Please critique my garage

[TXpcargarage]

Hello,

I'm in the process of renovating a house in Texas, and I finally get to build the garage of my dreams (tempered by my budget). The goal is four cars, with a 2-post lift, and room to work.


Here's the layout I have so far. Interior space is 20'10" wide by 40'8" (to back wall)

Goals for the downstairs:
- Car storage
- Room to work on the cars (minor stuff in the three other bays, more in-depth on the lift)
- Workspace (countertop, storage shelving around and above, drawers, etc.

Things I want on the first floor:
- Fridge (beers)
- Shelving (car parts)
- Counter to work on smaller stuff, guns, hi-fi, etc.
- Larger shelving for parts, wheels, etc.

Thoughts on garage lighting? I'd like both diffuse and direct, as I would like to dive into detailing at some point and keep them shiny.

Does this seem like a reasonable space? I'm thinking of expanding it 1 foot wider and 2 feet deeper.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

Outward appearance:


Upper floor (storage)


Main floor (grey dotted line represents raised ceiling to 12' for lift clearance.



Cutaways (raised floor is only around and above lift per the above):

 

[Copymutt]

Like it. If boats or trailered items to work on consider a drive thru. OH door on both ends.

 

[TXpcargarage]

Like it. If boats or trailered items to work on consider a drive thru. OH door on both ends.

Appreciate the kind words. No boats, no trailers, not allowed to have a drive thru per city.

 

[The Cobbler]

no man door at the end with the overheads?

 

[TXpcargarage]

no man door at the end with the overheads?

I was debating that last night. On the one hand it’ll be a push of a button to open the main doors. On the other hand the only man door is at the far corner of the garage from the house. Would I be making a mistake in not putting another door closer?

 

[tarmy]

You need some wall space. Workbench and layout areas for tools and parts. Clean up sink as well. Looks a bit narrow for me. Just my .02.

Here are some thoughts.

 

[rayra]

That’s a fine storage space four four vehicles.
also pretty sure having to shuffle cars around for the primary working / detailing spot will get tiresome pretty quick.
Way too narrow and short for that config. Barely room to open car doors fully, much less move and work around said open doors. And then no room for shelves / storage alongside the vehicles. That’s a huge opportunity missed.
lastly the pair of single doors is also unnecessarily restrictive. Looks cute in the plan views. But combined with the tight lack of extra space will wind up meaning you have to put a car out to do anything major or detailing. And when you do, you’ll have to pull a car in and turn it diagonal to gain enough working room. Instead of just pulling into the middle of a 16’ door.

either make the building 4’ wider and with a double door, or radically alter your design ideas to have something like a 2-car space as you primary roomy work area, and two single door standard spaces off to one end or even flanking.

eta I also note you are using some fairly small vehicles in your layout and I presume those are the vehicles you have or intend to have. It looks like 3 VWs and a small suv. That’s fine. Now try fitting four full sized vehicles, or pickup or Suburbans in there and see how your layout plan works. ‘Future proof’ to accommodate larger vehicles, other vehicles. Particularly if think you will be doing detailing work.

a building is a major expense and yes everything I suggested raises costs. But imagine spending that large amount and immediately running into ‘it’s too tight / small’ problems.

if you can’t afford a larger building in one go, consider a smaller plan that could readily be expanded later

 

[RPH]

Lift way to close to wall, at 18” there is enough room for the tire but not you. I would like that to be 36” minimum.

 

[nmk_61802]

Have you picked a lift yet? I think 13.5' is a little short for most.

 

[nadogail]

All garages seem to be too small

 

[kbeefy]

Lift is too close to the wall and the man door.
Like @rayra mentions, that might work for storage but not for working on anything.

I like to leave at least 3' of clearance on any wall for cabinets, shelves, countertops and enough room to stand in front of them. More if you want to open a car door.

My personal shop has at least 6' of clearance on all walls for 24" of shelving/storage and 4 additional feet to move equipment around.

 

[Youngandfree]

I was debating that last night. On the one hand it’ll be a push of a button to open the main doors. On the other hand the only man door is at the far corner of the garage from the house. Would I be making a mistake in not putting another door closer?

You lose more conditioned air opening a roll up just to walk in and out.

 

[ns_astro]

This looks like a great project ... congrats on taking this on. We built an accessory building for a workshop a few years ago and love it.

A couple of comments:

- I definitely echo the comments about width, clearances, height, etc. that others have made. Think through the process, for example, of detailing the car and wanting to have doors wide open, etc. The space for lifts and the space for storage (cabinets, tool chests, etc.) should be considered as already mentioned. You can take years to add in the finishing details, but space is hard to add later.

- Re: lighting. Have lots in terms of primary overhead lighting and think about the colour temperature. Also, look for opportunities for good task lighting. Putting strip lighting under cabinets that are above benches, etc. go a long way in terms making it a nice space to work in. I added some pot lights above benches and really happy I did. From a budget perspective, you can put initial wiring (or have chases for wiring) and add the finishing touches later. In the case of detailing, you want to make sure you have space to place and move lighting (i.e. on a stand) that lets you get good angles for when polishing or apply and removing product without leaving high spots.

- Man door close to where you will be coming and going for sure.

- I didn't see anything in the plan that shows you have water running to the building. A utility sink, water and drainage for washing cars inside (if you are really keen on detailing), and a washroom are all things to consider. In our building we have a small washroom and utility sink and very happy we do. Again if you are keen on detailing but will be washing cars outside, think about your building placement and see if you can have a place in the shade.

- Your plan has plenty of windows. It takes away from storage space, but in our building we have good views and opted for windows to take advantage of them and allow natural light. Glad we did. It makes it a great space to spend time. But do think about the storage implications.

Have fun planning this thing!

 

[rayra]

Lift is too close to the wall and the man door.
Like @rayra mentions, that might work for storage but not for working on anything.

I like to leave at least 3' of clearance on any wall for cabinets, shelves, countertops and enough room to stand in front of them. More if you want to open a car door.

My personal shop has at least 6' of clearance on all walls for 24" of shelving/storage and 4 additional feet to move equipment around.

That is my thinking as well. I've worked on too many full-sized vehicles, doors wide open, rewiring electrical or other interior mods, dragging a tool cart or shop vac around.
I'd think the best setup would be a 2-car door and space, where there is sufficient room to pull a vehicle into the middle of it AND have plenty of space at the front end for full movement around the engine bay AND have the workbench / shelving forward of that. And the two single-car spaces are essentially parking spaces / storage, not 'working' spaces. Both to one flank would also allow a partition or even a curtain wall.
My full-sized pickup and Suburban are both about 19'L and nearly 7'W. A 10'W x 20'L space is nowhere near big enough to work around or fully open their doors and then move anything around them without having to close them again.

Another issue that doesn't get thought about it or gets dismissed is sale-ability. OP may not need space for full-sized vehicles, a future home buyer might. Put that under 'future proofing' as well.

 

[beltfeed]

If you can bump the size up a little it will help in the long run. Try to get the width up to 28' with a lift and bump the length out to 45' if possible. I also would put 9' wide X 8' tall doors on it. You will need benches on the side and or the end of the garage to truly do work.

 

[mike93lx]

I agree on storage space. I dont see that as a 4 car garage... 2 cars plus room for tools and projects

 

[Black300zx]

I was debating that last night. On the one hand it’ll be a push of a button to open the main doors. On the other hand the only man door is at the far corner of the garage from the house. Would I be making a mistake in not putting another door closer?

When it's ******* rain or cold outside, not having to open the overhead doors will be nice in my opinion

 

[RegeSullivan]

As others have mentioned a bit larger will serve your goals for 4 cars and a lift better. You will end up moving the lift away from the wall so maybe if 28 or 30 feet wide isn't a possibility get used to the idea of a 3 car garage with room for your lift, tools and detail equipment. 30x50 would be great for your goals but your design looks really nice and will be a wonderful place to work on your cars/hobbies.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Your plan looks nice (I assume it will be brick on the exterior?) but if it were me I'd have two double doors along the long side so that cars would enter that way. Having to back out a car to get to another one will get tiresome.

As for size I alway figure in multiples of 12' x 24' for each vehicle, so a four car garage would ideally be 24' x 48'. Of course that can vary depending on the size of your vehicles - if you have a double cab extended bed pickup it's not enough, if you have a MINI it's more than needed.

 

[CombatNinja]

It's nice looking but the layout looks awful for working on cars. The lift is too close to the wall for my liking and that vast wall of windows, while attractive, would preclude cabinets or storage on that whole wall. The windows actually look too low to even have benches there?

I also agree on the issue of having no service door to use, esp. if the space is going to be climate-controlled. I'd look at making the overhead doors on the long side and making your shorter dimension a foot or two more so you can pull full-size vehicles in. If you're restricted to 40'8", maybe just make 3 x 9' doors across?

 

[KSJeff]

Beautiful building. My .02 since you asked.... Not sure what applies to you.

All those windows at that height on the side kill all your wall space. I'd want the bottom sill at least 36" off the floor so I could put in a shelf and have functional windows. However, there's not much room for shelves and walking so maybe that's a mute point.

Your cars are too close to the wall. Can you get out of all your cars with 18" of door swing?

Four post lift I assume? Don't think that's enough width for a two post and you don't have enough room to do much along side the car. If you need to pull out an axle how would you do that? Up that close to the wall it's going to be cramped and dark. I wouldn't want to work there.

I'd want a single garage door since I'd probably always put a car in the middle given such little wall clearance.

I'd want a man door on the front or the front side.

Not sure which way that's facing, but if you want air flow through there, I'd put a couple of windows on the other side as well.

For me, I'd probably want that lift centered, a big door and I'd call it a 2 car garage. I just don't see anything there but a parking area and keeping all your tools/parts upstairs is going to get old in about 30 seconds.

But it looks awesome and if that's the only thing you can get your wife to agree on, then I'd do it.

 

[flippin]

As mentioned by others, two single doors look pretty but they are less functional unless they are at least 10' wide. As we get older.... the narrow space always becomes an issue when coming and going. I have so many friends that built beautiful garages and still proceeded with 3-4 narrow doors instead of a couple of 16' doors. Needless to say they all sheepishly say "I should've listened"

 

[firebirdparts]

I will just go on record here saying I find it super easy to drive a car through a 9 foot door, blindfolded, at night, whatever. Obviously, a 10' wide door is great if the building is big enough to have that. But this is not, at least not yet. it's not an option at all.

Some people here like 16 foot doors, but I don't see how. If you can't get a car through a 9 foot door, how could you get two cars through a 16 and open a car door? It doesn't make any sense at all.

Changing the subject, I have dormers like that on my house, on the back, and I don't like the looks. With this layout, you may be kinda stuck there, but if "cute" is a consideration, I'd put cuter (smaller) dormers on the side people will see. Keep the big dormer on the side facing away from you.

 

[sjvicker]

Everyone on here will tell you to go bigger but you seem space/regulation constrained. You're considering going 1' wider and 2' longer and that seems small but that takes you from 847sqft to 931sqft.

What about going for the firehouse look and doing a flat roof on the second story?

 

[Viper98912]

Garage? I thought this was a house at first!

Firstly, beautiful exterior. Very very nice, I love the design, brick, and windows.

I would make the garage door 8' wide doors and not 7's. Overall, 21' wide is somewhat tight, I would go wider, you can never have enough space to walk around a car and open the doors, etc.

Also, how do you plan on getting stuff up to the second floor? The stairs? That gets old quick (and so do we ). I recommend having one area where you can "pulley lift" stuff up.

Finally, since you have a "split" second floor, how exactly is that being executed? Are you doing some LVL beams and then stacking the joists on top or something? Or are you needing to do support columns in the middle of the floor? Because if columns, it will REALLY hurt you in terms of moving the cars around and how you open the doors, etc. I think the split floor may not be the best idea, you may want to go with a level floor, high enough for your two post. But then of course it will limit your headroom in the storage area.

Overall, very nice! Lots of great ideas will probably come from this thread.

 

[thammel]

For 4 cars, I'd want it 48'wide and 32' deep at a minimum. Of course, with this layout, the garage doors would be on the wider side. I like 10' wide by 8' high doors. Ceilings should be 12' at a minimum for a lift. Also, I like water in a garage - a full bathroom with a shower. If you plan on HVAC you should have a door to separate the 2nd floor from the first floor. Also, think about a compressor isolation room. By the way, all these comments come from my own personal experience. I blew it on the shower and door separating the floors, but was pretty good on everything else!

 

[finn]

That’s a fine storage space four four vehicles.
also pretty sure having to shuffle cars around for the primary working / detailing spot will get tiresome pretty quick.
Way too narrow and short for that config. Barely room to open car doors fully, much less move and work around said open doors. And then no room for shelves / storage alongside the vehicles. That’s a huge opportunity missed.
lastly the pair of single doors is also unnecessarily restrictive. Looks cute in the plan views. But combined with the tight lack of extra space will wind up meaning you have to put a car out to do anything major or detailing. And when you do, you’ll have to pull a car in and turn it diagonal to gain enough working room. Instead of just pulling into the middle of a 16’ door.

either make the building 4’ wider and with a double door, or radically alter your design ideas to have something like a 2-car space as you primary roomy work area, and two single door standard spaces off to one end or even flanking.

eta I also note you are using some fairly small vehicles in your layout and I presume those are the vehicles you have or intend to have. It looks like 3 VWs and a small suv. That’s fine. Now try fitting four full sized vehicles, or pickup or Suburbans in there and see how your layout plan works. ‘Future proof’ to accommodate larger vehicles, other vehicles. Particularly if think you will be doing detailing work.

a building is a major expense and yes everything I suggested raises costs. But imagine spending that large amount and immediately running into ‘it’s too tight / small’ problems.

if you can’t afford a larger building in one go, consider a smaller plan that could readily be expanded later

I’ll second this. My 20’x20’ in Az is pretty useless if i try to fit a Jeep Cherokee and a Ram 1500 in it, but reasonable if I have a 67 Mustang and the Cherokee.

A lot of windows for natural light is great, but don’t underestimate the effect of lost wall space. I would suggest looking at high mounted windows.

 

[TXpcargarage]

So, it seems like the consensus is that I should go narrower.

In all seriousness, I appreciate the ideas.

A few points which might help steer the conversation:

I have less than half an acre total on which to enact my dreams. .39 acres to be exact.

The house itself is ~2,600 square feet. While I have fantasies about the 25 car garage with an apartment above it, the reality is that I don't want to dwarf my house.

We are tearing down the existing 2-car garage, with a ceiling height of about 5'10", to put this in.

This thing could be 1/4 the size, and it would still be the nicest garage I've ever owned / worked in. I'm used to cracked concrete and a piece of cardboard as a creeper.

The lot is in suburban Dallas, in a conservation district (Think HOA with the power of government). I have:
- Height restrictions
- Lot coverage restrictions
- Style restrictions (adding peaks to the dormers to make them more in keeping with the neighborhood style)
- Living space restrictions
- Wife restrictions
- Restriction restrictions...

- I'm married to a very understanding and supportive wife, but she has limits.

- Using the wide side for entry is out. A pass-through is out.

- We have a sloped corner lot, so we added a retaining wall to create two levels. The higher level is to the east, where the garage is located. Between the garage and the retaining wall, we need a path (no chewing into the lawn space with the path, I'm told).

- To the north of the garage I have utility access to property, pool equipment, generator, and am supposed to provide the kid with a jungle gym, to then be replaced by a garden with some raised planting beds.

- Need windows on the west side to break up the view. Otherwise we'd have a giant brick monolith looming over our lawn and pool area (see below)

- That said, I'm going to shrink the windows into two tighter groups of three, so I'll have space on either end and between them for shelving / storage.

- great point about lifting the windows above workbench height.

- After talking with the GC about cost of masonry these days, and talking to the conservation district about style restrictions, we are likely going with hardy siding to be more "tudor" and to keep costs down.

- Shop sink is in the works. Architect didn't include it in this round.

- I'll ask how wide we can go with lot coverage and other constraints. This might end up being a 3-car garage with workshop space, and room for a fourth car in a pinch (hail, vacation, etc)

- The cars in question are:
- 89 Porsche 911 (lowered)
- 03 BMW 540 Wagon (lowered)
- 85 Land Cruiser FJ60 (lifted)
- Wife's soccer mobile (Hyundai Santa Fe) - This doesn't get a spot in the garage.

- I had anticipated (or wanted) a 2-post lift. I was thinking of a Rotary. Most of my work is going to be monkey stuff - wheels, tires, brakes, detailing, etc. - I've heard a number of complaints about 4-post lifts limiting access to these areas (see m539 for one 2-post lover).
- https://rotarylift.com/product/spoa10-av/

I think this might help (original garage shown below; new garage will extend past "UPPER LEVEL" wording):

 

[Wreckster23]

My thoughts,
Move the lift back a bit, it's too close to the rear wall especially with the man door there, don't want to have to duck under the car to get to the door
Too many windows too spaced out for a garage space per my thinking, especially that last one towards the back where cabinet space could be more worthwhile. A couple double windows with space between should you want some wall storage or cabinet space (about 5 foot wider would make that even better but that costs)
One big single garage door, wonder what that would cost.. but that would make pulling cars in to detail super easy. Right in the middle of that front space.

 

[crewchief888]

I wouldn’t have my guns/gear/reloading eq in the garage either make space upstairs or leave them in the house.
In my current house all gun related stuff is in its own room in the basement. I have 2 separate benches one for reloading, another for tear down/ repairs.
this area for my competition guns/gear is 15x11 and sometimes gets a little crowded

 

[GrayFlattop]

No surprise here, go wider. IMO, 24’ is the minimum width if you will actually be using the garage to work on average size vehicles. 26’ or 28’ would be better.

I was limited to a 24 x40 by the building department, and I curse them daily - and have for 34 years. If I am doing any substantial work, I have to shuffle cars around (or out).

 

[Fixr]

I agree with the wider consensus. 12x24 per car has been standard minimum workshop bay size for decades because it's the smallest size that is reasonably workable around an average passenger car. You don't want to have to close the car doors every time you need to get past. And you want room to swing a floor jack handle around, even when you have a lift.

Within the limits of your restrictions, I very strongly recommend going for size over cool finishes, at least to begin with.

 

[Richard D]

Ditch the windows. Not only a waste of space, keeps prying eyes out. If the wife complains, put dummy windows outside.

 

[crewchief888]

my garage is small, 19X22 and is very crowded. when i was building my s10 blazer i took up the entire space, wifes car for parked in the driveway for 6 months over the winter. when i had the s10 blazer and her car both in the garage, i had just enough room to open my toolbox drawers along the wall, couldn't open her passenger door or passenger door on the blazer. i eventually moved the blazer outside to make some room to "work"

 

[Viper98912]

- Wife restrictions

This one's easy. She can only be mad at you for so long

 

[Fixr]

This one's easy. She can only be mad at you for so long

Just until the divorce is final?

 

[TXpcargarage]

I wouldn’t have my guns/gear/reloading eq in the garage either make space upstairs or leave them in the house.
In my current house all gun related stuff is in its own room in the basement. I have 2 separate benches one for reloading, another for tear down/ repairs.
this area for my competition guns/gear is 15x11 and sometimes gets a little crowded

No basements in this part of Texas, unfortunately. No guns or powder will be in the garage. Just a workbench, which I don't have in the house.

Ditch the windows. Not only a waste of space, keeps prying eyes out. If the wife complains, put dummy windows outside.

Those windows will face the interior of the property, which has an 8-10 foot fence surrounding it.

 

[dandan111]

I like it. I would do 10ft wide doors. I’d put 4ft between overhead doors. I like all the windows!

 

[Rounder]

One of my pole barns is 20 wide and 40 deep. previous owner built it for RV. I do not like it, things get parked in the back. Looks like you have doors in the back for that. Then you lose all that wall space. But either way you lose wall space for garage doors.

I suppose it depends on your land shape. I would prefer 40 wide and 20 deep. I would rather have section to the side, blocked off for shop that would not need doors, so more wall space. But that is what I would want.

Doors at ground level invite theft, not that I am overly worried about it. But I am againt all those windows because you losing valuable wall space, and just adding cost.

Are you living in an unAmerican subdivision? why make the thing so cute looking?

Before I spent all this money, do you really want to live where you are at with all the rules? Before I spent this much money i would in the country and be free.


Also this looks like just a place to park cars, and have some storage upstairs. what are you gaining after spending all this money? to small.

 

[Rounder]

I like nothing about it, needs more wall space. More space for items other than cars. Is this just for your wife?