Unpermitted work - it was there when i bought the place.

[Sumboodie]

I get a kick out of guys like the one you quoted, "my property, I'll do what I want to"

What happens when I do what I want to on my property and his family member is injured or killed because my half *** electrical work?

After it's sold? The buyer takes on that problem. As-Is, no warranty.

Inspected doesn't mean it's safe, nor does unpermitted work mean it's unsafe.

Alaskans tend to be independent and don't care to have the .gov involved in things such as permits.

I only found out at the last minute my septics were never permitted. It's not enforced, nor is there any penalty, and is quite common, BUT it is something that ended up killing the loan with Wells Fargo.l and I'd imagine would be an added PITA when I sell.

I plan on digging it up this summer and getting it sorted out.

 

[jjrbus]

House next door was owned by church and roof damaged by hurricane 10-15 years ago and church members put on a asphalt roof without a permit. New owner had to have roof inspected and is paying a premium for home owners insurance because roof was unpermitted. This is Florida so insurance is likely $4000 year!

At my old house pulled permit for fence, inspector never looked at fence and signed off on permit.

New to me house had a Federal Pacific Electric panel which I was told was unsafe. Pulled a permit and in the middle of replacing panel inspector showed up day early. Looked at new panel, wires sticking out all over, no breakers in and signed permit. I said you are going to pass this? He said you do not want to burn your house down and are going to do it right, I said yes. He left. I took a picture as I thought no one will ever believe this.

 

[Garcky]

Pardon me if this sounds like fear-mongering.

In my experience.... for every person that gets cold feet on some would-be home purchase over permit history, there's 3 more willing to jump on it as-is.

Nope. For most people, the buying money comes from a Mortgage. Banks don't like loose ends one bit. Not fear-mongering at all, just facts.

 

[PoorUB]

A lot of permits where I live in Alabama are only a money grab. They don’t really care except for a handful of safety concerns, such as the porch above. I do outdoor construction. I have pulled countless permits only for the fee and tax implications. They don’t care on most of it, so no inspections.

It happens, but if a permit is required, it doesn't make any difference.

I hear about the "money grab" deal all the time. It really doens't matter.

 

[n8n]

Assuming it doesn't look like pure hackery, or blatantly is against code (current or former) then no inspector is going to notice.

It's not like they pull a list of every permit and have pictures of the entire place at the time of construction to compare to.

Pretty sure the county did this to my old landlord. He extended the carport without a permit and they got him either by driving by or aerial photography. Dunno if they ever figured out he'd installed a kitchen in the basement to make it its own apartment or not. They care, not only because of code/safety reasons but if the renovations increase the value of the property they want the taxes.

 

[jar944]

Pretty sure the county did this to my old landlord. He extended the carport without a permit and they got him either by driving by or aerial photography. Dunno if they ever figured out he'd installed a kitchen in the basement to make it its own apartment or not. They care, not only because of code/safety reasons but if the renovations increase the value of the property they want the taxes.

Most counties update tax records through gis and air/satellite imagery. If you add a new carport/shed/deck thats visible from space (that can be taxed) and didn't have a permit nut required one you are not going to get away with it.

If you finish your basement on the other hand, no one from the county will likely notice.

 

[u2slow]

It's not even the HO or buyer getting cold feet. It's the banks, lawyers and title co's. If the sale can happen w/o a public mortgage then most of this goes away. The CO may be the only holdup.

Interesting. CO?
Here, there's a 2yr disclosure limit on home modifications.

Nope. For most people, the buying money comes from a Mortgage. Banks don't like loose ends one bit. Not fear-mongering at all, just facts.

Lenders here often ask for an inspection report, but it's not required. Inspection is an advisement only. Those facts are proving different in our respective countries (which I didn't expect). Home insurance has their own inspection protocols, but it's normally waived if the home had insurance prior, and it's just a questionaire.

 

[Hobby_Man22]

House next door was owned by church and roof damaged by hurricane 10-15 years ago and church members put on a asphalt roof without a permit. New owner had to have roof inspected and is paying a premium for home owners insurance because roof was unpermitted. This is Florida so insurance is likely $4000 year!

At my old house pulled permit for fence, inspector never looked at fence and signed off on permit.

New to me house had a Federal Pacific Electric panel which I was told was unsafe. Pulled a permit and in the middle of replacing panel inspector showed up day early. Looked at new panel, wires sticking out all over, no breakers in and signed permit. I said you are going to pass this? He said you do not want to burn your house down and are going to do it right, I said yes. He left. I took a picture as I thought no one will ever believe this.

Where's the green sticker?

 

[Lassen Forge]

Where we used to live there is SO much unpermitted / ilegal construction, it was assumed (incorrectly) that our house wasn't permitted, and various and sundry loan people locally just assumed our house, being "illegal", was ineligible for a loan. I remember when we pulled a well permit for our new well, EVERYONE warned us that it would bring "holy hell" around our shoulders because they'd "find out" that every bit of everything was illegal on our property and we'd be forced to tear it all down...

Well, gee whiz, when we finally pushed the issue they (of course) found permits for everything built from the house forward, the only thing that wasn't was our 1870's barn (which predated the building permit department, as well as the county, but hey... ) but it was a fight just to get them to LOOK at the county records and find the permits pulled for our property... all the naysayers started talking about how they must be forged permits and stuff... I asked them if they had pictures of bigfoot, taken while they were servicing fake birds...

To quote Doof Vader - "The farce is strong with those ones"...

 

[jjrbus]

Where's the green sticker?

Green sticker??

 

[acer66]

Green sticker??

This, I went through the trouble of gutting my place and installing completely new plumbing and electric.
Everything was signed off and I never got that precious green sticker of mine.

 

[Hobby_Man22]

This, I went through the trouble of gutting my place and installing completely new plumbing and electric.
Everything was signed off and I never got that precious green sticker of mine.

It depends on the city. This is why people get away with unpermitted work in some areas more than others. Some cities they take the permit and put it in a water proof pouch then put it right next to the structure being built. Hang it on the fence etc.

 

[Hobby_Man22]

Of course nowadays everyone does so much building and remodeling there's no way you won't get caught unless it's something that can be quickly built over the weekend.

 

[acer66]

It depends on the city. This is why people get away with unpermitted work in some areas more than others. Some cities they take the permit and put it in a water proof pouch then put it right next to the structure being built. Hang it on the fence etc.

Yeah, nearby town gets their stickers but I am in the county.

 

[LeonardY]

It depends on the city. This is why people get away with unpermitted work in some areas more than others. Some cities they take the permit and put it in a water proof pouch then put it right next to the structure being built. Hang it on the fence etc.

That's what my city requires. You have to have it in a visible location from the street. Probably so they can drive by and not get out of the car. We don't have a green sticker. Just the permit signed by the inspector. When I did my electrical panel, my wiring was so neat that the inspector signed off the first inspection. She said I've never seen a box done so nicely. I asked what about the closing drywall on the inside. She said just promise me you'll do it. I did and 18 years later I finished it. I really should have done it 18 years ago when my body didn't object as much.

Of course nowadays everyone does so much building and remodeling there's no way you won't get caught unless it's something that can be quickly built over the weekend.

Got a neighbor that attempts that all the time. Oh yeah. Told you about that.

 

[jjrbus]

Where's the green sticker?

I have a permit the inspector signed and IIRC the county website states job completed.

 

[Hobby_Man22]

I have a permit the inspector signed and IIRC the county website states job completed.

I'm just teasing. I couldn't care less honestly.

 

[tominboise]

Locally our building dept is so slammed and short staffed that they are not cruising old permits or structures for compliance. Now, my friend had a visit from Code Enforcement this week because someone dropped a dime on him, and he is just screwed and I hate to say it but fairly so. He pulled a permit for a barn which was never finaled and built a three story house. How long ago? Well when the inspector pulled up he was putting up the scaffold to re-roof the place, so 25 yrs? He is now having to prove time period of construction to determine what code level, ‘97, ‘03, ‘08, ‘14 he must comply with. Fortunately, he has As-builds and Engineering on the place and it is beautifully built Post and Beam. At minimum he will have to re-do the leach field. At maximum they can condemn the property. I think it will cost him at least a couple hundred k. Just look at back property, school taxes and penalties. He is “Ever the Rebel,” and he is now getting bitten in the posterior over it. He now must work with the County to show progress on the property. With care he can buy himself years with moderate effort. They do not want to throw him out but he has to make progress. Not a pretty picture at his 75 yrs.

But he did manage to save the cost of the original permit and all those pesky inspections, way back when. Good for him....

 

[75gmck25]

I find it interesting that at least a couple postings mention someone having problems because they did not get a permit to replace a roof.

I've had new roofing installed in two states (Texas (twice for hail damage) and Virginia) and in both states there was no permit required unless you were going to replace at least 10% of the roof decking. Since my contractor was only installing new shingles and making some minor repairs, no permit was needed for the roof. YMMV.

 

[ratflinger]

Why I live out in the county and not in the city - no permits required for anything but septic. Asked the county who was an approved installer and they handed me a list. Hired one of the approved guys and it was signed off immediately, guy did a good job though.

 

[Hobby_Man22]

Why I live out in the county and not in the city - no permits required for anything but septic. Asked the county who was an approved installer and they handed me a list. Hired one of the approved guys and it was signed off immediately, guy did a good job though.

Next time I buy a piece of property it will be out in the county.

 

[Hobby_Man22]

Next time I buy a piece of property it will be out in the county.

I've heard insurance is hard to find in the county though

 

[rd65]

My thought is it depends on the city or county you are in, as well as the inspector that you get. When we refinanced our house in 2012 9house built in 2000) to get her ex's name off the deed, the lender wanted proof that it was a legal build (zoned R5, all 100 houses are on 1 acre lots). We went to county for that letter, they said nope, it is not legal to occupy. Final inspection was never done. She was the 3rd owner and somehow the final inspection was never done. We had to renew the building permit, lady at county was "nice" by letting us renew a 12-13 year old permit. Renewed at the rate for 2012, "only" around 800 bucks. Inspector came out, looked around, made us fireproof exposed glue lam beam/post in garage with 5/8" drywall.
When we build the shop the electrical inspector (think old man Tim Conway from Carol Burnette show) shuffled out garage door to see where shop was and he says "WAY out there?", it's 200' from garage lol. He said i could have used standard outlets instead of tamper proof ones, then he signed off on shop panel before he even looked at main panel in garage. County did update pics and assessed value as soon as final was done on shop. New shop pic on assessor page was taken by holding camera up over 6' fence on the side of the house.
I say do whatever you have to do to be sure your insurance company is/will be happy to write you a check if ever the need arises.

 

[rd65]

Thats what i did. Didnt have money for the GC to do anything but the structure. Building and electrical are 2 different authorities here.

and if you do electrical permit, say NO when they ask if you are going to heat the building - insulation codes come into play at that point.

 

[u2slow]

I've heard insurance is hard to find in the county though

No counties around here... but I am rural and insurance is not a problem. It may cost more though, depending on a number of factors. One big one is how they rate community fire protection.

and if you do electrical permit, say NO when they ask if you are going to heat the building - insulation codes come into play at that point.

Good tip. Probably won't happen though. Insulation was already in the structure context... but by that stage, my funds were exhausted.

 

[Hobby_Man22]

No counties around here... but I am rural and insurance is not a problem. It may cost more though, depending on a number of factors. One big one is how they rate community fire protection.



Good tip. Probably won't happen though. Insulation was already in the structure context... but by that stage, my funds were exhausted.

They don't ask about cooling? They're concerned about a fire huh?

 

[u2slow]

They don't ask about cooling? They're concerned about a fire huh?

Never been asked about cooling my garage.

Fire yes - if you have the firehall and available water in certain proximity, there's a substantial home insurance discount.

 

[Hobby_Man22]

Never been asked about cooling my garage.

Fire yes - if you have the firehall and available water in certain proximity, there's a substantial home insurance discount.

Yeah no fire hydrants at the road in my area. Or street lights. Always wondered why they don't put them up on the light poles.

 

[racecougar]

Cost, maintenance cost, light pollution, etc.

 

[ecotec]

I am in a semi rural area and often they only have the septic on file if you go back a little bit further.

My house was originally build in 1901 but had numerous ad ons over the years that were more often than not done in a defying the laws of physics manner but nevertheless made it into the books at one point.

So I my uneducated guess is that they do not worry too much about the stuff done before they started keeping more track of things unless it is visible to the naked eye.

And with satellite images they do not even have to go to your place anymore or have someone call them.

I would not be surprised if they have a program that compares satellite images from different time periods and if there are changes it looks up if proper permits were pulled and notifies them if not.

My city does this for unpermitted structures. Before satellite, they used airplanes.

The only way that I know to build a shed in my city without a permit or concrete slab is to build a “kids playhouse”.

There is usually a legal way to break the rules.

 

[ecotec]

It was. His wife said that they ended up paying over $10K
He was screwed after that. The building department made him their hobby.

I love it.