Fridge Tripping GFCI

[mikeinri]

I have a fridge in my garage, it's been working perfectly out there for 18 years.

That garage outlet is at the end of a GFCI circuit. The GFCI is installed next to the circuit breaker panel in the basement. From there, the circuit runs to an outdoor outlet in front of the house, then to another in back of the house, then to the garage outlet.

Before Christmas, we had a nasty storm with heavy wind-blown rain, and the GFCI tripped. This had happened a few times over the years, usually because of water infiltration into those outdoor boxes (installed hanging off the side of the house). At one point, I replaced all 3 outlets with GFCIs (which I've since learned is overkill and over-complicates troubleshooting).

So, I pulled out all the outlets, and put a Fluke ST120+ GFCI tester on the GFCI outlet unit at the panel, it worked perfectly (showed the proper green lights, tripped the GFCI when I pressed the tester's test switch).

I then replaced the outlets with commercial, wet location units, added grounding wires (metal boxes), and put better covers on the outdoor boxes. Turned the breaker back on, and the GFCI at the panel tripped immediately.

Replaced the GFCI, tried again, and the new one wouldn't reset. Unplugged the fridge, and was able to reset it. Went to each outlet (in order, away from the panel / GFCI), and tested them with the Fluke. Everything normal (including tripping the GFCI at the panel in the basement when tested from the Fluke).

Plugged the fridge back in, tripped the GFCI again, wouldn't reset. Unplugged the fridge, was able to reset the GFCI.

THEN, I ran an extension cord to a different GFCI outlet (runs the driveway pole light), tripped that GFCI immediately. Unplugged, reset, tried to plug the fridge again, tripped immediately.

So, somehow, during that last storm, something really messed with the fridge. One of the GFCI outlets I removed had black marks on the back, and its box had standing water in the bottom of it (I've since drilled drain holes). That wasn't the unit in the garage, it was outside.

Question is, could it be something SIMPLE to fix in the fridge, or should I just buy a new one?

This was a Kenmore (Sears Outlet scratch and dent), and lasted us 18 years as a backup / overflow unit, so it doesn't owe me anything. Just curious.

Thanks.

Mike

EDIT / PS: Kenmore Model 106.74244402

 

[wyliesdiesels]

defroster bulb is burned out causing a short to ground

 

[mikeinri]

Thanks. I'm not seeing that, I'll look harder. My wife is already looking at fridges online, LOL...

Mike

 

[dscheidt]

Thanks. I'm not seeing that, I'll look harder. My wife is already looking at fridges online, LOL...

Mike

defroster heaters leak. It's the cause of almost all fridge tripping gfci. And it's exactly the sort of thing that gfci protect against. If it's 18 years old, it's probably straightforward to kill the heater. Worst case, you hate it, and have to buy a new fridge. best case, no new fridge.

 

[mikeinri]

This fridge hasn't been perfect. It likes to collect water in the refrigerator section (freezer on top). I think that's just a blocked drain, but it sometimes freezes that water inside of the fridge. Probably best to retire it.

I was really just curious why a power failure (GFCI trip) would kill it. Mostly so I don't risk killing its replacement the same way.

Mike

 

[larry4406]

Not saying you should ignore the reason the fridge is tripping the gfi, but at the panel GFI, you could pig tail your daisy chain off the line side instead of the load side, Install GFI's at the front and rear outlet locations (again pig tailing off the line side), which then returns your fridge outlet to non-gfi as it has been for the last 18 years.

 

[dscheidt]

Not saying you should ignore the reason the fridge is tripping the gfi, but at the panel GFI, you could pig tail your daisy chain off the line side instead of the load side, Install GFI's at the front and rear outlet locations (again pig tailing off the line side), which then returns your fridge outlet to non-gfi as it has been for the last 18 years.

Telling someone to put an appliance reasonably known to have a ground fault on a a circuit where that fault can kill someone seems unwise. The thing has worked properly for 18 years, it's not a defective design that has intended leakage.

 

[mike93lx]

This fridge hasn't been perfect. It likes to collect water in the refrigerator section (freezer on top). I think that's just a blocked drain, but it sometimes freezes that water inside of the fridge. Probably best to retire it.

I was really just curious why a power failure (GFCI trip) would kill it. Mostly so I don't risk killing its replacement the same way.

Mike

Could have been a surge or voltage drop during the storm. I doubt the grci tripping did it in

 

[mikeinri]

Not saying you should ignore the reason the fridge is tripping the gfi, but at the panel GFI, you could pig tail your daisy chain off the line side instead of the load side, Install GFI's at the front and rear outlet locations (again pig tailing off the line side), which then returns your fridge outlet to non-gfi as it has been for the last 18 years.

The garage outlet (where this fridge is located) has always been on GFCI. By changing the outlets this month, I simply restored the original layout.

My understanding is that GFCI is a code requirement for garage outlets.

Mike

 

[mikeinri]

It's interesting to me that (based on comments here regarding issues when defrosters go awry) fridges seem to be known for creating internal ground faults, but GFCI isn't a code requirement for them.

Mike

 

[mike93lx]

My understanding is that GFCI is a code requirement for garage outlets.

Yes, it is.

gfci's are a good idea and improve safety. But can also trip for reasons unrelated to an appliance issue, and when that happens, you can lose hundred of dollars in food.

 

[mikeinri]

Could have been a surge or voltage drop during the storm. I doubt the grci tripping did it in

Thanks. This is the GFCI that I pulled out of the front outdoor box, which had enough rainwater inside to reach the hot terminals.



Mike

 

[mikeinri]

Yes, it is.

gfci's are a good idea and improve safety. But can also trip for reasons unrelated to an appliance issue, and when that happens, you can lose hundred of dollars in food.

Trust me, I know. That was part of my (incorrect) logic for originally replacing all of the individual outlets with GFCIs in the past. I was hoping that it would make troubleshooting which outlet failed easier (that didn't work out).

We've never had any water in the garage (the house is situated on top of a hill on my property, and the driveway pitches sharply away from the garage).

I'm thinking about running a dedicated (GFCI) circuit to feed it.

Mike

 

[mikeinri]

Not saying you should ignore the reason the fridge is tripping the gfi, but at the panel GFI, you could pig tail your daisy chain off the line side instead of the load side, Install GFI's at the front and rear outlet locations (again pig tailing off the line side), which then returns your fridge outlet to non-gfi as it has been for the last 18 years.

Sounds like my original idea of using 3 GFCIs (at the outdoor and garage outlets) could have worked if I'd have run the circuit this way at the GFCI next to the panel.

Doesn't seem as safe, though (live juice would still be inside a potentially wet outdoor box).

Mike

 

[mike93lx]

Sounds like my original idea of using 3 GFCIs (at the outdoor and garage outlets) could have worked if I'd have run the circuit this way at the GFCI next to the panel.

Doesn't seem as safe, though (live juice would still be inside a potentially wet outdoor box).

Mike

If the water shorts the outlet, It should trip the breaker.

 

[mikeinri]

If the water shorts the outlet, It should trip the breaker.

I agree, but it didn't in this case. Is that because the GFCI(s) tripped?

Mike

 

[Wrench97]

Thanks. This is the GFCI that I pulled out of the front outdoor box, which had enough rainwater inside to reach the hot terminals.



Mike

Were the wires back stabbed into that outlet or attached under the screw terminal?

 

[mikeinri]

Screws. I'd installed this one.

The GFCI in the basement was original to the house (built in 1999 / 2000), and was back-stabbed. I used the screws when I replaced it yesterday.

Mike

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Were the wires back stabbed into that outlet or attached under the screw terminal?

GFCIs do not have back stabbed aka push-wire, connections.

They have back-wire terminals with pressure plates. No need to even loop the wire around the screws.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Screws. I'd installed this one.

The GFCI in the basement was original to the house (built in 1999 / 2000), and was back-stabbed. I used the screws when I replaced it yesterday.

Mike

You sure they were back-stabbed? GFCIs dont have push-wire terminals. Putting a wire thru the back holes puts the wire between pressure plates that clamps the wire as the screw is tightened. this is called "back-wire".

 

[dscheidt]

You sure they were back-stabbed? GFCIs dont have push-wire terminals. Putting a wire thru the back holes puts the wire between pressure plates that clamps the wire as the screw is tightened

backstab only gfci used to be a thing. It probably went away whenever 12 awg backstab did, but I don't know for sure.

 

[joel63]

defroster bulb is burned out causing a short to ground

Possible short to ground in the heater for the ice maker.
I got a real nasty surprise from an ice maker that went to ground a while back.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

backstab only gfci used to be a thing. It probably went away whenever 12 awg backstab did, but I don't know for sure.

There was never a 12 gauge rated backstab. Its always been 14 only

 

[mikeinri]

You sure they were back-stabbed? GFCIs dont have push-wire terminals. Putting a wire thru the back holes puts the wire between pressure plates that clamps the wire as the screw is tightened

Wasn't aware of that nuance. I just know the wires went into holes in the back, and not around the screws.

Possible short to ground in the heater for the ice maker.
I got real a nasty surprise from an ice maker that went to ground a while back.

Ouch. FWIW, this fridge had an ice maker, but we never connected it to water to even test it. No interest in running a water line out to the unheated garage.

-----

New fridge should be here on Tuesday. Same size and basic features, but is supposed to be "garage-ready." No ice maker in this one.

I bought new this time, despite looking at the scratch / dent outlet, because the price difference was only $100, and the outlet unit had clearly been dropped on one of the rear corners. It's possible that it was only cosmetic...

However, the saleswoman was quick to point out that "everything is tested three times!" But for only 10 minutes each time, just to see that they power up and start the compressor (I'd prefer overnight so they can confirm that it reaches and maintains the proper temperatures). We bought a washing machine from that store once, it leaked on the first load I ran in it.

Oh, and the delivery price difference between Lowe's and the outlet basically offset the fridge price difference (scratched and dented vs new).

Mike

 

[mm08822]

There was never a 12 gauge rated backstab. Its always been 14 only

I thought that was the case also......until I pulled this out for replacement from a house built in mid-90's. Leviton 5-15R.

 

[dave*99]

Thanks. I'm not seeing that, I'll look harder. My wife is already looking at fridges online, LOL...

Mike

If you are going to find it you will be removing the interior panel over the evaporator coil (rear of freezer compartment) and looking for a glass tube with a heater element inside or a metal tubular rod element without glass......

 

[dscheidt]

There was never a 12 gauge rated backstab. Its always been 14 only

No. I had a house built in the mid 80s. 20A branch circuits with 12 awg romex. Every device in the house, except for a few dimmer and 3/4 way switches was backstabbed, because the devices didn't have screw terminals, except for the ground. didn't have any failures of the stabs, but did replace a bunch of outlets because they couldn't hold a plug. (also: they were almond)

 

[Milton Shaw]

One other place I have seen tripping GFCI's was from the wire connector at the bottom of the frig from the doors. Water from inside the door would short the connector out. Usually this is right behind the toe kick at the front of the refrig. As earlier said most times it is the defrost heater. Glad you got a new one. Bet it doesn't last 18 years again.

 

[mikeinri]

Forgot to follow up!

Old fridge is gone, new one arrived last Tuesday, seems to be working well. No issues with the GFCI, but it hasn't really rained hard enough to challenge the outdoor boxes.

Old...



New...



Mike

 

[mike93lx]

Forgot to follow up!

Old fridge is gone, new one arrived last Tuesday, seems to be working well. No issues with the GFCI, but it hasn't really rained hard enough to challenge the outdoor boxes.

Old...



New...



Mike

Wow, completely different!