Lifetime Warranties??

[Nikolai_V]

Call me crazy but does anyone else on here feel that the notion of buying cheap second hand 'branded' tools on ebay (trademe in NZ) or in pawn stores then trying to get free replacements from their dealers is somehow wrong?

I mean you didn`t pay retail, you didnt buy it from the manufacturer, so why should they give you a new one at their cost?

I`ve seen a few threads where this was treated as some kind of divine right for consumers, and that companies who dont honour this are somehow evil or wrong.

Ive done a straw poll of a few friends and colleagues, who are not communists or atheists (or anything suitably immoral) , but engineers, architects, electricians etc, and none of us would even dream of doing this. My neighbour, who is german, and a mechanical engineer actually said that in germany, people are reluctant to claim on warranties, as most feel guilty for abusing the product. If a ratchet exploded in his face for no reason, then yes, but otherwise he reasoned that things wear out, and you should buy new ones, or repair them.

I kind of agree - why should the manufacturer pay for me to have an old worn-out ratchet rebuilt? I mean i`ve used it for almost 15 years on an almost daily basis so I think i`ve got my moneys worth out of it. I don`t expect Koken to give me a new one because its gotten sloppy.

I`m not posting this as a flame-bait or anything, it just seems to be a genuine difference of philosophies. I`m going to ask my Snap-on guy what he thinks of the practise, but i`d appreciate seeing what you guys think.

 

[Danglerb]

Companies are free to sell items under almost any terms they wish, no warranty, warranty to the original retail owner, warranty for non commercial use, limited lifetime warranty.

If a SnapOn wrench could only be warrantied by the original retail purchaser it was have a lower resale value. With a lower resale value, the retail price would also drop.

Only two types of warranty are practical, short and lifetime. Either warranty everything, or keep the warranty period short so that people can keep track of the paperwork.

Most lifetime warranties don't replace tools that still work, or just have normal wear issues.

I've got not one moment of guilt, "somebody" paid for the warranty, and I paid a premium for it used because it has that warranty.

 

[kidney]

Well, the manufacturer shouldn't offer a life time warranty as a selling point then. I have no issue taking anything back. Mainly b/c I would only assume that the warranty is included in the price that someone paid. However, there are a lot of tools out there that really don't fall under warranty. I doubt Channellock would take back a pair of pliers who's teeth have worn off from years of use, nor would I expect them to.

It would seem to me that in our day in age, too many companies are trying to cut corners in quality. I feel no remorse in taking back a busted Craftsman ratchet. Why is it that I have an old Indestro ratchet (at least 30 years old) that I use all the time, while some of the Craftsman ratchets I own wont make it a year? I also feel that a life time warranty builds brand loyalty. For instance: Lets take Snap-on and Mac. And say they both don't offer any warranty. We have two techs, one uses a Snap-on ratchet and the other a Mac. The tech with the Mac ratchet breaks his and is SOL now. All the while the Snappy ratchet the other tech is using is still working great. I have a pretty strong feeling the tech with the busted Mac ratchet would be the first in line when the Snappy truck rolls around. With a warranty, the tech with the Mac ratchet can just walk up to his Mac guy and get it fixed right on the spot.

I also think Craftsman uses their warranty to cover their sometimes crappy tools. How many people would buy Craftsman tools with no warranty? I know I wouldn't.

 

[Stuey]

A lot of times, I imagine replacement expenses are factored into a tool's original price. There's a reason that Craftsman charges $25 for certain rebranded products that can be found elsewhere for $20. In that type of a situation, they more then recoup the replacement costs unless everyone tries to have their tools replaces at the same time.

 

[rsanter]

the cost of the warranty is built into the cost of the tool. a lifetime warranty is how a company tells the public that they stand behind the tool they are selling.
I have broken less than 10 snap on tools over the last 20 years because I take care of my stuff even though I used to work as a mechanic and the stuff got used all the time.

I used to work for Black and Decker. as a rule of thumb the price they sold the tools for was double the cost of manufacture+warranty+shipping+warehousing...etc
a smart company will factor all of it in

I do not feel bad at all. I will buy lifetime name brand stuff used and ignore the rest

bob

 

[oxycodone]

My $.02:

When a reputable company offers a lifetime warranty on their product, they should replace it when it fails. End of story.


Now, companies offer lifetime warranties for many reasons, but usually because of economics...

A = Number of items produced
B = Number of failures
C = Percentage of people that will actually warranty a failure
D = Total Production cost of a single item
E = Retail Price of a single item
Z = Profit

(A x E) - (A x D) - (B x C x D) = Z

Snap-On charges $100 for a FLF80. Let's say that they make 1,000 of them, half of them will fail, 80% will seek a replacement, and it cost them $30 to inclusively produce a FLF80...

(1000 x $100) - (1000 x $30) - (500 x .80 x $30) = $58,000 profit.

Just a numbers game.

Think of all the products that have lifetime warranties that have a 100% failure rate... like brake pads. Now, these warranties will stipulate that you have a proof of purchase, so C goes way down.
Say it's $40 for a set of pads that cost $5 to make, they'll ALL fail, but only 10% will be eligible for a warranty - per thousand made:

(1000 x $40) - (1000 x $5) - (1000 x .1 x $5) = $30,000 profit.

 

[Dan95YJ]

If the tool is defective, then it should be taken back regardless of where you bought it. If the tool was abused, i.e. you used pliers to turn a screwdriver, then you don't deserve a free replacement.

 

[nissan_crawler]

Call me crazy, but if the company offers a lifetime warranty and doesn't give a damn how or why I have a broken tool, or if I bought it new or used, then I don't either. I bought a Snap-On 32 tooth 3/8" ratchet with 10 sockets for $45, sold the sockets for $40, then went to the Snap-On lady and got $40 credit for a new ratchet turning in my $5 one. She knew what I paid for it, didn't care. I get some Snap-On tools on ebay and they break and I get them exchanged. She sometimes asks when she sold it because she doesn't remember, and I tell her it's from Ebay. She doesn't care.

I've shattered my Craftsman mechanics mirror 9 times on the large one, and 4 times on the small one, they never question exchanging it, why should I

Hell, I buy General brand spring loaded punches, and when I break the tips, I buy a package (snap-on is rebadged general) of 2 tips. She then tells me to bring the old broken tips back in that little envelope and she'll exchange those for 2 more new ones so I have spares, FULLY KNOWING that they are off of a General brand punch, NOT a snap-on one.

You're forgetting the flip side of things. If Snap-On didn't honor that warranty, how many customers would they lose? I wouldn't pay squat for a Snap-On tool if there was no warranty. Most people wouldn't. They get good money from them BECAUSE of that warranty. What's an $80 ratchet now would be maybe a $40-50 ratchet with a limited warranty, and only $20 used instead of $40 used. Even if they offered a warranty to the original buyer, the tool value would decrease IMMENSELY, because who wants to keep paperwork for every damn socket and screwdriver they buy?

Why has (until recently anyway) Craftsman had such a huge following? There are plenty of other manufacturers out there with the same grade of tools. One reason: WARRANTY.

Hell I have bought (and would again) boxes of broken Craftsman/Mac/Snap-ON/Matco, etc., at auction sales and had them exchanged for new. Sorry, that warranty was paid for. When I go in to get them warrantied that time or the next time, I'll also probably be buying extra tools. Do I feel guilty about it? Not one bit. I paid $3 for a box of tools at an auction sale and ended up with almost $700 of new Craftsman/Snap-On/Mac tools.

I build steel things on the side sometimes. One guy had a set of ramps I built that he hooked on the trailer wrong and bent an end piece. He offered to pay for it, I cut it off and welded a new one on for free. Why? He paid a premium price the first time, and he'll be back for more paying work, guaranteed.

I built an ornate gate for a guy at work. His kid crashed into it with the four-wheeler and bent two bars. Again, I fixed it for free. He was tickled pink, and got me two new customers by mentioning how happy he was. If I had told him to get bent and pay up, I would've been out almost $700 from the other customers...

 

[eschoendorff]

Well, the manufacturer shouldn't offer a life time warranty as a selling point then. I have no issue taking anything back. Mainly b/c I would only assume that the warranty is included in the price that someone paid. However, there are a lot of tools out there that really don't fall under warranty. I doubt Channellock would take back a pair of pliers who's teeth have worn off from years of use, nor would I expect them to.

It would seem to me that in our day in age, too many companies are trying to cut corners in quality. I feel no remorse in taking back a busted Craftsman ratchet. Why is it that I have an old Indestro ratchet (at least 30 years old) that I use all the time, while some of the Craftsman ratchets I own wont make it a year? I also feel that a life time warranty builds brand loyalty. For instance: Lets take Snap-on and Mac. And say they both don't offer any warranty. We have two techs, one uses a Snap-on ratchet and the other a Mac. The tech with the Mac ratchet breaks his and is SOL now. All the while the Snappy ratchet the other tech is using is still working great. I have a pretty strong feeling the tech with the busted Mac ratchet would be the first in line when the Snappy truck rolls around. With a warranty, the tech with the Mac ratchet can just walk up to his Mac guy and get it fixed right on the spot.

I also think Craftsman uses their warranty to cover their sometimes crappy tools. How many people would buy Craftsman tools with no warranty? I know I wouldn't.

Well said! I am one of the most guilt-ridden people that I know (German and raised Catholic), but this is business. And my experience is that in teh business world, if you stop to contemplate "moral"issues, someone else is going to swoop in and take advantage of you. It's cut-throat.

 

[krusty the clown]

a liberal warranty policy is thier selling point and used to justify the high price so i have no problem with it. the first snappy guy i bought from said the tools were guaranteed not to rust, bust or collect dust, rip, rot, peel or smell bad.

on the same token, you would expect a used car that was still under 3yr or 36,000 mi to be warranteed even though you weren't the original owner, so whats the difference?

 

[dxdexter]

Call me crazy

Ok, your crazy!!!! Sorry I couldn't resist.

I agree that buying broken tools on Ebay just to return them for replacement is not right, but if you buy them and they break in service, then I think replacement is alright.

Most tool manufacturers "small print" says that the warranty is for the original purchasers, but seldom , if ever enforce this. How could they. The only ones that could are Snap-on with their date codes verses the age of the owner.

This subjects relates directly to several recent threads in respect to people wanting products for nothing. The manufactures know that this occurs and make up for the fact by increasing the price of the new tools to account for such losses.

There was a local mechanic, where I grew up, that always bought Snap-on. He had to have the tools polished and meticulously arranged. If the chrome was to scratch or the finish was to reach a point to become unattractive, then he would purposely break the tool and have it replaced. I think that is just plain wrong .

Warranty's are not free and the longer they last, the more you pay.

 

[D2002]

I agree that this is a very questionable practice and definately abuses the intent of the warranty.

With regards the tool dealers, they usually have acceptable percentages of sales to defectives. I would expect that he/she may clam up if the percentage of defectives is high for that ??? period of time they are rated for. On the other hand, it is a great way to increase customer loyalty and sell all those beautiful expensive new tools .

 

[wrenchr]

What I do not understand is the person who sells the broken tool, why not have it warranted and get more money when you sell it.

 

[rsanter]

if the warranty is for the original owner...what about when I get a tool from my dad. same family, in most circles if you but a car from the original family it is concidered a one owner car even if it was passed between family members

bob

 

[dxdexter]

if the warranty is for the original owner...what about when I get a tool from my dad. same family, in most circles if you but a car from the original family it is concidered a one owner car even if it was passed between family members

bob

Extended car warranty's generally are transferable for a fee, unless its the original factory warranty and that goes with the car regardless of purchaser. If it was a lifetime warranty then things would probably be different and the car cost would be so inflated that most could not afford to purchase.

Many hand power tool and stationary equipment manufacturers (not all) specify that the "original purchaser" can only receive the warranty and of course you must have the receipt to prove date of purchase. If your name is on the receipt then a "second hand" purchaser may have trouble obtaining warranty even if you gave them the receipt. These warranty's are for a specific time limit and therefore manufacturers can compete on a level playing field. Snap-on for instance can't. Their tools are highly sought after, by both pro and non-pro and sold just because of the warranty. The same cannot be said for most other brands. If I broke a craftsman socket, I either return it or throw it in the junk drawer until I get around to it, which is generally never. I don't think anyone on Ebay would buy it.

Hand tools are in a totally different league all together. No one is required (at this time) to show receipts, so they don't have any idea who bought the tool and therefore the warranty can be abused, by intentional breakage.

Professional technicians who mainly purchase these tools at inflated prices, pay for all the warranty abuse that occurs.

 

[64merc]

The other guys pretty much summed up my opinion, but I want to reiterate a couple of points:

1. The cost of warranty replacements is factored into the cost of the tool, which is why prices are so high. The manufacturers are not stupid - some of the decision makers are probably weekend wrenchers too, who also warranty their tools.

2. The person who initially bought the tool already paid the warranty premium, so it is not wrong to cash in on that prepaid premium.

3. How can the tool companies be hurting that much from the warranty exchanges if there are obviously many many broken tools that have not been warrantied.

 

[mike944]

What I do not understand is the person who sells the broken tool, why not have it warranted and get more money when you sell it.

I'd be willing to bet money that most of the broken tools sold on ebay and at swap meets have already been warrantied at least once. The broken tools have most likely been dug out of the unscruplous metal scrap yards that the tool companies send them to, and resold.

Why else would somebody be selling tons of broken tools, and tell you all you need to do is go return it for a replacement? If these tools were theirs, why wouldn't they get them replaced, and sell them if they really didn't want them anymore? I'll tell you why, because it would be the same guy showing up every month, with the exact same set of broken tools that he returned last month, and somebody would get suspicious.

All you people who buy broken tools know that, whether you'll admit it or not, and that's just wrong.

 

[Danglerb]

What I do not understand is the person who sells the broken tool, why not have it warranted and get more money when you sell it.

Two groups I can think of selling broken tools, high volume users that may not buy through normal channels, and buyers of used tools that buy whole chests and end up with some broken tools, but never buy tools new off the truck. Its much easier for both groups to sell the tools to people that will be able to have them warrantied more easily.

 

[64merc]

I'd be willing to bet money that most of the broken tools sold on ebay and at swap meets have already been warrantied at least once. The broken tools have most likely been dug out of the unscruplous metal scrap yards that the tool companies send them to, and resold.

Why else would somebody be selling tons of broken tools, and tell you all you need to do is go return it for a replacement? If these tools were theirs, why wouldn't they get them replaced, and sell them if they really didn't want them anymore? I'll tell you why, because it would be the same guy showing up every month, with the exact same set of broken tools that he returned last month, and somebody would get suspicious.

All you people who buy broken tools know that, whether you'll admit it or not, and that's just wrong.

Hold on a second mike944, I guess I didn't realize that there were two different issues here.

If what you are saying really does happen, then it would be wrong, if not illegal, for the sellers to be "recycling" old warrantied tools that were intended to be disposed of.

If someone buys a couple of broken tools at a pawn shop or digs up a couple of broken tools found in a friend's shed, then I don't see anything wrong with getting them warrantied. They were used by someone who paid a premium for the tool and then broke it, but didn't get it warrantied as they were entitled to do so.

 

[mike944]

Ok, maybe i was a little too strong there, there are some legitimate reasons that people might sell broken tools, but i suspect that the vast majority of them got there the way i said.

it does happen, and it happens a LOT

 

[64merc]

Ok, maybe i was a little too strong there, there are some legitimate reasons that people might sell broken tools, but i suspect that the vast majority of them got there the way i said.

it does happen, and it happens a LOT

Well, thank you for enlightening me. I don't buy off of Ebay so I didn't even know that the sale of broken "illegal" tools was such a problem. My personal experience comes from buying broken odds and ends from people's tools at flea markets and pawn shops.

You know, I sometimes take for granted that everyone takes as much pride in their tools as everyone on this board, but looking at people's crappy tool boxes tells me otherwise. No offense to anyone, but most tool boxes contain a collection of rusty/broken Pitsburgh, Great Neck, and Stanley tools (in my experience). Every once in a while I find a diamond in the rough

 

[Lyaec350]

Many people have mentioned that they think buying broken tools on ebay to turn right around and warranty them is wrong... take a look at the options:

Person A buys a blinker fluid drainer tool from the Snappy truck, pays full retail. 10 years later it breaks, he gets a new one from his dealer. The next day he decides he no longer needs to drain blinker fluid (it has become obsolete with new LED blinkers). I buy it on ebay (all my cars still have blinker fluid) and put it to good use for the rest of my lifetime.

Person A buys a blinker fluid drainer tool from the Snappy truck, pays full retail. 10 years later it breaks. The next day he decides he no longer needs to drain blinker fluid (it has become obsolete with new LED blinkers) and lists it on eBay. I buy it (all my cars still have blinker fluid), take it to my Snappy dealer and get it warrantied and put it to good use for the rest of my lifetime.

Both situations seem one and the same to me. In Snap-On's eyes, they built (1) blinker fluid drainer, it broke, they replaced it. Who is turning the knob on the tool over its 60 year used lifespan hardly matters.

 

[64merc]

Many people have mentioned that they think buying broken tools on ebay to turn right around and warranty them is wrong... take a look at the options:

Person A buys a blinker fluid drainer tool from the Snappy truck, pays full retail. 10 years later it breaks, he gets a new one from his dealer. The next day he decides he no longer needs to drain blinker fluid (it has become obsolete with new LED blinkers). I buy it on ebay (all my cars still have blinker fluid) and put it to good use for the rest of my lifetime.

Person A buys a blinker fluid drainer tool from the Snappy truck, pays full retail. 10 years later it breaks. The next day he decides he no longer needs to drain blinker fluid (it has become obsolete with new LED blinkers) and lists it on eBay. I buy it (all my cars still have blinker fluid), take it to my Snappy dealer and get it warrantied and put it to good use for the rest of my lifetime.

Both situations seem one and the same to me. In Snap-On's eyes, they built (1) blinker fluid drainer, it broke, they replaced it. Who is turning the knob on the tool over its 60 year used lifespan hardly matters.

Good example - I agree with you 100%

In my mind, the only example that causes concern is when someone gets discarded tools from the manufacturer using shady techniques and then sells them to be warrantied yet again. Other than this, you bought it so you're entitled to the warranty as well.

 

[jackmcmanus21]

Good example - I agree with you 100%

In my mind, the only example that causes concern is when someone gets discarded tools from the manufacturer using shady techniques and then sells them to be warrantied yet again. Other than this, you bought it so you're entitled to the warranty as well.

I agree with you there. You should be ethical and responsible when dealing with issues like this. I'd rather not look like a scumbag than save a few bucks

 

[dxdexter]

Many people have mentioned that they think buying broken tools on ebay to turn right around and warranty them is wrong... take a look at the options:

Person A buys a blinker fluid drainer tool from the Snappy truck, pays full retail. 10 years later it breaks, he gets a new one from his dealer. The next day he decides he no longer needs to drain blinker fluid (it has become obsolete with new LED blinkers). I buy it on ebay (all my cars still have blinker fluid) and put it to good use for the rest of my lifetime.

Person A buys a blinker fluid drainer tool from the Snappy truck, pays full retail. 10 years later it breaks. The next day he decides he no longer needs to drain blinker fluid (it has become obsolete with new LED blinkers) and lists it on eBay. I buy it (all my cars still have blinker fluid), take it to my Snappy dealer and get it warrantied and put it to good use for the rest of my lifetime.

Both situations seem one and the same to me. In Snap-On's eyes, they built (1) blinker fluid drainer, it broke, they replaced it. Who is turning the knob on the tool over its 60 year used lifespan hardly matters.

I have no problem with the scenario you describe. My beef is with the people who intentionally destroy tools in order to acquire new tools.

In reality the person who broke the tool would have returned it for warranty and them sold it on eBay for a higher amount than a broken tool. It would only make sense. The people who sell broken tools on Ebay more than likely don't get them legitimately.

 

[Dan95YJ]

I have no problem with the scenario you describe. My beef is with the people who intentionally destroy tools in order to acquire new tools.

In reality the person who broke the tool would have returned it for warranty and them sold it on eBay for a higher amount than a broken tool. It would only make sense. The people who sell broken tools on Ebay more than likely don't get them legitimately.

THIS is what I agree with!

 

[doug.j]

I'd rather buy a well designed tool or widget that when used properly works great and if used improperly will probably fail. To me is seems most stuff that sells based on warranty is either overpriced or built for abuse over performance. I don't expect a replacement unless the item broke under reasonable conditions. I believe part of Sears problems are related to warranty. People expect to get new screwdriver when they've used it as a chisel. Sears makes them cheap to compensate and covers them. People treat them as junk and the problem goes on.

 

[Coach James]

The manager of our local Sears has told me to look for C-man tools at flea markets and yardsales and bring the broken ones in for replacement. He said he'd be glad to do the warrenty for me. I havn't as I'm not much for going to yard sales and there are no flea markets around here. Plus even though he says to do it, I still wouldn't feel right about it.

Coach

 

[Danglerb]

I have no problem with the scenario you describe. My beef is with the people who intentionally destroy tools in order to acquire new tools.

In reality the person who broke the tool would have returned it for warranty and them sold it on eBay for a higher amount than a broken tool. It would only make sense. The people who sell broken tools on Ebay more than likely don't get them legitimately.

I think you vastly overestimate the pool of illegally gotten tools and how they are sold.

The first thing every thief that gets caught does is rat out their fence, its not a long term trade, its a get away with it a few months thing, then go to jail.

People who sell at swap meets or ebay might as well put up a sign that says, police come and check me out, and police routinely do check them out and go over their records of what was acquired and from whom.

 

[dxdexter]

I think you vastly overestimate the pool of illegally gotten tools and how they are sold.

Perhaps you're right, maybe I am a little cynical when it comes to second hand tool sales. I have been relieved of several thousand dollars worth, back in 1990 and always have that in my mind when I check local flea markets.

The odd broken tool from eBay is not suspicious, its the guy selling 20lbs of broken tools that looks mighty shady. Maybe I as well as several others are way off base.

 

[64merc]

I'd rather buy a well designed tool or widget that when used properly works great and if used improperly will probably fail. To me is seems most stuff that sells based on warranty is either overpriced or built for abuse over performance. I don't expect a replacement unless the item broke under reasonable conditions. I believe part of Sears problems are related to warranty. People expect to get new screwdriver when they've used it as a chisel. Sears makes them cheap to compensate and covers them. People treat them as junk and the problem goes on.

That's actually a great point, but if they stopped replacing these "prybars" then sales would drop and prices would go up to compensate anyway. I think that Sears is so far in the hole now that there is no turning back.

 

[Rickster]

Either a tool has a warranty or it doesn't. The fine print of the Snapon website tells you that they only warranty tools purchased from an authorized dealer. Yet, in the real world how is this regulated? Are you required to have you're reciept present when the tool needs warranty or does your dealer just have to know you? What if you get a new dealer? The bottom line is the company and their dealers have created this mess because there is no defined method for how the warranty claim is made enforceable. Together with the changing job environment in which the tools themselves are sold and warrantied one can only conclude that the warranty claim of first purchaser was never intended to be enforced. Additionally, the company has created an environment where purchasers can routinely be denied warranty based solely on the whim of the distributor, whether that's based on authorized purchase or tool abuse. ....I will now step off my soap box.

 

[fourfeathers]

When the Snap On truck stops selling repo tools, and Sears stops selling refurbished stuff, then I will fell bad about returning stuff bought second or even 3rd hand.
I have bought broken tools from a retired SO dealer, returned them, and ebayed the BRAND NEW tool. So, I am the *******? Ok, maybe I am, but...

 

[eschoendorff]

When the Snap On truck stops selling repo tools, and Sears stops selling refurbished stuff, then I will fell bad about returning stuff bought second or even 3rd hand.
I have bought broken tools from a retired SO dealer, returned them, and ebayed the BRAND NEW tool. So, I am the *******? Ok, maybe I am, but...

You're an ******* too??? Man, I though I was the only one around here! Howdy!

 

[UK Steve]

Call me crazy but does anyone else on here feel that the notion of buying cheap second hand 'branded' tools on ebay (trademe in NZ) or in pawn stores then trying to get free replacements from their dealers is somehow wrong?

I mean you didn`t pay retail, you didnt buy it from the manufacturer, so why should they give you a new one at their cost?

I`ve seen a few threads where this was treated as some kind of divine right for consumers, and that companies who dont honour this are somehow evil or wrong.

Ive done a straw poll of a few friends and colleagues, who are not communists or atheists (or anything suitably immoral) , but engineers, architects, electricians etc, and none of us would even dream of doing this. My neighbour, who is german, and a mechanical engineer actually said that in germany, people are reluctant to claim on warranties, as most feel guilty for abusing the product. If a ratchet exploded in his face for no reason, then yes, but otherwise he reasoned that things wear out, and you should buy new ones, or repair them.

I kind of agree - why should the manufacturer pay for me to have an old worn-out ratchet rebuilt? I mean i`ve used it for almost 15 years on an almost daily basis so I think i`ve got my moneys worth out of it. I don`t expect Koken to give me a new one because its gotten sloppy.

I`m not posting this as a flame-bait or anything, it just seems to be a genuine difference of philosophies. I`m going to ask my Snap-on guy what he thinks of the practise, but i`d appreciate seeing what you guys think.

Sorry for bumping this old thread up..
Nikolai, it seems you really started something here. If you take a look in any high quality tool catalogue the warranties are around the same wording basically " Any ............ tool that fails because of defective material or workmanship will be replaced or repaired through your dealer* ect.
Now... that is very basic and to the point and tool manufacturers take it to the letter.
Lets face it if a tool has worn out it's life is over. As for building warranty into the purchase price... take a $100 ratchet how many dealers, field managers, sales managers & branch managers take a slice of the $100, then you have the fancy cars for all those managers.
No the price does not include warranty items these days but I'm sure it used to 50 years back.
Then at the sharp end you have the tool dealer who has to decide whether to exchange the "warranty item", because at the end of the month his field manager will pay him a visit and make two piles of returns one pile the company will stand warranty and the second pile (usually the largest).....well that's down to the dealer to swallow.
So basically the "warranty" is a desision the tool dealer makes, and if he has been around a long time his decision will be different to a Rookie dealer....sad but true.

 

[rsanter]

I disagree with you on the point of warranty costs not bieng built in.
any company that does not have their collective heads up their *** will be building that into the cost of the product. as an engineer I have worked for several companied that I know for a fact adds a cost for warranty or service into the selling price of the product.

I have a bunch of SO tools as well as other brands. I can say that I have had to warranty very few of my SO tools Cman on the other hand has had a higher percentage of warranty replacement.

now if you ask would I buy a used tool and then break it so I can get warranty. that is questionable for sure

bob

 

[autoace]

Companies are free to sell items under almost any terms they wish, no warranty, warranty to the original retail owner, warranty for non commercial use, limited lifetime warranty.

If a SnapOn wrench could only be warrantied by the original retail purchaser it was have a lower resale value. With a lower resale value, the retail price would also drop.

Only two types of warranty are practical, short and lifetime. Either warranty everything, or keep the warranty period short so that people can keep track of the paperwork.

Most lifetime warranties don't replace tools that still work, or just have normal wear issues.

I've got not one moment of guilt, "somebody" paid for the warranty, and I paid a premium for it used because it has that warranty.

Snap-on warranty states, warranty to original purchaser, and they are starting to enforce it. Don't believe me? Try to warranty some old tools through Snap-on. They won't even replace new tools that were shipped defective, I give them to different people, virtually no warranty. Snap-on is not worth the money, for most things.

 

[autoace]

What I do not understand is the person who sells the broken tool, why not have it warranted and get more money when you sell it.

It's because, very few dealers really warranty well. Warranty replacement through Snap-on can be difficult,etc...I have given away truck brand tools, to several people, because I could not get them replaced under warranty, and the tools were brand new If a tool manufacturer gives me a hard time about warranty for legitimate claims, I cease to buy their tools!
In my experience Craftsman,Stanley,and Proto have easy warranty replacement, for the most part, in that order. Snap-on,MAC,and SK...I have found next to useless, in that order! I know there are exceptions, but that is my experience of about 19 years or dealing with these manufacturers.

 

[Vulturej]

My .02¢ worth.

A life time warranty, should be for a life time.

My SO dealer will warranty anything I bring him, because I do business with him. Sometimes if he only has one of the items on his truck he orders it for me. I have broken a couple items on the road and he set me up with the local dealer for replacement.

Now if someone brings him several broken tools and he has never done any business with them and there only purpose for tracking him down was to get the tool warranted, he will give them a card with info how to mail it in to SO for replacement. I agree with his policy, I know a lot of people won’t.

Dealers that sell broken tools they have been compensated for and did not have to turn in should be shot!

 

[autoace]

My .02¢ worth.

A life time warranty, should be for a life time.

My SO dealer will warranty anything I bring him, because I do business with him. Sometimes if he only has one of the items on his truck he orders it for me. I have broken a couple items on the road and he set me up with the local dealer for replacement.

Now if someone brings him several broken tools and he has never done any business with them and there only purpose for tracking him down was to get the tool warranted, he will give them a card with info how to mail it in to SO for replacement. I agree with his policy, I know a lot of people won’t.

Dealers that sell broken tools they have been compensated for and did not have to turn in should be shot!

I agree with you, but what happens if you lose your dealer, and don't have one for awhile, and some new dealer doesn't warranty well for you because, you gave the old dealer most of the money, etc... Then you become the guy with many expensive Snap-on tools with virtually no warranty! Snap-on warranty is mostly a "temporary warranty" if you have a good dealer, you spend money with. You get warranty service if you are spending money on a regular basis, otherwise cross your fingers.