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Some Fluorescent RFI info

66HertzClone

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Dec 6, 2006
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4,068
Location
Long Valley, NJ
I was at a trade show last week and stopped to talk to the people at a booth with fluorescent lighting. They were featuring T5 fixtures, saying this was the newest best thing available. Since I'm still searching to find the "right" fixtures for my garage I asked them some questions. They had some trouble telling me how these fixtures would react to my unheated garage in the winter time, no real answer to that question, just a dance around committing to an answer. I asked about RFI, they weren't sure but told me they would research and get back to me. Well today I received this from them, thought some others might like to see what they had to say. The vendor in question is Wesco lighting. BTW, I didn't say zero emission, just low emission.



What level of RFI are your fixtures emitting? One gentleman is looking to see if you offer any with 0 RFI. We offer a Radio Interference Filter option for our fluorescent fixtures. It’s approximately a $20 adder per fixture. We’ve used it in laboratories and in the medical field where there’s a concern to protect highly sensitive equipment. I will check on RFI levels for you.

Here’s more info on RFI –

Electromagnetic Interference (EMI)

Because of the arcing action at the lamp cathodes, all fluorescent ballast and lamps as a system generates EMI (Electromagnetic Interference), a portion of which is in the RFI (Radio Frequency Interference) range. This energy may interfere with sensitive equipment by one of three methods:

Direct radiation from the lamp,

Line feedback from the lamp through the power line, and

Direct radiation from the electric supply line.

Typically, the type of equipment RFI affects is radios, television, sound amplifiers, electronic devices, radar, telemetry systems and computer systems. A shielded fixture must provide for control of both feedback (line suppresser) and direct radiation. (shielded lens). Line feedback and line radiation may be suppressed through the use of a power line interference filter. Lithonia has two line suppresser options:

The RIF1 line suppresser limits emissions in the AM broadcast frequency range of 550 - 1600 KHz. An external RIF filter might not be required when a Class-A electronic ballast is use. The internal filtering of an electronic ballast does limit emissions in the AM broadcast frequency range of 550 - 1600 KHz, which makes the RIF unnecessary. However, if direct radiation (radiation from the lamp) is a concern then a shielded lens would still be necessary, even though the RIF filter is not required. Lithonia will supply an electronic ballast with external RIF suppressers if the project specification demands it.

The EIS1 line suppresser will meet the requirements of Military Standards 461A/462/463. These standards provide limits and measurement procedures for testing and qualifying shielded luminaries. The EIS1 line suppresser limits emissions in the frequency range of 50Khz - 50MHz. The RIF1 filter option does not meet the military standards. The EMI requirements of MIL Std 461 are more stringent than those imposed by the FCC (CFR 47 part 18) for an electronic ballast to receive an FCC-Class A (non-consumer) classification. Therefore an EIS filter would be necessary on any application that required fixtures (60Hz magnetic or high-frequency electronic) be in compliance with MIL STD461/462/463.
 
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kbs2244

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Nov 11, 2006
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So, you plan on doing brain surgury in your shop?

I my experice, even the cheapest fixtures, in the coldest weather, warm up enough in 20min. so that they don't bother even the cheapest portable AM radio with no attenna.

If I want to listen to talk radio I just put up with it or switch to FM for a while.
 

Chris Adams

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Oct 21, 2007
Messages
2,117
So, you plan on doing brain surgury in your shop?

I my experice, even the cheapest fixtures, in the coldest weather, warm up enough in 20min. so that they don't bother even the cheapest portable AM radio with no attenna.

If I want to listen to talk radio I just put up with it or switch to FM for a while.

I don't think you realize that not everyone lives in your area...:lol_hitti

Here there is only one (1) station that carries the talk I want to hear. So the choice is skip it, or have no static.

Trying to hear it over static is not conducive to a happy work environment...:(

Lots of cheap transformers will jam FM pretty good also, so even if there is a local FM talk station, (here there isn't) switching to FM wouldn’t help.
Also makes it pretty hard to test, diagnose, repair, radios in cars (something I do fairly often) when the static makes it impossible to hear AM.

So static making transformers are really a bad thing if you listen to radio in your shop, unless you are lucky enough to live somewhere with lots of radio stations on both bands that supply what you want.
Most folks don't.
As to them 'clearing up' when warm, that is only if the noise is cold related. I have had plenty of T12 transformers that NEVER shut up. Dang things would Buzz, then Hum, then Buzz again, all day long.
This was in shop and store environments. When you have twenty/fifty lights in the ceiling the company isn't going to pay for you to bug hunt all the lights and replace the noisy buggers.
In a home shop, with 14 transformers any one of which can jam the radio, knowing which ones make less noise is a real plus, before you find yourself with 14 different buzz, hum, crackle sounds to fix...
 

judgethis

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Joined
Nov 11, 2008
Messages
261
Location
maryland
I have 18 T5 lamps in my garage and havent had any problems with them. I have them on a sensor switch so when I walk in they come on instantly and bright. I havent had any problem with the TV or Radio.
Ill try to post some pictures this weekend.
 
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kbs2244

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Nov 11, 2006
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Good point Chris.
Radio reciption can vary a lot with location.
 

Dragster Racer

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Feb 9, 2008
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Location
Morrison, IL
You know, I gave up on trying to get good reception in my old shop without an antenna. I went out and bought at a tv store a radio antenna, and mouted it to a pole outside the shop. You would not believe the reception. No static or anything. It's a pretty simple antenna, and as I recall, didn't cost a fortune.
 

Chris Adams

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Joined
Oct 21, 2007
Messages
2,117
You know, I gave up on trying to get good reception in my old shop without an antenna. I went out and bought at a tv store a radio antenna, and mouted it to a pole outside the shop. You would not believe the reception. No static or anything. It's a pretty simple antenna, and as I recall, didn't cost a fortune.

That's good but sadly, it doesn't work everytime.

Hhaving spent some of my youth putting in antennas, and presently still putting systems in cars on occasion I have seen bigger antennas and boosters make things better, or way worse.

Getting good fringe reception is a more of an art than science. And mostly luck.


Yesterday I had to listen to an hour of a guy ( at a function I couldn't avoid) whine, complain, beef about how he can't get a certain station on FM. He is sure it is being jammed by Blackwater (not kidding here) because he can't get a low power station 80 miles away through a mountain range. But he used to when he lived on the second floor at the same place.
Thus some evil entity is jamming him...
Um, he votes too...


He's had a dozen people try different antennas, up to 28 feet tall, but no reception worth listing to, thus it must be jammed...

Radio bounces, gets interfered with by almost anything, can even be influenced by cars in a nearby parking lot or trees dropping their leaves. Or growing new ones.
A swimming pool can completely change your reception.

Problems is, when you have a low signal strength, anything at all can trash it.

A buzzing transformer can overawe even a strong signal, but when you mostly just get weak signals even a mildly noisy transformer can just ruin the station.
 
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