New rafters, new wire, romex or conduit.

[madosta]

I'm renovating a block garage (I need a build thread... I know... and pics... soon) and just moved my cross ties up about 11 inches and had a structural engineer over last night to approve them. (All was good, he said I should add a couple more between the garage doors - weak point of masonry), which I will.

Anyways, I have these new 2x6 rafters and installed a new garage door opener under them but I have an extension cord operating it now temporarily.

I have conduit to j box (GFCI) from the panel and was going conduit up above the block and then NM stapled (uninsulated ), down the side of the rafter, to the opener, and then a plastic duplex box and recept. I would be using conduit from the ceiling to the junction box to sheath NM and stranded in the conduit.

I'm thinking about just running conduit all the way on the side of the rafter to the opener, but it seems like overkill since I have 2 more doors that might want some amps.

Do I need insulated NM staples?
Should I just use NM or route conduit for fun? ugh.

 

[pattenp]

I'd just use the NM and the plastic style staples with two nails....

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Pick a system and stay with it. Worst looking thing I can think of is a mix of plastic boxes, PVC conduit, metal conduit, metal boxes, romex, loose wires, etc. It just looks unprofessional to me.

I do understand that you need conduit run down the walls to protect the wires and metal conduit, metal boxes and romex run open up in the wood structure is fine, but whatever you do, stick with it throughout the build or reconstruction.

I had some wiring I did one way, and later decided to standardize on something different, and I ended up ripping out the earlier installation and doing it to match my "standardized" installation.

Charles

 

[madosta]

Pick a system and stay with it. Worst looking thing I can think of is a mix of plastic boxes, PVC conduit, metal conduit, metal boxes, romex, loose wires, etc. It just looks unprofessional to me.

I do understand that you need conduit run down the walls to protect the wires and metal conduit, metal boxes and romex run open up in the wood structure is fine, but whatever you do, stick with it throughout the build or reconstruction.

I had some wiring I did one way, and later decided to standardize on something different, and I ended up ripping out the earlier installation and doing it to match my "standardized" installation.

Charles

I hear ya! That's why I don't know if it would be worth it to run conduit. I love the look of conduit, but it's an ok garage, not my ideal shop.

I bought both steel and plastic nail ons, but with romex, I'm thinking plastic makes more sense. (This is only for the opener recepts and the lighting recepts.) Fluorescent lights will be hard wired with romex in the future. The rest of the accessible stuff will be in conduit.

I think I'm going conduit for the block wall stuff below the top plate and romex, plastic for the ceiling.

 

[pattenp]

I hear ya! That's why I don't know if it would be worth it to run conduit. I love the look of conduit, but it's an ok garage, not my ideal shop.

I bought both steel and plastic nail ons, but with romex, I'm thinking plastic makes more sense. (This is only for the opener recepts and the lighting recepts.) Fluorescent lights will be hard wired with romex in the future. The rest of the accessible stuff will be in conduit.

I think I'm going conduit for the block wall stuff below the top plate and romex, plastic for the ceiling.

There is nothing wrong with your choice of doing it this way. I believe it's a time and money smart way to do it.

 

[bczygan]

There is nothing wrong with your choice of doing it this way. I believe it's a time and money smart way to do it.

And while it doesn't all match, it looks and feels appropriate, which is better in my book.

 

[madosta]

So I put in a GFCI on the panel with a switch that will be for outdoor lights (3-way 14ga in the box to the house) and ran the romex up to the rafters. I don't like them on the rafters, but I plan on putting firring strips on both sides of the romex once the rest of the garage romex is run.

 

[madosta]

No thoughts, questions, concerns? Spot any issues?

 

[pattenp]

You should put EMT bushings on the conduit ends.

 

[madosta]

You should put EMT bushings on the conduit ends.

Yea, sorry the pics are ****. I have those little red bushings between the NM and EMT.

 

[pattenp]

If you used what are called redheads they are for armored cable or flex conduit.

 

[madosta]

If you used what are called redheads they are for armored cable or flex conduit.

Yes, when I think of redheads I think of "gingers" first, then redhead anchors... lol

I have seen the redheads used before like this locally and my electrician has done it as well, although I much like the method you suggested.

I'll get some more bang on insulators ASAP.

Something like this: http://www.aifittings.com/products/spec-sheets/emt50.pdf

 

[pattenp]

Yes, when I think of redheads I think of "gingers" first, then redhead anchors... lol

I have seen the redheads used before like this locally and my electrician has done it as well, although I much like the method you suggested.

I'll get some more bang on insulators ASAP.

Something like this: http://www.aifittings.com/products/spec-sheets/emt50.pdf

I don't know that I would worry about it. Too much work to change'em over.

 

[madosta]

I don't know that I would worry about it. Too much work to change'em over.

Well, I might be running another 14-2 romex in the same 1/2" sleeve. I have also seen that done before, but don't know about the fill of 2 14-2 NM in 1/2" EMT. "Should be fine" as well and fairly easy for such a short run.

I'll probably change them out then.

Thanks pattenp.

 

[pattenp]

Even though two 14/2 NM may fit in 1/2" conduit I believe the conduit is overfilled because the cross section area of the cable is calculated based on the wide dimension of the cable for fill area. Even though your conduit run is short, if my memory serves me, the normal fill rates apply to conduit over 24". Even at 24" or less, I think the max fill is 60%.

I'm just providing this as info, not to make your life hard.

 

[madosta]

Even though two 14/2 NM may fit in 1/2" conduit I believe the conduit is overfilled because the cross section area of the cable is calculated based on the wide dimension of the cable for fill area. Even though your conduit run is short, if my memory serves me, the normal fill rates apply to conduit over 24". Even at 24" or less, I think the max fill is 60%.

I'm just providing this as info, not to make your life hard.

No worries. I was thinking the same thing. I can't find the fill chart for NM in 1/2inch if it's single cable and 6 14ga conductors. Probably have my electrician bend the 3/4 for this since I don't have any tools for that.

I'm thinking 14/2 width/diameter = .388 x 2 @ .6 should be 3/4 EMT.

 

[pattenp]

The MM2 area of 14/2 NM should be at 65.64 MM2. The fill for 1/2" EMT with 2 conductors is 61 MM2. So it's over a little, but to me not enough to worry about. This is provided my math is correct.

Oh yeah... 3/4" will do.

Duh... I forgot to do the math for two 14/2 NM cables. That's 131.28 MM2, almost a 70% fill in the 1/2" EMT.

 

[madosta]

Continuing the circuit in Romex® NM-B cable to an outlet mounted above the opener and then to another outlet(s) for other openers would be a proper installation. National Electric Code® Section 334.30 details the securing and supporting of this cable. Staples either insulated or non-insulated listed for this purpose can be used.
This answer is intended to apply to Romex® Brand NM Cable. For other NM cables, please check with those respective brand suppliers or cable manufacturers. Romex® is a Registered Trademark of Southwire Company.
This communication is for general informational purposes only and is not intended to constitute advice. As all the facts and circumstances in any given situation may not be apparent, this communication is not intended to be, and should not be, relied upon by the reader in making decisions with respect to the issues discussed herein, and the reader assumes the risk if he or she chooses to do so. The reader is encouraged to consult an expert before making any decisions or taking any action concerning the matters in this communication. All warranties, express or implied, including warranties regarding accuracy, adequacy, completeness, legality, reliability, safety or usefulness of any information, ARE DISCLAIMED. Southwire Company is not liable for any damages however caused and on any theory of liability arising in any way out of the information provided or the reader's use of it.

Thank you Mr. Corporate.