have an Attic Tent Cover on ours. Works great. Made a huge difference and also helps keep the blown in insulation from falling out the hole every time I have to get in the attic.

hayhauler71 · Dec 13, 2015

This is the only pic i have of mine. also has felt seal on ladder side

nafterclifen · Dec 13, 2015

Here is my Louisville 30x60 Big Boy...

DonPowers · Dec 16, 2015

Installed the ladder today. When I got it in place, found that some of the predrilled holes were below my 2x6 frame. Since they went through a steel bracket in the ladder frame, ended up installing it flush with the truss. I can always make an extension piece, kinda like an extension jam on windows, with my table saw. Was trying to avoid this, oh well it is what it is.

soapii · Dec 16, 2015

My Werner came with an insulated door and weather strip around the perimeter. Outside the door I just used some window casing to trim around the opening/drywall.

--Joe

RickP · Dec 16, 2015

My attic stairs have lightweight lauan plywood for a cover, painted white, with regular door trim around it. I covered it with an insulated plywood box, hinged on one end, with a rope/pulley to raise it.

DonPowers · Dec 19, 2015

Ended up using red seam tape for now to seal between the ladder frame and trusses. Will seal the void with non expanding spray foam when I get a can.

Before installing the vapor barrier, I doubled up the header on the hinge side.

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pattenp · Dec 19, 2015

The main thing I wanted was to have the pull down stair door to have a better fire rating being in the garage so I covered it with 5/8" sheetrock. I used brickmolding to trim it out because of the added thickness of the sheetrock.

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1233user · Dec 21, 2015

pattenp said:
The main thing I wanted was to have the pull down stair door to have a better fire rating being in the garage so I covered it with 5/8" sheetrock. I used brickmolding to trim it out because of the added thickness of the sheetrock.

View media item 55713

What did you do to compensate for the extra weight of the 5/8" sheetrock working against the springs that hold the door closed?

rharman · Dec 5, 2022

pattenp said:
The main thing I wanted was to have the pull down stair door to have a better fire rating being in the garage so I covered it with 5/8" sheetrock. I used brickmolding to trim it out because of the added thickness of the sheetrock.

View media item 55713

1233user said:
What did you do to compensate for the extra weight of the 5/8" sheetrock working against the springs that hold the door closed?

@pattenp - I just came across this old thread via a Google search. I'm planning on adding 5/8" Type X drywall over my door as well. Asked Werner Ladder Co. about heavy-duty springs or struts and they were of no help.

Just curious - same question as @1233user - How did you compensate for the extra weight? I'm thinking of ordering another pair of the standard springs and doubling up or, perhaps, adding a chain bolt similar to this.

Thanks.

pattenp · Dec 6, 2022

I didn't do anything. The stock springs handled the weight of the added sheet rock with no problem. Can't say that would be the case with every pull down attic stairs.

kaymccampbell · Dec 6, 2022

When I've done it, the springs were plenty over-designed for the stairs and a sheet of drywall.

rharman · Dec 6, 2022

Well, I guess I'll give it a go and see. Werner does offer heavy-duty gas struts for a different ladder series and notes that you need these if you sheet the door - go figure.

My plan is to cut the drywall about 2"-3" oversize on 3 sides and frame it with 5/8" aluminum C-Channel to seal the edges - all 4 sides. On the hinged end, I obviously can't extend beyond the framed out edge. Will probably put a piece of flat bar aluminum or something up as close to that end as possible to minimize any wood exposure. The frame-out is about 26"x55".

If it's too heavy, I guess I can go with the double springs or the latch. Have to see what the movement dynamics are.
I'm estimating the additional weight at about 22#.

I had thought of hanging (via corner braces) something like 1" aluminum angle or use C-Channel to make a track and just have a sliding panel that I could push back. Seems like that's getting into way over-engineered.

Also thought about hinging the cover on one of the long edges. Then, I still need a latch mechanism and would likely need to release it and swing down while on a ladder. Seems a bit dodgy.

larry4406 · Dec 28, 2024

rharman said:
Well, I guess I'll give it a go and see. Werner does offer heavy-duty gas struts for a different ladder series and notes that you need these if you sheet the door - go figure.

My plan is to cut the drywall about 2"-3" oversize on 3 sides and frame it with 5/8" aluminum C-Channel to seal the edges - all 4 sides. On the hinged end, I obviously can't extend beyond the framed out edge. Will probably put a piece of flat bar aluminum or something up as close to that end as possible to minimize any wood exposure. The frame-out is about 26"x55".

If it's too heavy, I guess I can go with the double springs or the latch. Have to see what the movement dynamics are.
I'm estimating the additional weight at about 22#.

I had thought of hanging (via corner braces) something like 1" aluminum angle or use C-Channel to make a track and just have a sliding panel that I could push back. Seems like that's getting into way over-engineered.

Also thought about hinging the cover on one of the long edges. Then, I still need a latch mechanism and would likely need to release it and swing down while on a ladder. Seems a bit dodgy.

Holy thread awakening batman!

What did you end up doing?

I need to upgrade the attic pulldown ladder in my attached garage. Want one that is fire rated and insulated. Current one (prior owner) is the typical wood type with plywood lid. Prior owner stuffed a thin sheet of foam insulation on the top side of the plywood and insulators stuffed bat between the rungs which is a trip hazard.

Looks like Fakro is the leader in this as their units are the main hits I get when googling.

Fire Rated Attic Ladders | LWF | LSF | DWF - FAKRO USA

FAKRO fire-resistant ladder which allows an easy and safe access to the attic, and at the same time serving as a fire block during a fire inside of the building.

www.fakrousa.com

Decent looking trim kit

30" x 56.5" Universal Trim Kit plastic - Fakro

The LXL is a great method to finish off your loft ladder installation and cover any remaining gaps in the ceiling. Go to our website and get yours right now!

www.accessdoorsandpanels.com

rharman · Dec 28, 2024

I did exactly what I described.

5/8" Type-X drywall. Wrapped in aluminum C-Channel adhered with some drywall mud in the groove. I added a much more robust hook to grab on to. All the hardware, including the hook and hinges are stainless.

For the hinge end, I used a 1/8"x2" piece of flat aluminum stock attached to spring loaded hinges. It rides nicely along the ceiling for the slight bit of travel - I did a slight roundover on the outside edges.

The springs are OK except the door had a bit of sag in the fully closed position. I added a couple of magnetic catches which really help. It closes with a nice "snap" at the end. I'll likely replace the springs as they're 30 years old now.

Still need to paint and I'll probably mix in some fire retardant just for good measure.

Those Fakro ladders look really nice - and pricey!

larry4406 · Dec 29, 2024

rharman said:
I did exactly what I described.

5/8" Type-X drywall. Wrapped in aluminum C-Channel adhered with some drywall mud in the groove. I added a much more robust hook to grab on to. All the hardware, including the hook and hinges are stainless.

For the hinge end, I used a 1/8"x2" piece of flat aluminum stock attached to spring loaded hinges. It rides nicely along the ceiling for the slight bit of travel - I did a slight roundover on the outside edges.

The springs are OK except the door had a bit of sag in the fully closed position. I added a couple of magnetic catches which really help. It closes with a nice "snap" at the end. I'll likely replace the springs as they're 30 years old now.

Still need to paint and I'll probably mix in some fire retardant just for good measure.

Those Fakro ladders look really nice - and pricey!

That turned out nice!

Mine is made by Louisville Ladders, have not found out the model yet. It does not fully close tight and I have to push it closed. Zero weatherstrip on it. Observed that there are no nails thru the hinge installation holes either; so more half *** work by the prior owner.

Innovate1 · Dec 29, 2024

I have 2 wood ladder ones with thin plywood cover - one in house and one in attached garage. Got them from the big box store as I recall - probably HD. I wondered about fire rating when we built as there are requirements for fire wall between house and garage. But they didn't require the sheeting to go all the way to the roof. Instead the garage ceiling is fire rated drywall. The attic is open between house and garage. In hindsight I should have put drywall in the attic on the separation wall. I asked the inspector about it and he said they allowed the stairs. Didn't make any sense as you have a big hole in your fire barrier.

They don't seal very well. They hang down just a little when closed. The magnetic catches are a good idea - I will look into doing that.

I built OSB boxes around the stairs and whole house fan to keep the insulation from falling into the holes. Built a cover for the top of the fan box and should do the same for the stairs. Just a sheet of OSB with some foam on it.

larry4406 · Dec 29, 2024

Innovate1 said:
I have 2 wood ladder ones with thin plywood cover - one in house and one in attached garage. Got them from the big box store as I recall - probably HD. I wondered about fire rating when we built as there are requirements for fire wall between house and garage. But they didn't require the sheeting to go all the way to the roof. Instead the garage ceiling is fire rated drywall. The attic is open between house and garage. In hindsight I should have put drywall in the attic on the separation wall. I asked the inspector about it and he said they allowed the stairs. Didn't make any sense as you have a big hole in your fire barrier.

They don't seal very well. They hang down just a little when closed. The magnetic catches are a good idea - I will look into doing that.

I built OSB boxes around the stairs and whole house fan to keep the insulation from falling into the holes. Built a cover for the top of the fan box and should do the same for the stairs. Just a sheet of OSB with some foam on it.

My 1987 built house is like yours - 5/8" type X on the attached garage ceiling and same on the wall common with the house.

My attic does not have a wall separating the house attic from the garage attic; hence the concern. I recall seeing a sticker on the pulldown ladder indicating 1990's manufacture so I am assuming the prior owner installed it after construction was complete.

Mine has a wood frame, thin plywood lid, and aluminum ladder. Typical big box store type.

I like those magnetic catches as well.

When we redid the attic insulation recently, my framer built a 2x10 curb around the opening. The curb sits on top of the truss 2x4 bottom chord. I had the framer also build a catwalk up there which ties into the curb. Curb keeps insulation from falling down.

Catwalk comprises 2x10's sitting perpendicular and on top of the bottom chord, set vertically upward, and spaced 24" apart. Every 24" there is a 2x4 at the top tying them together. Lastly, I have 3/4" OSB ripped to 24" wide on top as the walk surface. Walk surface was left loose initially so they could remove to foam and blow the attic. I have since screwed the corners.

Innovate1 · Dec 29, 2024

I also added a catwalk. Makes it MUCH easier to run wires or do anything up there. I took a look at my ladder. It has never closed completely leaving at least a 1/4" gap. I can push it up the rest of the way without much force. I got above it and had my wife fold up the ladder so I could see what was stopping it. The springs are completely compressed. I suppose I could remove the J bolts and hook the springs right to the arm to get a bit more travel. There is a little thread left on them so I could tighten them but I doubt that will be enough. I will give that a shot first. I might do the magnets too. Here's a pic of one side spring in the up position. They both look the same.

thammel · Dec 29, 2024

About a year ago, I bought and installed an aluminum attic ladder. Got it from HD - and it has a layer of insulation built into it. It's a very good design with a good weather tight seal when it closes. I made a box out of insulation board to cover the ladder when folded as extra insulation. And yes, I also built an elevated walkway above the blown in insulation the full length of the attic. It's a Louisville ladder,

Model # AH2240MG-R5.

I'm quite impressed with the quality of the ladder. I did this because we have a heat pump in the attic which needs filters changed every year. At 75 it was getting a little more of a pain in the **** to lug the ladder up so I could crawl through the access panel. This folding aluminum ladder makes it almost enjoyable to get up into the attic!

larry4406 · Dec 30, 2024

thammel said:
About a year ago, I bought and installed an aluminum attic ladder. Got it from HD - and it has a layer of insulation built into it. It's a very good design with a good weather tight seal when it closes. I made a box out of insulation board to cover the ladder when folded as extra insulation. And yes, I also built an elevated walkway above the blown in insulation the full length of the attic. It's a Louisville ladder,

Model # AH2240MG-R5.

I'm quite impressed with the quality of the ladder. I did this because we have a heat pump in the attic which needs filters changed every year. At 75 it was getting a little more of a pain in the **** to lug the ladder up so I could crawl through the access panel. This folding aluminum ladder makes it almost enjoyable to get up into the attic!

Doesn't have a fire rating that I can find.

hobie18 · Dec 30, 2024

Can you tighten that bolt another bit?

How Did You Trim & Seal Your Folding Attic Ladder

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Model # AH2240MG-R5.​

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Model # AH2240MG-R5.

Model # AH2240MG-R5.