Los Angeles code: romex or bx?

[Brinskan]

Hey,

I just moved to Venice from NYC, where BX is the only approved wiring in both residential and commercial applications, but I noticed that my garage here in Venice has a mix of BX and Romex.

Anyone know the rules as to what needs to be used where? I have done some google searches with conflicting results.

Thanks,

-BS

 

[MrMark]

Romex everywhere when protected from physical damage. I have seen some open stud applications of BX but it is not current codewise any different from romex with regard to the requirement of physical protection when deemed necessary by the inspector.

This is one of those things where you will never get a straight answer from anyone. I think that there is some "thought" that BX is allowed to be run exposed in a garage but I have never seen anything to back that up. Some inspectors may also have this "thought."

I would never use BX, but that is just me.

If this is exposed I would run EMT.

To summarize, I have never been able to find any place where BX is allowed that romex is not. If protection is required you would need EMT.

To be sure you will need to ask the building inspector and even they may not know.

 

[Brinskan]

MrMark,

Thanks. That makes sense. In NYC we use BX in the walls because of rats.

-BS

 

[MrMark]

Funny. I was wondering about that. Why BX???? which seems like shiiite to me. Would have never guessed!

 

[Frank The Plumber]

Chicago is all emt.

 

[cowboyjosh]

Denver and Phoenix its all Romex, we really don't have the rat and rodent problems NYC and Chicago do, and by Chicago rats, I mean Politicians.

In Colorado I know of a fella who wanted to EMT his whole house and the AHJ said "NO" due to "moisture" and condensation concerns; he ended up settling for Romex.

For a city like LA that has incredible building codes, Im surprised they allow Romex.

I know areas on Ohio where Romex is allowed in wood and some medal frame commercial buildings if the Romex is "protected". Who'd a thunk it?

 

[mrb]

if LA didnt allow romex then half the 'electricians' in so cal would be out of work because all they can do is rope romex.

romex became allowed due to a push from hud because of the huge cost savings. basically govt said if its not being done in romex, we're not paying for it.

personally, i hate the stuff.

 

[Norcal]

NM cable does just fine, there is absolutely no reason to bow down to union featherbedding & require EMT or other metallic wiring methods for residential wiring.

 

[MrMark]

if LA didnt allow romex then half the 'electricians' in so cal would be out of work because all they can do is rope romex.

romex became allowed due to a push from hud because of the huge cost savings. basically govt said if its not being done in romex, we're not paying for it.

personally, i hate the stuff.

What do you like? EMT requires big holes that ruins studs and structure. Electricians and plumbers tear up the house enough as it is. Surely, you don't like flex which is **** and requires big holes too.

 

[mrb]

What do you like? EMT requires big holes that ruins studs and structure. Electricians and plumbers tear up the house enough as it is. Surely, you don't like flex which is **** and requires big holes too.

MC in walls and ceilings, EMT in open stud garages, etc.

im not saying this is the way it should be for everyone, this is my personal preference.

i especially hate seeing exposed romex in garages and shops.

 

[MrMark]

What is the difference between MC and BX? I would definitely do EMT in open. MC = metal clad = greenfield = flex? All the same thing?

 

[mrb]

What is the difference between MC and BX? I would definitely do EMT in open. MC = metal clad = greenfield = flex? All the same thing?

BX is old and hasnt been made for many years. Sometimes people call MC BX.

FMC aka flex aka freenfield is flexible metal conduit. it is big and comes empty

MC is ~3/8in dia, comes with wires including insulated ground. the sheath is not suitable for grounding. There is a newer one with an aluminum strip for the ground, big timesaver but i havent used it yet, may require special fittings.

 

[MrMark]

Thanks man. I've used quite a bit of flex aka FMC aka greenfield and do not like it one bit. I've used a wee little bit of the mc I believe, if that is the one that requires the anti short bushing and needs a special tool to cut. Outside for the entrance I've used PVC and even a little ridgid for something once. I like NM and PVC the best so far.

Why do you prefer MC over NM cable? Do you feel that it offers some additional protection? If is much tougher to do correctly, no?

 

[mrb]

MC isnt *that* much more $ than romex, esp @ current copper prices. it doesnt get abraded when pulled through holes in framing members, you dont have overdriven staples causing AFCI trips, its more resistant to damage by other trades, and you dont have uninsulated grounds inside boxes presenting an opportunity for ground faults. I dont see it as tougher to do correctly. A little more money after considering fittings and metal boxes, but I look at the big picture and the extra couple hundred bucks on a $XXXX+ job shouldnt matter -if it does you have bigger problems than your wiring.

 

[MrMark]

Makes sense. I use 4S or 5S metal boxes mostly anyway for strength and capacity. I can see the chaffing issues. I am always careful to just snug the staples but I have seen them basically cutting through on work I have ripped out. It is tougher to make the bends with that MC though. Going through a corner isn't happening either. You can go up and over, but you limit some options there. Something to consider . . .

 

[cowboyjosh]

MC in walls and ceilings, EMT in open stud garages, etc.

im not saying this is the way it should be for everyone, this is my personal preference.

i especially hate seeing exposed romex in garages and shops.

Only hacks and ignorant DIYers are stupid enough to expose Romex or use extension cord wiring(usually for lightingfrom what i usually see) in garages.

One problem with wiring a house with mc cable is new True Joist have knock outs for Romex so there is little drilling to do when pulling wire, mc cable in our AHJ cannot run thru the provided knock outs, it would have to be secured to the bottoms of the joist, which could be problematic if one finishes a basement with a drywall ceiling at a later time. Again this is a long shot, but still a concern. Personally if i ever build myself a new house it will be wired in mc cable and or emt.

 

[Thruxton]

MC isnt *that* much more $ than romex, esp @ current copper prices. it doesnt get abraded when pulled through holes in framing members, you dont have overdriven staples causing AFCI trips, its more resistant to damage by other trades, and you dont have uninsulated grounds inside boxes presenting an opportunity for ground faults. I dont see it as tougher to do correctly. A little more money after considering fittings and metal boxes, but I look at the big picture and the extra couple hundred bucks on a $XXXX+ job shouldnt matter -if it does you have bigger problems than your wiring.

I'm an amateur, but I just rewired the second floor and attic in my house to get rid of some very flaky old BX. I have seen enough Romex chewed through by squirrels that I went with MC. I bought the cutter and that was about the only thing that was complicated about switching over to a different system. Now I really like using this stuff, even the drops to switches and receptacles weren't hard. My garage redo is going to be all EMT though, except for MC in the ceiling for lighting.

 

[ddawg16]

There are some cities in LA that require MC....Redondo Beach is one of them I believe....

Personally.....If I'm going to have a bunch of wires going to a certain location....I would rather run conduit and use THHN.