Is this an open or enclosed light fixture?

[Vintage Veloce]

I have these recessed can lights in my garage.
View media item 105409
The cans are sealed, protecting the stuff above.

But the baffle/trim ring on the ceiling is open on the bottom:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B014I5ARJG/?tag=atomicindus08-20
I mean, it's clearly open on the bottom. Obviously, there is no venting on the top because of the sealed can.

So... I bought some LED bulbs that say "Forbidden to be used in enclosed luminares". I actually bought 8 about 18 months ago at $35 bucks each. 35W each and 3500 lumens. They are great for brightness.

Interestingly, they no longer sell that exact bulb that is failing for me. They now offer a revised version:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07DL99ZXZ/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I figured with the open bottom trims, these are not "enclosed"... BUT ...
I have now had 4 of the eight fail in the last two months. The manufacturer has been honoring the warranty, one bulb at a time. I asked them to replace all of the rest, now, because the are obviously all failing. And they asked for a picture. So I sent the one above... And then they said; that is an enclosed fixture! They still seem to be honoring the warranty, (one at a time), and we will see if any of the new ones fail.

But... should I consider this fixture enclosed? I'm thinking I'll replace the remaining 4 bulbs as they fail under warranty. But if the new ones fail... maybe I need to get bulbs rated for an "enclosed fixture"?

What say the lighting experts?

 

[sparky 1971]

It's open. Enclosed means the lamp (light bulb) is covered, or enclosed. There are a lot of led lamps that can't be used in enclosed fixtures. The #1 killer of led is heat, and when they are enclosed, the heat can't dissipate.

 

[BillK]

I wonder if they consider it "enclosed" because the heat cant escape out of the top ?

 

[cybrdyke]

It's open. End of story.
CD

 

[nadogail]

It's open. End of story.
CD

My opinion also.

 

[casmurbax]

What is an Enclosed Fixture?

An enclosed fixture is any fixture or application where the light bulb is encased in a way that does not allow for proper airflow or ventilation. This includes but is not limited to porch lights where the bottom is glass or plastic instead of open air, enclosed Mason jar light fixtures, and lensed recessed light fixtures.

Enclosed fixtures that don’t allow for proper ventilation can drastically affect the temperature of the LED bulb, causing it to overheat and shortening the lifespan of the bulb

my 2 cents.

Been there, done that.

 

[Bert_]

I don't care weather you consider it open or enclosed. It will not allow heat to dissipate very well. To make matters worse those cheapo light bulbs probably have very poor thermal management.

 

[Vintage Veloce]

To make matters worse those cheapo light bulbs probably have very poor thermal management.

You must have different standards for "cheap" than I do. At $35/bulb, that's not how I'd describe them!

Now they are VERY bright BR30 bulbs, actually the brightest floods I could find. And thus they are warm and spectacularly vented if you look at them. So I can believe maybe they require a *more* open fixture. But in my experience, most bulbs like this are installed in fixtures that are closed at the top, because they screw in at that end.

 

[DieselNut88]

Look up Satco lights. Very good quality. You will probably have better luck with them.

 

[Bert_]

You must have different standards for "cheap" than I do. At $35/bulb, that's not how I'd describe them!

Now they are VERY bright BR30 bulbs, actually the brightest floods I could find. And thus they are warm and spectacularly vented if you look at them. So I can believe maybe they require a *more* open fixture. But in my experience, most bulbs like this are installed in fixtures that are closed at the top, because they screw in at that end.

A brand nobody has ever heard of and while the description on Amazon isn't to bad it definitely wasn't written in English originally.

It's straight off the boat from China. Sorry

 

[Showkey]

You must have different standards for "cheap" than I do. At $35/bulb, that's not how I'd describe them!

Now they are VERY bright BR30 bulbs, actually the brightest floods I could find. And thus they are warm and spectacularly vented if you look at them. So I can believe maybe they require a *more* open fixture. But in my experience, most bulbs like this are installed in fixtures that are closed at the top, because they screw in at that end.

]

So they are obviously not 25000 hrs life ?

As per amazon:
CERTIFIED QUALITY-- Isolated built-in power supply with constant current making this bulb more stable, ensures a longer service life (25000 hrs. ) in the segment. With our 5-year- and 30-day-no-question-asked policy, you can sure buy with confidence!

Before you order and PAY for version 2 maybe collect on the 5 year warranty no questions asked policy ????? Especially at $35 per bulb.

LED purchase.........applies to all types, all brands........date bulbs, keep the receipts. Obviously 60 watt equivalent are now common at a $1.00 per bulb nobody bothers to complain. $35 bulb or $50-$100 fixture keep good records, but assumes the company is still around to service or collect.

 

[Vintage Veloce]

Before you order and PAY for version 2 maybe collect on the 5 year warranty no questions asked policy ????? Especially at $35 per bulb.

I thought I was clear in the original post, but maybe not: The company has been quickly replacing the failed bulbs for free under warranty. They just wouldn't proactively replace the remaining 4 that are operational still (but likely to fail IMO). I'm hoping the problem is not the heat, but that maybe version 1 had a fault. That said, if my version 2 replacements fail... well, maybe I need to get bulbs rated for an enclosed fixture...

A little research does lead me to believe Sansi is a real company.
http://www.sansi.com/aboutus/index.htm

 

[Showkey]

I thought I was clear in the original post, but maybe not: The company has been quickly replacing the failed bulbs for free under warranty. They just wouldn't proactively replace the remaining 4 that are operational still (but likely to fail IMO). I'm hoping the problem is not the heat, but that maybe version 1 had a fault. That said, if my version 2 replacements fail... well, maybe I need to get bulbs rated for an enclosed fixture...

A little research does lead me to believe Sansi is a real company.
http://www.sansi.com/aboutus/index.htm

Thanks......it’s clear now. Your statement “They still seem to be honoring the warranty“ was where I was confused where you might have been getting the run around.

It’s good see they are standing behind their warranty. My experience with Amazon returns and refunds are a no brainer and absolutely fast and without question when your in the Amazon return period. When the vendor is actually involved there’s often a delay or marginal after sale service . Your service seems to be ok.

Since regular BR30 LED bulbs are:
2700K Soft White or 5000K Daylight
650 Lumens
Actual Watts Used 7.2
Life Hours 25,000
Energy Star Dimmable
Cost about $3.00 and can be found with utility instant rebates for $1.00 Per bulb.

So these bulbs at 3500 lumens at 35 watts In the same size package is no wonder there’s a heat problem.

42 watts 4200 Lumens in a two bulb LED fixture are common for $18-$40.