Long versus Extra Long 3/8 locking flex head ratchet
- Thread starter mikey03
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Fedwrench
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I'd go for the 13 inch long version. I think 3/8 drive ratchets over 14 inches in length flex too much and are too long for use in some applications. The 13 inch gives you enough length & leverage to effectively use the full range of 3/8 socket sizes. 
oldschoolcraft
Well-known member
I think a better question is what will you pair with it? Is it your only ratchet? Or will you have two? Three?
If you're ending up with 4+ then you will wind up having one of everything anyway as the obsession grows.
But what's a good two ratchet set in 3/8? Maybe the 13" locking flex paired with a smaller stubby flex non-locking that will give you more options in low access places. I'm not a pro mechanic, maybe others have good ideas on a two versus three ratchet setup pairing.
If you're ending up with 4+ then you will wind up having one of everything anyway as the obsession grows.
But what's a good two ratchet set in 3/8? Maybe the 13" locking flex paired with a smaller stubby flex non-locking that will give you more options in low access places. I'm not a pro mechanic, maybe others have good ideas on a two versus three ratchet setup pairing.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
GM wheel bearing hub assembly. I'm under the car with my 11 1/2'' long flex head ratchet with both hands on the handle pulling with every ounce of strength I got to tighten those 3 bolts. My 17 1/2'' long 1/2'' drive version had too big of a head to get in there. The extra long 3/8'' drive flex head ratchet is on my list of tools to get. I don't know if I need the locking flex though.
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VolvoRyan
Well-known member
The shortest locking flex from every manufacturer is pretty long compared to the "standard" 3/8" handle.
In the flow chart of life, you gotta start with the shorter ratchet before going for the longer.
-Ryan
In the flow chart of life, you gotta start with the shorter ratchet before going for the longer.
-Ryan
13" given the OPs question. My most used 3/8 is ~10" long because it fits and does the job. I use the 12-13" ones occasionally, and the 15 and 18" almost never, in comparison. Yes, there will be an application where you'll need the 15-18", but for me that's a 1% thing.
oldschoolcraft
Well-known member
I dont know if they exist, but someone probably makes a 20" 3/8" drive breaker bar. If it's really a 1% thing that's pretty rare, what if OP paired the 13" locking flex head with a 20" breaker bar. And that 1% scenario at least he isn't stuck, he can use the breaker bar. Maybe just to break and then finish with the 13"
Looks like Snap On makes an 18"
Snap-on Store
Kind of weird they make a ratchet that's longer than their breaker bar.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
I dont know if they exist, but someone probably makes a 20" 3/8" drive breaker bar. If it's really a 1% thing that's pretty rare, what if OP paired the 13" locking flex head with a 20" breaker bar. And that 1% scenario at least he isn't stuck, he can use the breaker bar. Maybe just to break and then finish with the 13"
Looks like Snap On makes an 18"
Snap-on Store
shop.snapon.com
Kind of weird they make a ratchet that's longer than their breaker bar.
This bad-boy is probably what I'll get eventually.
Wiz02
Well-known member
I am so stealing your saying!
Dave455
Well-known member
I'd go for the long / 13".
I have this ratchet, and it's by far my most used, even with other lengths to choose from. It's got just enough leverage to break loose the things I need to, like caliper bolts or sump plugs, but also to make light work of rusted fasteners that need a lot of turning. Often I just pick up one ratchet from my box, and it's this one.
The extra long is awesome when you need it, but it's not a frequently used tool.
The extra long isn't so much about giving you leverage, but reach. These are superb, almost essential in some cases, for holding belt tensioners. Sometimes you can access a tensioner from the "wrong" direction, cable tie the ratchet handle, and remove the belt relatively unobstructed. Sometimes you need these even from the right direction.
Yet another example of a Snap On tool that few other makers offer, yet is bordering on essential for some jobs.
With these XL ratchets you really do need fine teeth though. Dual 80 is just great.
I have this ratchet, and it's by far my most used, even with other lengths to choose from. It's got just enough leverage to break loose the things I need to, like caliper bolts or sump plugs, but also to make light work of rusted fasteners that need a lot of turning. Often I just pick up one ratchet from my box, and it's this one.
The extra long is awesome when you need it, but it's not a frequently used tool.
The extra long isn't so much about giving you leverage, but reach. These are superb, almost essential in some cases, for holding belt tensioners. Sometimes you can access a tensioner from the "wrong" direction, cable tie the ratchet handle, and remove the belt relatively unobstructed. Sometimes you need these even from the right direction.
Yet another example of a Snap On tool that few other makers offer, yet is bordering on essential for some jobs.
With these XL ratchets you really do need fine teeth though. Dual 80 is just great.
oldschoolcraft
Well-known member
Damn you just blew my mind. If I got a job designing cars, I'd come up with a way to have a hole near the belt tensioner. So you could insert a rod in there, and lock that rod to the wrench that's putting tension.
I only change my belt every 5 or so years, but it's enough of a pain in the **** that I'd love this feature. Actually, come to think of it, I should probably just have a friend pull tension while I do the belt with two hands.
oldschoolcraft
Well-known member
On further thought, would a 1/2 drive breaker bar with Koken Zeal sockets have had low enough clearance to work?
I've been eyeballing Koken Zeal low profile sockets lately and looking for excuses to buy them in 1/2 drive.
Dave455
Well-known member
That would be an excellent idea. Or even just a locking pin.Damn you just blew my mind. If I got a job designing cars, I'd come up with a way to have a hole near the belt tensioner. So you could insert a rod in there, and lock that rod to the wrench that's putting tension.
I only change my belt every 5 or so years, but it's enough of a pain in the **** that I'd love this feature. Actually, come to think of it, I should probably just have a friend pull tension while I do the belt with two hands.
Unfortunately, while most of us here are practical people and can see the need for such things, engine designers are not.
If you work on older vehicles, which I generally do, you have to remove the belt before swapping an alternator, water pump, idler pulley, ore even the tensioner itself, so the requirement comes up fairly often.
richfinn
Well-known member
Meh, locking mechanisms just add bulk at the business end.
I've managed for nearly 40 years as a "pro mechanic" and never owned locking flex heads
I've currently got three flex head 3/8" ratchets, an extendable Facom which is a high Torque animal of a tool, A Snap-On dual 80 (I guess it's around 13") which is somewhere in between and a more delicate Ko-ken Zeal 72T (280mm) which is super compact where it matters and very low backdrag for tight access jobs.
I like all three for different reasons, but gun to my head would still probably pick Snap-On as an all rounder.
richfinn
Well-known member
I've seen that on a brand of European or Japanese cars, but I can't remember which one
Dave455
Well-known member
Perhaps check some of the prices on Japanese websites. The weak Yen is giving some competitive prices at the mo.
I tend to use "Webike" a Japanese bike part supplier. Used them for bike parts, but they have a lot of Japanese tools available.
Dave455
Well-known member
As I was writing that I was thinking the same, but can't remember either. Not something I've worked on recently.I've seen that on a brand of European or Japanese cars, but I can't remember which one
Not BMW's I can say for sure...
The clown length ratchets to compensate for everyone being a weenie are a relatively new development. People have been fixing "modern cars" with ~13 inch ratchets for close to 20 years now. A nearly 2 foot long 3/8 ratchet is a little silly, not to mention the fact that it's likely to be more of a hindrance than anything else. Think about how much of a hassle getting a 2ft breaker bar in an engine bay would be.
I wouldn't buy a 20" 3/8 unless I've got every other nice to have tool and the cash is burning a hole in my pocket. The 13 seems far more practical to me.
I wouldn't buy a 20" 3/8 unless I've got every other nice to have tool and the cash is burning a hole in my pocket. The 13 seems far more practical to me.
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KnurledNut
Well-known member
Damn you just blew my mind. If I got a job designing cars, I'd come up with a way to have a hole near the belt tensioner. So you could insert a rod in there, and lock that rod to the wrench that's putting tension.
I only change my belt every 5 or so years, but it's enough of a pain in the **** that I'd love this feature. Actually, come to think of it, I should probably just have a friend pull tension while I do the belt with two hands.
I've seen that on a brand of European or Japanese cars, but I can't remember which one
A lot of tensioners have the ability to pin, even some BMWs.
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Did my B8 Audi tensioner about a month ago and it had a pin. I can't recall a single tensioner that hasn't had the ability to pin, which is why I keep a handful of pins in my top drawer!A lot of tensioners have the ability to pin, even some BMWs.
KnurledNut
Well-known member
I've worked on some that don't.
L-keys work well for pinning- the short leg gives a grab point.
Sorry for derailing the thread, guys.
@mikey03, i'd choose the 13" ratchet.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
That might've worked, but I would've had to use a 12-point socket to get the handle out of the way of the floor.
An extra long ratchet would've let me tighten the bolts with one hand.
Dave455
Well-known member
Sounds like I need to look at mine more closely.A lot of tensioners have the ability to pin, even some BMWs.
Except of course, that I can barely see it at all, hence I'm using my extra long ratchet to even reach it...!
richfinn
Well-known member
The one I saw was on either a Ford Galaxy/VW Sharan
Maybe it’s because, like so many on here have been saying for years, modern ratchet design has made the breaker bar near obsolete.
ThePostman
Well-known member
Go with the 13", but make it a Matco, better locking mechanism, lower profile head, and more ergonomic grips if you want that
rust in the eye
Well-known member
Not many places under the hood you'll have room to swing a 20" handle. If you need that much leverage chances are you should step up drive size.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
That ratchet would be perfect for rotating the engine over by the crank bolt, but it's more of a under-car ratchet.
oldschoolcraft
Well-known member
Interesting! What's changed with modern ratchets to negate the need for breaker bars? Are they just so much stronger that they can handle more torque without breaking?
Dakotadadv8
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Already have the CM extra long 3/8 quick release flex ratchet. Not bad but have the new Snap on Flex 3/8 100 tooth ratchet FLF100, already will be my go to for flex. May need to add the Snap on flex 1/2 drive, not sure if locking flex is better for the 1/2 drive.
assassin10000
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One? The 18" matco locking flex. It's my most used.
I mainly deal with suspension though. Still great in the engine bay for tensioners or other items where a long reach is necessary.
I mainly deal with suspension though. Still great in the engine bay for tensioners or other items where a long reach is necessary.
Yes.
For the OP, if you haven’t bought yet, I too don’t like locking flex ratchets. Snap Ons flex heads are designed to be quite stiff, not in anyway loose or floppy. So locking isn’t critical. I have hard handles and soft handles and chrome handles and everyone here prefers the soft handles, even tho they can take a minute to clean.
When you need more torque, you should be switching to 1/2” drive. Related to @oldschoolcraft s question above, the strength of the guts of these ratchets has both rendered breakers obsolete, and permitted manufacturers to mKe longer ratchets that you can’t easily break. But that IS a practical limit.
With 250ftlbs of capability, it’s tough to apply 250 to 13” ratchet. When the ratchet is nearly 2’ long, the breaking load is down to 125. My guess is, ratchet designers use around that load as the max applied load.
So the XL 1/4” and 3/8” ratchets are close to their limits, if you are buying them for their leverage. The right answer are the normal long ratchets in all three drive sizes.
BUT: The problem I and others face is that sometimes the bolt you are turning isn’t a hex head and you don’t own a T40 in 1/2” drive for example. Or a triple square. This is when it’s nice to have the XL ratchets for just in case. I mostly (and rarely) use mine to get my hand into a more comfortable place to work.
IndyGarage
Well-known member
I have a standard 13 inch Gearwrench locking flex head that I've been using for a couple years. It's pretty good. I used a buddy's 20 inch Snap on 3/8 Locking head once, and I had to have one. Ordered it the next day. The head is a bit bigger than Gearwrench but the flex head and locking mechanism is way better.
As others have said the 13" is good if you only get one. I like having the leverage of the longer ratchets and not having to go with a breaker bar.
As others have said the 13" is good if you only get one. I like having the leverage of the longer ratchets and not having to go with a breaker bar.
oldschoolcraft
Well-known member
I've never used a locking flex head, and as a home gamer I don't use sockets that often to make an intelligent opinion. But I do have Snap On non-locking flex, and it hasn't been an issue to me. Though I see so many people saying locking flex head is critical, and an equal number of people saying it doesnt matter, that I'm also confused by this.
One of my worries is that my $150+ non-locking flex head snap on ratchet gets loose eventually and SO doesnt consider that a warranty issue and it becomes a worthless ratchet. I'm not sure what makes it tight, or it could get wobbly eventually, I assume everything wears.
One of my worries is that my $150+ non-locking flex head snap on ratchet gets loose eventually and SO doesnt consider that a warranty issue and it becomes a worthless ratchet. I'm not sure what makes it tight, or it could get wobbly eventually, I assume everything wears.
WWheeler
Well-known member
13" or thereabouts is as long as I go in 3/8" dr.
If and when I need longer than that I grab a larger drive ratchet and socket. 1/2" dr usually does it but I've got 3/4" sets in SAE and metric and some 1" in SAE if things get that ugly and I can't get an impact on it.
If and when I need longer than that I grab a larger drive ratchet and socket. 1/2" dr usually does it but I've got 3/4" sets in SAE and metric and some 1" in SAE if things get that ugly and I can't get an impact on it.
I have a 20" long Snap on 3/8" flex. It nice, but I rarely need it... I do use my SK 15" long 3/8" breaker bar. I need a 15" long 3/8" drive breaker with a 14mm socket to get the drive tensioner on 2012 Rav4 and 2005 Accord. 12" long is too short and a 1/2" drive breaker or 3/8" drive ratchet are too big.
Dakotadadv8
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I became a convert using flex ratchets after getting a long 3/8 drive flex ratchet. 1/4 and 1/2 drive extra long on order. Reading GJ and ordering with a few clicks of the mouse is dangerous.