fuss about Snap-On??????

[sprackydoo]

I've had a Snap-On ratchet for a few months now I honestly don't feel ANY difference from my craftsman (I actually prefer my cman!!!) My older cman actually is smoother! I have the snappy comfort grip one (1/4" drive) so it's not a super high tooth count ratchet but it doesn't feel really fantastic. Per your guys' suggestion i've packed it with white lithium grease still doesn't "feel" worth $70!!!

My dads old snappy stuff feels really really really nice and smooth (made way before I was born) I was just wondering if the new snappy stuff will break in and I should just work the pawl spring in or if snappy just isn't what it used to be.

I have this one but a diff color (red with black writing) http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=12838&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

A guy at work (an all out EVERYTHING MAC guy) is giving me hell for my snappy not being as "good" as his MAC ratchet

 

[motorheadjohn]

I would agree with you on the 1/4" drive ratchet.

I have the same cushioned-grip ratchet in 1/4", plus a cushioned standard 3/8" and 2 cushioned long-length 1/2".

The 1/4" ratchet has a vague or crude feel, to me. I'm satisfied with the 3/8" though, and I love the long 1/2"s. And I'm satisfied with all my other Snap-On tools...screwdrivers, ratcheting screwdrivers, hex drivers, extensions, etc. But that little 1/4" ratchet I am no fan of. My standard Cman has a little better feel, but there is a decent amount of slop in the mechanism, so I'm not entirely happy with it either.

This past fall, I picked up a Cman 3/8 slimline, and it's everything you guys say about it. Looking to pick up the 3-piece set if Sears will ever get them back in stock online. It irritates the **** out of me that the set is a "catalog/online exclusive deal" and you cannot get the 1/2" slimline in my local store either. Sorry for the hijack...back on topic now.

 

[davejs]

Settle down, smoothness in rachets is derived by gears of hub. More splines in hub cost more to produce, with new style being gear less. If your unhappy with it trade it or live with it as it is. Next time your hearing some guy selling his wrenches to you saying it is better ask him this.
"How is your product better then your competitor?"
I heard one salesman say his was better because it was BrandX and we are the best. Next salesman just said here is his product grab your brandX product and I will show you how our product is better.
Now I don't buy any of Brand X due to poor salesman and service. Buy what you like better and not Brand X **** that the crowd say is best because they say so.

 

[motorheadjohn]

Excellent point Dave. There are plenty of tools I like because of how they feel or perform for me, and that is subjective. There are other tools I like because in side-by-side comparisons they are clearly superior in construction or performance. That's the way to decide what you spend your money on, and it will not be the same decision made by other people, even in the same situation.

 

[wythors]

Last year I won a $250 SnapOn gift certificate at work. I'm a parts guy at a dealership, so I have access to the Snappy truck. I picked out two ratcheting screwdrivers (standard and stubby), a flex-head 1/4" drive ratchet, and a long-handled 3/8" drive ratchet. I really like the screwdrivers. They are obviously very well-made and are quality pieces. However, I'm really not impressed with the ratchets for exactly the same reasons cited by Sprackydoo. I have an ooooold SK 1/4 that belonged to my father-in-law that feels like twice the tool the Snappy is. Much finer geared and sturdier feeling. And my old Craftsman 1/4's feel sturdier too. I have a Mac flex-head that has been my "go to" 3/8 for many years as well as a Mac stubby and a Craftsman "quick release". I bought the long handled Snappy thinking it would be a nice complement, size-wise, to my collection. The ratcheting action feels akin to some of the Taiwan tools in my very first set from 25 years ago. I currently have it up for auction on eBay. The SnapOn stuff, I'm sure, is really durable and convenient for professional mechanics, but I think I'll stick with SK and Craftsman for the most part from now on. We also have a really friendly Mac dealer that comes into the shop at work, so I'll probably frequent his truck if I feel the need to spend some money.

 

[kartracer55]

Itll loosen up a bit. the pawl spring needs to wear in a bit. Were you honestly expecting a ratchet with no drawback or anything? Thats my one complaint about snap on. Look into a fine tooth for 1/4 rarely does 1/4 stuff need a super strong ratchet, if you do need serious force, use a little breaker bar or up to 3/8.

Jim

 

[drbill]

The rachets I used most was this 1/4 drive http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...2&group_ID=107&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog
And a 3/8 drive one. The ones I have don't have the fancy handles, there too old for that. Just plain black plastic.
If given a choice I would always grab the fine toothed Snap on rachets.

 

[wythors]

Itll loosen up a bit. the pawl spring needs to wear in a bit. Were you honestly expecting a ratchet with no drawback or anything? Thats my one complaint about snap on. Look into a fine tooth for 1/4 rarely does 1/4 stuff need a super strong ratchet, if you do need serious force, use a little breaker bar or up to 3/8.

Jim

I have no idea what "drawback" is, but the mechanism just feels clunky to me. My Mac and Craftsman ratchets both feel much smoother and precise.

 

[chevy302dz]

Snap on is very overrated there are plenty of other professional brands out there that will do just as well for half the money, especialy when it comes to basic hand tools. Even if the truck does come to you. That being said your ratchet will break in and work well, however if you don't use it everyday it will take a while.

 

[kartracer55]

whythors, I think I used the wrong term, couldnt remember it for the life of me... Its the force it takes to actually make the damn thing ratchet. The stronger the pawl spring is, which actually makes it ratchet, the more drawback there will be. White lithium grease will help a bit, but how the ratchet feels mostly has to do with the pawl spring.

Jim

 

[slowride66]

The only thing I have to say Positive about a Snap~On ratchet is it will most likely take abuse like a pipe on the handle in a emergency


I used to walk around with a new ratchet and spin it around for a few days if I was walking to the bathroom or something like that ...LIKE working in a new knife.

SR66

 

[Fast Orange]

Guys-
Lets look at the guts of a ratchet from a mechanical design standpoint.
The larger the engaged surface area of the ratchet pawl,the more torque the mechanism will be able to transfer before breaking/slipping.Adequate area can be gained in one of two ways.You can make more teeth in a shallower engagement or fewer teeth in a deeper engagement.The shallow engagement will be more suceptable to wear and dirt over a set number of uses compared to a deeper engagement.Therefore,to make a ratchet as strong as possible and to last as long as possible,it becomes necessary to use a deeply engaged mechanism.
The second part of the equation is the spring to activate engagement of the pawl. Since the objective of the spring is to engage the teeth of the pawl as deeply as possible under conditions that include lubrication or lack thereof and the presence of dirt in the mechanism,the stronger the spring,the better.
The optimal design of the ratchet mechanism also needs to include other factors like degree of backwards motion to engage the next set of teeth,amount of "back drag" that is allowable and a realistic amount of torque that the mechanism must be able to withstand during it's expected useful life.
How and what compromises are made in the design and manufacture of the ratchet will determine it's "feel". A deeply engaged set of large teeth with a strong pawl spring will feel somewhat rougher than a design with shallower engaged teeth with a lighter pawl spring.
I'll allow you to draw your own conclusions from the above statements and assumptions,but as to my choice-I'll take a slightly "clunky" feeling ratchet over a "smooth" feeling one whenever a high torque application presents itself.I like my knuckles too much to sacrifice them for the sake of a tactilely pleasant feeling tool.A fine tooth ratchet does have it's place when working in a tight spot, but a standard 36 tooth ratchet will last longer and be stronger than it's 72 tooth cousin.

George

 

[iiibdsiil]

So George, would it be safe to say that since I have broken about 25 Craftsman ratchets and 1 Snap-on ratchet that the Snap-on ratchet has a deeper engagement and a sronger pawl spring?

 

[Fast Orange]

There are a couple of other variables that I didn't address in my post-
The metalurgy of the components used to make the toothed parts of the ratchet will have a large effect on the strength of the mechanism and how long it will last.A "softer", more ductile alloy will wear quicker and will deform under load. A harder metal will wear better,but may be brittle and break under load.
The number of teeth engaged at one time will also have a bearing on the strength of the tool. Because of the space limitations inside of the ratchet head and that the depth of engagement will require differing amounts of pawl travel,a ratchet with deeper teeth will have to have fewer teeth, while a fine toothed ratchet can have more teeth.
The gist of what I'm trying to say in this diatribe is that the tactile "feel" of a ratchet will have very little bearing on the quality of the tool.While a certain "quality" brand tool that has a reputation for strength and longevity may feel like a POS due to it's "klunkiness",it will probably last longer due to better choice in the various compromises made in it's design.A chinese built cheapie may have a smoother feel,but fail under simular use and circumstances.
In short-don't judge a ratchet based on it's "click"-there is a lot more to judging quality than a pleasant smoothness to the operation of the mechanism.
I have very rarely had the need to open up a ratchet,and not knowing the metalurgy of the components in the various brands,I have no reliable method to predict what brand or style of tool is the "best".
As stated in the post by iiibdsiil,sice he has broken about 25 CM ratchets to a single SO,in his particular case and usage,the design of the CM is inferior to the SO. In my personal experience,I've broken many different brands over the years,primarily the cheaper brands,and also primarily due to abuse. Personaly,I prefer Snap-On and SK and stay away from Stanley,Allen, Craftsman and anything chicom. I have no real experience with Proto ,Williams and I'm sure other brands.

George

 

[iiibdsiil]

Hrmm... I'm gonna have to open some of my various brand ratchets up now... Hope I can get them back together

 

[Uncle Buck]

All that psycho analysis George did on the science of ratchets sound great, but at the end of the day I have not seen one yet, including (gasp) Snap-On that will not shoot craps at some point in time! For my end, I have had just as many Snap-On ratchets fail, if not more than Craftsman, I still prefer to use my Snap-On ratchets over my Craftsman, but I do not believe that they are truely put togeather much better than the Cman based on my failure rate experience, particularly when you start to factor in the initial cost. Plus, as I continue to say, warranty problems are my greater issue with Snap-On. PS. The way any ratchet clicks is not usually an issue with me, although I must a

 

[iiibdsiil]

In my experience, I have only broken 1 Snap-on ratchet. My Craftsman ones seem to break about every 3rd time I use them, start skipping on me. My one Mac ratchet I have I broke before the driver left the shop, and he gave me a brand new one since it was my 3rd time warrantying it. I have yet to break that one, so maybe they get sloppier each time they are taken apart or something. I have 7 or 8 snap-on ratchets, of which 1 broke once.

Last time my dad handed me a Craftsman ratchet when I asked for a ratchet I threw the thing out the shop door into the bushes. He went poking around out there and grabbed it to have it warrantied. Broke on him a couple weeks later. He doesn't care though, he's an old timer and Sears ain't far from his place.

 

[stupidjet]

i call bs...is craftsman sucked sooooo much for you, why did you continue to use a crafstman ratchet 25 times, especially when you had a god of a ratchet made by the almighty snap on....
your full of ****. point is, youre better than everyon here b/c you have snap on and they remove and install nuts and bolts better than any other ratchet on the market time and time again, while others wont even remove one bolt...*******.

 

[Uncle Buck]

+1

 

[iiibdsiil]

i call bs...is craftsman sucked sooooo much for you, why did you continue to use a crafstman ratchet 25 times, especially when you had a god of a ratchet made by the almighty snap on....
your full of ****. point is, youre better than everyon here b/c you have snap on and they remove and install nuts and bolts better than any other ratchet on the market time and time again, while others wont even remove one bolt...*******.

Lol. Bro, I've been using Craftsman since I was 7, 8, 9 years old. I didn't get Snap-On **** until I was almost 17. My buddy's dad owned a shop that worked on older Porsche's, and I worked there for about 6 months with my Craftsman garbage. The Snap-on guy laughed at me when I laughed at him because I had just purchased a complete Craftsman wrench set for like $120 or something. He told me "You are laughing now, but within 6 months you will make the move to the real ****." When I was working, and I needed either another wrench, or there was a Snap-on laying there I would use it and I saw the difference man. Maybe I'm just easily persuaded, but I tell ya what, there is a huge difference to me. When you are doing it everyday it makes a difference. I don't care if your sister's cousin's uncle or whoever works with Craftsman everyday at the dealer or whatever. Good for them. Maybe they don't want the bill associated with them. Some people drive Chevy's, some driver BMW's. Either way it get's you from point A to point B. When you are 16 years old, making $500 a week cash, and don't have jack to spend it on (car is paid for, and you don't pay your own insurance), you buy whatever floats your boat. I love working on cars, and I appreciate a good tool or two. I have had nothing but bad luck since I was little with Craftsman. In fact, I had better luck with China brand ratchets then I did with Craftsman. They didn't break like the Craftsman.

The reason I kept a Craftsman ratchet or two around is because when we are at my warehouse, people use the Craftsman. Too many times I have heard "What the FRICK is wrong with this thing?" "Sorry, I didn't get it warrantied yet, here, use this one." "Damn, that's nice," they say.

You can drink cheap wine, you can drink expensive wine, whatever floats your boat man. You might have good experiences with that garbage, but I don't.

I love how you stooped to name calling.

 

[kartracer55]

Well There is a quite obvious difference in snap on/craftsman quality... Snap On ratchets have little if any play in them, craftsmans are extremly sloppy... the difference? The snap on costs about 4X as much.

Also, Id like to point out that snap on tools are not indestructable... Ive actually broken 2 craftsman and 2 snap on sockets, I was abusing the craftsmans, so it was expected. The one snap on was borderline abuse and the other was under normal conditions. Both Snap ons were less than 5 years old. Also, I did manage to break a snap on ratchet... maybe it was from age, but I use a craftsman ratchet from the same time period all the time, no problems.

Just because its snap on, doesnt mean its good.

Also, You can have the best tools in the world, but it doesnt matter if you dont know how to use'm

Jim

 

[iiibdsiil]

I'm not trying to start a who's pecker is bigger here match.

You're right, they all break. All of my Snap-on ratchets I purchased used. The one that broke was trying to pull a lug off at a buddies that was impacted on. He didn't have a breaker bar, so we put a pipe on the Snap-on ratchet. And there are many Snap-on things I won't purchase. Not all my sockets are Snap-on, but they are either Matco, Mac, or Snap-on. I break Mac chrome sockets on my 3/8" impact fairly regularly. My Snap-on's do not have that problem, for some reason. I honestly have no idea why. The Matco's don't break either. Most of my stuff was purchased used, so I do not know the history of it. The only new stuff I ever really owned was my Craftsman stuff.

For whatever it's worth, I use cheap Companion (Champion maybe?) extensions on my 3/8 impact gun. They are the $9.99 for three at Sears, wobble extentions. I have yet to break one of them either.

 

[Uncle Buck]

You are right iiibdsiil: I added a +1, Not for the namecall though!

 

[kartracer55]

I break Mac chrome sockets on my 3/8" impact fairly regularly. My Snap-on's do not have that problem, for some reason.

Leads me to believe the MAC sockets are a harder, yet more brittle steel... interesting.

Jim