Looking for some GOOD phillips screwdrivers. So far I have found a Wiha #2 that list anti cam out ribs. I looking for a precision set of phillips screwdrivers from size 000 - 2. So far the only screwdriver I have found mentioning anti cam out ribs is the Wiha #2. There must be more.
Screwdrivers with Anti CamOut Ribs
- Thread starter redmed
- Start date
KnurledNut
Well-known member
Brownsfan
Well-known member
I will be that guy too. The Snap On and Williams with the ACR are absolutely amazing. I wish I didn't do most of my work on the road. I'm afraid to take the good tools in fear of loosing them or getting stolen. I LOVE the soft grip instinct handles. Best handles I have ever used.
Richard Cranium
Well-known member
I think I have seen the anti cam out on some of the other brand screwdrivers also.
Pantsfall_McFixit
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 8, 2012
- Messages
- 167
Wiha and Wera. Though some have said the Wera lasertips are soft. I'd say try the snap-on ones mentioned in this thread.
The ACR bits are only like $3.00 and will fit in whatever $$ bit holder
Maybe you might feel OK with takin such a setup on the road
dnschmidt
Well-known member
ACR is a Phillips patent and not beholden to any screwdriver manufacturer. TOPTUL sells bits with this feature.
I don't know if ACR does much other than overcome the inherent cam out design of the original Phillips which was designed on purpose to cam out at the request of Henry Ford. The JIS compatible screwdrivers (basically everybody on Earth not headquartered in America - TOPTUL, Vessel, Wera, Wiha, P. B. Swiss etc.) all use the DIN standard and all work much better than the original Phillips. ACR doesn't hurt anything it just might not be that big of a deal if the screwdriver was made to international standards to begin with.
I don't know if ACR does much other than overcome the inherent cam out design of the original Phillips which was designed on purpose to cam out at the request of Henry Ford. The JIS compatible screwdrivers (basically everybody on Earth not headquartered in America - TOPTUL, Vessel, Wera, Wiha, P. B. Swiss etc.) all use the DIN standard and all work much better than the original Phillips. ACR doesn't hurt anything it just might not be that big of a deal if the screwdriver was made to international standards to begin with.
Crazyjake8493
Well-known member
I've been wanting to try the Wera lasertips for a while, but a lot of reviews said the tips wear out faster than they should.
davethorik
Well-known member
Careful now. I brought this up about a year ago with a lot of pictures on the forum and the wera kool-aid drinkers came unglued and attacked me
kabinenroller
Well-known member
I just bought some Vessel screwdrivers, bits for 1/4" drive handles, impact bits, and two impact screwdrivers. They work great on Phillips but I bought them for JIS screws. High quality tools, that work as advertised.
DethHalo
Member
These two Vessel screwdrivers have a built in torque drive function. After you've used them a couple times, you'll never reach for a phillips again.
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B003BGTTSE/?tag=atomicindus04-20
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B003BGZ9CO/?tag=atomicindus04-20
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B003BGTTSE/?tag=atomicindus04-20
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B003BGZ9CO/?tag=atomicindus04-20
KnurledNut
Well-known member
While its long been held that it was designed to cam out, there is no mention of this in the ORIGINAL patent, and little evidence supporting this.
ACR was originally designed with drivers AND screws BOTH having anti-camout ribs that would interlock. While very effective, fasteners were expensive to produce and lost appeal.
Its also worth noting that there are different ACR styles:
Removal only
Installation only
Or both
Brownsfan
Well-known member
The ACR bits are only like $3.00 and will fit in whatever $$ bit holder
Maybe you might feel OK with takin such a setup on the road
I do have a few that came with my snap on ratcheting screw drivers. I use them in my $5 Husky ratcheting screwdriver I bought on clearance a while back. That's a good suggestion. I may buy a couple more soon
That's why I only bought them when they were on sale last month for $12 after surprise points on Sears.com 
bmwpowere36m3
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2012
- Messages
- 1,125
Apex, Zephyr, Bosch, Snap-On, Williams, Wera, Wiha (some only bits)...
However I don't know if they go down to 000 in ACR. OTOH, I've only found a "need" for ACR in #2. On stubborn #3 screws I'll use a hand impact and #3 bit socket. ACR is a nice feature, but a high-quality fitting screwdriver/bit is more important.
Don't for JIS drivers, I use them on my Japanese motorcycles.
However I don't know if they go down to 000 in ACR. OTOH, I've only found a "need" for ACR in #2. On stubborn #3 screws I'll use a hand impact and #3 bit socket. ACR is a nice feature, but a high-quality fitting screwdriver/bit is more important.
Don't for JIS drivers, I use them on my Japanese motorcycles.
Careful now. I brought this up about a year ago with a lot of pictures on the forum and the wera kool-aid drinkers came unglued and attacked me
Woah woah hey now, unglued? Just a little spirited is all!
My buddy has broken the tip off his SO #2 twice since I got my Wera Lasertips. I have had no problems. We work on pretty much the same stuff. I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'...
Color me confused, but I thought DIN and JIS were different than standard Phillips (ANSI Type I cross-recess) and that mixing one type of driver with a different type of fastener was suboptimal at best and likely to result in damage. Ditto for Pozidriv (type Ia) and Phillips, although maybe a Phillips driver on a Pozidriv screw is an OK combo?
There's a special place in hell reserved for the mech e's who come up with incompatible lookalike fasteners....
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
There's a special place in hell reserved for the mech e's who come up with incompatible lookalike fasteners....
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
DethHalo
Member
Vessel is manufactured in Japan, since 1916.
The Ford thing is a myth, the "cam-out" Mr. Phillips references in the original patent refers to the tools ability to push debris out of the engagement area. It is not referring to the tools being pushed out of the screw.
KnurledNut
Well-known member
Look for the DIN 5260 certification on your cross point driver and don't worry about the JIS anymore.
This spec is most compatible with JIS and Phillips standards.
I'd also say that at least some if not all eu/and other modern hardware seems to fit the euro DIN tips better than USA (true philiips) ones. Though the ACR ones are the best of the bunch in true phillips.
With screwdrivers it sort of takes two sides to tango...
Aren't those Pozidriv, or at least close to it? I know the drivers on my Swiss army knife are Pozidriv, although they work more-or-less ok on regular Phillips.
With screwdrivers it sort of takes two sides to tango...
Phillips, Pozidriv, Frearson, Robertson, Torx, TorxPlus, argh! It's a giant circle dance.
Not to mention the various widths and thickness of slotted heads. Those are where the Chapman sets are the best—hollow-ground and enough options to get a nice tight fit.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
dnschmidt
Well-known member
When the model T was being produced air screwdrivers were a reality. What wasn't was air screwdrivers with adjustable clutches like what we commonly have today on cordless drills. The idea behind the Phillips camming out was that it would greatly reduce the number of overdriven and therefore stripped out screws on Ford's production line which were hindering production on the Model T. I've read an article a long time ago about Henry Ford requesting screw companies to design such a screw and from what the article said Phillips won the contract. Wish I could find a reference to this article as it was quite interesting and worthy of sharing. Sadly, I can't.
Phillips itself eventually designed a screw that wouldn't cam out (like the JIS) and called it Pozidriv. Although this is an American invention it never took off in the United States. However, it's the defacto standard in Europe. All of the major European furniture hardware manufacturers such as Hettich, Hafele, Grass, Blum and Salice all use Pozidriv on their furniture hardware. I guess no man is a profit in his own land.
Phillips itself eventually designed a screw that wouldn't cam out (like the JIS) and called it Pozidriv. Although this is an American invention it never took off in the United States. However, it's the defacto standard in Europe. All of the major European furniture hardware manufacturers such as Hettich, Hafele, Grass, Blum and Salice all use Pozidriv on their furniture hardware. I guess no man is a profit in his own land.
ScottsGT
Well-known member
GM use to use the Pozidrive on interior trim screws back in the '70's and into the '80's. I still have my Snap On Pozidrive screwdriver from the bodyshop days. Took my kids forever to realize it was not a Phillips, even after telling them many times.
I ordered a few #2 Phillips type screwdrivers to determine what set of screwdrivers to get. So far I have a Vessel with a JIS type tip that does grip screws better than the Craftsman & Stanley screwdrivers I plan to replace. I also just got a Wera that grips so well I can let go and the screwdriver holds itself in place horizontally! I'm impressed. I'm still waiting for a Wiha with anti cam out ribs and a JIS type from Moody.
I waiting for the other screwdrivers but it is going to have to be some kind of screwdriver to beat the impression Wera 917 SPH made on me. I expected anti cam out ribs on the tip of the 917's but do not see any so probably just laser cut? I like this screwdriver the best so far but would rather have a round rather than a hex shaft. I have seen Wera's with the anti cam out ribs on the tip and expected them on the 917 so I'm going to keep checking and may get another Wera model. But first I want to try the Wiha with the anti cam out ribs and round shaft.
I waiting for the other screwdrivers but it is going to have to be some kind of screwdriver to beat the impression Wera 917 SPH made on me. I expected anti cam out ribs on the tip of the 917's but do not see any so probably just laser cut? I like this screwdriver the best so far but would rather have a round rather than a hex shaft. I have seen Wera's with the anti cam out ribs on the tip and expected them on the 917 so I'm going to keep checking and may get another Wera model. But first I want to try the Wiha with the anti cam out ribs and round shaft.
bmwpowere36m3
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2012
- Messages
- 1,125
A Snap-On ACR screwdriver will stay in place horizontally as well...
On the cheaper side of things, I'm pleased with Craftsman's diamond coated screwdrivers and surprisingly the HF cheapies (no fancy ACR or diamond coating... just a well-fitted tip).
On the cheaper side of things, I'm pleased with Craftsman's diamond coated screwdrivers and surprisingly the HF cheapies (no fancy ACR or diamond coating... just a well-fitted tip).
d.mcfarland
Well-known member
The Snap On ACR bits are nice for 1/4" ratcheting drivers because unless you keep the driver in the perfect spot, the bit still has the ability to twist perfectly fine at those strange angles.
HF PRO's or the real cheapies?
bmwpowere36m3
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2012
- Messages
- 1,125