HF ****** fluid Exchanger for $399,any good?

[Nealcrenshaw]

http://www.harborfreight.com/transmission-fluid-exchanger-93019.html

This is on sale for $399,$320 with 20% off coupon, Does anyone have any experiences with it? It looks good, the price is great,should pay for itself in 4-5 uses.

 

[wafrederick]

Waste of money and those need to be taken off the market.I call them transmission ruiners,backflushes the **** back in the valve body and know a transmission shop that can prove this.One transmission shop in my area makes money off flushes which are more expensive repairs,valve body cleanings and rebuilds.Drop the pan,change the fluid and filter instead.The filter inside the automatic transmission is just like an oil filter,trap dirt

 

[georgiadave]

I agree with wafredrick. To flush the transmission, disconnect the return line and run the engine. Catch the used fluid in a big container, add fluid to make up the old until the fluid runs clear. A hose to channel the used fluid helps keep things neater.

 

[SMKS]

If you follow the link you can read the instruction manual. It looks like you can use it to inject a solvent into the transmission to clean it. Or, you could skip that step and just use it as an exchanger. Basically it just does what georgiadave said, except it doesn't make a huge mess. You hook it up to the input and output lines on the transmission and use it to replace the old fluid with new stuff. Pretty simple.

 

[tonydanzah]

I have used the ****** flushers several times without a problem. I think the main problem that most people do is not change the filter after the flush. Which involves more fluid and dropping the pan.

 

[SLAUGHTERHAUS FAB]

As an automotive technician I have done many flushes, all they do is exchange old fluid for new, then you drain the fluid, put in a new filter, and put in new fluid, done properly and hooked up the correct direction there is no backflushing involved.

Never used the harbor freight exchanger, but do a few flushes and it will pay for itself.

 

[mrholeshot]

I had one I bought from BG products. The third time I used it it screwed up a perfectly working transmission. From then on it was drian, change the filter and fill. I just sold it the other day and it was 10 years old and only used 3 times. It has become such a problem that any place I know that uses them warns you ahead of time. nice thing for a quicky lube that has connections to a transmission shop.

 

[Danglerb]

Some I think Toyota's are made to only be flushed, anything else best to drop the pan and change the filter etc. Shops paid a load of money for the flushing machines, and decided to recover some whether its good for the customer or not.

 

[wafrederick]

I have replaced a transmission in a 1998 Monte Carlo,warned this lady not to have it done and it shifted fine before the flush was done.It acted up after the flush was done,not done at an oil change place and the transmission was replaced because of the flush done.Plus most car manufacturers use differant automatic transmission fluids.Chrysler uses ATF+4 fluid which is a synthetic transmission fluid,1998 and up Fords use Mercon V.Most older GMs and Fords use Dextron.

 

[krusty the clown]

exchanging fluid with a flush machine will not damage a transmission.......PERIOD.
if the transmission fails after a flush it already had the damage done.......PERIOD.

dropping the pan will only replace 1/3 of the damaged fluid............

i do not recommend using the cleaner though, just replace the fluid with new.

 

[regguy1]

exchanging fluid with a flush machine will not damage a transmission.......PERIOD.
if the transmission fails after a flush it already had the damage done.......PERIOD.

dropping the pan will only replace 1/3 of the damaged fluid............

i do not recommend using the cleaner though, just replace the fluid with new.

Right on....Customer usually notices something then has it done and when trouble becomes more apparent..blame the service.

Right on the cleaner also....many of those products can be harmful

 

[wafrederick]

It will do too do damage,I know this transmission shop I mentioned that can prove this.Read some of the factory service manuals,most Ford,GM and Chrysler factory service manuals including Honda's say not to flush the transmission.Get customers in that ask to have their transmission flushed and tell them do not do this explaining why.Where I work at,drop the pan completely cleaning the transmission pan up and changing the fluid and filter only.

 

[krusty the clown]

It will do too do damage,I know this transmission shop I mentioned that can prove this.Read some of the factory service manuals,most Ford,GM and Chrysler factory service manuals including Honda's say not to flush the transmission.Get customers in that ask to have their transmission flushed and tell them do not do this explaining why.Where I work at,drop the pan completely cleaning the transmission pan up and changing the fluid and filter only.

show me in a ford service manual where it say's not to flush a trans............in fact they used to give instructions on how to exchange fluid.

btw i'm a ford senior master technician............unless things have changed in the last couple of years i'm calling BS


edit: every ford dealer i have ever worked at HAD and USED flush machines........

 

[regguy1]

show me in a ford service manual where it say's not to flush a trans............in fact they used to give instructions on how to exchange fluid.

btw i'm a ford senior master technician............unless things have changed in the last couple of years i'm calling BS


edit: every ford dealer i have ever worked at HAD and USED flush machines........

By the way:
I've got 45 year experience as trans rebuilder.....regarding the 1988 Monte Carlo that he claimed the flusher ruined.....when he tore down the trans and inspected all internal components to determine why the unit malfunctioned, what SPECIFICLY did he find that was caused by the fluid exchange service?

Be specific in your answers.

Everyone has thier opinon.

I think the term "flush" is a misnomer, all the thing does is exchange fluid through the lines.....fluid is going through the cooler lines every second the car goes down the road in everyday use.

In the same line of reasoning: we have a emission check in some areas our state.... people always come in and say "the e-check screwed up my car" I look at it and always it's something worn out that showed up after the e-check and now they're convinced they got shafted...I saw a leaky water pump on a 135K chevy...e-check's fault...yeah, right. I could give you a dozen other stories.

It's not always true that because A preceded B that A caused B.

 

[CarCrafter]

exchanging fluid with a flush machine will not damage a transmission.......PERIOD.
if the transmission fails after a flush it already had the damage done.......PERIOD.

dropping the pan will only replace 1/3 of the damaged fluid............

i do not recommend using the cleaner though, just replace the fluid with new.

+1

Opinion not based on hear say.

 

[blarf]

It will do too do damage,I know this transmission shop I mentioned that can prove this.Read some of the factory service manuals,most Ford,GM and Chrysler factory service manuals including Honda's say not to flush the transmission.Get customers in that ask to have their transmission flushed and tell them do not do this explaining why.Where I work at,drop the pan completely cleaning the transmission pan up and changing the fluid and filter only.

Ya they also tell you it's lifetime transmission fluid.

 

[CarCrafter]

ItWhere I work at,drop the pan completely cleaning the transmission pan up and changing the fluid and filter only.

Not to sound lewd, but this is like doing a #2 and not wiping your @$$. Replacing 1/3 of the fluid, you may as well not do it at all.

I personally own a Wynns trans serv machine and I use whatever fluid the manufacturer calls for only. I don't use the cleaning solvents or additives.

 

[regguy1]

I pasted this from another thread on this subject. I have photos of a Honda Transaxle on page 2.

Everyone has varying ideas as you'll see if you click th link.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=69920

1. The filter in that trans is a stainless steel screen, changing it will get you zero benefit.

2. Toyota uses a seperate sump for the final drive section of the transaxle,
I've seem people remove that drain plug while changing the trans fluid and assume everything is filled through the trans fill tube....in reality they now have a dry differential and burn it up in short order.
Check the fluid level in the final drive, just because the trans is full doesen't mean the FD is full. (plug on back diff. cover, fill until it runs out )

3. I think "flush" is a poor term to use "fluid exchange" is more accurate for the service they do using the cooler lines.

4. If the fluid looks discolored an exchange probably won't hurt
but remember it will still be a trans with 235K on it...with new fluid.

5. Many of the stories about fluid change causing problems are due to someone making a stupid error while performing the service. Also people who notice something not quite right with their trans run out and have fluid changed, and when it fails blame the guy who serviced it wanting something for nothing.......guess what, it was on it's way out anyway.

6. All this talk about "loosening garbage" in the trans is silly.

If your trans is full of "garbage" it's on it's last leg anyway
Most of this concern was about new fluid loosening up varnish deposits that have
built up over time. This is not a great concern in late model cars, you don't see many
that have varnish build up any more due to improved fluid and other factors

My humble opinion based on 45 yrs experience.

 

[wafrederick]

I know a guy that had his F150 in for a transmission flush done by the dealer.Transmission shifted fine before the flush and did not shift right after the flush was done.My father even saw a valve body torn apart being cleaned at this transmission shop I mentioned,valve body was full of "****" after a flush with the machine was done.I have not seen a transmission failure yet after dropping the pan and changing the fluid and filter.Transmission filters wil plug up if the fluid and filter is not changed.Seen this on a 1992 Dodge with 350,000 miles on it now,changed the fuid and filter in at 300,000 miles for the first time.The filter was plugged right up and the owner saw power loss.Owner saw a huge differance after the fluid and filter was changed,got power back and this truck has the 5.9 Cummins turbo diesel.I seen a list of things which are a waste money to do to any vehicle,any type of flush is a huge waste of money.

 

[krusty the clown]

I know a guy that had his F150 in for a transmission flush done by the dealer.Transmission shifted fine before the flush and did not shift right after the flush was done.My father even saw a valve body torn apart being cleaned at this transmission shop I mentioned,valve body was full of "****" after a flush with the machine was done.

.are you saying the flush machine put the trash into the trans? i'll bet the trash was there from a lack of mainainance over the life of the vehicle.

Transmission filters wil plug up if the fluid and filter is not changed.

if a filter is plugged up it's from friction material......if it has enough friction material in the filter to plug it up it's toast.

Seen this on a 1992 Dodge with 350,000 miles on it now,changed the fuid and filter in at 300,000 miles for the first time.The filter was plugged right up and the owner saw power loss.Owner saw a huge differance after the fluid and filter was changed,got power back and this truck has the 5.9 Cummins turbo diesel.

a plugged up trans filter caused a power loss?


time to get real here guy's. see why i don't come around much

 

[Hiball]

.a plugged up trans filter caused a power loss?


time to get real here guy's. see why i don't come around much

Im no Transmission expert, I did rebuild a TH350 with the help of a friend and remarkably i put over 100k on it without any problems. LOL I guess i could see how a Plugged ****** filter could cause wear on the pump and possibly not allow the ****** to efieciently put power to the pavement. Again.. Im no expert but if your complaining about a ****** that has 300K miles on the original Oil and filter your asking for trouble. Especially on a vehicle that has seen any type of towing etc..

 

[Bull]

time to get real here guy's. see why i don't come around much

Maybe it's precisely why you need to come around more.

 

[krusty the clown]

possibly not allow the ****** to efieciently put power to the pavement.

then it would be slipping...........and once again the trans is toast

 

[krusty the clown]

Maybe it's precisely why you need to come around more.

just to argue with internet intellectuals?

 

[Bull]

just to argue with internet intellectuals?

You can't teach people who already know; you have to teach people who don't know. Ya know?

 

[krusty the clown]

You can't teach people who already THINK they know; you have to teach people who are willing to listen

fixed, don't you think

 

[Treeman]

There is a history of bad transmission back flushes only in Muskegon, Michigan.

Enough said.

 

[Bull]

fixed, don't you think

Can't argue with that!

In my career, I see a split between those who are and those who are not willing to listen to and learn from an authority. You can't reach them all, but that doesn't mean it isn't worth trying!

 

[krusty the clown]

There is a history of bad transmission back flushes only in Muskegon, Michigan.

Enough said.

never heard of a transmission "back flush". during a flush fluid flows into the transmission in the same direction it normally flows (and out as well).

i guess it ain't enough said

 

[TCJ1981]

Fluid exchangers are just a glorified 5 gal. bucket and a couple of rubber hoses. I have a good friend of mine who's rebuilt 1000+ trannies and says those machines have made him quite a bit of money off rebuilding good, serviceable transmissions that have had their life shortened because some slick shop foreman told them that they don't need to have the filter changed after it was done. The same line the BG reps preach to sell you a filter flush kit.

 

[krusty the clown]

Fluid exchangers are just a glorified 5 gal. bucket and a couple of rubber hoses.

and a bladder and a flow meter and a pump and a bypass valve.........

 

[Treeman]

never heard of a transmission "back flush". during a flush fluid flows into the transmission in the same direction it normally flows (and out as well).

i guess it ain't enough said

Apparently there is at least one in Muskegon Michigan, because this has been "discussed" on other forums. Most machines I know of are like you describe, Krusty...ie, T=Tech.

Waste of money and those need to be taken off the market.I call them transmission ruiners,backflushes the **** back in the valve body and know a transmission shop that can prove this.......

 

[TCJ1981]

and a bladder and a flow meter and a pump and a bypass valve.........

Sounds like someone fell for the sales pitch.

 

[MattT]

Fluid exchangers are just a glorified 5 gal. bucket and a couple of rubber hoses.

and a bladder and a flow meter and a pump and a bypass valve.........

Since we're discussing the HF version TCJ1981 might be right

 

[Dan_inthewind]

I'm with Krusty on this one. 33 years at the current Ford dealership. Pricing out a new unit. Newer transmissions are being serviced with a fluid exchange as part of maintanance. Problem is most posters here are thinking of the units that remove and filter and pump back in the old fluid. Lots of smaller shops use them. They "****". I am not considering any unit below $2500.00 so get a grip,these cheapies are simple pump out and pump right back in units! Unless you buy a unit that does an flush and "exchange" then forget it. And I hate to bi*** but why is it the experts have always heard of the problem but never got thier hands dirty with the problem,,,, did you read it on the internet so it MUST BE TRUE? If you flush the toilet the craps goes down the drain, if you flush and the drain runs back into the toilet,,,,,you still have the ****!

 

[Fedwrench]

I'm amazed at all of the twist and turns this thread has taken.
A few observations: 1. A transmission flush isn't a cure all. Often people have internal transmission issues prior to a flush but, blame everything on the flush. Kind of like putting a band aid on a sucking chest wound.
2. Ford, GM, and Chrysler each have their own transmission flush machine that is a required tool in all dealerships. Most modern transmission filters are a screen type instead of the old dacron type. Flushes have taken the place of filter changes on many models consult your service manual (not to confused with a haynes manual). Which is better replacing 14 quarts of ATF or 5? 3. Fluid type is critical. There is no safe thing as a generic one size fits all ATF or a super additive package that can turn Dexron III into a full synthetic ATF. 4. I don't know of any Trans flush machine that back flushes (unless hooked up wrong). Most rely on the transmission pump to circulate the fluid. 5. Most transmissions are sealed units without a dipstick these days, making a flush the prefered service procedure. 6. Buying and using a Harbor Freight transmission flush machine to turn a profit by servicing one of the most expensive components on a vehicle is asking for trouble in my opinion but, that's just me...

 

[Bull]

5. Most transmissions are sealed units without a dipstick these days, making a flush the prefered service procedure

Back in college in the late '90s, I tried to check the ATF on my girlfriend's '95 Jetta. I looked all over the damn engine bay for a dipstick. Nada. It just did not compute for me, coming from a history of working on old '60s and '70s American cars.

 

[yellowbox]

exchanging fluid with a flush machine will not damage a transmission.......PERIOD.
if the transmission fails after a flush it already had the damage done.......PERIOD.

dropping the pan will only replace 1/3 of the damaged fluid............

i do not recommend using the cleaner though, just replace the fluid with new.

agreed agreed agreed.........

 

[tonydanzah]

I think alot of people that have problem after they do the flush don't realize the only reason the trans was shifting at all is all the friction material was floating in the fluid. The clutches were probably worn smooth. Remove the fluid filled with friction material and afterward there is nothing left to grab.

 

[blarf]

I'm amazed at all of the twist and turns this thread has taken.
A few observations: 1. A transmission flush isn't a cure all. Often people have internal transmission issues prior to a flush but, blame everything on the flush. Kind of like putting a band aid on a sucking chest wound.
2. Ford, GM, and Chrysler each have their own transmission flush machine that is a required tool in all dealerships. Most modern transmission filters are a screen type instead of the old dacron type. Flushes have taken the place of filter changes on many models consult your service manual (not to confused with a haynes manual). Which is better replacing 14 quarts of ATF or 5? 3. Fluid type is critical. There is no safe thing as a generic one size fits all ATF or a super additive package that can turn Dexron III into a full synthetic ATF. 4. I don't know of any Trans flush machine that back flushes (unless hooked up wrong). Most rely on the transmission pump to circulate the fluid. 5. Most transmissions are sealed units without a dipstick these days, making a flush the prefered service procedure. 6. Buying and using a Harbor Freight transmission flush machine to turn a profit by servicing one of the most expensive components on a vehicle is asking for trouble in my opinion but, that's just me...

That.

I wonder how much of this damage is due to using the wrong fluid. Even if you go back to the early 80s, you had issues with which type of fluid to use. Volvo went from Type F/G ATF to Dexron without any other substantive changes to the transmission in... 83? 84? And these were old school beefy Toyota (Aisin-Warner) units with mesh filters.