Please critique my garage

[admranger]

Lift way to close to wall, at 18” there is enough room for the tire but not you. I would like that to be 36” minimum.

I agree 100% having lived with this with my first Las Vegas garage (see link below).

given the space you have, have you considered (as other has suggested) a full width garage door and centering the lift in the back section of the garage so you have room to work? If you need to store more cars, put in a 4 post lift(s) in the front section. Yes, I excel at spending other people's money.

I agree on deleting the windows. You never have enough storage space for the "I might need this someday" stuff. Levrack makes an interesting storage system like those old library filing walls, but I don't know how usable it is unless you're good at organizing stuff (and remembering where you put it).

Moveable tables/carts are super useful when you're working on projects. Having room to store them is my problem.

Don't forget to leave space to store your under lift tools like a stand, trans jack, oil drain, etc., etc., etc.

GL on whatever you choose to do.

 

[PoorUB]

Ditch the windows. Not only a waste of space, keeps prying eyes out. If the wife complains, put dummy windows outside.

Those windows will face the interior of the property, which has an 8-10 foot fence surrounding it.

Apparently you are not planning on using the wall space for storage? With all that glass there is no room for cabinets, shelves or peg board. Even if you don't plan on wall storage that is way to many windows! Maybe half as many! Even the attic has too many windows for me.

If you want natural light in the garage, small windows up high are my preference.

I have two awning windows in my garage. I also have larger window on the south wall that got broken many years ago and got a sheet of plywood screwed to the frame and painted. I mentioned to my wife I was going to clean it up, board over the opening and patch up the siding. I was instructed to order a replacement window! At least the bottom of the window is about six feet off the floor.

 

[admranger]

I forgot to mention to lose the standard garage door openers and go with a jackshaft GDO with the garage door rails tucked up tight to the ceiling (will allow for a 4 post lift should you ever want one or two.

 

[Rounder]

Being in vegas, won't the windows just bring more light and heat in? It looks cute, like it is in some yuppie subdivision for a guy wants to park his cars inside.

Put windows up high for light. Don't let martha stewart convice you get southern exposure in your garage.

 

[niget2002]

I'd treat this as a 3 car garage, not a 4 car. With one big garage door in the front. I'd move the lift in the back so you have working room on both sides and I'd be prepared to have one of the cars stored on the lift to fit 3 in the garage.

Alternatively, it looks like you have a pretty nice sized driveway. Never underestimate the utility of a nicely built carport. My shop has a 20' carport on the front of it. My truck gets parked underneath it. It's not fully out of the elements, but it keeps hail off of it.

 

[Joe Reed]

I'd flip the plan in regards to the stairway and man door so that entrance is on the pool side instead of the fence side. Only having the rear man door isn't that bad....you'll quickly get used to it. My small standard 2-car garage (~20'x24') is attached to my house...rear entrance from a service road. The only man door goes from the back of the garage into the house, with a door to the side/back yard off that foyer. It isn't ideal, but isn't awful. When I'm doing stuff outside I usually just leave the 16' garage door open since it isn't seen from the street.

16' door for sure. Even with something as small as my MGB there have been plenty of times when I've parked it dead center of the garage to have lots of room all around it even with the doors open.

 

[Joe Reed]

Are you living in an unAmerican subdivision? why make the thing so cute looking?

Maybe because that's what he wants?? Some people actually care about the architecture and appearance of their property. Not everyone wants a plain warehouse building in their yard. I suppose that's unAmerican....

Before I spent all this money, do you really want to live where you are at with all the rules? Before I spent this much money i would in the country and be free.

Consider that not everyone wants to live in the country. Some of us like living in more urban areas. Freedom gives us that choice.

Also this looks like just a place to park cars, and have some storage upstairs. what are you gaining after spending all this money? to small.

He's gaining a large, attractive garage that will add usefulness and value to his property. He's not building it for you....

 

[KSJeff]

After reading your feedback I think I would:

Find a two post lift where the side posts will slide under your ~10 ceiling and move it as much toward the center as you can where the car will clear up into your 12' ceiling. (where the blue dot is on the attached picture) Remember that your actual car will be at least 12" from the side of the post. That's going to eat up the car area beside that, so I would go ahead and setup your workshop area there. Toolbox, workbench and whatever else you want (lawnmower, kids bikes, motorcycle). Then you have your two spaces by your garage doors for parking. So, effectively a 3 car garage.

I think that would leave you the most room to actually get something done without a major change and depending on where you put your toolbox and bench, you might be able to squeeze a little car in there if you need to.

 

[PoorUB]

I'm in the process of renovating a house in Texas, and I finally get to build the garage of my dreams (tempered by my budget). The goal is four cars, with a 2-post lift, and room to work.

All garages seem to be too small

No one else comment on the width? I have a 24 ft wide garage and I can not imagine going narrower.

I might give up 5 feet of hte length to have it 2 feet wider.

21 feet inside with a car lift. It is going to be cramped!

 

[Rounder]

. He's not building it for you....

He asked for opinions. Only good thing is the upstairs so his wife can store Christmas decorations.

 

[y'sguy]

I think the windows only look good on paper.

I would find an interesting transom style that is up high, closer to the roof.line. You can then creatively landscape in front of this wall so it won't be "a wall" Provide tons more light and less wall space lost. No one gets in, either.
They also don't need to open, not in Texas. My son's house has windows like your drawing and to me, it looks goofy from the street to see a car in there. I know it's a garage but looks weird still. I would also loosw the windows on the doors. I think the width is fine, that is what I have on mine.

 

[Vise_Squad]

In your place I would have relatively narrow benches with open shelves below running the length of both sides, or possibly the side with no windows and down the center. When working on the window side you want to have a bench without going all the way across the garage I suggest. Of course in the center you'd need several pass-throughs so you don't have to walk around either end of of the central bench.

Open shelves invite spousal snooping more than closed cupboards though, so there is that to think of.

If the second story is just storage/office/work space a hoist would be a good idea as mentioned, to get heavier or bulkier stuff up and down. If there's any chance that space might be living quarters (parents or inlaws?) in future, then an elevator that would work for both stuff and people might be a good option.

As for hosts, a four post is more tolerant of less than perfectly positioned vehicles and inherently stronger and therefore safer all else being equal. Someone I know has one of the massive old cylinder lifts buried in his shop floor, that's a real space saver if you can find one.

 

[TXpcargarage]

I like nothing about it, needs more wall space. More space for items other than cars. Is this just for your wife?

you seem nice and fun.

 

[TXpcargarage]

In your place I would have relatively narrow benches with open shelves below running the length of both sides, or possibly the side with no windows and down the center. When working on the window side you want to have a bench without going all the way across the garage I suggest. Of course in the center you'd need several pass-throughs so you don't have to walk around either end of of the central bench.

Open shelves invite spousal snooping more than closed cupboards though, so there is that to think of.

If the second story is just storage/office/work space a hoist would be a good idea as mentioned, to get heavier or bulkier stuff up and down. If there's any chance that space might be living quarters (parents or inlaws?) in future, then an elevator that would work for both stuff and people might be a good option.

As for hosts, a four post is more tolerant of less than perfectly positioned vehicles and inherently stronger and therefore safer all else being equal. Someone I know has one of the massive old cylinder lifts buried in his shop floor, that's a real space saver if you can find one.

That would be amazing, but I don't think I have the resources to find and install it.

 

[TXpcargarage]

I think the windows only look good on paper.

I would find an interesting transom style that is up high, closer to the roof.line. You can then creatively landscape in front of this wall so it won't be "a wall" Provide tons more light and less wall space lost. No one gets in, either.
They also don't need to open, not in Texas. My son's house has windows like your drawing and to me, it looks goofy from the street to see a car in there. I know it's a garage but looks weird still. I would also loosw the windows on the doors. I think the width is fine, that is what I have on mine.

Eh, I like windows, I find myself enjoying the weather more than you might think in Texas, and they face interior to the property. There's a 4' high retaining wall, topped by a 6' high fence, so from the street, you have to see over ten feet to see into the property. And I like looking at my cars. I do like the landscaping idea though, and will use it to help "shrink" the garage in the property. Appreciate the thoughts.

 

[Rounder]

I'd make the windows as high as what meets your vision. Atleast work benches, and low stuff.

The comment about cars sitting in front of windows looking odd from outside also seems something to consider.

Even you want a view, does it have to be so many windows? Pick a spot to sit and look out, but leave the rest useful.

This just seems like a garage, for parking cars, with storage for your wife's stuff up stairs. Is it even worth putting in a lift?

 

[Vise_Squad]

That would be amazing, but I don't think I have the resources to find and install it.

Looks like they're well covered here: https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/threads/single-post-old-school-car-lifts.93914/

Not a perfect solution clearly.

How much work do you do in your garage, as in potentially dirty and dusty work? If you do much, you either cover your vehicles or you subdivide the space with curtains hung from the ceiling.

I would be thinking about compressors(s) and a sound-proofed room for them, wall/floor outlets, air lines, shop vac system with different hose attachment points (use that built-in vac feature) and have that in a sound-proofed enclosure also. Cyclonic separator on the vacuum.

If you don't plan on heating the whole space all the time, think about what tools and equipment need to be kept at what temps to avoid condensation and rust etc. A dedicated and heated space might be needed.

I would be thinking about a small, evacuated paint booth as well, if that's the kind of thing you might use?

If you do any grit blasting in cabinets that is also better done in a dedicated and isolated space.

Light is a BIG issue as others have mentioned, so using software to calculate/model how much sun exposure and light you would get with your planned window arrangements might be wise. A few light-columns over your benches might be nice if needed.

Maybe a car port would allow you to keep a few of your cars out of the elements, and free up that valuable indoor space for more work areas?

In floor heating would be an option if you plan to be near the floor much. Personally I'd look at heating the fluid with solar panels and a heat reservoir system if sun hours and exposure favoured that. A woodstove is a very nice feature and could also be plumbed into such a system, though maybe after the inspectors have come and gone.

 

[rockcrawler]

Lift way to close to wall, at 18” there is enough room for the tire but not you. I would like that to be 36” minimum.

My BendPak two post lift is 16” from the wall. With my truck centered in the lift, the space between the wall and the truck comes out to be about 4‘, which is plenty of working space for me. No need to work between the lift post and the wall. 16” between post and wall, the post itself is about 20” including the arm mounts, and then the truck sits about 15” or so away from the inside of the post/arm mounts. In total, about 51 inches from truck to wall. I’ve removed wheels from my truck multiple times and removed wheels and rear axles from my Jeep with no issues and plenty of working room.

 

[isb cornbinder]

You need some wall space. Workbench and layout areas for tools and parts. Clean up sink as well. Looks a bit narrow for me. Just my .02.

Here are some thoughts.

If you can, please vent the vacuum to the great out-doors. The ultra fine dust will harm your lungs.

 

[rockcrawler]

Have you picked a lift yet? I think 13.5' is a little short for most.

Should be fine. My two post lift has a total height of 145” (12.08”) and floor to top switch height of 141” (11.75”) and if I lift my truck all the way up and set it on the top safety stop, I have a hard time reaching some things. I never use the highest setting because it is too high and I’m an average 5’ 9”. I could imagine a 6’ tall person would still be fine with the same height lift with no problems.

 

[Vise_Squad]

That'a fine looking setup he has, but a Dust Deputy cyclonic separator on a separate and easily emptied bin plumbed in before the vac's canister will make life a LOT easier and less dusty.

 

[rockcrawler]

You lose more conditioned air opening a roll up just to walk in and out.

And let in a lot of debris in (dirt, leaves, bugs, etc) for you to have to sweep up later.

 

[Doozer75]

I think the roof with 4 dormers looks ridiculous.
And it is a New England style to do that. Not a Texas style. Very out of place.
And dormers like that are a renovation thing, not a new build style.
Just make the roof the pitch of the dormers and be done with it.
If you have to match some style rules, tell them their taste is in their mouth.
I would never suffer an HOA.

-Doozer

 

[rockcrawler]

Too many windows down low. Windows are easy entry points for thieves. Plus, you will need wall space for work bench, toolboxes, cabinets and other wall storage or you will end up with stuff laying all over the garage.

 

[ddurrett896]

Pull all those windows OR put smaller ones in the top 2' of the wall. Those doors will let in enough light anyway. I've got 2 garages with no windows and works perfect with overhead LED lights that cost nothing to run.

Will also save $ on the windows, lintels and brick labor.

 

[jmdirk]

I'd treat this as a 3 car garage, not a 4 car. With one big garage door in the front. I'd move the lift in the back so you have working room on both sides and I'd be prepared to have one of the cars stored on the lift to fit 3 in the garage.

Alternatively, it looks like you have a pretty nice sized driveway. Never underestimate the utility of a nicely built carport. My shop has a 20' carport on the front of it. My truck gets parked underneath it. It's not fully out of the elements, but it keeps hail off of it.

Given some of the constraints, I think this needs to be the approach.

With your desire for shelving, storage etc. Some of that certainly can go up to the second floor. Give some though to tool boxes and size of shelving for regularly accessed stuff, work benches etc. and start drawing those into your planned design. You might be surprised how quickly that available floor space disappears.

For example, a lot of people like to have the tool boxes directly in front of the lift. So in front of the lift you need a couple feet for tool boxes, plus space to move around. And if you are the type to help other work on their vehicles - you'll have a garage and a lift, you'll be amazed at how many friends you suddenly have - think about how much space you need to two people to be moving around the front of a vehicle.

I have a 30' x 40' but no attic storage. But with work benches, shelving, tool boxes, the lift etc., having three vehicles in there gets tight. Granted there's a lot of **** in my garage.

 

[DCJets]

no man door at the end with the overheads?

Not having read everything in this very active thread. Just noted "No drivethrough as per city regulations". An 'emergency exit' could always be argumented.
Very nice garage.

 

[dave*99]

What model 4 post lift is shown on the drawings? Seems much smaller than usual.

As others have said 9 foot doors minimum.

I had a 16’ wide door on the old house. Wife and I parked in it daily. It was a side entrance garage too. Surprisingly we had no issues. Garage interior was 21’ wide. Cars were parked on an angle. Splayed out at the front. Rears closer together. But for working on cars the space sucked.

The neighbors had the same size garage with 8’ doors. Way too tight.

Eventually I added a 14x25’ third bay with a 15’ cathedral ceiling and a 2 post lift. I was working on old Porsches at the time.

Recognizing the land constraints you are in a tough spot

Which is more important to you? Working room or car storage?

 

[Hank11]

The obvious thing to me is the dormer arrangement. I’d make them full length instead of chopped halves. Simpler framing and more space.

 

[dave*99]

As drawn, the lift and the door to the staircase will give you little space to maneuver. If you intend to use the second floor for storage, keep in mind the hard 90 degree turn at the bottom of the staircase will limit what you can carry up there.

The footprint of a narrow Bend Pak 4 post HD-9ST is 100.25" x 174" without the ramps. Check your drawing. The lift is drawn at 86" wide.

The issue is that 20x40 is bigger than a 2 car garage and smaller than a 4 car garage for a hobbyist that wants to work in the garage.
I knew a guy that would put his Boxster on dollies in the winter and turn it sideways at the front of the garage. He got 3 cars in a 2 car garage with that method.

I'm not sure it this helps, but take a look at one of these maybe it helps free up some space.

 

[CraigStu]

Lot's of comments here about the size. I am not sure about the timing of the posts vs when the OP put in the overall lot diagram but it seems to me there are a lot of negative comments that are useless because of the OP's restrictions. It is pretty obvious that he can't go 28 wide no matter how much he would like to. He can't put the doors on the long side either. I do agree about too many windows. I'd reduce the # but keep them at normal viewing height. He will be able to look out and see his kids in the pool, on the lawn, etc. Just that view keeps a guy kind of in the family activity loop even if he is in the garage. Valuable. I also agree about the (to my eyes) funny roof line. I'd make the dormer one piece. Also it would make the framing simpler. I would also consider a 2 post lift for greater usability. And consider it more of a 3 car garage so there can be room around the lift. There may only be 7-8ft of space left next to it but one can sneak a small car in there. Either a car that isn't used very often or maybe just put there once in a while to allow an extra car under roof for weather or vacation.

 

[rockcrawler]

If the upstairs area is just for storage, why not put the stairs outside to provide more room inside? You’re loosing space for something that will be rarely used.

 

[Rounder]

The issue is that 20x40 is bigger than a 2 car garage and smaller than a 4 car garage for a hobbyist that wants to work in the garage.
.

Agree. This seems like just a place to park, if you live in a subdivision and can't park outside. I have a 20x40. If I wanted to park autos I would do 40x25 or 30. 30x60?? So I could pull in and back out. Maybe that would give you some room in the back.

Either way I have this long narrow barn too, and just don't care for it. My other pole barn is wider. 30 or 35. Comfortably fit two vehicles side by side with room in the back for stuff. Still end up with land locked stuff though.

If I was spending what I am guessing will be a ton of money, I would go just a little bigger, 20 foot wide is not much for 2 autos.

If I was building new I would want a seperate area, other than parking cars. All you are doing is spending lots of money to park cars and put your wifes christmas decorations upstairs. Do you really want to be carrying those up the stairs for her?

I like loft, but it will hotter than hell too, especially in Texas.

It needs to be wider, less windows, or windows up high. Both my barns have transparent panels up high to let light in.

 

[dave*99]

Agree. This seems like just a place to park, if you live in a subdivision and can't park outside. I have a 20x40. If I wanted to park autos I would do 40x25 or 30. 30x60?? So I could pull in and back out. Maybe that would give you some room in the back.

Either way I have this long narrow barn too, and just don't care for it. My other pole barn is wider. 30 or 35. Comfortably fit two vehicles side by side with room in the back for stuff. Still end up with land locked stuff though.

If I was spending what I am guessing will be a ton of money, I would go just a little bigger, 20 foot wide is not much for 2 autos.

If I was building new I would want a seperate area, other than parking cars. All you are doing is spending lots of money to park cars and put your wifes christmas decorations upstairs. Do you really want to be carrying those up the stairs for her?

I like loft, but it will hotter than hell too, especially in Texas.

It needs to be wider, less windows, or windows up high. Both my barns have transparent panels up high to let light in.

Look at post 28, there is no land to go bigger. Consider how you would organize your 20x40 if that was all the space you could achieve. The lot is packed to the gills.

 

[Rounder]

Look at post 28, there is no land to go bigger. Consider how you would organize your 20x40 if that was all the space you could achieve. The lot is packed to the gills.

My first post was to not spend the money on this property. I wouldn't. I would wait until I could move. He will not get the value of what he spends when he sells it. And its not worth spending all that money for what he is getting.

But if you wanted to know, I park my trucks outside. I have never parked an auto inside in my life. I keep a pushbroom outside to clear snow

I would put a shop in the back half, and front to work on vehicles. As many have said, get rid of the windows. I doubt he will. I suspect he wanted us to admire what he building, look at this$$$.

He will spend to much on this, to be worth it IMO. Move.

 

[TXpcargarage]

Given some of the constraints, I think this needs to be the approach.

With your desire for shelving, storage etc. Some of that certainly can go up to the second floor. Give some though to tool boxes and size of shelving for regularly accessed stuff, work benches etc. and start drawing those into your planned design. You might be surprised how quickly that available floor space disappears.

For example, a lot of people like to have the tool boxes directly in front of the lift. So in front of the lift you need a couple feet for tool boxes, plus space to move around. And if you are the type to help other work on their vehicles - you'll have a garage and a lift, you'll be amazed at how many friends you suddenly have - think about how much space you need to two people to be moving around the front of a vehicle.

I have a 30' x 40' but no attic storage. But with work benches, shelving, tool boxes, the lift etc., having three vehicles in there gets tight. Granted there's a lot of **** in my garage.

I'm not opposed to the 3-car plus workspace approach. Wife's car is outside unless we hear of nasty hail or tornado, so it's only mine going inside. I've asked architect to see about widening and lengthening, but we're at or near limits given lot and other needs.

What model 4 post lift is shown on the drawings? Seems much smaller than usual.

As others have said 9 foot doors minimum.

I had a 16’ wide door on the old house. Wife and I parked in it daily. It was a side entrance garage too. Surprisingly we had no issues. Garage interior was 21’ wide. Cars were parked on an angle. Splayed out at the front. Rears closer together. But for working on cars the space sucked.

The neighbors had the same size garage with 8’ doors. Way too tight.

Eventually I added a 14x25’ third bay with a 15’ cathedral ceiling and a 2 post lift. I was working on old Porsches at the time.

Recognizing the land constraints you are in a tough spot

Which is more important to you? Working room or car storage?

Both are important, but I don't need the best of all. Just a workable space.

Lift I'm picturing is this: https://rotarylift.com/product/spoa10-av/

The obvious thing to me is the dormer arrangement. I’d make them full length instead of chopped halves. Simpler framing and more space.

As of now, those are mandated by the conservation district (Gov't-powered hoa). But I've asked whether we can run them full length.

If the upstairs area is just for storage, why not put the stairs outside to provide more room inside? You’re loosing space for something that will be rarely used.

I might try to get the upstairs permitted as living space in the future, so want to future-proof that path.

Look at post 28, there is no land to go bigger. Consider how you would organize your 20x40 if that was all the space you could achieve. The lot is packed to the gills.

Exactly. This is the question I was trying to ask.

My first post was to not spend the money on this property. I wouldn't. I would wait until I could move. He will not get the value of what he spends when he sells it. And its not worth spending all that money for what he is getting.

But if you wanted to know, I park my trucks outside. I have never parked an auto inside in my life. I keep a pushbroom outside to clear snow

I would put a shop in the back half, and front to work on vehicles. As many have said, get rid of the windows. I doubt he will. I suspect he wanted us to admire what he building, look at this$$$.

He will spend to much on this, to be worth it IMO. Move.

Plan A is to live here until I die. And I need a garage. Hope I helped you vent some frustration with whatever's vexing you.

 

[TXpcargarage]

Not having read everything in this very active thread. Just noted "No drivethrough as per city regulations". An 'emergency exit' could always be argumented.
Very nice garage.

Appreciate the kind words. It's coming together.

I think the man door is doable. I just can't do car doors at both ends. It's a city ordinance; one direction car entry only. Plus, I have something like a 40-foot setback in the front, which means I basically can't use my own front lawn. But I CAN put my driveway there. With the size of the lot and those constraints, it doesn't make sense to chew up back yard space, which I DO have control over and can make private / use for whatever. I'd rather take what is effectively a city park and use that for my driveway.

 

[TXpcargarage]

You need some wall space. Workbench and layout areas for tools and parts. Clean up sink as well. Looks a bit narrow for me. Just my .02.

Here are some thoughts.

THat's the dream, and I sent your pics to the architect. I don't think I'll have anywhere near that amount of space.

What is the finish on the floor?

Thanks

 

[CraigStu]

That is an excellent lift. I retired from a Lexus dealer as a tech 12 yrs ago. 6yrs prior to that we moved into the new shop. It had 25 of the 9000# version of that lift. You will love it.

 

[Richard D]

I would consider at least one mandoor a necessity, if for no other reason than safety.