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Billings and Bonney Wrench Connection

PowderKeg

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Been meaning to post this for a little while - I picked up a Bonney combo wrench this summer that is clearly (at least to me) off a Billings forge/press. It has the same slightly tapered beam as Billings combos (see pic, I've never seen a similar Bonney before), and they both line up 95% perfectly - the Bonney open end tips are oh so marginally longer/pointy-er than the Billings (probably a final/finish grinding result) and the Bonney is just-slightly thicker on the open end and beam (possibly finishing difference as well), but otherwise the 2 appear identical (I've seen/have some Billings with similar very slight differences between 2 of the same size). They're both 11/16" (and # 1165).

I know Bonney supplied ratchets and sockets/drive tools at times for Billings, esp after they were united under one corporate head, but I'm pretty certain these wrenches long pre-date the merger.
 

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Private Lugnutz

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I know Bonney supplied ratchets and sockets/drive tools at times for Billings, esp after they were united under one corporate head, but I'm pretty certain these wrenches long pre-date the merger.
What merger are you referring to, PK? I don't think Bonney and Billings production were ever united under the same corporate banner. Crescent Niagara bought Billings in 1962. I'm not sure when they bought Barcalo and BHM, but it's fair to say they were all united under Crescent Niagara in the same way and around the same time that Utica, Herbrand, and Bonney were united under Kelsey-Hayes in 1964, then under Triangle in 1967. Cooper bought Crescent Niagara (and with it the Billings brand) in 1968, but they didn't buy Triangle (and with it the Bonney brand) until 1995. Technically, I guess that would be the time when it could be said that the Billings and Bonney names were both owned by Cooper, but was there any co-production? Weren't both brands all but gone by then?

I guess that's a long, strange way of saying I agree with you about the wrenches looooong pre-dating 1995. :) In fact, they look 50's to me.
 

Ricky Joe

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I’ve wondered, also. I have Billings tools that look exactly like Herbrand, and Wright sockets indistinguishable from Herbrand, to the point that I have actually wondered if Billings quit manufacturing and farmed out production to Bonney, Herbrand, or if the various companies didn’t collude to stake out their various specialties. I’ll be at my other house tomorrow and try to show examples. I think some of this may have been addressed here before on a thread about sliding selector switches on ratchets.
 

Ricky Joe

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Herbrand and Billings15/16” sockets, and Herbrand, Billings, and Bonney 11/16” sockets, all 1/2” drive. The very slight difference in height of the Bonney could be due to era.
 

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Ricky Joe

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Somewhere I have the Herbrand 3/8” version, but can’t find it immediately. Here is the Billings 3/8” drive ratchet and the Herbrand 1/2” drive. Knurling on handles is identical, as is the faceplate design. Hard to see on this Herbrand example.
 

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Ricky Joe

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Herbrand and Billings 1/2” and 7/8” socket comparison:

I goofed. Herbrand was 29/32” compared to Billings 7/8”.
 

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Ricky Joe

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I think there is plenty of evidence of either collusion in manufacture, or the tooling factories bought identical manufacturing tooling, from whoever made the tooling equipment. Has anyone investigated that possibility? Lugz would know, if anyone.
 

Private Lugnutz

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Lugz would know, if anyone.
I appreciate your confidence in me, but this is not my era.

PK putting Bonney and Billings under one roof, which is not something I had envisioned before, and still can't find any evidence of happening in anything other than very indirect M&A paperwork, virtually, did prompt some research, though, which I plan to post in the Bonney thread.
 

Ricky Joe

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I appreciate your confidence in me, but this is not my era.

PK putting Bonney and Billings under one roof, which is not something I had envisioned before, and still can't find any evidence of happening in anything other than very indirect M&A paperwork, virtually, did prompt some research, though, which I plan to post in the Bonney thread.
Im specifically wondering if the tool manufacturers may have bought tooling from a common source, resulting in such strong similarities between different manufacturer’s products. That would explain nearly identical socket shapes, with differences in knurling patterns, manufacturer identification markings, and, perhaps, alloy of steel used.
 
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PowderKeg

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Nah Lugz, you're absolutely right, my swiftly aging and rapidly declining memory conflated my 3 favorite tool companies from back in the day - Billings, Bonney, and Herbrand (actually, throw Wright in there for a 4th). So while I'm way out in left field on Bonney and Billings getting united under one corporate roof while they were both still producing tools, as Bonney and Herbrand actually did, that still leaves the central query about what is the Bonney brand doing on a Billings combo? I have no doubt about the Billings pedigree - they're the only combo wrenches I've ever seen with that slightly tapered beam, and the Bonney tapers exactly like the all the Billings I have/have seen. Of the two 11/16" 1165 wrenches in the original post, the pic makes the Billings open end look slightly wider than the Bonney but that's an optical illusion, lay them on top of one another and you can't see or feel any dimensional differences along the edges or open end gullet other than the slightly pointy-er open end tips of the Bonney. The Billings disappears under the Bonney and only the very tips of the Bonney peak out from under the Billings. The Bonney beam and open end are slightly thicker than the Billings but the taper matches right up. The Bonney is marked Bonaloy on the reverse side.

Some of my Billings combos from over the years, most are also marked Vitaloy (as is the 1165 matched to the Bonney) with some others and extras that are Billings Life-time. While the tapered beam appears more obvious on some than others, without pulling a micrometer and taking precision measurements of each one they all taper at the same rate towards the box end. It's also interesting (at least to me) to note that the 15/16 & 1, 13/16 & 7/8, and 9/16 and 19/32 wrenches each share the same size blank with the other. While I don't doubt there are other brands that do similar, Billings is the one I've noticed most.

Finally, in a weak attempt to defend my vaporizing brain cells, as Ricky Joe pointed out there is a Herbrand connection with Billings on sockets and drive tools, albeit most likely some time before Bonney and Herbrand were united under Triangle. I have both horizontal and vertical slide shifter ratchets branded for Billings and identical to Herbrand. That's what helped erroneously conflate Bonney into the picture, as Bonney branding can also be found on Herbrand 1/4 and 3/4 slide shifter ratchets (horizontal 1/4 ones, would need to check catalogs to see if the 3/4 ratchets were horizontal or the earlier vertical shifters ones, or both).
 

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Private Lugnutz

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No worries. If anything, it had a great byproduct, giving me motivation to track down the last vestiges of the once proud brand that was Bonney. See Bonney thread!

Only thing I have to add to your actual topic is a reminder that Billings, like Williams, did do contract forgings. They were an industry leader with patents for drop hammers, dies, and tooling.
 
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PowderKeg

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Direct from Alloy Artifacts ref Billings sockets and drive tools:

"By 1930 Billings had discontinued their clunky line of male-drive forged sockets and had begun offering a new line of square-drive alloy steel socket tools sourced from Walden-Worcester. Walden continued as the major supplier of socket tools to Billings through the 1930s and into the early 1940s.

Billings stuck with this decision to use contract manufacturers for their socket tools, and later production was done by Herbrand in the 1940s to mid 1950s, and by Wright Tool from the late 1940s into the 1950s."
 
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