To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

I'm confused, is Metabo (non HPT) a pro level tool?

dclark2171

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2024
Messages
186
I've read that Metabo is highly regarded and at a level higher than Makita, Milwaukee, etc Just curious, I never looked at the brand in such high regard. I just figured Metabo was along the levels of most DIYer tools like Ryobi.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

aquinob

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 7, 2014
Messages
239
Location
Portsmouth, VA
Metabo is a German/Euro brand, similar to Bosch. They bought out Hitachi and rebranded it Metabo-HPT or something along those lines. I wouldnt consider them (HPT) pro level but probably not bad either. My only Metabo tool was a corded jigsaw that I would say was equal to Bosch but that was probably 20 years ago.
 
OP
D

dclark2171

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2024
Messages
186
I would have thought the HT was the high end line (rebranded old Hitachi), I guess it's the opposite. the regular line is considered the premium.
 

MBfreak

MEMBER EMERITUS
Joined
Dec 10, 2010
Messages
2,301
Location
Linkoping , Sweden
I have a drill made by Metabo 1964. Wonderful quality.
METABO blue.
Some nice issues
The brushes have a built in spring with a small insulator. When brush is worn, the insulator will pop out and lift the brush from the commutator. No burned commutators.
The chuck is self-locking and perfectly centered. 1 to 10,2 mm
The original 220 V lead is super flexible and like new after 60 years. Marked METABO

Absolutely top quality

Ola
 

KnurledNut

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
8,199
Location
n/a
German-made Metabo is most definitely a pro level tool.

They were sold in 2016 and are currently owned by Koki Holdings Co headquartered in Japan, but are still being manufactured in Germany.

https://www.metabo.com/us/enus/info/company/about-metabo/made-by-metabo/
"Our power tools marked ‘Made in Germany’ are produced entirely at our headquarters in Nürtingen. The unique thing about the site is that it not only houses our development department, but is also where we manufacture turned parts and motors, inject plastic parts and cast aluminum parts – for many different machines. That is why our production department has one of the best vertical ranges of manufacturing in the entire industry.”
 

finn

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 27, 2005
Messages
16,372
Location
The UP, God's country
Metabo is a German/Euro brand, similar to Bosch. They bought out Hitachi and rebranded it Metabo-HPT or something along those lines. I wouldnt consider them (HPT) pro level but probably not bad either. My only Metabo tool was a corded jigsaw that I would say was equal to Bosch but that was probably 20 years ago.
It’s the other way around. Hitachi bought out German based Metabo in 2015. Both became part of an investment group, KKR since 2018, but the Hitachi Power Tool name didn’t go with the sale, so the company was renamed Metabo HTP.

Supposedly Metabo is a separate business unit under KKR. I would guess that’s a similar operating arrangement to what TTI operates under, where the parent company has several brands, ie Milwaukee, Ryobi, Homelite, Dirt Devil, etc are all part of Hong Kong based TTI.
 

dr_clyde

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Messages
6,464
Location
Holland, MI
Original Metabo was/is considered some of the nicest power tools available. German made stuff is typically top quality and extremely nice.

I was pretty disappointed by the buyout because I know Hitachi just wanted to use the brand name to sell lesser quality tools at the big box stores.

Real Metabo was not and still is not available in the box stores, and is usually only available through industrial dealers.

I put the original Metabo in the same category as Hilti, Festool, and Fein. Top quality stuff meant for professional use. The HPT stuff isn't really all that interesting to me.
 

Robinson1

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 22, 2015
Messages
834
Location
Kentucky
Metabo HPT is the same thing that used to be sold as Hitachi.

Metabo (Germany) is every bit as good as Hilti and has a similar price point
 

neophyte

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 23, 2012
Messages
9,792
Location
Pennsylvannia
Metabo and Hitachi (now Metabo HPT in the USA) produced both higher quality “professional” level tools, and lower grade “homeowner” or “hobby” level tools.
This is both brands.

Metabo produced lighter weight, lower quality, cheaper tools, similar to Bosch.
Some of those tools have been sold to professionals thru certain outlets, the same way Bosch “Green” (non-professional) tools, were sometimes sold in the USA, in the Bosch Blue color, that Bosch usually used for their professional level tools.
The Metabo 3” ramdom orbit sander was one example, although I think there were also drills without metal gear boxes, and some other tools as well.
The lower quality Metabo tools weren’t ****, they just weren’t built to the same standard as the better tools, and certain parts like motors, might need to be completely replaced if they failed, rather than replacing individual components like brushes etc.

As for Hitachi, they had a wide variety of quality levels, from cast metal tools for timber framing, that were likely similar in quality to Makita’s Tomber framing tools, to miter saws, which were well liked.
These were usually considered “professional” quality, and had prices to match.
Hitachi pneumatic nailers have always been considered top notch, at least until the designs were updated to the newer, less “industrial” looking aesthetics.
Hitachi handheld power tools varied.
The older models were probably considered on par with Makita tools of a similar vintage, maybe plus or minus based on the individual tool.
I think Hitachi may have outsourced production to China earlier than Makita did, and their tools had engineering that tried to cut costs, while still retaining durability.
Bearing in some tools were smaller, but mounted in metal, to prevent destroying plastic motor housings in case of failure.
These tools seem to have been well liked, plus or minus, compared to similar tools from brands like Bosch or Dewalt or Makita, but could usually save you a bit of money.
The older Hitachi cordless tools (NiCd period) were not considered high quality, and might have been equivalent to something like Black & Decker of the time period. Usable, but most professionals opted for Dewalt, or Makita, or Milwaukee, etc.
Hitachi has come out with much better cordless tools since then.
I’m not sure were they fit quality wise.
Hitachi seemed to be trying to up their game as far as performance, with the exception of the timber framing tools, which got dropped from distribution, or at least common distribution in the USA maybe two decades ago.
Hitachi also has the brushless corded grinders, with narrow diameter motor housings that some users really like.
One thing Hitachi was not as good at, which was common with “professional level” tools, was providing a variety of specialty attachments, such as cup or dust collection guards for their tools.
For certain tasks, you really need these for safety reasons.

The current Metabo HPT line is basically just rebranded Hitachi, so the above comments should apply.
 

Wamsutta

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
10,890
Location
Amarillo, Texas
Non-HPT Metabo is the real deal before they got infected by the Hitachi ****. You can tell I hate company acquisitions and mergers.
 

dnschmidt

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 3, 2014
Messages
7,293
Location
Phoenix, AZ
KKR (the dark side of the force) bought both Hitachi's power tool division HIKOKI and the German Metabo. In the rest of the world they are labeled as Hikoki and Metabo. Hikoki isn't bad stuff as I stated previously they are at the Rigid Home Depot level. METABO is the real deal, particularly with grinders and the good stuff starts at about $200. Most professional welders use Metabo. Why KKR decided to defame Metabo with the HPT **** is a crime. Why they didn't just call them Hikoki is one of the dumbest marketing decisions of the last 20 years. All they did was make Metabo seem ordinary. It's like if TTI started calling their stuff Ryobi-Milwaukee.
 

Wamsutta

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
10,890
Location
Amarillo, Texas
Why KKR decided to defame Metabo with the HPT **** is a crime. Why they didn't just call them Hikoki is one of the dumbest marketing decisions of the last 20 years. All they did was make Metabo seem ordinary. It's like if TTI started calling their stuff Ryobi-Milwaukee.
The people that make these marketing decisions have never touched a Metabo tool in their life. They know nothing about long time honored traditions or product reputations. They want to ***** out the Metabo name to cover their HPT ****. All they care about is profit. It's going to come back and bite them in the *** someday.
 
OP
D

dclark2171

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2024
Messages
186
So the Metabo tools at the stores are not the good ones correct? I'll probably just go Makita
 

F-22

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 23, 2022
Messages
1,830
and at a level higher
Depends from tool to tool. These total brand comparisons are usually a bit silly. All of the top end manufacturers produce top end tools that are only marginally different in performance, be it Bosch, Makita, Metabo, Hikoki/MetaboHPT, Milwaukee, Dewalt, Hilti....

I probably wouldn't buy into the hikoki battery system, or the German Metabo. Probably not even Bosch. The Dewalt and Milwaukee and Makita have a wider range and bigger global support, and out of those three I think Makita is the most well rounded and used globally so parts and batteries will always be available for it, even decades from now. As a bonus it is not owned by some conglomerate...

Similar with chainsaws. You can get really nice ones today, you have Echo, Husqy, Makita... But if you look at 70's chainsaws I think by far the easiest to get parts for is Stihl. So that's my reasoning why it is better. Maybe one of the others is slightly more powerful or faster, but stihl parts (and bars and chains especially) are just always so much easier to find and I plan on keeping my chainsaws for a long time.
 

Stobal

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 15, 2014
Messages
180
I have older Hitachi nailers, a hitachi 10” miter saw, and a first generation 18v Li-Ion hammer drill and Impact Driver. All of it was built extremely well, and they continue to function today despite being used and abused. It used to be that the higher tier Hitachi tools were certainly up to par with any of the power tool brands.

I switched to Bosch and then again to Milwaukee. It honestly had nothing to do with dissatisfaction with the Hitachi or Bosch products but instead due to the range of products available from Milwaukee that you could not get in the other brands. I gave the battery Hitachi and Bosch stuff to my dad, and it still works great. I can’t say anything about their newer stuff because I don’t have any experience with it.

I also have a couple German Metabo grinders that are as nice as anything I have used by any brand.
 

neophyte

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 23, 2012
Messages
9,792
Location
Pennsylvannia
So the Metabo tools at the stores are not the good ones correct? I'll probably just go Makita
They’re fine.
Even German made Metabo tools were known to fail. (This includes the heavier duty models as well).
For any HPT tool, you really need to judge the tool by the individual model and features.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

dnschmidt

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 3, 2014
Messages
7,293
Location
Phoenix, AZ
Depends from tool to tool. These total brand comparisons are usually a bit silly. All of the top end manufacturers produce top end tools that are only marginally different in performance, be it Bosch, Makita, Metabo, Hikoki/MetaboHPT, Milwaukee, Dewalt, Hilti....

I probably wouldn't buy into the hikoki battery system, or the German Metabo. Probably not even Bosch. The Dewalt and Milwaukee and Makita have a wider range and bigger global support, and out of those three I think Makita is the most well rounded and used globally so parts and batteries will always be available for it, even decades from now. As a bonus it is not owned by some conglomerate...

Similar with chainsaws. You can get really nice ones today, you have Echo, Husqy, Makita... But if you look at 70's chainsaws I think by far the easiest to get parts for is Stihl. So that's my reasoning why it is better. Maybe one of the others is slightly more powerful or faster, but stihl parts (and bars and chains especially) are just always so much easier to find and I plan on keeping my chainsaws for a long time.
F-22 the only objection I have to your statement has to do with Makita batteries. These seem to be locked into 5 and at most 6 A-hr versions due to the dual 18V (36V in series) tools that Makita makes. If I were to go Makita I'd start with their 40V line which has room to grow. The one thing about the Hikoki system is that they have a 120V adapter that can fit where the battery goes. For continuous duty this is a nice feature basically converting a battery powered tool to a corded tool. Grinders are known battery killers. This advantage might be important to some users that don't have a sack full of Makita batteries (as I do).
 

F-22

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 23, 2022
Messages
1,830
F-22 the only objection I have to your statement has to do with Makita batteries. These seem to be locked into 5 and at most 6 A-hr versions due to the dual 18V (36V in series) tools that Makita makes. If I were to go Makita I'd start with their 40V line which has room to grow. The one thing about the Hikoki system is that they have a 120V adapter that can fit where the battery goes. For continuous duty this is a nice feature basically converting a battery powered tool to a corded tool. Grinders are known battery killers. This advantage might be important to some users that don't have a sack full of Makita batteries (as I do).
Fair enough, there are slight pros and cons to everyone but I'd say Makita is most likely to support the 18v lineup for a long time. More volts can lead to more power but... At the same time, more and more power isn't always the best idea either. I think current 18v tools are overall plenty powerful enough for most common needs and while niche uses may benefit from more power, an 18v drill can easily snap an arm if it has no safety clutch, and the 18v impacts can snap off screws up to sizes that are not used on normal cars anymore.

There's always improvement and that's why the bigger makita batteries now exist. But 18V is the most common standard and will remain so...
 

Hohn

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 25, 2016
Messages
2,719
Location
Diesel Central, Indiana
I've read that Metabo is highly regarded and at a level higher than Makita, Milwaukee, etc Just curious, I never looked at the brand in such high regard. I just figured Metabo was along the levels of most DIYer tools like Ryobi.
Ask a welder what they think of Metabo angle grinders. Most will tell you they are perhaps the best angle grinders made on earth.

I myself have never owned any. Their new cordless stuff is REALLY intriguing though, since they are leading an effort to commonize the industry around nonproprietary batteries. That could be huge.

 

tarbellb

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
5,779
Location
Oregon
The bulk of Hitachi tools sold here in the US for the last 30yrs are mid to low tier, especially the big box stuff

However some US Hitachi (hikoki) stuff is super industrial or just plain good
- Hitachi nailers
- Hitachi sliding miter saws
- specialized metal and wood tools

And if you dive into the Japan top tier market stuff its as good or better then anything here
 
OP
D

dclark2171

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2024
Messages
186
So I am guessing Hikoki and Metbo HPT are the same, same batteries, etc...just differnt countries...correct? The "Regular" metabo is a totally different system with different batteries
 

NakeDiesel

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
2,750
Location
oklahoma
My only experience with either Hitachi or Metabo are in the air tool lines. I've got quite a few of both that I use quite frequently from brad nailers to staplers to coil nailers, etc... around here on the farm for various projects. Also purchased a metabo portable compressor to run them in the last year after my old compressor gave up building pressure when working around the farm. Never had any issues with any of them and have all worked flawlessly on my projects. I'd buy them again or buy more of the brands.
 

neophyte

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 23, 2012
Messages
9,792
Location
Pennsylvannia
So I am guessing Hikoki and Metbo HPT are the same, same batteries, etc...just differnt countries...correct? The "Regular" metabo is a totally different system with different batteries
No No No!!!!!!

Metabo was a mostly German made tool brand.

Metabo HPT is what used to be Hitachi’s power tool line.

The two tool lines use completely different battery systems, and as far as I can tell, the current owners have not made adapters of any kind so the tool batteries from one or the other line can use the same batteries.

In the rest of the wotld, the former Hitachi Power tool line is now sold as Hikoki, but the Equity firm that bought the brands decided yo use “Metabo HPT” as the branding in North America.
 

alfazer

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 1, 2011
Messages
393
Location
N. Ireland
I have two Metabo angle grinders, a 5" and a 9", both from the early/mid 90's, both running perfectly. The 9" had has done some pretty heavy cutting over the years on both steel and concrete.
 

engineer2

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 13, 2009
Messages
11,825
Location
Chicago burbs
Menards carries Metabo HTP tools.
Out of curiosity I looked up country of origin. It's all over the planet depending on the tool. They say they source production parts globally too.

"Group-wide research and development is headquartered in Nürtingen (suburb of Stuttgart Germany), which is where the company still manufactures steel components and motors, molds plastic parts and processes aluminum components for many different machines."

"We develop our famous Metabo Marathon motors, for example, fully in-house and manufacture 100% of the motors for the angle grinders we build in Nürtingen in-house."

"Production facilities in Nürtingen and Shanghai"

" ...our tools are manufactured – from our headquarters in Nürtingen, in the international production network of our parent company Koki Holdings or at our production partners." (Plants in Japan, China, Taiwan, Malaysia, maybe others.)
 

neophyte

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 23, 2012
Messages
9,792
Location
Pennsylvannia
Menards carries Metabo HTP tools.
Out of curiosity I looked up country of origin. It's all over the planet depending on the tool. They say they source production parts globally too.

"Group-wide research and development is headquartered in Nürtingen (suburb of Stuttgart Germany), which is where the company still manufactures steel components and motors, molds plastic parts and processes aluminum components for many different machines."

"We develop our famous Metabo Marathon motors, for example, fully in-house and manufacture 100% of the motors for the angle grinders we build in Nürtingen in-house."

"Production facilities in Nürtingen and Shanghai"

" ...our tools are manufactured – from our headquarters in Nürtingen, in the international production network of our parent company Koki Holdings or at our production partners." (Plants in Japan, China, Taiwan, Malaysia, maybe others.)
Malaysia is interesting.
Bosch has had tools made in Malaysia for decades, and seems to gave increased production there.
I wonder if Metabo simply followed Bosch’s example, after seeing Bosch’s results, or if Bosch is doing some manufacturing for Metabo.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Job

F-22

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 23, 2022
Messages
1,830
Menards carries Metabo HTP tools.
Out of curiosity I looked up country of origin. It's all over the planet depending on the tool. They say they source production parts globally too.

"Group-wide research and development is headquartered in Nürtingen (suburb of Stuttgart Germany), which is where the company still manufactures steel components and motors, molds plastic parts and processes aluminum components for many different machines."

"We develop our famous Metabo Marathon motors, for example, fully in-house and manufacture 100% of the motors for the angle grinders we build in Nürtingen in-house."

"Production facilities in Nürtingen and Shanghai"

" ...our tools are manufactured – from our headquarters in Nürtingen, in the international production network of our parent company Koki Holdings or at our production partners." (Plants in Japan, China, Taiwan, Malaysia, maybe others.)
Just to make it clear again, Metabo HTP is same as Hikoki and previously Hitachi power tools. Not made in Germany, but some may be made in Japan.

s-l1600.jpgWH36DBGGZ_Profile.jpg16075550.jpg



Meanwhile the German company with the similar name makes completely unrelated products in Germany but some are of course now made in the hikoki factories too. Uncompatible batteries etc...


2210_390x723px_18V_Schlagschrauber800Nm_8633c71def.jpg
 

borizm

New member
Joined
Oct 25, 2024
Messages
1
Barbarians at the Gate.

KKR

Greed is good.

Their goals aren’t to make or sell great tools. Their goals are to maximize profits and divide and conquer.
True and this is two (KKR globalists and not a top end quality anymore) of the three reasons why we shouldn't buy Metabo and HiKoki (Hitachi) tools.
The other one is the need the batteries unification/standardization so we shouldn't support the manufactures of another batteries types that do not bring anything special. We already have a very decent like DeWalt XR Flexvolt 18V/54V(dual-voltage); Bosch Pro 12V, 18V, 36V and also Bosch Power4All 18V, 36V; Makita LXT(18V), XGT(40V); Millwaukee M12, M18, MX(72V).
 

dnschmidt

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 3, 2014
Messages
7,293
Location
Phoenix, AZ
True and this is two (KKR globalists and not a top end quality anymore) of the three reasons why we shouldn't buy Metabo and HiKoki (Hitachi) tools.
The other one is the need the batteries unification/standardization so we shouldn't support the manufactures of another batteries types that do not bring anything special. We already have a very decent like DeWalt XR Flexvolt 18V/54V(dual-voltage); Bosch Pro 12V, 18V, 36V and also Bosch Power4All 18V, 36V; Makita LXT(18V), XGT(40V); Millwaukee M12, M18, MX(72V).
You seem not to realize that Metabo is leading the effort to standardize batteries in Europe. They are part of the Alliance which shares batteries among several European manufacturers including Mafell. You can hate on KKR as much as you want, and I'm on your side on this one, but Metabo is doing it's best to standardize batteries and for that they should be lauded. On a side note their grinders are the best in the world.
 

neophyte

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 23, 2012
Messages
9,792
Location
Pennsylvannia
You seem not to realize that Metabo is leading the effort to standardize batteries in Europe. They are part of the Alliance which shares batteries among several European manufacturers including Mafell. You can hate on KKR as much as you want, and I'm on your side on this one, but Metabo is doing it's best to standardize batteries and for that they should be lauded. On a side note their grinders are the best in the world.
Bosch is doing a unified battery system as well, called AMPshare.
Brands so far seem to include;
Bosch,
Cox (Medmix),
Fein,
Honsel,
Ledlenser,
Mato,
MK (Medmix),
Orgapack,
PerfectPro,
Rextoth,
Rothenberger,
Signode,
Steinel,
Yotsn,
Wagner,

Dome tool manufacturers may be buying into both systems, and seeing if a winner emerges, and some like Fein haven’t converted all cordless tools yo the new system/s.
 

IRQVET

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 29, 2015
Messages
1,188
Location
Forgotten Coast (FL)
Only Metabo HPT tool I own is the "Tank" pancake compressor, it's a freaking BEAST. Love that thing. If the rest of their line is anything like that, I'd be a serious player if I wasn't already so heavily invested in one battery line.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!
Top Bottom